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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 9/7/2005 3:06:37 PM EDT
Just my .02 on this, but I'm not sure what the union is "thinking" about here. They are being offered one of the BEST if not the best salary and benefits package in the aerospace business.
They are striking for pensions and work security. Work "security" is based on your company being the most cost efficient and offering the best product for the dollar in whatever your business is. The fact is, Boeing NEEDS the assembly workers, but they certainly don't NEED overpriced machine operators fabricating detail parts in internal Boeing fab shops. Outside suppliers can produce these at less than HALF THE PRICE!!! Now, if you have efficient outside sources manufacturing components and Boeing doing the assembly/final assembly now you have a winning product. Almost every other major OEM in America has outside suppliers producing all the details
(Ford, GM, GE etc.) why Boeing still has THOUSANDS of people making $10-$10,000 parts is asinine. Boeing has over $8 billion in free cash sitting in their reserves. I think they can hold out quite some time (many airlines would like to defer plane deliveries due to poor cash positions...Delta is a good example). Union management must be smoking hash if they think this is going to go their way.
Link Posted: 9/7/2005 3:31:18 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/7/2005 3:37:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bigscrun:
So what is everyone gonna do when Boeing say FU and moves building planes to Mexico?



Que? No habla Ingles. Lo siento.
Link Posted: 9/7/2005 3:52:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/7/2005 3:53:49 PM EDT by R-32]

Originally Posted By bigscrun:
So what is everyone gonna do when Boeing say FU and moves building planes to Mexico?



I will do the same thing I always do when the shitbirds from the flying B strike or get laid off...


Work more overtime to keep up with all the stupid shit they pull because they are not working.

Link Posted: 9/7/2005 4:12:27 PM EDT
AirBus wins again.
Link Posted: 9/7/2005 4:14:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 1GunnerHogan1:
Just my .02 on this, but I'm not sure what the union is "thinking" about here. They are being offered one of the BEST if not the best salary and benefits package in the aerospace business.
They are striking for pensions and work security. Work "security" is based on your company being the most cost efficient and offering the best product for the dollar in whatever your business is. The fact is, Boeing NEEDS the assembly workers, but they certainly don't NEED overpriced machine operators fabricating detail parts in internal Boeing fab shops. Outside suppliers can produce these at less than HALF THE PRICE!!! Now, if you have efficient outside sources manufacturing components and Boeing doing the assembly/final assembly now you have a winning product. Almost every other major OEM in America has outside suppliers producing all the details
(Ford, GM, GE etc.) why Boeing still has THOUSANDS of people making $10-$10,000 parts is asinine. Boeing has over $8 billion in free cash sitting in their reserves. I think they can hold out quite some time (many airlines would like to defer plane deliveries due to poor cash positions...Delta is a good example). Union management must be smoking hash if they think this is going to go their way.



AMEN! Preach it brother. My Dad worked at Boeing for almost 40 years and he is fed up with unions. They protect two things and two things only... Themselves (union bosses) and Collective Laziness. They don't protect the American Worker, they don't even offer that attractive of a political force anymore.

I am sick and tired of the entitlement mentality of most union workers trying to tell a company what the company owes them. The truth is... the company owes nothing to you and answers only to their stockholders. They give you a paycheck to perform a service and that is it. Don't like the paycheck... go somewhere else.

Boeing will survive long after they lay off their entire machinist force and farm it out to some foreign source. I've only worked at one job that could have been unionized, and the people always gawking about wanting to form a union were the laziest son's of bitches I ever met. Never learned a thing about an honest days work in their life.

- DH
Link Posted: 9/7/2005 7:19:53 PM EDT
Boeing kept throwing cash at them, they kept telling them they didnt want any cash, they wanted it spent on benefits.

Its called collective bargaining.

Boeing is willing to put up X dollars, why not put it where the workers want it? Because retirement funds are liabilities, and dont help that corporate bottom line, and looks like shit on the books. They never want to defer comp, no matter what. And if I want my raises to go towards my health care, its myself and my coworkers business.

I still havent decided if they are breaking the cardinal rule of striking. You never strike over money, only over principle. This seems like principle, but money is behind it. Either way, they will both lose more than either will ever gain in short order.

They need to get their colective asses in their and get some bargaining done.

Link Posted: 9/7/2005 7:50:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By CavVet:
Boeing kept throwing cash at them, they kept telling them they didnt want any cash, they wanted it spent on benefits.Its called collective bargaining.
Boeing is willing to put up X dollars, why not put it where the workers want it? Because retirement funds are liabilities, and dont help that corporate bottom line, and looks like shit on the books. They never want to defer comp, no matter what. And if I want my raises to go towards my health care, its myself and my coworkers business.
I still havent decided if they are breaking the cardinal rule of striking. You never strike overmoney, only over principle. This seems like principle, but money is behind it. Either way, they will both lose more than either will ever gain in short order.
They need to get their colective asses in their and get some bargaining done.

Reasonable choice of words!
Link Posted: 9/7/2005 8:06:26 PM EDT
Like you said, Boeing can wait them out. Sounds like their customers are willing to cooperate. Not happy to see it, but there it is. Seems like a solvable problem, but who the hell has job security anymore? With those guys not paying any taxes, Gregwhore will just go after the rest of us harder.
Link Posted: 9/7/2005 11:56:29 PM EDT
I figure in about three weeks the garage sales will start. as usual with every Boeing Strike, good deals to be had on toys-ATV's, Snomobiles, motorcycles, and of course, guns.
Anything that can be bought on credit usually is by Boeing machinists, with virtually no cash in the bank, time for some good deals!
Link Posted: 9/8/2005 12:45:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By sixgunsblazing:
I figure in about three weeks the garage sales will start. as usual with every Boeing Strike, good deals to be had on toys-ATV's, Snomobiles, motorcycles, and of course, guns.
Anything that can be bought on credit usually is by Boeing machinists, with virtually no cash in the bank, time for some good deals!



Didn't a bunch of these guys just get back to work with the rehire for the 7J7?...

might not have to many toys to sell, they were out of work for a couple years.


Anyway like I said, when things get bad in my area, I end up with lots of extra work...

Link Posted: 9/8/2005 9:41:37 AM EDT
The just rehired guys must have had jobs somewhere in the meantime, and you know they spent every penny of those first paychecks.
Link Posted: 9/8/2005 10:00:09 AM EDT

Originally Posted By sixgunsblazing:
The just rehired guys must have had jobs somewhere in the meantime, and you know they spent every penny of those first paychecks.



good point
Link Posted: 9/8/2005 10:28:51 AM EDT

Originally Posted By sixgunsblazing:
I figure in about three weeks the garage sales will start. as usual with every Boeing Strike, good deals to be had on toys-ATV's, Snomobiles, motorcycles, and of course, guns.
Anything that can be bought on credit usually is by Boeing machinists, with virtually no cash in the bank, time for some good deals!



Damn, I can hardly wait for the next garage sale! If any Boeing machinists are reading this thread and you have some toys to sell, please email me!
Link Posted: 9/8/2005 7:48:26 PM EDT
They do seem to like to live large, at least the ones I've met.
Link Posted: 9/8/2005 8:42:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stickman:
They do seem to like to live large, at least the ones I've met.



Live large...and "Think" small....
Life is "great" when you are "working" OT for mishaps, poor performance etc and collecting checks.
Life ain't so great when your company asks you to take a MORE THAN GENEROUS offer to stay competitive in a global economy and some MORON like Matt Blondin (the union mouthpiece) says stick it to the company. Well Matt, I guess the jet ski's and 35 foot motor homes are out this year for your $40.00 an hour "friends" to buy. Better buy some firewood dipstick. Its gonna be a long cold autumn for you.
Link Posted: 9/8/2005 10:35:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sixgunsblazing:
The just rehired guys must have had jobs somewhere in the meantime, and you know they spent every penny of those first paychecks.



One of the couples that came by looking at my house (for sale) today mentioned that he was just rehired at Boeing in Renton two weeks ago. He said "Right now I'm one of those idiots holding a sign down there. Well, I haven't actually held a sign yet, but you get the idea." His words, not mine. He must be feeling pretty good about the strike ending soon to be looking at a new house.....
Link Posted: 9/9/2005 2:08:53 PM EDT
Just hit my first Boeing Garage sale today!
Picked up a Craftsman 10" table saw, a folding work bench, a pickaxe and a coupleof gas cans and funnels for 50 bucks!

Overheard the guy telling another customer he had 1700.00/month house payments and actually voted for the strike!

Link Posted: 9/9/2005 2:15:12 PM EDT
We need a Boeing garage sale thread so we can all get in on those great deals!

Link Posted: 9/9/2005 3:05:39 PM EDT
This one is going to last for a while. Company and union are one BILLION $ apart. Machinist union members/dumb f**ks are getting paid way too much as it is. They can only extort so much $ from the company. If those idiots keep it up they will end up like "Midwestern Aero" which Boeing turned non-union.
New CEO of Boeing is anti-union. If he goes for broke and tries to break up union those very same dumb f**cks. former Machinists will end up working for half of what they get now days just few months from now.
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