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Posted: 8/24/2004 7:01:09 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/24/2004 11:25:29 AM EST by _DR]
My three worst were:

Norinco 9mm Tokarev 213 replica - $179 new - it was a jam-omatic
Llama 1911 .45 - $215 new - stovepipe-omatic
S&W 9mm SW9M compact - $229 new - painted black finish, really bad mag release design (press two tabs at base of magazine - almost required two hands) and jammed constantly. Glock sued S&W for design infringment on this pistol and won. The model was discontinued. To their credit S&W sent me a new model 908 which worked fine after I sent the SW9M in for "repair".

Having learned that you usually get what you pay for with handguns, I now own only SigArms and Heckler & Koch handguns.

What were your worst handguns?
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 9:19:05 AM EST
HK USP 45 V1 full size...


Sat too far out of the hand making it point very akwardly and took forever to "find" the sights when presenting from the holster. Then there is the crappy double action trigger that is among the wost of any double action pistol I have ever fired, especially compared to the years I spent being spoiled by fine S&W revolvers with smooth triggers from high round counts.


Only thing the HK had going for it was it was rugged. As for speed in operating, accuracy, and being a gun that I could quickly get rounds on target with, the HK USP was NOT THE GUN FOR ME. I was better off with my Para Ordinance P14, quicker, more accurate, and the thing holds more ammo as well.
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 9:36:42 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/24/2004 9:39:45 AM EST by mjohn3006]
My true first handgun was a Davis P-380. 5 shot 380 auto made out of pot metal.

I still have it. probably will never get rid of it just because it was truly my first.

It bites the hell out of your thumb. No matter how carefull you are, you end the range time with a bloody thumb.

It jams. it jamed every other shot until I smoothed out the feed ramp. Now it goes 3-5 mags with no trouble, then it starts jamming every other shot.

The paint....yes PAINT, that is the finish is coming off.

I paid $120.

But I knew nothing of handguns. I was a poor college student who could barely believe he was dumping $120 into a gun.

If I am asked what my first handgun was I say my Ruger P89. Because that is one of the best 9mm ever created by God. IMHO

I just concider the Davis a novilty. And a collectors item cause the company went under
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 10:18:31 AM EST

Originally Posted By _DR:
Llama 1911 .45 - $215 new - stovepipe-omatic



A friend has this same gun and the only shortcomings it has is with winclean ammo. At 5' it fails to print on a 16"x16" target. Its fine with any other ammo though.
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 10:42:38 AM EST
my worst was a davis 380 as well. i bought it used for $50. this was my first internet auction purchase. you could not hit the side of a barn with it from 5 yards away. i soon got rid of it. it does "bite the thumb" more often than a normal handgun should. i never had jamming issues, but i did not keep it for very long.
mp
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 10:46:09 AM EST
Kahr p9? small frame 9mm for concealed. Trigger felt like you were trying to pull a bus.
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 11:37:54 AM EST
My Walther P22 5-inch Target Model. About $300. Constant FTF, FTE, Double Feeds. It just plain sucks. My mother liked it so I pre-ordered one, BIG mistake. Never buy a gun your mother likes I have allways looked up specs and reviews before buying a gun, but not with this one
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 11:48:45 AM EST
Grendel P12.
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 3:32:14 PM EST
Bersa Thunder .380. Paid $200 for it. Less than 200 rounds fired when the trigger broke. What a piece of crap. Been sitting in the safe for nearly two years now. I should just sell it for parts.
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 3:44:54 PM EST
S&W Sigma a few years back when they first came out and Glock went after them. The Sigam flat sucked. Ended up tradeing it and a Daewoo DR-200 for a Fairly nice pre-ban AR
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 4:00:32 PM EST
I have to agree, S+W Sigma...What a POS compared to any of the 5 Glocks I now own. I sold it to finance a very sweet Browning MK III Hi Power
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 4:00:47 PM EST
S-W mod 39
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 4:15:41 PM EST
I've only had two "bad" guns. One was a KT P-11. Super long and heavy trigger pull that I could have thrown it at an intruder faster than pulling that damn trigger. The trigger bar spring kept coming loose and I finally sold it.
The other was my first Kahr PM9 before Kahr replaced it with a working one. Even after breaking it in, and 300rds later the failure to chamber and the slide locking back after almost each shot drove me nuts. Kahr reluctantly replaced it and I got a mag for my shipping costs.
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 5:31:53 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 5:55:31 PM EST
S&W 22A: $200 and it jams, stovepipes, and FTEs every other round with everything except Remington. The thing is barely a gun.

Cheers
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 6:03:14 PM EST

Originally Posted By hound:
Kahr p9? small frame 9mm for concealed. Trigger felt like you were trying to pull a bus.



Heh. I was going to say that I never had a bad pistol, but I do have to ditto the above statement. I had a K9 for about six months before it was traded for a Glock 27 and the trigger was freakishly heavy. Yeah, I know I should have taken it to a 'smith, but that's water under the bridge.

I still LITERALLY have dreams (nightmares?) about trying to pull that damn trigger.

Overall, it was a neat little gun, but I guess it DID get traded for a reason so I'll mention it on this thread.
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 7:32:34 PM EST
As far as handguns go? Beretta Brigadier Model 92. It was actually a fine gun. I've never bothered spending hard earned money on "cheap" guns. And that was the bottom rung. My HK's are very nice, as are the Colts, the Kimber and the Smith. All have been excellent.

Worst gun was probably a norinco SKS, paid 75 dollars for it in 1992. Got about 150 for it in 2003.
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 7:55:11 PM EST
My first 9mm... I belive the brand was called "Stallard" or some such...

It was FRIGGEN HUGE... and had like a 9 round capacity... I bought it for 150 dollars, and dont recall to this day what I ever did with it.
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 8:36:58 PM EST

Originally Posted By TheSaint2004:
My Walther P22 5-inch Target Model. About $300. Constant FTF, FTE, Double Feeds. It just plain sucks. My mother liked it so I pre-ordered one, BIG mistake. Never buy a gun your mother likes I have allways looked up specs and reviews before buying a gun, but not with this one



I have one with the 3.4 and 5in barrels. Its the worst pistol I have owned so far.
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 8:50:53 PM EST
Bit of a sore point with me at the moment!!

Leastwise most of you guys had problems with cheap handguns (no offense).

A recent, expensive problem for me was a Walther P99 (with a S&W made slide) in .40S&W. It cost about $500. It would occasionally fail to go fully into battery, which wasn’t too bad since a slight push on the back of the slide would solve that.

Far worse was the fact that – with both mags – the bullet would sometimes hang up on the bottom of the feed ramp as the slide went forward. This was impossible to clear without removing the magazine.

I guess I could have gotten those problems solved. But I also found that based on how I held the pistol, the inside of the triggerguard abraded my triggerfinger unmercifully when firing double action.

I finally sold it at a substantial loss.

Honorable (actually dishonorable) mention to:

Astra 600 I bought from Montgomery Ward in the late 1960’s for maybe $30. While very well built, the trigger was incredibly heavy and long. Plus, being a straight blowback 9MM, the recoil was savage!

S&W Model 25 .45 ACP revolver. It had cylinder endshake NIB. Plus the rear sight was mounted too high, making it impossible to get the sights adjusted to point of impact.

S&W Model 669 9MM semi. Hammer frequently fell into the half cock notch when pulling the trigger (and expecting it to go off).
Link Posted: 8/24/2004 9:03:39 PM EST
I've never owned a bad handgun, but I suppose the "worst," if I had to choose, was also te first--a .22 Ruger MK I. Shoot a couple hundred rounds through it without cleaning and the damn thing would start to jam. My SIGs never did that.
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 8:08:42 AM EST
Springfield 1911 v-10 ultra compact ( ported ). I had FTE, FTF, the slide stop rounded off and it would not lock the slide back, the two tone finish was starting to oxidize. I have talked to 3 other v-10 owners who said the same thing. I sent it in , 1 month later i had it back. Traded it for a GLOCK the next day.
I had a Llama mini-max 45 b/c it was like $200 at a show and i wanted to see how bad it really was. That thing ran like a champ. I fed it everything. It was accurate and reliable. After 4K or so the front site fell off. other than that it was worth the $200.JMO


J
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 9:02:56 AM EST
Hmmmm. I've never experienced a single problem with my Springfield Utra Comp V10.

Also saw the Kel-Tec P11 mentioned above -- I really like mine. I've put a couple thousand trouble-free rounds through it and can draw from concealment and hit faster & more accurately than with most of my other guns. BUT, it is definitely not for everyone. Although it works well for me, I think the trigger design & short sight radius don't exactly give it universal appeal.

There's only 1 bad handgun I ever owned and it's the sole exception to my "sell no guns" policy. A Jennings-Bryco .380. It belonged to a coworker and he was afraid it would jump out of the box in the middle of the night and hunt his children down so he asked if I'd help him get rid of it. I showed him what it was worth on the internet and said I'd take it off his hands for $35 but he'd be better off selling it at a fun show. Well, he took my $35 offer. I shot it once and found it to be a jam-o-matic, so I sold it myself at a fun show for $90.
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 9:06:55 AM EST
got 2:

Astra A80. First handgun I owned. I bought it because it looks like a Sig 226. Less than 50 rounds before the slide stop broke. Sent it back for warranty work, another 20 or so rounds and the hammer broke...back to teh factory....another 40 rounds and slide stop broke again. It went into the lake.

This is the one that still PISSES ME OFF. I special ordered a Colt 1911 Ser 80 in .40sw. Slide would lock back after nearly every shot, ftf, fte--never once got thru a full magazine. It went back to the factory for repairs 3 times in the year I owned it. I sold it to an older gentleman in Boulder CO for $250. I told him how it didn't shoot fer shit and nobody seemed to be able to find anything wrong with it. He emailed me about a month later, seems that the frame was mis-machined or something...why didn't they catch that at the warranty dept? I won't own any Colt product made after 1990 for this reason.
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 9:30:36 AM EST

Originally Posted By captainpooby:
Grendel P12.



yeah, me too. got it in trade, looked small and flat. Mine FTF about every other round, and the trigger is crap!
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 1:51:18 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 1:57:53 PM EST


J-22 Jennings...




i should have never bought this POS, i didnt know any better back then
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 2:10:56 PM EST

Originally Posted By kpel308:
Norinco Tokarev. Funny about that, as the Norinco .45 1911 I had was the best shooter I've ever owned.

Sorry, Lumpy!



Considering that the 1911 is at least a reliable design, even being made by a ChiCom manufacturer like Norinco, stands to reason it would be a better pistol than a pre-WWII Russian designed ChiCom made pistol like the Tokarev 213.
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 2:41:32 PM EST

Originally Posted By Moe-Ron:
S&W 22A: $200 and it jams, stovepipes, and FTEs every other round with everything except Remington. The thing is barely a gun.

Cheers

Odd, mine has been very reliable. Not a single problem I can think of. It's very accurate for a $200 gun, too. Outshoots me everytime.
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 2:44:46 PM EST
Ruger P-95. It handled recoil better than any other gun I have ever shot, and was utterly reliable. The problem was the stupid mag release. Every time I pulled it from my waistband, my pants would release the mag.
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 2:47:38 PM EST

Originally Posted By captainpooby:
Grendel P12.



Isn't that the precursor to the Kel-Tec P11? I saw one of those a few years back. If I remember correctly, it had an internal 12-round magazine that had to be loaded from the bottom. It was a .380, right
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 2:57:32 PM EST

Originally Posted By lu380:

Originally Posted By captainpooby:
Grendel P12.



Isn't that the precursor to the Kel-Tec P11? I saw one of those a few years back. If I remember correctly, it had an internal 12-round magazine that had to be loaded from the bottom. It was a .380, right



Both were designed by George Kelgren. The Grendel P-10 had a fixed mag fed from the top with a stripper clip. The P-12 had a detachable box mag.
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 3:09:00 PM EST
Taurus revolver one of the first'ns . Bigtime lead shaver , junk . $100.00 in 1984 . They have come along way now they say................
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 3:19:43 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/25/2004 3:20:22 PM EST by BallisticTip]
A Jennings, POS jamomatic .22, threw it into the fucking river.
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 3:46:34 PM EST
About 15 years ago I bought a S&W wondernine.It was about the size of a colt commander ,all stainless with a doublestack mag.fit and finish was pretty good and it went bang every time but the trigger was horrible.Double action (first shot) must have been 18-20 lbs and following shots with the hammer cocked still must have been 12-14 lbs. It went top dollar-$400+ and I could have bought any revolver they made for the price. Local gusmith tried but felt so bad he wouldn't even charge me.I bought a 1000 round case of ammo and myself and a buddy shot and loaded mags for each other thinking it would smooth out some. we raised some horrible blisters but didn't do s***.About five years later I traded towards a ruger O/U Shotty ,think they only gave me $145 for it.I couldn't bring myself to sell it to anyone I knew.Trigger was so bad I couldn't get more than 3 or 4 hits on a paper plate at 30' with a 14 round mag
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 3:50:02 PM EST

Originally Posted By Taxman:

Originally Posted By TheSaint2004:
My Walther P22 5-inch Target Model. About $300. Constant FTF, FTE, Double Feeds. It just plain sucks. My mother liked it so I pre-ordered one, BIG mistake.



I have one with the 3.4 and 5in barrels. Its the worst pistol I have owned so far.



+2

It was such a pos, I sold it in less than a month after having bought it, when they first came out and were hot.

It went to the range twice. FTF, FTE, PMO (pissed me off).... It had to go!
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 4:21:26 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/25/2004 4:24:13 PM EST by RSF45]
Originally Posted By hound:
Kahr p9? small frame 9mm for concealed. Trigger felt like you were trying to pull a bus.[/quote]

I have a Kahr MK9, good gun, I like it but man the trigger SUCKS !

O, worst handgun, Astra 45. Inaccurate as hell and constant feed problems.
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 4:22:20 PM EST
Raven .22, $ 75.00. Piece of shit.
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 4:33:13 PM EST
I didn't own it, but delivered a .38 Davis derringer to my Dad. It had a 40 pound trigger pull and not enough weight even for a medium load. It turned my trigger finger into hamburger in 10 rounds. I could hit a B-27 target at 7 yards with one barrel, the second barrel probably hit the space shuttle. Total POS.

Link Posted: 8/25/2004 4:38:07 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/25/2004 4:40:51 PM EST by Noner]

Originally Posted By TheSaint2004:
My Walther P22 5-inch Target Model. About $300. Constant FTF, FTE, Double Feeds. It just plain sucks. My mother liked it so I pre-ordered one, BIG mistake. Never buy a gun your mother likes I have allways looked up specs and reviews before buying a gun, but not with this one I have one with the 3.4 and 5in barrels. Its the worst pistol I have owned so far.


+2

It was such a pos, I sold it in less than a month after having bought it, when they first came out and were hot.

It went to the range twice. FTF, FTE, PMO (pissed me off).... It had to go!



+3


I feel ya!

It was my first handgun purchase, and I loved that gun... but DAMN if the stupid thing didnt break every other round... even after proper "Hi-Vel" ammo and proper cleaning and breakdowns..

it seemed like it got worste the longer I owned it.

I eventually traded it for a NIB Ruger MKII 512 (Walther was gaurntee'd)

-Jason
Link Posted: 8/25/2004 8:51:01 PM EST

Originally Posted By CavVet:

Originally Posted By Taxman:

Originally Posted By TheSaint2004:
My Walther P22 5-inch Target Model. About $300. Constant FTF, FTE, Double Feeds. It just plain sucks. My mother liked it so I pre-ordered one, BIG mistake.



I have one with the 3.4 and 5in barrels. Its the worst pistol I have owned so far.



+2

It was such a pos, I sold it in less than a month after having bought it, when they first came out and were hot.

It went to the range twice. FTF, FTE, PMO (pissed me off).... It had to go!




Im thinking of selling mine, a friend wanted to buy it, but I didnt want to stick him with it.
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