Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login

Site Notices
Posted: 8/28/2009 11:08:25 AM EST
I just heard PGH is considering a Ban on "Assult Weapons" during the G20 Summit in sept. Not many details given so far, just that it's being considered by City Council.
Link Posted: 8/28/2009 11:09:36 AM EST
Philly tried this and it was found unconstitutional.
Link Posted: 8/28/2009 1:41:33 PM EST
Originally Posted By wildturl1:
I just heard PGH is considering a Ban on "Assult Weapons" during the G20 Summit in sept. Not many details given so far, just that it's being considered by City Council.


And by doing this it will prevent what? What a bunch of commie fucks.

Link Posted: 8/28/2009 1:57:16 PM EST
Originally Posted By arjohnson:
Originally Posted By wildturl1:
I just heard PGH is considering a Ban on "Assult Weapons" during the G20 Summit in sept. Not many details given so far, just that it's being considered by City Council.


And by doing this it will prevent what? What a bunch of commie fucks.



Exactally! I think they just like to feel important.

Link Posted: 8/28/2009 4:53:39 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/28/2009 4:53:56 PM EST by wgjhsafT]
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/09240/993804-53.stm


Assault weapon ban for G-20 summit?
Gun debate springs from city proposal to control protesters
Friday, August 28, 2009
Pittsburgh's short-lived ban on assault weapons, quashed by the General Assembly in 1994, is still on the city's books, and it may get new life under legislation driven by next month's G-20 summit.

A little-noted clause in a proposed ordinance written by Mayor Luke Ravenstahl's administration to keep protesters from thwarting police crowd control efforts invokes the defunct assault weapons ban. The clause says "no person shall possess" an array of items including 37 "contraband" weapons listed in the ban, "for the purpose of defeating lawful removal" by police.

Its effect is a matter of debate.

To Councilman Bruce Kraus, a gun control advocate, it's "clearly saying that this ban on assault weapons would be an effective tool for policing the G-20."

"If indeed, by sending this over, [administration officials] feel that the assault weapons ban is needed for effective policing during the G-20, would they not also feel that the ban is needed for daily policing?"

City Solicitor George Specter said the clause is "not an attempt to ban such things," but rather "a restriction on how they are used, in clearly defined, limited circumstances."

But to Meghan Jones-Rolla, a firearms lawyer who has represented the National Rifle Association locally, it looks like "a back-door attempt at an assault weapons ban."

"After the G-20, if I'm standing on the corner, and I have an assault weapon, and [a police officer] says, 'Move,' am I in violation?"

Council is set to debate and vote on G-20 legislation today but may postpone two protest-related bills until it can hold a public hearing.

Pittsburgh officials have said they need new rules to deal with techniques that a few protesters use, and the legislation bars possession of "animal or human waste, animal or human blood, rotten eggs, acid, gasoline, manufactured gases or sprays, and alcohol" if its meant for thwarting crowd dispersal. The legislation isn't limited to the Sept. 24 and 25 summit, having no sunset provision.

By invoking a 1993 list of weapons –– from the ArmaLite AR-180 to the Weaver Arms Nighthawk 9 mm –– the legislation could touch a raw nerve with gun rights advocates.

The city last month won the first round of a court fight with the NRA, when Common Pleas Judge R. Stanton Wettick Jr. threw out the group's challenge to an ordinance demanding that firearm owners report a missing gun within 24 hours of noticing that it's gone. The NRA has appealed.

After being told of the legislation by the Post-Gazette, Ms. Jones-Rolla said she informed the NRA, but she did not yet know if the group would challenge the ordinance, if it is passed.

She noted that even though the NRA lost the first legal round on lost-and-stolen guns in Pittsburgh, it has so far defeated a Philadelphia attempt to ban assault weapons there.

The NRA bases its arguments on the state law barring localities from regulating the "ownership, possession or transportation of firearms." Passed in 1994, it was, in part, a reaction to then-Councilman Jack Wagner's successful push for the assault weapons ban in Pittsburgh. Mr. Wagner is now state auditor general.

Fraternal Order of Police President Dan O'Hara said that he generally didn't oppose peoples' right to own powerful guns.

"It's not the fact that people own assault weapons that's a problem," he said. "The problem is how they're being used, and who owns them."

He said police have gotten reports that representatives from the group Open Carry –– which backs the right of most citizens to openly bear arms –– would be near the G-20 perimeter.

"We don't know if they'll be walking around with guns on their hips," he said.

Mr. Kraus said he didn't know how the G-20 legislation jibes with the state law, but he'd like to expand on it by updating the code's list of 37 guns.

"Is it not prudent to look at all additional automatic and semi-automatic weapons available today?" he asked.

The G-20 summit of leaders of economic powerhouse nations is expected to draw protests, and is a National Special Security Event, making the Secret Service the lead security agency.

Mr. Kraus said that Washington could be the city's ally against big guns. "We need the feds to petition Harrisburg to ban this kind of weaponry for the G-20" and maybe beyond, he said.


Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/09240/993804-53.stm#ixzz0PX5uVTPm
Link Posted: 8/28/2009 6:06:28 PM EST
<sigh> Glad i moved out of the city. Screw 'em.
Link Posted: 8/29/2009 5:00:43 AM EST
What an absolute pile of garbage.

Here's another article from today:

City's plan to ban guns has NRA up in arms
Saturday, August 29, 2009
A weapons plank in a raft of G-20 Summit legislation moving through Pittsburgh City Council drew fire from gun rights advocates yesterday, prompting the National Rifle Association to consider yanking its 2011 annual meeting from the city.

The proposed ordinance would allow police to cite people for carrying a variety of items, from rotten eggs to 37 types of guns, if police perceive an intent to defy their orders.

"They may try to call this some other thing, but by every reasonable account, and reasonable review of what they intend to do, this is a gun ban, plain and simple," said Andrew Arulanandam, director of public affairs for the NRA.

If it is passed and remains in place, it would "jeopardize" the NRA's plans to hold a conference here April 29 through May 1, 2011, costing the city tens of thousands of visitors, he said.

City Councilman Bruce Kraus, a gun control advocate, said the ordinance may not be enforceable as it's now written, but he's determined to make it so.

Carrying powerful guns "is of genuine concern when you're having a massive protest," as may occur around the summit, he said. He argued that the city isn't trying to ban anything.

"You actually could have those weapons in your possession as long as you were not using those as a way to avoid a lawful dispersal order."

That argument didn't mollify gun rights advocates, who noted that the General Assembly gave the state the sole right to regulate the ownership, possession, transfer or transportation of guns.

"This is the inevitable encroachment of government in areas where they've been proscribed from doing that," said Kim Stolfer, legislative committee chairman for the Allegheny County Sportsmen's League. His group will "entertain the possibility of a federal civil rights action" if the ordinance passes, he said.

The Sportsmen's League fought a 1993 "assault weapons" ban passed by City Council and quashed by the Legislature the year after. His group's lawsuit ended with the city stipulating in 1995 to "abide by and adhere to" the state preemption law.

But the proposed G-20 legislation refers directly to the gun list in the quashed code section. That's part of city officials' effort to grapple with the security challenges inherent in hosting the Sept. 24-25 summit, expected to draw leaders of the world's economic powers –– and many protesters.

Council yesterday voted tentatively to allow $16 million in spending on summit security, to accept $14.3 million in federal and state aid, and to allow the city to enter into agreements with other governments that might provide back-up police.

The budget includes $9.5 million for hiring out-of-town police, $1.7 million for city police overtime, $862,000 for new radios, $350,000 for riot gear and $250,000 for crowd control equipment, among other items.

Council postponed votes on proposals to bar the use of masks, hoods, noxious substances and "contraband" weapons to defeat police efforts, pending a public hearing set for 1:30 p.m. on Wednesday in council chambers.

Council President Doug Shields raised the possibility of adding a "sunset provision" making the rules temporary. But so far, the proposals written by Mayor Luke Ravenstahl's administration don't include an expiration date.

"The fact that they want to leave it open-ended, I think is the most ominous point," said Mr. Arulanandam.

The city may be trying to "bait people" to bring rifles to G-20 protests, said Mike Stollenwerk, co-founder of OpenCarry.org, which encourages people to openly carry guns.

He said his group is not telling members to bring guns to G-20 protests.

He called the city plank "nonsensical."

"Assuming the [police] order to disperse is lawful," Mr. Stollenwerk said, "well, then, it doesn't matter if they're carrying a fishing pole. They're still [potentially] guilty of failing to disperse."

Some gun rights advocates pointed out that state law already allows the city to declare an emergency and bar people from carrying guns on public property.

City Assistant Solicitor Yvonne Hilton said the city is only trying to outlaw "the use of the tool to obstruct the passage" of people through public places. "It's all tied to conduct, and not possession."

City officials said that one wouldn't have to commit another crime to run afoul of the proposed rules on possessing guns or other objects, or wearing a mask, with the intent of foiling police. Police Chief Nate Harper said police are trained to evaluate the totality of a situation, and gauge someone's intent.

Mr. Arulanandam said it "doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this out: Anyone who's intent on conducting any crime at the G-20 summit, or before or after, they are not going to telegraph their intent."


Read more: http://www.postgazette.com/pg/09241/994100-482.stm#ixzz0Pa3AiiCP


Link Posted: 8/29/2009 8:25:10 AM EST
wgjhsafT, thanks for adding to this. I made the post as I was hearing it on the local news. They didn't really get into any details.
Link Posted: 8/29/2009 9:06:08 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/30/2009 2:34:01 PM EST
You know, I work downtown, in Oakland! I work for the government and they are considering shutting us down for three days with pay. Now this is good because if I actually have to drive down there for those days and some asshole starts protesting by throwing rocks at my car or even better at me riding my motorcycle, or posing some sort of threat to my life, well that is when I would want my concealed to protect me! Now normally I would never have it when I am going to work, however that is the time I probably would! Secondly, there is something else that is really bothering me. If this damn thing is causing this many problems, why in the HELL would you even have it. All it's doing is causing more problems, I think it is all BS!

~Zach
Link Posted: 8/31/2009 3:27:50 AM EST
Firearms Owners Against Crime (a political action committee (PAC)) and Allegheny County Sportsmen's League (ACSL) are on top of this issue. Stay tuned.
Link Posted: 8/31/2009 4:54:26 AM EST

Originally Posted By Ducky15:
You know, I work downtown, in Oakland! I work for the government and they are considering shutting us down for three days with pay. Now this is good because if I actually have to drive down there for those days and some asshole starts protesting by throwing rocks at my car or even better at me riding my motorcycle, or posing some sort of threat to my life, well that is when I would want my concealed to protect me! Now normally I would never have it when I am going to work, however that is the time I probably would! Secondly, there is something else that is really bothering me. If this damn thing is causing this many problems, why in the HELL would you even have it. All it's doing is causing more problems, I think it is all BS!

~Zach

My wife's company is relocating them to Youngstown, OH from Sept. 23-25. I'm taking off to take care the of the kids at home (I have vacation days to use). Kids will be in school and I figure I can get some shooting done at the range.

Why are we having it? Oblammy picked us.

The next G20 summit is due to take place in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania on September 24–25, 2009.[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_G-20_Pittsburgh_summit#cite_note-kdka-0][1][/url] Announced shortly after the April 2009 G-20 London summit, U.S. President Barack Obama volunteered to host this summit, initially planning to hold it in New York City and coordinating it with the opening of the United Nations General Assembly. However, due to coordination issues, on May 28, 2009, the Obama Administration announced a change of venue to Pittsburgh in order to highlight the city's economic recovery following the collapse of its manufacturing sector in the latter half of the 20th century. In response to the Global credit crisis, a G20 summit in one year was proposed shortly after the London summit in April 2009. The second G20 2009 summit will hopefully evaluate the measures taken in April 2009 in London and implement new policies which will stimulate the global economy.

Amongst the issues to be discussed is a proposal to radically reform the International Monetary Fund.[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_G-20_Pittsburgh_summit#cite_note-IMF_reform-1][2][/url] French President Nicholas Sarkozy also suggested that there would be an evaluation of measures already taken.[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_G-20_Pittsburgh_summit#cite_note-economic_times-2][3][/url]


From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_G-20_Pittsburgh_summit

oduibhne: Good to hear. ACSL are like rabid dogs on this stuff. Glad to know they are taking action. These idiots in the city are trying to use protester law (which might be questionable itself) to get their prized AWB.
Link Posted: 9/1/2009 8:46:40 AM EST
They will try to sell it as a healthcare issue. they did it before, they will try it again.
Link Posted: 9/1/2009 8:48:27 AM EST
check Marylands list most probably the same.
Link Posted: 9/1/2009 8:58:52 AM EST
Originally Posted By wildturl1:
wgjhsafT, thanks for adding to this. I made the post as I was hearing it on the local news. They didn't really get into any details.


Here is What maryland is going for. http://mlis.state.md.us/2006rs/bills/hb/HB1367f.pdf
Link Posted: 9/2/2009 5:03:55 AM EST
Here's the definition of 'Assault Weapons'

§ 607.02 DEFINITIONS.
As used in this Chapter, certain terms are defined as follows:
(a) FIREARM. Any pistol, revolver, rifle or shotgun of any kind which impels a pellet or bullet by means of explosive charge.
(b) AIR GUN. Any gun which uses air under pressure from pumping or other means to discharge missiles at a muzzle velocity in excess of two hundred (200) feet per second.
(c) TOY AIR GUN. An air gun which does not contain air under high pressure from pumping or other means but which derives its force from a spring which is set by a simple cocking operation and discharges missiles through a smooth bore barrel at a muzzle velocity less than two hundred (200) feet per second.
(d) FACSIMILE OF A FIREARM. Any toy, antique, starter pistol or other object which bears a reasonable resemblance to an operable firearm, or any object which impels a missile or pellet by means of spinning action, compression or CO2 cartridge.
(e) AMMUNITION. Any projectile, pellets or bullets, along with their fuses and primers, that can be fired from guns or otherwise propelled.
(f) ASSAULT WEAPON. All automatic, semi-automatic weapons or weapons parts, designated as assault weapons herein. The term shall include all versions of the following, including weapons sold under the designation provided in this subsection:
(1) Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder such as the "Street Sweeper" or "Striker 12";
(2) M1 carbine type;
(3) M16 type;
(4) Uzi type semi-automatic weapons;
(5) Algimec AGM 1 type;
(6) Armalite AR-180 type;
(7) Australian Automatic Arms SAR;
(8) Avtomat Kalashnikov type semi-automatic weapons;
(9) Beretta AR-70 and BM59 semi-automatic weapons;
(10) Bushmaster Assault Rifle;
(11) Calico M-900 Assault carbine and M-900;
(12) CETME G3;
(13) Chartered Industries of Singapore SR-88 type;
(14) Colt AR-15 and CAR-IS series;
(15) Daewoo K-1, K-2, Max 1 and Max 2, AR 100 types;
(16) Demro TAC-1 carbine type;
(17) Encom MP-9 and MP-45 carbine types;
(18) FAMAS MAS 223 types;
(19) FN-FAL, FN-LAR or FN-FNC type semi-automatic weapons;
(20) Franchi SPAS 12 and LAW 12 shotguns;
(21) G3SA type;
(22) Galil type;
(23) Heckler and Koch HK91, HK93, HK94, MP5, PSG-1;
(24) Intratec TEC 9 and 22 semi-automatic weapons;
(25) M14S type;
(26) MAC 10, MAC 11, MAC 11-99mm carbine type weapons;
(27) PJK M-68 carbine type;
(28) Plaingield Machine Company Carbine;
(29) Ruger K-Mini-14/5F and Mini-14/5RF;
(30) SIG AMT, SIG550SP, SIG551SP, SIGPE-57 types;
(31) SKS with detachable magazine type;
(32) Spectre Auto carbine type;
(33) Springfield Armory BM59 and SAR-48 type;
(34) Steyr A.U.G. semi-automatic type shotgun;
(35) USAS 12 semi-automatic type shotgun;
(36) Valmet M62, M71S, M76, or M78 type semi-automatic weapons; and
(37) Weaver Arm Nighthawk.


Comes from the city municipal code site.
Link Posted: 9/2/2009 8:25:38 AM EST
Well isn't that just interesting. Makes damn near anything "gun" related illegal. Hmm.

Hopefully they will see that they will fail miserably and not even go ahead with it for this G20 thing.
Link Posted: 9/3/2009 4:44:40 PM EST
Just bring your .50 cal rifles, or M60's or M240's they arent on the list.
Link Posted: 10/30/2009 1:50:12 PM EST
Steyr AUG semi automatic type shotgun?
Link Posted: 11/2/2009 7:04:19 PM EST
THIS AWB list is the kind of un-american shit we NJ residents put up with all the time. In January we start with 1 pistol a month even with FID card's and pistol permits. Geesh i cant wait to get out of new germany. soon.
Top Top