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11/20/2019 5:07:11 PM
Posted: 9/25/2009 2:15:48 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/2/2009 7:22:35 AM EST by StealthyBlagga]
The team at Rio Salado always put on a fun match, and this one will be no exception. There will be 7 run-and-gun stages (rumor has it, including shooting from a moving vehicle). The theme this year will be "Halloween". There will be separate divisions for submachineguns and semi-auto pistol-caliber carbines, so this is the perfect chance for all those 9mm semis to come out from the back of the gun safe. You can see a video of the typical match format and a match entry form here. Entry fee is only $25 if you pre-enter before October 10th, which I recommend if you want to be sure of getting a slot (and match T-shirts are only available by pre-order). Oh, and bring plenty of ammo - this match is a hose-fest .
Link Posted: 9/25/2009 5:05:53 PM EST
I *might* be in town for this.... We'll see how my schedule goes.
Link Posted: 9/26/2009 3:37:10 PM EST
I hope they go over safety rules before shooting and make sure everyone understands them. I saw some serious safety violations at the last subgun match I shot.
Link Posted: 9/26/2009 4:45:29 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/29/2009 8:16:09 AM EST by StealthyBlagga]
Originally Posted By AZ3GUNNER:
I hope they go over safety rules before shooting and make sure everyone understands them. I saw some serious safety violations at the last subgun match I shot.


Hmmm - that surprises me as in my experience the organizers of this particular match are really overboard on safety (strict enforcement of muzzle discipline, guns must be re-cased before the stage is called "clear" etc.). Please PM me the specifics, or grab me at the next multigun match, so I can make sure the right people are spoken to.

ETA: Thanks AZ3G for the PM. From the description, it sounds like an inexperienced person taking the clock and ROing without knowing the rules (i.e. they assumed the "no harm, no foul" principle). This is being taken very seriously and WILL NOT be allowed to happen again.
Link Posted: 9/29/2009 7:55:15 AM EST
The Halloween Shotgun match on the same day is full... better get your entries for this match in quick, because everyone wants to shoot on Halloween .
Link Posted: 9/30/2009 10:00:48 AM EST
Richard, I have a question.....

When you are done shooting, drop your mag and show clear, what is the next step?
Squeeze trigger / drop bolt on empty chamber??
How should the gun be bagged, open bolt or closed bolt??

Please advise.

Thanks,
G
Link Posted: 9/30/2009 3:41:01 PM EST
Originally Posted By CowboyGunner:
Richard, I have a question.....

When you are done shooting, drop your mag and show clear, what is the next step?
Squeeze trigger / drop bolt on empty chamber??
How should the gun be bagged, open bolt or closed bolt??

Please advise.

Thanks,
G


If I am the RO, this is what I ask the shooter to do...

For a closed-bolt gun, it's the same as for any other 3-gun/multigun match:
1) Clear the gun (remove the magazine, then cycle the bolt to clear the chamber).
2) Show the RO an empty chamber.
3) Close the bolt then drop the hammer by pulling the trigger (to prove nobody missed a live round). Under USPSA rules, the command at this point is "If Clear, Hammer Down, Open Action".
4) Lock the bolt open again (or install a chamber flag).
5) Keeping the muzzle pointed safely down range at all times, re-case the gun.

For an open-bolt gun, the procedure is:
1) Clear the gun (pull the bolt back, then remove the magazine).
2) Show the RO an empty chamber.
3) Drop the bolt by pulling the trigger (to prove nobody missed a live round).
4) Leave the bolt closed (install a chamber flag at this time if you wish).
5) Keeping the muzzle pointed safely down range at all times, re-case the gun.

Note that, at our subgun matches, the range is not called "clear" until the gun has been re-cased - this is an extra safety precaution you don't typically see at most 3-gun/multigun matches. At Rio Salado subgun matches, the gun can ONLY be removed from the firing line in a case, and may only be uncased in the safety area or under the control of an RO.
Link Posted: 10/2/2009 7:21:32 AM EST
UPDATE: I confirmed there will be a "drive by" stage, shooting from a moving vehicle. The driver will be Carly Drake... sitting next to Carly will be worth the entry fee on its own :

Link Posted: 10/3/2009 9:23:21 AM EST
Looks like a whole lotta fun!

Am I correct the only way to preregister is sending a check via mail? Didn't see any phone or online payments as a possibility.
Link Posted: 10/3/2009 10:00:33 AM EST
Crap.
How am I supposed to bring my wifey now?
Link Posted: 10/3/2009 3:21:19 PM EST
Originally Posted By Balisong:
Looks like a whole lotta fun!

Am I correct the only way to preregister is sending a check via mail? Didn't see any phone or online payments as a possibility.


Yes, check or MO by mail please.
Link Posted: 10/5/2009 7:41:33 AM EST
My app is on the way via snail mail.

Link Posted: 10/5/2009 11:12:50 AM EST
um linky no worky. can't print an app to send in the mail
Link Posted: 10/5/2009 12:25:25 PM EST
Originally Posted By StealthyBlagga:
UPDATE: I confirmed there will be a "drive by" stage, shooting from a moving vehicle. The driver will be Carly Drake... sitting next to Carly will be worth the entry fee on its own :

http://arbrtek.net/rpm/fullauto/azsm/cd/dsc_1483.jpg


Ya but will dad be sitting in the back seat to make sure nobody breaks the 180 if you know what I mean?

Let's make sure to take her cell phone away so she isn't texting during the stage. Sounds like it's going to be a fun stage.
Link Posted: 10/5/2009 2:56:52 PM EST
Originally Posted By Balisong:
um linky no worky. can't print an app to send in the mail


Apparently the website may be intermittent today because they are upgrading the content. I am told it should be back up tomorrow, so please try again then .
Link Posted: 10/5/2009 7:52:58 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/6/2009 8:10:27 AM EST
App in the mail today!
Even ordered a shirt, I hope I like it.
Link Posted: 10/6/2009 10:19:22 AM EST
Originally Posted By Balisong:
App in the mail today!
Even ordered a shirt, I hope I like it.


You're going??

Damn.

There goes >my< good time.



Seriously - this looks like a great time. I can't hardly wait...
Link Posted: 10/6/2009 8:05:47 PM EST
Originally Posted By Choadlywan:
Originally Posted By Balisong:
App in the mail today!
Even ordered a shirt, I hope I like it.


You're going??

Damn.

There goes >my< good time.



That's the only reason I'm going; I have no interest in it otherwise.
Link Posted: 10/7/2009 12:36:33 PM EST
Do you get a big trophy if you win this match ? If you win, do you go somewhere's to compete for a USA championship ?

Couldn't find much info on the web site about this.
Link Posted: 10/7/2009 1:14:13 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/7/2009 1:15:28 PM EST by StealthyBlagga]
Originally Posted By anm2_man:
Do you get a big trophy if you win this match ? If you win, do you go somewhere's to compete for a USA championship ?

Couldn't find much info on the web site about this.


If you win you get a big trophy. I won last year, and this is what I got (the 2008 match had a zombie theme):



Unfortunately, there is no national body for subgun/PCC matches, so there is no National Championships like there might be with USPSA or similar disciplines. This particular match is about as large a match of its type as you will find anywhere in the World .
Link Posted: 10/8/2009 8:48:32 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/8/2009 10:06:04 AM EST

Originally Posted By StealthyBlagga:
Originally Posted By anm2_man:
Do you get a big trophy if you win this match ? If you win, do you go somewhere's to compete for a USA championship ?

Couldn't find much info on the web site about this.


If you win you get a big trophy. I won last year, and this is what I got (the 2008 match had a zombie theme ):

http://i244.photobucket.com/albums/gg34/stealthyblagga/AZSSMTrophy2008.jpg

Unfortunately, there is no national body for subgun/PCC matches, so there is no National Championships like there might be with USPSA or similar disciplines. This particular match is about as large a match of its type as you will find anywhere in the World .

Pretty dam nice trophy. I didn't think there was a national Subgun match, I may come down and take a look see.

PS: what weapon did you use to win ?


Link Posted: 10/8/2009 11:45:59 AM EST
Originally Posted By anm2_man:
...PS: what weapon did you use to win ?


Lage MAX-11

Link Posted: 10/22/2009 3:18:49 PM EST
Looks like I will be in town and can shoot this match. Are there still slots open? Carlie (my wife, not the stage driver) will want to shoot it, too.
Link Posted: 10/22/2009 5:11:29 PM EST
Originally Posted By MP5_guy:
Looks like I will be in town and can shoot this match. Are there still slots open? Carlie (my wife, not the stage driver) will want to shoot it, too.


I believe there are still slots - send in your application quick
Link Posted: 10/27/2009 5:56:07 PM EST
BUMP - there are still open slots for this match. Its probably too late to mail in your entry, but it will be possible to enter on the day.
Link Posted: 10/29/2009 3:33:42 PM EST
Any word on stage designs?

I'm guessing I'm in (I haven't heard either way, and I sent my app in last week), and I think I'll shoot a second gun and sign up for that on Saturday. In addition to a subgun, I'll shoot a semi-auto carbine –– just for more trigger time.
Link Posted: 10/29/2009 5:58:41 PM EST
Originally Posted By MP5_guy:
Any word on stage designs?

I'm guessing I'm in (I haven't heard either way, and I sent my app in last week), and I think I'll shoot a second gun and sign up for that on Saturday. In addition to a subgun, I'll shoot a semi-auto carbine –– just for more trigger time.


IMHO its very possible to win this match outright with a semi-auto. I'll be interested to see how your semi runs compare to your SMG runs.
Link Posted: 10/31/2009 1:51:24 PM EST
Great match. Thanks to the staff and the sponsors (Dillon Precision, Admiral Products and Lage Mfg.) . I got a free Dillon Aero shirt and Lancer 30 round magazine in the drawing...bonus.

The last time I shot the match was in 2007 and the stages left much to be desired. This years stages were greatly improved (except for stage 1).

Since I didn't stand a chance on winning, I didn't stick around for the results. Who won?
Link Posted: 10/31/2009 3:27:34 PM EST
Originally Posted By AZ3GUNNER:

Since I didn't stand a chance on winning, I didn't stick around for the results. Who won?


The guy who designed stage 1. Really.

Link Posted: 10/31/2009 8:32:03 PM EST
Originally Posted By MP5_guy:
The guy who designed stage 1. Really.




To be fair, the guy got handed that stage concept and made the best of a not-so-great idea. He shot well across the whole match to take first place. I think there is a consensus that we will want to avoid that kind of stage in future matches. I hope everyone enjoyed the rest of the stages... I know I did .
Link Posted: 10/31/2009 8:08:19 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/31/2009 8:09:27 PM EST by AZ3GUNNER]
Results are up.

Results

One death jam on stage 4 and my optic shutting down and jams on stage 1 pretty much did me in. Everything else except 1 penalty on stage 2 went well. Too bad they don't go with percentage. Too much weight was given to stage 1 and that was the stage that would make or break you. Hopefully they do away with silly stages like that in the future.
Link Posted: 10/31/2009 8:34:04 PM EST
Originally Posted By AZ3GUNNER:
Too bad they don't go with percentage. Too much weight was given to stage 1 and that was the stage that would make or break you. Hopefully they do away with silly stages like that in the future.


I agree, and I will work on selling the idea of normalized stage scores so no single stage dominates the match outcome in the future.

I have uploaded video of the match to YouTube.
Link Posted: 10/31/2009 8:48:11 PM EST
I burned thru more than 830 rounds.
I am whupped.
I had to convince the wifey that it really wasn't just gratuitous hosing.
At least I don't think I finished last.

Oh yeah, and our "driver" / RO on stage3 said she had the most fun with ME as her passenger.
Eat yer hearts out.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 1:25:01 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2009 1:25:31 PM EST by StealthyBlagga]
Lage Manufacturing generously sponsored a special prize - The Lage Challenge Trophy. I was the lucky recipient by virtue of being the highest placed MAX-11 shooter (I took second place overall at the match). The prize is a special trophy and a $100 Lage gift certificate. Thanks Richard - I'll be salivating over your website today .

Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:12:00 PM EST
Oh yeah, and our "driver" / RO on stage3 said she had the most fun with ME as her passenger.
Eat yer hearts out.


Hey, that's what she told me.

While I think shooting out of a moving vehicle is a great stage prop, that one added a variable that wasn't controlled by mother nature or the shooter – another person. The times are also determined on how fast she drove. I know you could tell her to go fast or slow but it could never be consistent shooter to shooter. It wouldn’t have been so bad if the golf cart only had 2 speeds (stop and go) and the shooter should be controlling that. The roller coaster stage in the 2007 SMM3G is a great example of a consistent moving vehicle but that would’ve been a monstrosity to set up for this match. I know, it’s only a subgun match and I’m just getting picky.

Link Posted: 11/3/2009 9:38:53 AM EST
Great shooting Stealthy!

I'd like to say a big THANKS to the sponsors and everyone who was involved in putting the match together. This was my third year to attend, and I've enjoyed every single one.
I didn't show up with my "A" game proving once again that luck is sometimes better than skill.
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