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Posted: 3/7/2005 4:59:43 PM EST
Not even a year ago ten-round .45 mags were "only" about $35. Now all I can find are 12 rounders for $55. What has increased the price so much?

I know this will start some kind of HK bashing, and I know that some of the price is in the name. But there must be a real reason.
Link Posted: 3/7/2005 5:49:48 PM EST
[Last Edit: 3/7/2005 5:50:17 PM EST by JSIG]

Originally Posted By bcw107:
I know that some of the price is in the name.



You said it all right there. There is nothing unearthly, exotic, or even special about the construction of HK mags that make them any greater than those made by other high quality manufacturers. Like everything else HK, you are payng for the name. They are undoubtedly a great firearm, and I own a USP, but the cost is in the name.
Link Posted: 3/7/2005 6:14:38 PM EST
Look I love HKs, but let's call a spade a spade. HK knows that we will drop a lot more money for the sake of owning one of the best pistols made in the world and they stick it to us on the price. And since they know we will pay more for the pistols, they take it one step further and stick it to us again on the accessories. EVERY damned thing with HK on it costs more. We know that going in and we have a choice to make, buy a completely functional and adequate pistol like a Glock at 2/3s the price, or buy the HK. We choose to buy the HK so is it any surprise that a company not ashamed to give us high (some say over) priced guns with mediocre customer service would turn around and charge us double what the mags are worth? We may bitch about it, but we pay it, and that is exactly what HK is counting on. They couldn't care less how much we bitch so long as we buy, and buy we do.
Link Posted: 3/7/2005 6:17:36 PM EST

Originally Posted By Big-Bore:
Look I love HKs, but let's call a spade a spade. HK knows that we will drop a lot more money for the sake of owning one of the best pistols made in the world and they stick it to us on the price. And since they know we will pay more for the pistols, they take it one step further and stick it to us again on the accessories. EVERY damned thing with HK on it costs more. We know that going in and we have a choice to make, buy a completely functional and adequate pistol like a Glock at 2/3s the price, or buy the HK. We choose to buy the HK so is it any surprise that a company not ashamed to give us high (some say over) priced guns with mediocre customer service would turn around and charge us double what the mags are worth? We may bitch about it, but we pay it, and that is exactly what HK is counting on. They couldn't care less how much we bitch so long as we buy, and buy we do.



well said
Link Posted: 3/8/2005 2:01:54 AM EST
Yeah!

[sarcasm]...And why does my Ferrari's gas tank cost so much too? [/sarcasm]


Link Posted: 3/8/2005 2:59:11 AM EST
Same reason that you pay more for Mercedes, the car, and accessories. Some sell large numbers for less, others sell less for more...

Nobody is forced to buy a particular car or gun, so, yes Big-Bore is right, they (HK, Mercedes, and others) do it because they can .
Link Posted: 3/8/2005 6:48:56 PM EST
hk isnt the best right now for me as it is............ too many problems. muzzleflip and felt recoil are insane in the 9mm. I hate to try a .45 just cause of that.
Link Posted: 3/9/2005 12:10:00 AM EST

Originally Posted By Voldermortist:
hk isnt the best right now for me as it is............ too many problems. muzzleflip and felt recoil are insane in the 9mm. I hate to try a .45 just cause of that.



I had the same problem with the 9mm but I tried the 40 and 45 and man I can tell there is a lot of diffarance I can shoot the 40 better then the 9mm and you can hardley notice the muzzel flip and the recoils is not that bad compared the Glock or Sig.

The 45 is great thier is hardley any muzzel flip and the recoil on it is hardley felt at all it just kind of push's back and straight so there is really no muzzel flip.

Try these two out and you will notice the differance in the way they both shoot and feel, I had to stick with the USP40Compact due to me haveing small hand's but I can shoot the shit out of it and hit everything I aim at and put the round where it need's to go.
Link Posted: 3/9/2005 12:33:42 PM EST
A few years ago a gun shop in town was going out of business. they had USP .45 mags NIW for 22 bucks. I bought a bunch. It will be a long time before I drop 55 to 60 bucks just to gain 2 more rounds.
Link Posted: 3/11/2005 12:06:58 PM EST
[Last Edit: 3/11/2005 12:07:12 PM EST by Stottman]
Because they cost so much to make.

German labor is expensive. The minimum wage in Germany is over $13 USD an hour (at current exchange rates). Thats for some guy working in McDonalds, not a factory worker.

Something you also forget is currency exchange. The dollar is allot less against the Euro (whats used in Germany) then it was 3 years ago, even a year ago. Before 9-11, it was $1 buys 1.20 . Now, $1 buys .75 Euro. It hit a low about 3 months ago, when $1 buys .68 Euro.
Link Posted: 3/13/2005 7:07:08 PM EST
it's a $800 gun. $55 dollars isn't that bad for a magazine. this is like the people that buy corvettes and then complain because the tires that go on it are more expensive than the tires that fit on a corolla.
Link Posted: 3/13/2005 7:10:01 PM EST
[Last Edit: 3/13/2005 7:10:30 PM EST by AssaultRifler]

Originally Posted By Stottman:
Because they cost so much to make.

German labor is expensive. The minimum wage in Germany is over $13 USD an hour (at current exchange rates). Thats for some guy working in McDonalds, not a factory worker.

Something you also forget is currency exchange. The dollar is allot less against the Euro (whats used in Germany) then it was 3 years ago, even a year ago. Before 9-11, it was $1 buys 1.20 . Now, $1 buys .75 Euro. It hit a low about 3 months ago, when $1 buys .68 Euro.




All that is true, but I'm betting USP magazines are made by machine not by hand. Final assembly might be by hand but that only consists of slapping in a follower, spring and floorplate, a person could assemble over 100 per hour easily
Link Posted: 3/14/2005 8:24:55 AM EST
Actually, you would be suprised the amount of labor that goes into a magazine.
Link Posted: 3/14/2005 8:44:43 AM EST
What's all involved in making one ?
Link Posted: 3/14/2005 8:22:40 PM EST
[Last Edit: 3/14/2005 8:25:40 PM EST by Stottman]

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:
What's all involved in making one ?



I have toured the HK factory in Germany a couple times (they give free tours to LE and Mil on request).

Here is what I saw for USP mags.

Bare in the white stamping is stamped, cut, welded (pretty much by hand), then
put in this big tumbler (to smooth everything or something like that), heat treated, then finally finished. Only then does it go to some assembler to have the other parts added.

The injection molding (for the follower) is pretty much automatic.

Spring, I dont know. Didnt see them make any, so perhaps they are sub contracted out.

Also, then remember that you have to tack on the cost of importation, import taxes, costs of running a US office, shipping to the dealer, and finally his cut (normal retail profit margin is 20-40%, though gun and gun items seem to be way different).
Link Posted: 3/15/2005 1:57:07 AM EST
That's cool information. I'm guessing Glock mags are pretty much made the same way and involve the same labor and sell for less than $20. And made in Austria too. Maybe Glock has bigger economies of scale than HK.
Link Posted: 3/15/2005 7:05:48 AM EST

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:
That's cool information. I'm guessing Glock mags are pretty much made the same way and involve the same labor and sell for less than $20. And made in Austria too. Maybe Glock has bigger economies of scale than HK.



Comparing the two is apples and oranges. The Glock mags are plastic, with a metal liner. The .45 USP mags are all metal.
Link Posted: 3/15/2005 9:37:32 AM EST

Originally Posted By Stottman:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:
That's cool information. I'm guessing Glock mags are pretty much made the same way and involve the same labor and sell for less than $20. And made in Austria too. Maybe Glock has bigger economies of scale than HK.



Comparing the two is apples and oranges. The Glock mags are plastic, with a metal liner. The .45 USP mags are all metal.



The 9mm and .40 mags are plastic though and still cost roughly $40 US.
Link Posted: 3/15/2005 11:12:49 AM EST

Originally Posted By Alien:

Originally Posted By Stottman:

Originally Posted By AssaultRifler:
That's cool information. I'm guessing Glock mags are pretty much made the same way and involve the same labor and sell for less than $20. And made in Austria too. Maybe Glock has bigger economies of scale than HK.



Comparing the two is apples and oranges. The Glock mags are plastic, with a metal liner. The .45 USP mags are all metal.



The 9mm and .40 mags are plastic though and still cost roughly $40 US.



No reason why HK couldn't contract out USP mag production to Glock in Austria and knock some $ off their mags unless it really costs the same as Glock to make their mags, more or less, and they don't want to give up the excess profit they make off their own USP mags
Link Posted: 3/15/2005 11:19:08 AM EST
Ever notice there are never any in stock at most places who carry them at $55/mag? It's either two things happening:

1) They are not making enough mags overall for the US market and DEMAND is VERY VERY high, so the price can be very, very high.

OR

2) The demand is so high naturally that even at the $55/mag price that there is no reason to lower the price as they would be losing a profit margin for no reason.

Either way the price seems to keep them selling so why change? Would you?
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