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Posted: 7/17/2008 1:36:27 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/22/2008 6:25:18 PM EST by jonnybravo]
I just got a 1911 in .45 acp. i am trying to find a good HP carry load and need some ideas. i tried Taurus's solid copper hex round (185G).... it was a nogo, wouldnt cycle and i kept jamming the bullet back into the casing. i tried federal Hydra shok (230g), cycles great but it has a lot more recoil, bang, and a fireball about the size of a softball. i an not a fan of hornadae rounds.... had some poor performance with thier rounds. any suggestions and reccomendations?


looking for a good load without a fireball the size of a softball


Note: i did read the artice at the top on self defense ammo, however i dont have either the time or the funds to do so scientific a study myself.
Link Posted: 7/17/2008 1:58:05 PM EST
Winchester Ranger T 230gr also available as +P, Federal HST 230gr also available as +P, Federal Tactical Bonded 230gr +P, Speer Gold Dot 230gr.
Link Posted: 7/17/2008 2:07:23 PM EST
i have been looking at federal HST... but im lookingat a 2-4 week backorder. And i had a bad experience with gold dot... not to mention hydra shok outperformend it by a mile. i will check the ranger T for sure.
Link Posted: 7/17/2008 2:09:11 PM EST

Originally Posted By 87GN:
Winchester Ranger T 230gr also available as +P . . .


+1 - Winchester TA45T or RA45TP
Link Posted: 7/17/2008 2:12:49 PM EST

Originally Posted By jonnybravo:
i have been looking at federal HST... but im lookingat a 2-4 week backorder. And i had a bad experience with gold dot... not to mention hydra shok outperformend it by a mile. i will check the ranger T for sure.


How does hydrashok outperform gold dot?
Link Posted: 7/17/2008 3:01:12 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/17/2008 3:03:42 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/17/2008 3:04:04 PM EST by PBIR]
I've been running TAP but my 1991A1 eats it all. I haven't been able to find a HP it won't cycle.
Link Posted: 7/17/2008 4:21:21 PM EST

230 Grain Gold Dot
230 Grain HST
230 Grain Win-T

Pick one, I don't care which. My preference is for the Gold Dot due to availability.
Link Posted: 7/17/2008 4:23:10 PM EST
tested gold dot Vs. hydrs shok and a number of other rounds in wet newspaper for an even comparison 9mm same gun same day. Also had issues with casings on gold dot they started showing a lines at the base of the bullet and cracking.

Gold dot 115g expanded to .664 for about 87.042% expansion over origional size
Hyra shok 135g expanded to .768 for about 116.338% expansion over origional size.
Link Posted: 7/17/2008 4:30:02 PM EST
185 grain federal hydra-shok....one hell of a hot round..my new agent loves it
Link Posted: 7/17/2008 8:19:29 PM EST
200gr +P Gold Dots
Link Posted: 7/17/2008 8:20:57 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/17/2008 8:23:42 PM EST by Mikhail_86]

Originally Posted By Essayons:

Originally Posted By 87GN:
Winchester Ranger T 230gr also available as +P . . .


+1 - Winchester TA45T or RA45TP


Where the hell are you finding Ranger T series? Online?

ETA: I have Hydrashoks in both my 1911's and love 'em
Link Posted: 7/17/2008 11:22:24 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/18/2008 1:53:52 AM EST by ecgRN]
I met a very nice man online. We exchanged goods for currency. I'm set.

Keep an eye on the EE...




Link Posted: 7/18/2008 2:39:21 AM EST
Link Posted: 7/18/2008 9:32:28 AM EST

Originally Posted By SGB:

Originally Posted By jonnybravo:
tested gold dot Vs. hydrs shok and a number of other rounds in wet newspaper for an even comparison 9mm same gun same day. Also had issues with casings on gold dot they started showing a lines at the base of the bullet and cracking.

Gold dot 115g expanded to .664 for about 87.042% expansion over origional size
Hyra shok 135g expanded to .768 for about 116.338% expansion over origional size.


......... so much more scientific than ballistic gelatin.


Well then, the hydroshock is the round you need when defending yourself against rouge phone books.


I shall rush to the gun store immediately to purchase this wonderful ammo! There was a suspicious looking phone book waiting to ambush me in my driveway just yesterday!
Link Posted: 7/18/2008 12:27:30 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/18/2008 5:48:51 PM EST

Originally Posted By Zhukov:
Please read the post "BEST CHOICES FOR SELF DEFENSE AMMO" tacked at the top of the page.


this is why I think before a thread can be posted, A mod needs to review it before it can be seen by everyone
Link Posted: 7/18/2008 9:37:26 PM EST

Originally Posted By jonnybravo:
tested gold dot Vs. hydrs shok and a number of other rounds in wet newspaper for an even comparison 9mm same gun same day. Also had issues with casings on gold dot they started showing a lines at the base of the bullet and cracking.

Gold dot 115g expanded to .664 for about 87.042% expansion over origional size
Hyra shok 135g expanded to .768 for about 116.338% expansion over origional size.


So you are going to choose 1980s technology that is known for plugging up with clothing when fired on the two-way range over a bullet that is reputable, has excellent weight retention and is bonded.

I just don't know what to tell you.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 6:57:33 PM EST

Originally Posted By vanilla_gorilla:

Originally Posted By jonnybravo:
tested gold dot Vs. hydrs shok and a number of other rounds in wet newspaper for an even comparison 9mm same gun same day. Also had issues with casings on gold dot they started showing a lines at the base of the bullet and cracking.

Gold dot 115g expanded to .664 for about 87.042% expansion over origional size
Hyra shok 135g expanded to .768 for about 116.338% expansion over origional size.


So you are going to choose 1980s technology that is known for plugging up with clothing when fired on the two-way range over a bullet that is reputable, has excellent weight retention and is bonded.

I just don't know what to tell you.


Big +1
Link Posted: 7/20/2008 3:51:54 PM EST

Need a new round for my 1911


Oh...I was going to say 10mm Auto.

I like the HSTs and Gold Dots out of all of my Pistolas, including my .45 ACP.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:41:41 PM EST
im insulted. Despite the fact that phone book is not ballistic gelatin as long at the comparison is apples to apples in the same medium it gives me a round to round comparison on funationality. besides ballistic gelatin is only an approximation of average tissue in an average human bieng and does not account for differences in muscle layering or bone upon bullet impact. So there goes your "scientific" theroy on balliatic gelation.

Originally Posted By SGB:

Originally Posted By jonnybravo:
tested gold dot Vs. hydrs shok and a number of other rounds in wet newspaper for an even comparison 9mm same gun same day. Also had issues with casings on gold dot they started showing a lines at the base of the bullet and cracking.

Gold dot 115g expanded to .664 for about 87.042% expansion over origional size
Hyra shok 135g expanded to .768 for about 116.338% expansion over origional size.


......... so much more scientific than ballistic gelatin.


Well then, the hydroshock is the round you need when defending yourself against rouge phone books.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:44:44 PM EST
i shall have to retry the gold dot in my 1911. i know it is a good round, my main issue was with the casing issues i had. its worth a shot and its just gonna take time to see if they will last in my mags.

Thanks
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 3:19:10 AM EST
I've been very happy with the Federal HST in my Springer.
Ballistic tests show it to be one of the top performing rounds, it's much cheaper than most other defense ammo, and you can get it in +P or standard pressures.

I need to pick up another 2 boxes sometime soon.
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 6:09:49 AM EST

Originally Posted By jonnybravo:
im insulted. Despite the fact that phone book is not ballistic gelatin as long at the comparison is apples to apples in the same medium it gives me a round to round comparison on funationality. besides ballistic gelatin is only an approximation of average tissue in an average human bieng and does not account for differences in muscle layering or bone upon bullet impact. So there goes your "scientific" theroy on balliatic gelation.


Your testing was flawed in some way. Gold dot > Hydrasuck. This has been proven from ballistic gelatin to real world applications. There's a reason why Federal doesn't market the Hydrasuck to LE any more.
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 6:32:27 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/22/2008 6:32:57 AM EST by Zhukov]
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 8:26:38 PM EST

Originally Posted By 87GN:

Originally Posted By jonnybravo:
im insulted. Despite the fact that phone book is not ballistic gelatin as long at the comparison is apples to apples in the same medium it gives me a round to round comparison on funationality. besides ballistic gelatin is only an approximation of average tissue in an average human bieng and does not account for differences in muscle layering or bone upon bullet impact. So there goes your "scientific" theroy on balliatic gelation.


Your testing was flawed in some way. Gold dot > Hydrasuck. This has been proven from ballistic gelatin to real world applications. There's a reason why Federal doesn't market the Hydrasuck to LE any more.


Check out my post from a little while ago. This poll was geared towards law enforcement. The poll speaks for itself if you ask me......

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=76&t=680904
Link Posted: 7/22/2008 8:48:40 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/22/2008 8:49:35 PM EST by ecgRN]
I just voted and tied all it up...

two
Link Posted: 7/23/2008 6:10:09 AM EST
Link Posted: 7/23/2008 2:11:43 PM EST
sounds like the OP has a finicky-feeding 1911..

I could argue that the Remington 230gr Golden Saber features the best overall feed profile of all the premium loads, and excellent terminal ballistics to match
Link Posted: 8/2/2008 4:47:06 PM EST
bump
Link Posted: 8/3/2008 7:59:58 AM EST

Originally Posted By Rampant_Colt:
sounds like the OP has a finicky-feeding 1911..

I could argue that the Remington 230gr Golden Saber features the best overall feed profile of all the premium loads, and excellent terminal ballistics to match


I agree that he has a finicky 1911.

I wouldn't recommend any HP for carry until those feeding issues were sorted out. GS might work most of the time, or it might not...

Is this a PT1911?
Link Posted: 8/3/2008 8:06:54 AM EST
I've seen the HST, Ranger-T, Gold Dot, Hydrashok, and Golden Saber all in regular bare gel, denim covered gel, and through auto glass into gel thanks to an ATK demonstration at our department range.


HST and Ranger-T impressed me most with consistent expansion and penetration. Gold Dot was good in the respect that it's bonded jacket held it together, watched the HST and Ranger-T both lose it's jacket on 1 or 2 occasions through auto glass but they still had some expansion.

A fully expanded HST is an awesome sight.


My vote is HST first and Ranger-T second.




Try to get your gun working with 1 of those two loads, they seem to have good jacket profiles as they stand now so it would concern me that your gun doesn't feed them.
Link Posted: 8/3/2008 2:39:57 PM EST

Originally Posted By jonnybravo:

Note: I tried Federal HST and Winchester white box Personal defense hp rounds. Both failed to function. they nosed down and jammed the gun the first 3-4 rounds. was using Star mags and taurus mags. taurus functioned slightly better but not by much. all fed hardball flawlessly.


Get a Wilson and a CM Power mag...

Buy lots of which ever one works.
Link Posted: 8/4/2008 11:26:13 AM EST
ANy of those I would not want to be on the receiving end that is for sure. Pick the one that works in your gun.
Link Posted: 8/4/2008 9:12:05 PM EST
In your poll I would replace the Hydra Shock with the Corbon DPX, and then choose whichever feeds best in your firearm.
Link Posted: 8/7/2008 6:20:06 AM EST
I know corbon DPX is a great round, but the most wt i can get is 185, and i wanted to stick with 230.

Originally Posted By Buck_Naked:
In your poll I would replace the Hydra Shock with the Corbon DPX, and then choose whichever feeds best in your firearm.
Link Posted: 8/7/2008 6:41:11 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/7/2008 6:33:05 PM EST
yes, but i still dont like the lighter bulelts. plus it may not match up with how my target ammo shoots because of the weight.

Originally Posted By Zhukov:
The reason the DPX is 185gr is due to its solid copper construction. It's a long bullet even at 185gr. The "slow and heavy" approach is usually a good indicator, but in this case, 185gr is just fine if that's what you're worries about.
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