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Posted: 6/11/2009 8:57:22 AM EST
Getting ready to pick up an FNP-40 within the next 2 weeks, and was having a conversation with my dad about it last night. Topic came up that it's got a decocker instead of a thumb safety, and I'm not sure whether I explained it poorly, or my dad (who has really only shot 1911s, as far as pistols go) just wasn't understanding what I was saying. Is there an easier way to explain it other than "Half-cocked and DA"?

Link Posted: 6/11/2009 9:01:49 AM EST
Lorena Bobbitt's knife?
Link Posted: 6/11/2009 9:13:21 AM EST
Originally Posted By DemonicLemming:
Getting ready to pick up an FNP-40 within the next 2 weeks, and was having a conversation with my dad about it last night. Topic came up that it's got a decocker instead of a thumb safety, and I'm not sure whether I explained it poorly, or my dad (who has really only shot 1911s, as far as pistols go) just wasn't understanding what I was saying. Is there an easier way to explain it other than "Half-cocked and DA"?



just tell him its a lever that your depress and it automatically safely lower the hammer.

Link Posted: 6/11/2009 10:23:49 AM EST
It is a lever that safely lowers the hammer allowing the pistol to be fired in double action mode. You can also thumb cock it again and use it in single action mode if you wish. It does not prevent the trigger from being pulled, but the double action mode does present a heavier (some would say safer) trigger pull. This allows the gun to be more comfortably carried.

MAX
Link Posted: 6/11/2009 5:27:37 PM EST

I'm trying to understand them myself. Why anyone would want a decocker instead of a safety is beyond me. I'm very conscious of safe gun handling and it doesn't bother me to manually lower the hammer on a round. Point it in a safe direction just in case you do screw up.

CZ uses them on a lot of models so there must be a demand for them. I just can't figure out why.
Link Posted: 6/11/2009 6:03:57 PM EST
get a gun that has both decocker and safety (ie my PT99)
Link Posted: 6/11/2009 6:13:32 PM EST
Originally Posted By fudd022:

I'm trying to understand them myself. Why anyone would want a decocker instead of a safety is beyond me. I'm very conscious of safe gun handling and it doesn't bother me to manually lower the hammer on a round. Point it in a safe direction just in case you do screw up.

CZ uses them on a lot of models so there must be a demand for them. I just can't figure out why.


i can see why people are afraid/not liking to manually decock a loaded weapon. but what really surprises me is that they are now wanting a Decocker AND a safety.

Link Posted: 6/11/2009 6:24:49 PM EST
On my old Beretta 92Fs I saw that dropping the safety 'broke' the firing pin so as the hammer fell that momentum wasn't transferred anywhere.
Link Posted: 6/11/2009 8:30:52 PM EST
Originally Posted By 22LR:
Originally Posted By DemonicLemming:
Getting ready to pick up an FNP-40 within the next 2 weeks, and was having a conversation with my dad about it last night. Topic came up that it's got a decocker instead of a thumb safety, and I'm not sure whether I explained it poorly, or my dad (who has really only shot 1911s, as far as pistols go) just wasn't understanding what I was saying. Is there an easier way to explain it other than "Half-cocked and DA"?



just tell him its a lever that your depress and it automatically safely lower the hammer.



'Bout the best way to explain a decocker right there.
Link Posted: 6/11/2009 9:21:32 PM EST
Originally Posted By max229:
It is a lever that safely lowers the hammer allowing the pistol to be fired in double action mode. You can also thumb cock it again and use it in single action mode if you wish. It does not prevent the trigger from being pulled, but the double action mode does present a heavier (some would say safer) trigger pull. This allows the gun to be more comfortably carried.

MAX


Am I to understand that when decocked, it can be fired in double action mode only, no single action on following shots?
To fire in single action mode it has to be cocked each time like Peacemaker?
If so, I do not understand the logic behind it.




Link Posted: 6/12/2009 12:56:53 AM EST

Originally Posted By Richard257:
Originally Posted By max229:
It is a lever that safely lowers the hammer allowing the pistol to be fired in double action mode. You can also thumb cock it again and use it in single action mode if you wish. It does not prevent the trigger from being pulled, but the double action mode does present a heavier (some would say safer) trigger pull. This allows the gun to be more comfortably carried.

MAX


Am I to understand that when decocked, it can be fired in double action mode only, no single action on following shots?
To fire in single action mode it has to be cocked each time like Peacemaker?
If so, I do not understand the logic behind it.


No, you can thumb cock it back to single action mode [for your first shot] or just fire double action. Subsequent shots will be single action as the gun is cocked by the movement of the slide to the rear. The decocker is basically a safe [fancy] way of lowering the hammer on a live round.
Link Posted: 6/12/2009 5:02:24 AM EST
I don't care for safeties. I like a decocker only with DA/SA trigger.

If I has SAO, an external safety would be mandatory, and I may as well also have a decocker ONLY if the gun is safe to store decocked. If the hammer is unable to hit the firing pin while decocked, I like having a decocker.
Link Posted: 6/12/2009 10:52:53 AM EST
I like decockers, though i currently only have one gun (Stoeger Cougar) that has one.
While it's no big deal to safely lower a cocked hammer when your hands are dry and you are calm, imagine yourself confronting a threat in the middle of the night, it's dark, your adrenaline gauge is pegged. You clear the house, then check the yard. Threat is gone, so you need to safe the firearm. Your hands may be sweaty, you may have a bit of shake to them.
Can you be sure you will safely control the hammer in those coniditions?
Probably. But it's so much more secure to just flick the decocker with your thumb and go back to bed.
Link Posted: 6/12/2009 6:04:27 PM EST
It's NOT half-cocked. Using the "de-cocker" returns the hammer to DA mode for the first/next trigger pull ONLY. All the rest will be SA shots unless you "de-cock" again.
Link Posted: 6/13/2009 9:48:19 AM EST
DA/SA, no manual safety, decock only

thats the way i like it
Link Posted: 6/13/2009 7:20:37 PM EST
Smith&Wesson has some of the best de-cockers on semi-auto pistols,a steel lever comes up and actually prevents the hammer
from hitting the pin! Smith also makes some great semi's!

Bob
Link Posted: 6/14/2009 2:54:30 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/14/2009 2:57:11 PM EST by FredMan]
Originally Posted By fudd022:

I'm trying to understand them myself. Why anyone would want a decocker instead of a safety is beyond me. I'm very conscious of safe gun handling and it doesn't bother me to manually lower the hammer on a round. Point it in a safe direction just in case you do screw up.

CZ uses them on a lot of models so there must be a demand for them. I just can't figure out why.


IMO you can't be very conscious of safe gun handling and think that manually lowering the hammer on a chambered round is safe.

Your comment about pointing in a safe direction "in case you screw up" just reinforces the point that manually decocking a pistol without a decocker is in no way safe.
Link Posted: 6/15/2009 12:33:15 PM EST
"It makes the hammer thing go down."

Link Posted: 6/15/2009 2:18:06 PM EST
Sorry for the smart ass reply but even serious discussions need a little bit of humor now and then.

Isn't the definition of a decocker, "an ingenius solution to a non-existent problem?" No wait, that's the definition of a double action semi-auto pistol!

On a more serious note, some of these (not this brand) have failed haven't they? Dropping the hammer hard enough to set off the round in the chamber. As stated above, if it's mechanical, it can fail. The normal Joe Blow might not every use it enough for it to break. Someone who uses it regularly might see a problem someday.
Link Posted: 6/15/2009 5:04:26 PM EST
Originally Posted By RexB:
I like decockers, though i currently only have one gun (Stoeger Cougar) that has one.
While it's no big deal to safely lower a cocked hammer when your hands are dry and you are calm, imagine yourself confronting a threat in the middle of the night, it's dark, your adrenaline gauge is pegged. You clear the house, then check the yard. Threat is gone, so you need to safe the firearm. Your hands may be sweaty, you may have a bit of shake to them.
Can you be sure you will safely control the hammer in those coniditions?
Probably. But it's so much more secure to just flick the decocker with your thumb and go back to bed.


Eh, I can just let go of my handgun...






HK P7.


Oh, and if anyone ever says anything about DA/SA or DAO guns lacking safeties... just bring up revolvers. People carried DA revolvers for many, many decades. No safeties, and they were (and are) carried fully-loaded.
Link Posted: 6/15/2009 6:42:03 PM EST
Originally Posted By FredMan:
IMO you can't be very conscious of safe gun handling and think that manually lowering the hammer on a chambered round is safe.

Your comment about pointing in a safe direction "in case you screw up" just reinforces the point that manually decocking a pistol without a decocker is in no way safe.


Fair enough. I didn't mean to imply that there aren't some safety hazards in manually decocking a gun. For that matter, there are safety hazards when handling any loaded firearm, if you aren't careful. I feel confident manually dropping the hammer on a live round, but would never own a Glock. To each their own I suppose.
Link Posted: 6/15/2009 6:45:21 PM EST
Revolvers do have safeties. They are all usually internal and have hammer transfer devices to prevent live rounds under the hammer to be safely carried. Remember older Colt revolvers with a hammer mounted fring pin? The decocker is an old device that was used on DA (ie Walther PP series) and SA (ie P35 Radom, Mauser M1914) autos to safely lower the hammer to after firing. DA is a means to carry a loaded weapon and have the gun ready for instant use without having to cock the hammer for the first shot. Well the single action was used first, remember that there were DA revolvers during the Civil War!

CD
Link Posted: 6/15/2009 8:47:38 PM EST
The decocker on my Baby Eagle actually blocks the firing pin from the hammer, then triggers the sear to drop the hammer which hits nothing because it is blocked. Since it engages the sear, it also disengages the trigger from the sear because as far as the sear is concerned, the trigger is "back." When removed from safe and back to fire, it lets the sear drop back down to be engaged by the trigger in double action. The slide can manually be operated even while on safe to cycle rounds if you want. I have absolutely no preference for a decocker over a safety, a well designed decocker is just as effective as a well designed safety.
Link Posted: 6/16/2009 1:07:44 PM EST
Originally Posted By Combat_Diver:
Revolvers do have safeties. They are all usually internal and have hammer transfer devices to prevent live rounds under the hammer to be safely carried.


And modern DA/SA and DAO auto don't? My point was that carrying a traditional DA revolver, like was done for so long, is no different than carrying a decocked "safety-less" auto that was designed for such a mode of carry..

And then there's the whole argument about whether a FPB is really a "safety" or more of a "failsafe". (I personally am of the opinion that they are failsafes, just like the half-cock notch on a 1911.)
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