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Posted: 5/13/2018 12:46:15 AM EDT
I’m hoping someone can steer me in the right direction.

I have an interested buyer, for my Walther PPQ, that is an FFL in California. I’m not a business and don’t have my FFL, so the way I understand the law I should be able to ship directly to him and would be exempt from having to abide by the roster since this would be a private party transfer.

Am I understanding this correctly? Is there anything I need to do other than obtain a signed copy of the FFL for my records?

Thanks for any direction!
Link Posted: 5/13/2018 1:27:47 AM EDT
Link Posted: 5/13/2018 1:33:35 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By 50_Shooter:
How do you consider it a private party transfer if you don't live in CA?

If you don't live here and it's not on the roster, I'm pretty sure you can't do this deal.
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Does it even matter if the buyer is an FFL? How do they buy handguns to sell to exempt persons like LEOs if they can't buy them in the first place?
Link Posted: 5/13/2018 3:32:27 AM EDT
I thought it could be shipped into the state through an FFL only if it was on roster.
Link Posted: 5/13/2018 5:32:31 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By endermend:
I thought it could be shipped into the state through an FFL only if it was on roster.
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Sounds like the FFL is the end user. If it was being sent to an FFL for transfer to some private person, then yeah, I do believe you are correct, with some exceptions that don't apply here.
Link Posted: 5/13/2018 10:17:58 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By bigstick61:

Sounds like the FFL is the end user. If it was being sent to an FFL for transfer to some private person, then yeah, I do believe you are correct, with some exceptions that don't apply here.
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Yeah, FFL is the end user.
Link Posted: 5/13/2018 4:00:22 PM EDT
Not an FFL but my impression would be that they have to keep the "business" and the "personal" separate. So I suppose an FFL could purchase an off roster PPQ for inventory and (hopefully) eventual legal sale out of California. If buying for personal use, then I think this would be a problem at his end. Not sure how you as an individual would necessarily have insight into this, though.
Link Posted: 5/14/2018 1:15:53 AM EDT
It is NOT a private party transfer. Those are clearly defined as being between two residents of California, and those have to be performed by both of them meeting at a 01-FFL to perform the 4473, DROS (including DES entry), and 10-day wait.

Logically, a 01-FFL can buy any handgun from out of state, independent of the roster. Many gun dealers in California have a special showcase for "LEO only weapons", where they sell non-roster handguns. Those obviously come from out of state. Whether the non-roster-gun comes from a private individual, or from a distributor like RSR or Davidson's doesn't matter to the law: the 01-FFL can buy a non-roster gun from out of state, take it into his inventory, log it into his book. However, he can not sell it to normal state residents, only to exempt people.

I have NO idea about how the separation between personal collection of an individual who has a 01-FFL license, and his FFL-controlled inventory works.
Link Posted: 5/14/2018 1:19:39 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By Featureless:
Not an FFL but my impression would be that they have to keep the "business" and the "personal" separate. So I suppose an FFL could purchase an off roster PPQ for inventory and (hopefully) eventual legal sale out of California. If buying for personal use, then I think this would be a problem at his end. Not sure how you as an individual would necessarily have insight into this, though.
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He may be purchasing it for inventory, I’m not sure. It’s just not being purchased by a non-FFL with us doing the transaction through him. The transaction is just between me and him.

I checked with an extended family member who is LEO in California, and he said if the buyer is an FFL then I should be good. Is there any legal hot water I would be in for selling to him given he’s sending me a signed copy of his FFL and the fact that the law says private party transfers are exempt?
Link Posted: 5/14/2018 1:28:26 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By smitty_007:
He may be purchasing it for inventory, I’m not sure. It’s just not being purchased by a non-FFL with us doing the transaction through him. The transaction is just between me and him.

I checked with an extended family member who is LEO in California, and he said if the buyer is an FFL then I should be good. Is there any legal hot water I would be in for selling to him given he’s sending me a signed copy of his FFL and the fact that the law says private party transfers are exempt?
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Originally Posted By smitty_007:
Originally Posted By Featureless:
Not an FFL but my impression would be that they have to keep the "business" and the "personal" separate. So I suppose an FFL could purchase an off roster PPQ for inventory and (hopefully) eventual legal sale out of California. If buying for personal use, then I think this would be a problem at his end. Not sure how you as an individual would necessarily have insight into this, though.
He may be purchasing it for inventory, I’m not sure. It’s just not being purchased by a non-FFL with us doing the transaction through him. The transaction is just between me and him.

I checked with an extended family member who is LEO in California, and he said if the buyer is an FFL then I should be good. Is there any legal hot water I would be in for selling to him given he’s sending me a signed copy of his FFL and the fact that the law says private party transfers are exempt?
You're not even in California. I wouldn't worry about it. If there is any reason at all for anyone to be in hot water, and I seriously doubt that there is, it'll be on the FFL and not you.
Link Posted: 5/14/2018 7:58:29 PM EDT
Just a Heads up, I heard a story that some of the PPK's have a recessed threaded barrel and the CA DOJ was going around and checking all the FFL's PPK's for threaded barrels and charging them. Apparently Walter was unknowingly sending them into the state. They went trough a Guy's inventory and checked them till they found the one(yes just one)with a treaded barrel. Its retarded, but treaded barrels are illegal in the peoples republic.
Link Posted: 5/14/2018 11:55:16 PM EDT
Okay, been doing a bunch more research, and it seems like a lawful act for an out-of-state private party seller of an off-roster handgun to sell to a class 01 FFL. Looks like they can purchase it as inventory to sell to an exempt Cali resident (i.e., LEO or Military), or to sell out-of-state.

Basically, it's a Cali FFL buying an off-roster handgun for inventory to sell to exempt residents that can legally own off-roster handguns. If anyone has any evidence to refute this, please post it!

Thanks for the discussion so far.
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