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Posted: 7/22/2008 12:51:39 PM EDT
If I use an AR for self defense in my home...

When the authorities confiscate the rifle for ballistics testing, could I "strip" it down and just give them the upper? You know, take out the BCG, remove the Eotech, 4-rail handguard, keep the lower, etc.

That way, they can test the ballistics of the barrel and I can go shopping for a new upper instead of a whole new rifle.

Link Posted: 7/22/2008 12:58:43 PM EDT
Is this before or after you check on your neighbors in a 200 yard radius? Pistol with hollow points is plenty for self defense. If you are more paranoid, keep a shotgun handy.
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 1:13:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/22/2008 1:15:16 PM EDT by CA_TX-Cop]
Chances are probably NO.

The serial numbered portion is the lower receiver, in addition, to actually match a casing collected to a casing from the rifle, you would have to have the same extractor, firing pin, hammer, etc.

I'm not an expert in the field of ballistics, but I'd say they (or WE) would want the whole rifle.

As far as taking pieces and parts off the rifle (like the Eotech or anything else), I don't see a problem with doing something like that, but then again, it's never been addressed. We don't let people take rims off cars, but if someone had a pull-out stereo they'd be able to take it with them.

Kind of a stange example, but it's the one that comes quickly to mind of things that get impounded/stored most often.

ETA: Also, is it the proliferation of TV shows that everyone thinks guns are going to be taken for ballistic testing when you are ADMITTING to having shot someone with a particular gun for a particular reason?
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 3:01:22 PM EDT

Originally Posted By QwikKotaTx:
Is this before or after you check on your neighbors in a 200 yard radius? Pistol with hollow points is plenty for self defense. If you are more paranoid, keep a shotgun handy.


Well, that's certainly one opinion, and not one shared by many people. You might want to check out the numerous studies on terminal ballistics discussed here and published elsewhere that show that the threat of overpenetration from .223 Remington/5.56x45mm is less than the most common pistol caliber hollowpoint ammunition.

I do like how you included an implied slight against those of us here who take our personal protection and the protection of our families and property much more seriously than the average naive clueless unaware sheep. Some of us, myself included, believe that the AR-15, or similar weapons, are the penultimate when it comes to home defense weapons offering greater accuracy, ergonomics, and lethality than a handgun.

Next time, before you start to run your online gob, why don't you think about what you're about to type and consider whether it's actually a useful comment, or just an underhanded slap that really has nothing to do with the question that was asked by the original poster.

Why don't you stop swigging the Feinstein AW kool-aid?
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 3:16:22 PM EDT
You can take off all the add ons but the lower goes with the upper. Be sure you take a picture of it before they take it so you can complain when it comes back rusty or more worn than it should.
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 3:31:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/22/2008 3:36:04 PM EDT by bob-nunya]
The gun would be evidence. Altering the gun would be tampering with evidence so I'd say bad idea from that perspective.

ETA: This is one major reason why a $200 12 gauge pump is best for home defense.
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 3:40:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By QwikKotaTx:
Is this before or after you check on your neighbors in a 200 yard radius? Pistol with hollow points is plenty for self defense. If you are more paranoid, keep a shotgun handy.


Not to flame you but just to inform you.
There is one and only one reason to use a pistol for self defense. That one reason is because you can't get your hands on a powerful rifle or shotgun in time to save yourself.
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 5:48:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By JC_Conn:

Well, that's certainly one opinion, and not one shared by many people. You might want to check out the numerous studies on terminal ballistics discussed here and published elsewhere that show that the threat of overpenetration from .223 Remington/5.56x45mm is less than the most common pistol caliber hollowpoint ammunition.

I do like how you included an implied slight against those of us here who take our personal protection and the protection of our families and property much more seriously than the average naive clueless unaware sheep. Some of us, myself included, believe that the AR-15, or similar weapons, are the penultimate when it comes to home defense weapons offering greater accuracy, ergonomics, and lethality than a handgun.

Next time, before you start to run your online gob, why don't you think about what you're about to type and consider whether it's actually a useful comment, or just an underhanded slap that really has nothing to do with the question that was asked by the original poster.

Why don't you stop swigging the Feinstein AW kool-aid?


So I take it you share the individuals mindset who think they need an AR pistol for a CCW weapon as well? The average homeowner lives 75 feet across from a neighbor. There is plenty of documentation and opinion out there that it is the responsibility of the user to imploy a large diameter, high energy and high expansion round. AKA knockdown power, not penetration. I'm no rocket scientist but the velocity and diameter of the .223 is a perfect equation for making deeper entry into ballistics gel etc.

On your finer points:
Greater Accuracy: Of course, it utilizes a longer barrel.
Better Ergonomics: Two hands separate from each other increase stability.
Superior Lethality: Penetration and over penetration, what's the difference on this subject.

I am far from anti-gun, far from Liberal. Not sure where you are reading into that. I was implying the overkill nature of the beast and letting the OP know that what's behind the target is as important as the actual target. No Kool Aid here, why would I own 2 AR's and be on this board if that were the case? The only scenario where I could see an AR being the weapon of choice for home defense is for an individual that had a lot of land with multiple points to secure. As most know when you are in the middle of nowhere it takes longer for help to arrive and criminals are more apt to attacking in greater numbers. Scary thought. I would want nothing less than the most intense firepower available to me. I had the average homeowner in mind with my comments. A large # of posters here have the luxury of living on large parcels of land. I am highly jealous.
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 6:47:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By QwikKotaTx:
The only scenario where I could see an AR being the weapon of choice for home defense is for an individual that had a lot of land with multiple points to secure. As most know when you are in the middle of nowhere it takes longer for help to arrive and criminals are more apt to attacking in greater numbers. Scary thought. I would want nothing less than the most intense firepower available to me. I had the average homeowner in mind with my comments.



BS. Plenty of instances where people in large metro areas wait for hours for the local police to show up. I dare say you have a better chance of your 911 call being dropped or qued incorrectly in the big city as opposed to the smaller Sheriff Office. Also chances of a home invasion with multiple assailants will be far more likely in the big city than out in the sticks.
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 8:10:06 PM EDT
Here is my 2 cents on it

No you can not remove anything from the rifle, and they will most likely require all the ammo that was in the magazine as well. As stated earlier it is evidence and it will be brought into court, in the same condition that it was during the event in question!

Mr. Doe and how was it you where able to make that headshot in such low light conditions? Well Mr. DA I had my 2 MOA Aim Point turned down low and Bi-Pod on my quad rail system and the shot was relatively easy at a mere 15 yards. But MR. Doe there are none of those things on this rifle So you must be lying, you must have been cleaning your gun when it went off killing that poor man who was asking to use your flat screen TV at 3:am, You say you did this things but the evidence does not show it.

45-52 grain HP out of a 223 are a superb for thin skinned game and many times will not even exit a coyote or bobcat at short range, I have tested then on a sheet rock wall and it will not exit a one gallon jug of water after penetrating the wall and visa versa. As far as over penetration concerns and a total release of energy into its target you cant beat a good varmint bullet, they out performed Frangible ammo in my testing

I believe it is statistically recorded in the FBI history of violent crime report that violent crime in the country is typically more often than not committed by larger numbers of persons than they same type of crime in the city.

And a end note I think that if you light up a couple of turds in your house at night and the cops have any question about your story then your going to have more to worry about than your favorite AR-15

Phil
www.theimpactzonerange.com
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 8:54:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By theimpactzone:

And a end note I think that if you light up a couple of turds in your house at night and the cops have any question about your story then your going to have more to worry about than your favorite AR-15

Phil
www.theimpactzonerange.com


Words to take to heart....

Link Posted: 7/22/2008 10:16:19 PM EDT
If you want to face a tampering w/ or destroying evidence or at least hindering an investigation you could do those things, but NO.

Link Posted: 7/23/2008 4:02:18 AM EDT
Remington 870, 12 ga 00 buckshot. If you even still have to light them up after pumping the slide, they will most certainly die and there will be little if any penetration through the sheetrock walls.
Link Posted: 7/23/2008 4:42:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By theimpactzone:
And a end note I think that if you light up a couple of turds in your house at night and the cops have any question about your story then your going to have more to worry about than your favorite AR-15


I completely agree. I treat home defense weapons like fire insurance...have them, but pray everyday that you never have to use them.

This original post was more of a curiosity question. I imagine if that scenario ever presents itself, I'll be more concerned about the physical and emotional well-being of my family, not the stupid Eotech on top of my newly confiscated AR.

As for the conversation regarding the appropriateness of an AR for home defense...to each his own.
Link Posted: 7/23/2008 5:43:31 AM EDT
The EOTECH and anything removable would be in my safe by the time the cops got here.

They would have to get a seach warrant to open the safe and get anything out.

Therefore, the silencer that is on the AR, the AIMPOINT, the SUREFIRE LIGHT and the VFG will be locked in the safe.

Screw'em and their investigation . . . . They have no right to anything other than the Firearm.
Link Posted: 7/23/2008 9:31:26 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SC-Texas:
The EOTECH and anything removable would be in my safe by the time the cops got here.

They would have to get a seach warrant to open the safe and get anything out.

Therefore, the silencer that is on the AR, the AIMPOINT, the SUREFIRE LIGHT and the VFG will be locked in the safe.

Screw'em and their investigation . . . . They have no right to anything other than the Firearm.


Amen brother.
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