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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 9/2/2005 6:08:42 PM EDT
OK first of all I'm a city cop and always have trusted Sig for years. I used to carry a 220 for patrol and loved the gun so much I managed to carry the big tank with me while in my current undercover assignment. I put up with it's size and weight even when the current administration sold out to glock. I was grandfathered in with the 220 with the exception that if there was ever a mechanical problem I had to replace it witha G22 or G23.
Now the bad news. 10 years of L.E. had its wear and tear on my 220 and the blued finish was worn down to bare metal in several large areas. I decided to have the slide refininshed but ONLY by Sig. The matte electroless nickel seemed to be the way to go so I went through the lengthy process of convincing my current admin. to loan me a 220 while mine was getting refinished. I contacted Sig and they told me that it would take 6 weeks. 2 1/2 months later it finally arrived. I put the slide on and guess what. The damn thing wasn't finished to spec so my barrell won't clear my takedown lever inside the frame. I called sig and they basically told me tuff luck. Nice customer service right! So farewell Sig I'm off to plastic land! Has anyone had a similar problem?
Link Posted: 9/2/2005 9:48:04 PM EDT
That is totaly the opposite of the norm for SIG. They ALWAYS take care of their customers. Has the gun been worked on by someone else then SIG? If so that might be why they won't fix it. Something does not seem right here.
Link Posted: 9/3/2005 5:23:11 PM EDT
Sorry to hear about your problem. I too am surprised that Sigarms won't make this right for you; they tend to be hyper-sensitive to customer service issues. Did you try to speak to a CS manager?

Regards,

Kevin
Link Posted: 9/3/2005 5:28:15 PM EDT
I think you've been smokin some of the contraband you seized there Starsky.

Joe
Link Posted: 9/4/2005 9:21:56 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2005 9:22:19 AM EDT by lcsert416]
I am not sure I follow the problem. I am a SIG armorer and refinishing the slide should not have changed the dimensions to the point the gun won't go back together. Can you post any pics? SIG's customer service is usually top notch, even more so for LE customers.
Link Posted: 9/4/2005 10:57:50 AM EDT
Clear the take down lever "when"? Putting on the slide and barrel? Rotating the takedown lever with slide on? Racking the slide? Once the slide and barrel is installed onto the frame, it has already "cleared" the takedown lever.

Why didn't you send in the entire pistol when refinished? There's no way that Sig would not have attempted to reassemble, and if it won't clear the take down lever, the problem would have immediately surfaced.

How far back is the slide sliding onto the frame before it stops? Are you sure it ins't the trigger disconnect stuck up and interfering with the slide (not that I've even heard of this happening)? How do you know it is the takedown lever stopping the slide/barrel? Could it be the barrel interfering with the locking insert instead?
Link Posted: 9/4/2005 4:39:01 PM EDT
I'll post pics soon to clear all the confusion here. Yes, SIG worked on the product. No I didn't send the whole gun, they said I didn't need to. I'm not an armorer so I can't describe it in detail. Every time I attempt to put the slide on my barrell is getting chewed up right at the point where the round is fed into the barrell. Maybe CS was having a bad day, my PD armorer is going to contact them and let them know a 1500 member PD will keep this incident in mind.
Link Posted: 9/4/2005 8:34:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2005 8:39:32 PM EDT by Xer0]
If it's dinging the sides of the chamber feed ramp (little nicks on both sides), the barrel is hitting the "locking insert" not the take down lever. Those nicks are standard fair on Sig 220's when the barrel is not pushed all the way up into the slide before assemby or the spring/rod left out and assembled.

Here is a pic of my barrel, yes it has nicks as I am not very careful with assembly. They are highlighted in red. The yellow is the normal wear from actually riding over the locking insert. The Red is nicks from ramming "into" the locking insert instead of riding over.



Two ways I see this (red nicks) usually occuring. THe first way is people like me who will install the barrel without spring or guide rode and mess with the action. The spring/rod, normally pushes and keeps the barrel fully up into the slide on assembly so it clears the locking insert, but without spring/rod, the barrel will fall downwards and ram "into" the locking insert.

The other way it usually occurs, is that on assembly, either the barrel is not fully seated into the slide or the palm of the hand holding the slide pushes the barrel downwards alittle and it rams into the locking insert.

Note that this feed ramp damage does NOT affect operation or function, just looks odd. Bullets never touch the edge areas during feeding.


Assuming, the 2 things are not happening to you:

Now the verticle space/distance of the barrel heighth (top of chamber to bottom feed ramp) on a Sig is very close in tolerance. What "could" have happened is that the additional thickness of nickle on the inside of the slide (just in front of ejection port) is pushing the barrel down just enough
so that edge of feed ramp is banging into the locking insert (yellow area of picture). If you have damage higher than this edge, one of the other two listed issues is happening as nickle does not add that much thickness.

You can fix the issue with a file if it is indeed hanging on the locking insert. Easiest way for a novice who doesn't handle files a lot, is to buy some auto painting 600+ grit at the auto store (black color), put on edge of flat table and just press bottom of barrel ramp on it and sand off "TINY" bit at a time until the barrel/slide goes onto the frame. Or you can use files, but files take off material MUCH faster than 600 grit sandpaper and is not as forgiving of mistakes in judgement.

Before you go sanding/filing away though, I suggest you make sure that A; there is nothing on top of the barrel (right by top shoulder area) and nothing under the slide (front of ejection port) that is keeping barrel from COMPLETELY seating into the slide. B, the barrel is indeed seated all the way into the slide by spring/guide rod and nothing is accidentally pressing it down as you assemble.

Or you can just send everything to Sig like you should have the first time. It is not Sigs fault if they can't test for proper operation, and being a LEO is no excuse. The barrel/slide/locking insert fit is the highest tolerance part for Sig accuracy and proper function. Hundredth of an inch matter here (as you are finding out). Sig isn't the only one who will tell you tough luck for such an essential part functionality after a refinish that changes the dimensions of the slide without having the parts for test fitting.
Link Posted: 9/5/2005 1:52:07 AM EDT
thanks alot...Well it must be the additional thickness of nickle on the inside of the slide that is pushing the barrel down just enough so that edge of feed ramp is banging into the locking insert. I have some pretty bad dings on the bottom of the feed ramp. Thanks so much for the post. XerO, the only thing I'm worried about are my HP rounds catching the feed ramp if I (carefully) file the affected area. Somehow I don't think Sig would reccomend filing the barrell. Thanks for the posts everyone. I love the 220 but i think it's time to move on. Yes it hurts to switch to plastic. I'll still post the pics in a few days but short of Sig replacing my 220 with a new one (not gonna happen). I'm gonna be forced to go to the BLOCK.

Thanks,



(Some dumb LEO that thought Sig wouldn't fuck up his gun if he sent it to them for service)
Link Posted: 9/5/2005 3:23:16 AM EDT
Just use some of the sandpaper on the ramp and it will take any dings right out, dont change the angle, just smooth out any protrusions caused by the dings. 30 seconds worth of work.

The sanding/filing on the bottom flat of the feed ramp is "standard" type work when fitting a Sig barrel to the slide/frame whether it is a Sig barrel, or a Barstow barrel (even drop-ins). If you don't want to do it yourself, what exactly is the problem with sending Sig the entire pistol? They would take the 30 seconds, file the lip down couple hundredths(or maybe a new barrel), test fire it and send it back. I don't see why you have such reluctance to allow them to do what they can.

"(Some dumb LEO that thought Sig wouldn't fuck up his gun if he sent it to them for service)"

Sorry, but I have to disagree with you about Sig messing it up. They did exactly what you asked of them, refinished it in nickle. Now they might have taken a bit long to do it, but that doen't mean they screwed up your gun. The only way the ramp edge could have got dings is if you tried to muscle the slide/barrel on. Period. You should have immediately stopped and sent it back to Sig if you didn't know why. The dings are not Sig's fault. I've got dings (as seen from the pics) from messing around, but they are "my" fault an I know exactly why.
Link Posted: 9/6/2005 6:50:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By coppa6459:
NO MORE SIGS FOR ME!!!



Good! More for me.
Link Posted: 9/8/2005 9:57:53 AM EDT
Ok look, first thing first. I did my own finishing on my sig and had a similar problem. Before you hack away at the feed ramp on the barrel check you barrel and see where it locks up in your slide. Notice how the factory sigs always hove the top of the barrel polished. Anything you put on top of that incliding any finish will change your lockup. The only problem with hacking at your feed ramp is that eventually that nickle will wear of the top of the barrel at the ejection port. I recomend taking a light polishing toll on the dremal and just polishing it. Also, did you go anything to the locking block? Did you send that to get refinished? If so you can simply polish the top of that too. If you really do not want to do that stuff you can file the bottom of the feed ramp. I would start on the back side (the part where the bullet doesnt touch) and sort of round it forward. Yes you can do this with a polishing stock or a dremal.

Remember, polishing the top of the barrel and the locking block is only to remove thick finish and doing the feed ramp will remove metal. I would considering doing the first one first since the thing fit fine before you got it refinished.
Link Posted: 9/12/2005 4:51:15 PM EDT
well folks I just qualified with the G22. I have ta say it's much lighter and faster that the 220. So I'm happy. Good luck to you guys but I'll be over at the Glock forums from now on.
Link Posted: 9/12/2005 5:09:29 PM EDT
Admit it, you wanted the glock anyway...

Sell me your 220.

Bob
Link Posted: 9/13/2005 7:44:14 PM EDT
Wait until you use it for something other than target shooting after being used to the 220. The long clanky trigger and weird grip angle are going to slow things down a lot. I think you will pull the 220 back out.
Link Posted: 9/13/2005 8:33:21 PM EDT
I have also used a P-220 on duty for about 10 yrs. and will never carry anything else. My dealings with Sig have always been productive and without hassle. Tatical tupperware need not apply!!!hippie.gif
Link Posted: 9/14/2005 2:17:16 PM EDT
I'll stick with Sig but I do understand your unhappiness. Plastic ain't bad at all. I like Sigs and Glocks so whatever decision you make will be a good one. Sig CS is normally top notch.
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