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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/21/2005 9:12:59 PM EDT
Can I just remove the plunger and arms and shoot it or is there more to getting rid of this? My trigger pull is much heavier on this gun than my other 1911s. I've also noticed the sear is not smooth on the commander like it is on my govt models. It has a notch/raise in the middle of the radius, why???
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 9:14:54 PM EDT
iv'e seen spacers to prevent anything from shifting.

i personally picked up a titanium coated Series 80 kit form brownells. Works good for me.
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 8:00:18 PM EDT
I'm currantly buying a series 80 Government model,why would I want to do this?

Would this be like buying a 220 Sig and then dissabling the fireing pin diconnect?

And I ask again why?????


Bob
Link Posted: 8/22/2005 11:10:10 PM EDT
the series 80 style seems to make the trigger pull a bit more mushy. For some, it's horrible. For others, it's not really abig deal.
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 5:53:01 AM EDT
Ten new Colt pistols, ten 'different' trigger pulls. Just the way it is. Nothing wrong with the system. Have a good smith clean up your action.
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 1:20:30 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ALAN308:
Ten new Colt pistols, ten 'different' trigger pulls. Just the way it is. Nothing wrong with the system. Have a good smith clean up your action.



I've had a "good smith" fit my barrel, after that experience I'll be trying on my own or sending it out. I dont think there are any good 1911 guys locally.
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 1:42:32 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 2:32:06 PM EDT
Very simply remove your firing pin then remove the plunger and spring. Next, buy youself an overpower firing pin spring to eliminate your chances of inertia firing pin strike/AD. Lastly , remove the plunger lever from the frame by removing the hammer pin. Nothing will shift. Congrats, now you have a series 70. I would assume it will be as safe as the 50 million series 70's and Springfields out there already. Save the parts. If ou ever sell the gun I would restore it to factory specs. This is what I did with my competition series 80. I wouldn't mess with a service or defensive handgun for possible legal ramifications.
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 6:04:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TARFU:
I would assume



Tarfu, Not everyone should be expected to be as capable as you in performing such work. It sounds like '45' does indeed need help with his pistol.

Mr45Auto, Yes, there are more smiths than good smiths. I hope you have better luck with a well reccommended gunsmith to perform a basic action job. It is not dependant upon removal of the series 80 system. Your call.
Sticky preceding this page is one place to start.
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 9:54:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/23/2005 9:55:20 PM EDT by watertower]
To some the series 80 parts MUST be removed. I polish 'em up and put 'em back in. Honestly I can't tell the difference between a well polished 80 and my Springfields that don't have the parts. Maybe I'm not that good.

If you want to keep that safety operational, Cylinder & Slide sells a premium set of parts that is supposed to help eliminate the effects the series 80 safety has on trigger pull. Never tried it, but C&S makes great stuff (not counting their Safety Fast Shooting system).

ETA: If you don't want the parts in there, pull them out and go to the range to see how the gun reacts. There shouldn't be an issue with not having the parts installed.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 1:17:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TARFU:
Very simply remove your firing pin then remove the plunger and spring. Next, buy youself an overpower firing pin spring to eliminate your chances of inertia firing pin strike/AD. Lastly , remove the plunger lever from the frame by removing the hammer pin. Nothing will shift. Congrats, now you have a series 70. I would assume it will be as safe as the 50 million series 70's and Springfields out there already. Save the parts. If ou ever sell the gun I would restore it to factory specs. This is what I did with my competition series 80. I wouldn't mess with a service or defensive handgun for possible legal ramifications.



Ditto, for 60 years the pistol didn't have a firing pin block, then it shows up and everyone is ok with it?

The pistol already has three safety, and then they just added a forth. Plus with the Hammer half cock notch, the FP block is redundent (unless you count shoving a round in the cahmber, and letting the slide slam closed to allow the firing pin to slam/walk forward and ignite the primer/round).

Simpley put, unless the pistol had a decocker (was added), then there is no reason for the FP block over the standard design.

Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:44:21 AM EDT
A pre-series 80, if it lands muzzle down from about waist high can go off, esp if the ammo has soft primers. I have 5 Colts and only 1 is a pre-80. I can not tell the diff myself.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 8:04:13 AM EDT

Originally Posted By FreeAmerican:
A pre-series 80, if it lands muzzle down from about waist high can go off, especially if the ammo has soft primers.



With an in spec firing pin spring, it takes more than that. Plus, adding a extra tension FP spring takes the safety factor even father (read you dam near have to throw it muzzle down to have the FP have enough force to ignite the primer. Fact is then only time I have had an AD by inserting a round in the chamber and letting the slide slam forward was when I was using an 18 LB recoil spring, and forgot to change the stock FP spring to the stronger Wolff FP spring.


I have 5 Colts and only 1 is a pre-80. I cannot tell the difference myself.


Series 80 requires trigger creep/movement to activate the FP cam/block. Series 70 does not require this creep, and if you can't feel the differences, the triggers (FCGs) on the 70's needs some attention to remove the unneeded creep, and may even after travel.

Simple put, the trigger on a non-FP block 1911 only needs to travel around 1/8" to release the sear off the hammer, then back forward to reset the disconnector. The 80 on the other hand, needs dam near 1/2" of trigger travel to active the cam/FP block.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 8:47:54 AM EDT
Well, it is all a little more complicated. If you have a lighter hammer, such as some of the commander hammers seen today, with a heavy firing pin spring, you can have fail to fire. Not good in my book. Esp for a carry pistol.

My Colts on a trigger gage don't even see the action of the 80 series stuff. At the worst, you get the feel of a 2 stage trigger. In fact the spring tension on the 80 stuff is less than the trigger spring on all 3 of mine.. again, I can not even feel them.. Only issues I have had were with the sear and hammer surfaces.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 9:39:08 AM EDT
I've had an AD while reloading/ releasing the slide, the hammer followed the slide down and Bang!!

Good reason to have a series 80 IMHO. But I can understand why many don't like them. I have both and the simplicity of the series 70 is hard to beat, but it can have AD's unlike most guns produced today...everything seems to be a trade off.

It would be interesting to "feel" a gunsmithed series 80 trigger compared to the standard. I can feel the difference in mine, if you pull the trigger slowly. Pull it fast and I don't notice the difference...much.

I suspect if someone redesigned those two levers and plunger, the trigger pull could be much better, but don't know!
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 9:59:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By semi45:
I've had an AD while reloading/ releasing the slide, the hammer followed the slide down and Bang!![/quote)

You have bigger problems than you are aware of,

The hammer has two sear points, the primary for when the hammer is at full cock, and a lower safety sear (half cock) that will catch the hammer if the sear is danced off the primary and catch the hammer before it can make contact with the firing pin. You need to have the FCG check, since this safety catch point (half cock position) is the device that prevents runaways if the primary hammer catch/ sear ever does have problems.




I suspect if someone redesigned those two levers and plunger, the trigger pull could be much better, but don't know!

Already been done, Kimber tied the FP lock into the grip safety, and not into the trigger/pull like Colt to activate the system.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 10:01:04 AM EDT

Originally Posted By NAM:
the series 80 style seems to make the trigger pull a bit more mushy. For some, it's horrible. For others, it's not really a big deal.



I'm one of those guys. If I want a match competition 1911 I'll buy one. The Series 80 is more than fine just as it is. But whatever.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 10:57:27 AM EDT
" Already been done, Kimber tied the FP lock into the grip safety, and not into the trigger/pull like Colt to activate the system."

The Kimber style safety doesn't prevent an AD due to slamfire, etc. You would be holding the gun while releasing the slide. I have experienced and read on multiple occasions where people had an AD due to the hammer dropping for whatever reasons. I don't know or "read" about any 1911's going off from being dropped. No doubt it's happened.

The Kimber/S&W seems to function only as a "drop safety" which is not only very rare I believe, but other manufacturers have accomplished the same effect with lighter Firing pins and heavy FP springs.

Grip safeties are not always reliably "depressed" by people with certain hand sizes and shooting styles. Add additional safeties to an already useless safety(grip safety) and you have "double trouble". hose
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 2:39:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Dano523:

Originally Posted By semi45:
I've had an AD while reloading/ releasing the slide, the hammer followed the slide down and Bang!![/quote)

I suspect if someone redesigned those two levers and plunger, the trigger pull could be much better, but don't know!

Already been done, Kimber tied the FP lock into the grip safety, and not into the trigger/pull like Colt to activate the system.




All of the above

Kimber's safety of exploding MIM is well doccumented. Colt has used 80 series as well as mim for longer than Kimber has been. If you do not have a good one, you are never far from having it right. Do not forget Colts has a warranty, for those shitty production examples.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 5:11:57 PM EDT
When I talked about removing the series 80 safety above, I failed to mention that it was after a trigger job by a good gunsmith. He wouldn't remove it for liability reasons but when I removed it the trigger was that much better, mostly lighter. Worth it for competition gun, YES! For any other use, probably not. Just my opinion.
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