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Posted: 2/17/2010 7:43:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/17/2010 9:55:29 AM EDT by WIZZO_ARAKM14]
I just realized that on the 2 5" Springfields I have on hand, at the moment at least, both have barrel bushings that can fall out they're so loose. No bushing wrench required. All I have to do is tilt the slide one way or another and jiggle and they'll fall out if the barrel and spring/plug are not present.

I also noticed that while reassembling them that the GI plug actually pushes the barrel bushings on both of them out a decent amount (I don't have my feeler gauges on me, but it's easily seen from the side). One of them pushes straight out, while the other levers the bottom of the bushing forward.

Granted, this isn't a huge amount, but if I had to guess, it might be .020"-.030" for both of them. Not sure about the slop between the bushings and the barrels, but they've got some wiggle room in there too. I'll see if I can get to Sears tonight and pick up some new feeler guages. I wish I had my digital caliper too.

Could this be why my groups with either of them aren't satisfactory or is this amount of slop normal? My newly purchased Champion LW GI can shoot much better groups (bull barrel) with a heavier/creapier trigger and less weight to calm down my non-stable hands and I'm shooting the same WWB out of them.

I guess I'm just wondering if your bushings have any wobble to them when there's no barrel/spring/GI plug installed.

Thanks

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Link Posted: 2/17/2010 8:01:30 AM EDT
mic the barel od and slide id. order a EGW custom bushing. Yor groups will be better.
Link Posted: 2/17/2010 8:54:43 AM EDT
what?
Link Posted: 2/17/2010 9:42:54 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Geohans:
what?


He means use a micrometer to measure the inside diameter of the slide and outside diameter of the barrel. That way they can custom build a bushing without having to send the gun in.
Link Posted: 2/17/2010 9:48:48 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Gregory_K:
mic the barel od and slide id. order a EGW custom bushing. Yor groups will be better.


That's actually a great idea.
Link Posted: 2/17/2010 10:15:04 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Gregory_K:
mic the barel od and slide id. order a EGW custom bushing. Yor groups will be better.


You would not just get an oversized bushing and fit it???? If you know how the fitted option would be my choice.
Link Posted: 2/17/2010 1:30:03 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/17/2010 4:21:03 PM EDT
Just got back from Sears with a new set of feeler gauges.

The bottom of the bushing (that holds in the spring plug) fits flush when I push it towards the back of the pistol and I can fit a .015" feeler under it when I pull it forward from the front of the slide on one pistol. It will fit .013" on the other one.

Both exibit signs of a couple thousanths slop for the actual barrel as well. Looks like a couple new bushings are in order.
Link Posted: 2/17/2010 4:52:53 PM EDT
How's your lower lug fit on those barrels? Can you push the barrel down at the hood while it's in battery?

A tight bushing may or may not be much help if your lower lugs have a sloppy fit, but at least they're a step in the right direction.
Link Posted: 2/17/2010 4:57:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Ammo_X_Fuzztone:
How's your lower lug fit on those barrels? Can you push the barrel down at the hood while it's in battery?

A tight bushing may or may not be much help if your lower lugs have a sloppy fit, but at least they're a step in the right direction.


They move, but barely. Just enough to see.

If I had to guess, maybe .003 or so. I really wish I had my damn digital caliper with me. It'd make some of these measurements easier.
Link Posted: 2/17/2010 5:01:08 PM EDT
Dial caliper's are like $20 at harbor Freight. Good enough for gun repair.

Briley also makes a spherical bearing bushing. If you shop EGW, get the angle bored one. Saves time.
Link Posted: 2/17/2010 5:29:30 PM EDT
I have a digital one at my parent's, but that's 250mi away at the moment.

I'll remember the EGW, they make good stuff and I've been wanting to order some other stuff from them.
Link Posted: 2/17/2010 7:23:52 PM EDT
So if one were to order a bushing from EGW, sized for Barrel O.D. and Slide I.D., and if one were not 100% clear on the "straight bored" vs. "angle bored" option that's available on EGW's website....
What would be the difference, if any?
Link Posted: 2/18/2010 2:54:18 AM EDT
Originally Posted By RifleCal30m1n00b:
So if one were to order a bushing from EGW, sized for Barrel O.D. and Slide I.D., and if one were not 100% clear on the "straight bored" vs. "angle bored" option that's available on EGW's website....
What would be the difference, if any?


Local GS advised me to go with the angled bore to minimize barrel bind when the 1911 unlocks and the barrel drops.
Link Posted: 2/18/2010 7:43:39 AM EDT
Am I right to think that .013 & .015 range of movement of the bushing between the frame and slide is uncalled for though?

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Link Posted: 2/18/2010 7:53:56 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/18/2010 8:05:31 AM EDT by Gregory_K]
i don't think it is excessive. but something i would fix.
.696-.005 od on a nm bushing

the slide looks to be .699+.003 ID
Link Posted: 2/18/2010 7:57:56 AM EDT
Originally Posted By EdgecrusherXES_45:
Originally Posted By Gregory_K:
mic the barel od and slide id. order a EGW custom bushing. Yor groups will be better.


You would not just get an oversized bushing and fit it???? If you know how the fitted option would be my choice.


And you can order one made to measure if you do not want to fit it.
Link Posted: 2/18/2010 8:39:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/18/2010 10:12:22 AM EDT by Spook410]
(delete)

Link Posted: 2/18/2010 8:40:19 AM EDT
I've had both experiences when it comes to barrel bushings. Not as loose as the one you are describing, I don't remember ever having front-to-back bushing movement.

But I've had them where they come out really easy with fingers, and then I've had fitted ones that took a bushing wrench and a little elbow grease to get out.

I'm a good pistol shooter, but not good enough to really tell the difference in what it did for my groups.

So I don't freak out anymore if the bushing isn't super fitted.

YMMV.
Link Posted: 2/18/2010 9:07:38 AM EDT
I don't consider myself a very good shot either, but there were marked differences between my new Champion w/ILS mainspring, no trigger job, aluminum frame, on a cold windy day compared to my 5" on a nice summer afternoon with no breeze, 4lb trigger, all steel, with a rest.

At 10yds offhand with the Champion, the groups were easily 1-2" tighter compared to my half-assed bench rested groups with the 5".

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Link Posted: 2/18/2010 10:09:28 AM EDT
Originally Posted By WIZZO_ARAKM14:
I don't consider myself a very good shot either, but there were marked differences between my new Champion w/ILS mainspring, no trigger job, aluminum frame, on a cold windy day compared to my 5" on a nice summer afternoon with no breeze, 4lb trigger, all steel, with a rest.

At 10yds offhand with the Champion, the groups were easily 1-2" tighter compared to my half-assed bench rested groups with the 5".

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I'm certainly what I would consider a good shot, but shooting standing up my DW Valor with a very tight front bushing is in a different class than everything else.
Link Posted: 2/18/2010 6:41:54 PM EDT
My Talon has a bushing that I can take out by hand, but put all three bullets in the same hole on the test target. I haven't shot it for myself yet, but it appears to be accurate without a super tight fitting bushing.
Link Posted: 2/19/2010 2:35:27 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/19/2010 2:54:09 AM EDT by Green0]
Link Posted: 2/23/2010 1:04:38 PM EDT
Take your magazine out make sure there is no round in the pistol and cock the slide back,do you feel any movement
between the barrel and bushing? If not then it is pretty tight. If so then you can purchase after measuring the barrel
or bushing on that is smaller then hone it down to a tight fit.

You might be lucky and buy one that fits tight,that is what makes the barrel shoot straight.

Bob
Link Posted: 3/11/2010 6:26:12 AM EDT
Just got to Sears last night. They didn't have a Vernier dial caliper, but I did pick up a micrometer.

The OD of the barrel is right at .577 and the OD of the bushing is .698

Browsing through Brownells catalog and the angle bored EGW bushing is listed at .579 ID. Is .002 gonna be enough clearance for the barrel?

I still have to get my digital caliper to get an ID on the slide and an actual measurement on the ID of the bushing before I order anything, but I thought I'd update.

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Link Posted: 3/11/2010 7:42:07 AM EDT
Wizzo go to the EGW webpage. There you type in the numbers you measure spec a thick or thin bushing and angle or straight bore. EGW then cuts machines the bushing to your specs. Why deal with gap if you do not need to.

I just had this done to my commander. It does improve the groups. I had to put 150 rounds downrange before the gun would always gointo battery after I polished the end of the barrel some to get he to go into battery.
Link Posted: 3/11/2010 8:20:18 AM EDT
Thanks Gregory_K. I've been busy with other stuff and this got put on the backburner for a couple weeks until last night so I haven't been able to research this like I'd wanted.

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