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Posted: 9/19/2005 5:48:14 AM EDT
I had an arfcommer from NC recently tell me so. I thought anything going out-of-state has to go through an FFL.

Anybody know for sure?
Link Posted: 9/19/2005 9:59:38 AM EDT
I don't know about a FTF, but I do know that you can't purchase a rifle from a North Carolina dealer if your a Virginia resident.  Many states have reciprocity agreements for purchase of rifles for contiguous states. Unfortunately, VA and NC aren't among them.  I would think that if a purchase from a FFL is out, then a FTF would be too. I live in Norfolk and asked about buying a rifles at Jim's Pawn in Fayetteville, NC.  Store personnel explained to me they couldn't make the sale as much as they would have liked to without shipping to a VA FFL.

You may want to post this in the Legal Forum and see if there is any distinction between the types of purchases.
Link Posted: 9/19/2005 12:34:22 PM EDT
I think you can, I was told at Coles gun works that I can buy a rifle/shotgun, but not a pistol, but the guy could have just been trying to make a sale.

chris
norfolk
Link Posted: 9/19/2005 1:58:11 PM EDT
I was told rifle or shotgun yes, handgun no by law unless an FFL does the transfer.

But then that was 5 years ago.
Link Posted: 9/19/2005 2:52:43 PM EDT
You can buy a rifle or shotgun in NC.,but no handguns. From what I hear, residents there have to get a permit from the local police to buy a handgun.
Link Posted: 9/19/2005 4:08:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/19/2005 4:09:05 PM EDT by varoadking]

Originally Posted By Bladerunner:
I don't know about a FTF, but I do know that you can't purchase a rifle from a North Carolina dealer if your a Virginia resident.  Many states have reciprocity agreements for purchase of rifles for contiguous states. Unfortunately, VA and NC aren't among them.  I would think that if a purchase from a FFL is out, then a FTF would be too. I live in Norfolk and asked about buying a rifles at Jim's Pawn in Fayetteville, NC.  Store personnel explained to me they couldn't make the sale as much as they would have liked to without shipping to a VA FFL.

You may want to post this in the Legal Forum and see if there is any distinction between the types of purchases.



DeGoff's handled a rifle transfer to a North Carolina resident for me recently - with both of us in their store.  No North Carolina FFL involved...

I would think that your experience may have been store specific...

Link Posted: 9/19/2005 9:54:43 PM EDT
As a non-licensee you may:

- transfer a long gun to/from another non-licensed resident of your state and it may be delivered from seller to buyer via USPS. No requirement to meet face-to-face, no paperwork necessary.

- purchase a long gun from a FFL in another state provided (a) the transaction takes place at the FFL's place of business and (b) does not violate any state laws in either the FFL's or the purchasers state of residence.

- transfer a handgun to/from a resident of your state and have it delivered by common carrier. No requirement to meet face-to-face, no paperwork necessary.


As a non-licensee you may not:

- purchase a firearm from or transfer a firearm to a non-licensed resident of another state without the transfer going through a FFL

- ship a hand gun via USPS


Check state laws for any additional requirements from the particular state where the transaction will occur.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 5:12:24 AM EDT
Thanks for the responses folks. Hope this nfo may be of use to others.
Link Posted: 9/20/2005 5:46:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BH1:
As a non-licensee you may:

- purchase a long gun from a FFL in another state provided (a) the transaction takes place at the FFL's place of business and (b) does not violate any state laws in either the FFL's or the purchasers state of residence.



Here's a real kicker about this item ---

If you go to an FFL in NC and pick up a long gun, and the NC FFL doesn't properly comply with VA laws in transferring long guns, you AND the dealer can both be accountable.

For instance, VA requires a "assault weapon" stipulation for long guns sold with 21rd or higher capacity mags.  I believe there is a special box or some such on the VA form.  Fail to declare that and have it found out........

I'd rather do my interstate firearms commerce with the out of state weapon transferred to an in-state FFL.

YMMV.....HTH.....
Link Posted: 10/9/2005 10:33:22 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SHIVAN:

Originally Posted By BH1:
As a non-licensee you may:

- purchase a long gun from a FFL in another state provided (a) the transaction takes place at the FFL's place of business and (b) does not violate any state laws in either the FFL's or the purchasers state of residence.



Here's a real kicker about this item ---

If you go to an FFL in NC and pick up a long gun, and the NC FFL doesn't properly comply with VA laws in transferring long guns, you AND the dealer can both be accountable.

For instance, VA requires a "assault weapon" stipulation for long guns sold with 21rd or higher capacity mags.  I believe there is a special box or some such on the VA form.  Fail to declare that and have it found out........her
YMMV.....HTH.....



Well, kinda... there are 3 laws that deal with "assault firearms" in the code of VA.  One is posession by persons not legal residents of the United States.

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+18.2-308.2C01

So, if you aren't an illegal, then no harm no foul by you or the dealer.

The second would be the criminal background check statute that restates the non legal resident stuff from above:

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+18.2-308.2C2

So here, I'd say that as long as you present something that would establish you as a legal US resident, you and the dealer are in the clear. That of course would be no problem as long as the other state has requirements similar to VA in checking legal residency.

The third law deals with posession of assault firearms by persons under the age of 18.

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+18.2-308.7

Again, probably not a problem since most places restrict the purchase of firearms by persons under the age of 18 anyway.

As an aside, I would also think that a stripped receiver (AK, AR, FAL etc.), while capable of being built into an "assault firearm" would not apply since it wouldn't be "equipped at the time of the offense with a magazine which will hold more than 20 rounds of ammunition" or have a stock (folding or otherwise) or "designed by the manufacturer to accommodate a silencer" since it wouldn't have a barrel (threaded or otherwise) .

As for the check box, I don't recall seeing any such thing on the VA form but I could be wrong. Hopefully someone will chime in (who is a dealer) and say if the VA form has anything regarding "assault firearms" or if there is anything other than the laws I've cited that have any relavence regarding "assault firearms."

lansker
Link Posted: 10/9/2005 7:31:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By lansker:

Originally Posted By SHIVAN:

Originally Posted By BH1:
As a non-licensee you may:

- purchase a long gun from a FFL in another state provided (a) the transaction takes place at the FFL's place of business and (b) does not violate any state laws in either the FFL's or the purchasers state of residence.



Here's a real kicker about this item ---

If you go to an FFL in NC and pick up a long gun, and the NC FFL doesn't properly comply with VA laws in transferring long guns, you AND the dealer can both be accountable.

For instance, VA requires a "assault weapon" stipulation for long guns sold with 21rd or higher capacity mags.  I believe there is a special box or some such on the VA form.  Fail to declare that and have it found out........

I'd rather do my interstate firearms commerce with the out of state weapon transferred to an in-state FFL.

YMMV.....HTH.....



Well, kinda... there are 3 laws that deal with "assault firearms" in the code of VA.  One is posession by persons not legal residents of the United States.

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+18.2-308.2C01

So, if you aren't an illegal, then no harm no foul by you or the dealer.

The second would be the criminal background check statute that restates the non legal resident stuff from above:

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+18.2-308.2C2

So here, I'd say that as long as you present something that would establish you as a legal US resident, you and the dealer are in the clear. That of course would be no problem as long as the other state has requirements similar to VA in checking legal residency.

The third law deals with posession of assault firearms by persons under the age of 18.

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+18.2-308.7

Again, probably not a problem since most places restrict the purchase of firearms by persons under the age of 18 anyway.

As an aside, I would also think that a stripped receiver (AK, AR, FAL etc.), while capable of being built into an "assault firearm" would not apply since it wouldn't be "equipped at the time of the offense with a magazine which will hold more than 20 rounds of ammunition" or have a stock (folding or otherwise) or "designed by the manufacturer to accommodate a silencer" since it wouldn't have a barrel (threaded or otherwise) .

As for the check box, I don't recall seeing any such thing on the VA form but I could be wrong. Hopefully someone will chime in (who is a dealer) and say if the VA form has anything regarding "assault firearms" or if there is anything other than the laws I've cited that have any relavence regarding "assault firearms."

lansker



That's all swell, but quite simply unless the state dealer outside Virginia is well versed in Virginia gun laws I refuse to run the risk of doing business out of state, when I could pay $15 and make sure all my i's are dotted and t's are crossed.  I just can't see a scenario where it might be beneficial to buy a gun in that manner.

BTW, Templar confirmed the "assault weapon" catergorization some time ago.  I'm not an FFL, nor to I play one on TV, but I'm pretty sure the dealer must disclose the "type of weapon" if it's sold with a 20+rd magazine.

I also hope Templar will chime in soon.
Link Posted: 10/10/2005 7:37:42 AM EDT
VA is in a quircky position.  Because our state law requires the VSP to conduct the instant check, and because dealers outside don't use the VSP, we, as VA residents can not purchase from a dealer outside VA.  NC residents can buy long guns from VA dealers but VA residents can't buy from NC dealers.  

Face to face transactions can not happen between residents of other states.  Period.  Not long guns or handguns.  It must go through an FFL and in the case of a NC and VA resident, it can't go from the NC resident to a VA resident at a NC dealer.  
Link Posted: 10/10/2005 8:16:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By cliffy109:
VA is in a quircky position.  Because our state law requires the VSP to conduct the instant check, and because dealers outside don't use the VSP, we, as VA residents can not purchase from a dealer outside VA.  NC residents can buy long guns from VA dealers but VA residents can't buy from NC dealers.  

Face to face transactions can not happen between residents of other states.  Period.  Not long guns or handguns.  It must go through an FFL and in the case of a NC and VA resident, it can't go from the NC resident to a VA resident at a NC dealer.  




There was previously a law that limited long gun purchases by VA (non dealer) residents to dealers in VA or dealers (face to face) in contiguous states at the place of business of the contiguous state's dealer. This was repealed last year, allowing VA residents to buy long guns in any state from any dealer, face to face at that dealer's place of business, as per federal law.

If you read the law regarding VA (VSP) background checks for firearm purchases, you will see that as long as you follow the laws of that state and federal law, there is no restriction on purchasing long guns, even if they are "assault firearms":

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+18.2-308.2C2

J. The provisions of this section shall not apply to restrict purchase, trade or transfer of firearms by a resident of Virginia when the resident of Virginia makes such purchase, trade or transfer in another state, in which case the laws and regulations of that state and the United States governing the purchase, trade or transfer of firearms shall apply. A National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) check shall be performed prior to such purchase, trade or transfer of firearms.
Link Posted: 10/10/2005 9:28:47 AM EDT
Thanks for the correction on that.  My experience with this was back in 2003 when I attempted to buy an over/under shotty out of state.  I'm glad to see this has changed.
Link Posted: 10/10/2005 11:13:29 AM EDT
No problem. I was recently looking into all of this in detail because I plan on buying a couple of  AK receivers while on my hunting trip/vacation in Texas at the end of this month.  I'm in the queue with Global Trades, but I don't know if the backlog will be cleared enough by the time I'm there. Damn Rita... I might have to have them ship and get a transfer done here in VA.lansker
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