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Posted: 4/16/2009 4:56:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/18/2009 10:13:04 AM EDT by DanTSX]

Need some opinions to help me decide, since my thoughts are full of warm gun-fuzzies.  I just started reloading and the used kit I bought is all set up for .38/.357 and .223.  Anyways, I want to start loading for .38/.357 so I can use some of the thousands of bullets, primers, shells that came with the kit.   I like revolvers a lot and would like to keep it for a nice gun too.  Budget is $500 plus or minus $150 or so.  Ideally, I want I gun that I can carry concealed in a pinch.   Unfortunatly, ideal is not something you get when shopping for a used revolver.


Here is what I am looking at and have on hold for a few days, at Cabelas of all places

Colt Trooper MkIII, 8" barrel, 95%, and when I say that, it really is 98%, but has a weird blemish near the trigger guard.  Lock-up is VERY tight on all cyls.  Function is fine on DA and SA.  Appears to have been fired VERY little. Cyl line is very faint.  Clean as a whistle too!, no carbon buildup in cyl bores.  I personally have an attachment to Colt revolvers.  I already own a few woodsmen and an Agent/Det Special.  And have a bit of a pride about the company as it is local and historic.

The price is $539.  They are taking $25 off the price, plus I save $50 on the gun by putting it on their Credit Card.  So that is $465 for a very clean, very nice Trooper.


Only problem is that the barrel is 8 Freakin' inches long!  I'm not sure I am comfortable with that  

The price sounds good to me, but CCW is out of the question.  I am thinking I buy this now, and wait until a nice 4" trooper (what I really want) comes up, and buy that.

what you say?
Link Posted: 4/16/2009 8:28:34 AM EDT
Good gun, not a bad price for a Colt, but the 8 inch barrel would be a deal killer for me.  Just to long.
Link Posted: 4/16/2009 8:31:32 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/16/2009 8:32:50 AM EDT by DarkStar]

Agreed, not to bad a price at all... with that 8" barrel you'd have a nice whitetail hunting revolver, if you don't hunt the longer barrel will be a bit cumbersome...



Link Posted: 4/16/2009 5:54:50 PM EDT
Thanks for the replies folks!  The 8" barrel was a dealbreaker.  I called around to all the local shops and nobody had anything in .357 that wasn't a 2" or 8", but I found a really nice 6 "S&W 586-2 with houge grips in the box for $450.  It has a really nice trigger on it and some very light wear.  The 6" is still kind of big, but there was NOTHING in 4" unless I wanted to pay double what I paid for the 586 and still have to settle for a gun with a lock and MIM parts.  

Y'all think that's a good price?

I'll post up pics tomorrow. I pick it up tomorrow after work.
Link Posted: 4/16/2009 9:42:40 PM EDT
$450 is too expensive for a 6" 586 with the Houges.  It would be a good to fair price for a 4" with the wood stocks.  

Look for a used Dan Wesson Model 15.  If the barrel length is the wrong size you can just swap barrels and sell off the one you don't want.
Link Posted: 4/17/2009 6:15:09 PM EDT
You should look around for a used Dan Wesson revolver. You can change the barrels to get different lengths for different applications.
Link Posted: 4/17/2009 7:33:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/17/2009 7:40:36 PM EDT by DanTSX]
Originally Posted By Sixguns4Fighting:
You should look around for a used Dan Wesson revolver. You can change the barrels to get different lengths for different applications.


Yeah, too late for that now  I picked up the S&W 586 today after work   The Dan Wesson pistol packs were under $400 a year ago or so, but they are non-existent it seems these days.  I like the barrel-swapping, but I don't think the 6" barrel will bother me.  This is a range and house gun, and I was searching for one of the "big two" anyways.  Despite the barrel, it seems to feel smaller than my buddies GP100 and the grip just feels right with a great trigger reach and pull.

Oh, it is a 586-4, not a -2.  I have ZERO idea what the differences is.

sorry about the fingerprints.  S&W blueing is kind of tough to keep clean.  

Anyways, I think I will like it just fine.  I will still keep an eye out for nice Colts, and probably would consider trading this in for the right Colt, but as of right now, I have ZERO thoughts about doing that.  Think it will be a keeper as I don't want one of the MIM or locked guns.






Oh, here is my other S&W, an old K-17 next to Wife's Colt.  (learned to shoot on that old K-frame.)



Link Posted: 4/20/2009 7:24:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/20/2009 7:25:45 AM EDT by dragongoddess]
Originally Posted By NVGdude:
$450 is too expensive for a 6" 586 with the Houges.  It would be a good to fair price for a 4" with the wood stocks.  

Look for a used Dan Wesson Model 15.  If the barrel length is the wrong size you can just swap barrels and sell off the one you don't want.





Really. IS there an overabundance of 586's in your area. I bought the only 586 that I've seen in my local gun shop the moment it came in the door. It was the only one I've seen in 3 years. To me $450 is a bargain for a 586. I would also have bought the Colt. Troopers are fine revolvers as were the Lawman's.
Link Posted: 4/20/2009 5:57:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By dragongoddess:
Originally Posted By NVGdude:
$450 is too expensive for a 6" 586 with the Houges.  It would be a good to fair price for a 4" with the wood stocks.  

Look for a used Dan Wesson Model 15.  If the barrel length is the wrong size you can just swap barrels and sell off the one you don't want.





Really. IS there an overabundance of 586's in your area. I bought the only 586 that I've seen in my local gun shop the moment it came in the door. It was the only one I've seen in 3 years. To me $450 is a bargain for a 586. I would also have bought the Colt. Troopers are fine revolvers as were the Lawman's.


I'm glad you are not from CT then  I "hemmed and hawwed" over this gun for three weeks while I tried to find a revolver in Vitamin Colt that didn't have an 8" barrel.   Went back to the shop I started my revolver shopping at, and they told me that my fingerprints were still on the Smith.
Link Posted: 4/20/2009 5:57:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By dragongoddess:
Originally Posted By NVGdude:
$450 is too expensive for a 6" 586 with the Houges.  It would be a good to fair price for a 4" with the wood stocks.  

Look for a used Dan Wesson Model 15.  If the barrel length is the wrong size you can just swap barrels and sell off the one you don't want.





Really. IS there an overabundance of 586's in your area. I bought the only 586 that I've seen in my local gun shop the moment it came in the door. It was the only one I've seen in 3 years. To me $450 is a bargain for a 586. I would also have bought the Colt. Troopers are fine revolvers as were the Lawman's.


.$450 is a good price if it has the original wood grips, figure -$40 to -$50 for the Hogues, 6" barrels typically sell for around $25-30 less than the 4".
Link Posted: 4/20/2009 9:26:10 PM EDT
Originally Posted By NVGdude:
Originally Posted By dragongoddess:
Originally Posted By NVGdude:
$450 is too expensive for a 6" 586 with the Houges.  It would be a good to fair price for a 4" with the wood stocks.  

Look for a used Dan Wesson Model 15.  If the barrel length is the wrong size you can just swap barrels and sell off the one you don't want.





Really. IS there an overabundance of 586's in your area. I bought the only 586 that I've seen in my local gun shop the moment it came in the door. It was the only one I've seen in 3 years. To me $450 is a bargain for a 586. I would also have bought the Colt. Troopers are fine revolvers as were the Lawman's.


.$450 is a good price if it has the original wood grips, figure -$40 to -$50 for the Hogues, 6" barrels typically sell for around $25-30 less than the 4".




Was it supposed to come with wood grips too?  I thought that they could be had with the wood or the rubber grips.  I have the original box, is there any way to tell from the codes on the side of it?  I don't care much if I was supposed to, as I have a local guy that makes custom grips, but it would have been nice to have both.  Although, I do prefer the feel of the houges over wooden grips, a nice set of oiled exotic wood always looks damn good.
Link Posted: 4/21/2009 8:44:21 PM EDT
Earlier you said it was a -2, those would have come with wood target type grips, a -4 probably came stock with the rubber actually.
Link Posted: 4/22/2009 12:57:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/22/2009 1:08:14 AM EDT by Oro]
Oh, it is a 586-4, not a -2. I have ZERO idea what the differences is.


The -4 had a few minor tweaks from the -2 - the ejector star and cylinder hand were radiused, the cylinder yoke screw was changed, and the rear sight leaf was altered so that it had pre-drilled and tapped scope mounting points underneath it to make scope mounting easier and not require drilling.  Small changes to improve things, but nothing dramatic over any earlier version.  The early -4's shipped with wood grips, but that changed during the run and all guns got rubber Hogue grips and round butt grip frames instead of square.  Before you buy any other grips for it, be sure to take those off and check what kind of grip butt shape it has.

That things looks ANIB!  $450 was as VERY good price for that.  You did really well.  I have been wanting a 586 (I much prefer blue to stainless, but the stainless is dang gratifying to shine up and for carrying in the woods), and even though I'm not a huge fan of 6", I would have snapped that one up!  The -4's were the last 586/686 model to have the hammer mounted firing pin and forged steel triggers and hammers - in my opinion they are the last engineering variant you want to "collect" - later ones are still great guns, just not quite as desirable from a collecting/traditionalist point of view.

To manage the fingerprints on the gun, wax it.  Yep, just like your car or bike.  It is also a great way to prevent it from oxidizing.  You can use a regular car wax, but a better way is to go to a woodworking shop and buy "Renaissance Wax" - it is English and was invented specifically for use on weapons and furniture in the British Imperial Museum - to both protect them and hide fingerprints.  Lots of gun collectors and museums use it.  It is kinda expensive ($15 buck for a small can) - but the small can will do like 300 handguns - it goes very, very far.

As to grips, on the longer barreled (4" and over) magnums, my by far favorite grips are factory "plain target" grips - meaning large wood w/o the checkering - which tends to bite and grate at your hand with powerful magnum loads.  I put some presentation plain targets on my 686 that came from an early '70s "Texas Ranger" commemorative Model 19.  The emblems have little Texas stars in them instead of the S&W logo.  They make shooting magnums much more pleasant:

Link Posted: 4/22/2009 5:34:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By NVGdude:
Earlier you said it was a -2, those would have come with wood target type grips, a -4 probably came stock with the rubber actually.


You are right.  I thought it was, until after I had already done the paperwork.  I had done enough homework to know that the -2 was fine, and that the -4 was ideal.  The customary buyers remorse dissapeared at that point.  So I celebrated by buying a few almost normally priced pmags.
Link Posted: 4/22/2009 5:47:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/22/2009 5:51:01 PM EDT by DanTSX]
Originally Posted By Oro:
Oh, it is a 586-4, not a -2. I have ZERO idea what the differences is.


The -4 had a few minor tweaks from the -2 - the ejector star and cylinder hand were radiused, the cylinder yoke screw was changed, and the rear sight leaf was altered so that it had pre-drilled and tapped scope mounting points underneath it to make scope mounting easier and not require drilling.  Small changes to improve things, but nothing dramatic over any earlier version.  The early -4's shipped with wood grips, but that changed during the run and all guns got rubber Hogue grips and round butt grip frames instead of square.  Before you buy any other grips for it, be sure to take those off and check what kind of grip butt shape it has.

That things looks ANIB!  $450 was as VERY good price for that.  You did really well.  I have been wanting a 586 (I much prefer blue to stainless, but the stainless is dang gratifying to shine up and for carrying in the woods), and even though I'm not a huge fan of 6", I would have snapped that one up!  The -4's were the last 586/686 model to have the hammer mounted firing pin and forged steel triggers and hammers - in my opinion they are the last engineering variant you want to "collect" - later ones are still great guns, just not quite as desirable from a collecting/traditionalist point of view.

To manage the fingerprints on the gun, wax it.  Yep, just like your car or bike.  It is also a great way to prevent it from oxidizing.  You can use a regular car wax, but a better way is to go to a woodworking shop and buy "Renaissance Wax" - it is English and was invented specifically for use on weapons and furniture in the British Imperial Museum - to both protect them and hide fingerprints.  Lots of gun collectors and museums use it.  It is kinda expensive ($15 buck for a small can) - but the small can will do like 300 handguns - it goes very, very far.

As to grips, on the longer barreled (4" and over) magnums, my by far favorite grips are factory "plain target" grips - meaning large wood w/o the checkering - which tends to bite and grate at your hand with powerful magnum loads.  I put some presentation plain targets on my 686 that came from an early '70s "Texas Ranger" commemorative Model 19.  The emblems have little Texas stars in them instead of the S&W logo.  They make shooting magnums much more pleasant:

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd275/kamerer/S-W/686/IMGP2818-1.jpg




Thanks for the good words!  I am already considering what 3 or 4 inch revolver to salivate after  On that one, I'll get exactly what I want and take a lot of time looking for the "right" gun.  My requirements for this gun were pretty easy:  S&W or Colt .357mag mid to fullsized frame, pre-lock, no MIM, good sights, well-kept shooter, under $650.  I like the wood target grips on yours.  I'm starting to like stainless guns, but they never did much for me since I had seen what a "good" blueing looks like.  If they grow on me more, my safe has room.

Should I use that wax if I am going to be shooting this gun?  I intend to shoot around 25 - 50 rounds of .38 a week.  I did my best to take a few quick snappies because the day was so nice outside, and wanted to show people on the internet my new toy.  There are a few hobby and restoration shops around me that I am sure has that wax.  $15 is nothing when you have to pay $5 - $8 a can for some birchwood casey grease remover these days.
Link Posted: 4/22/2009 9:25:58 PM EDT
DanTSX:  Congrats on your 586.  They are great revolvers!  One of the best designs to ever come out the the S&W shop, as far as I'm concerned!



I bought a 586 back in 1984 when I worked as a security guard. In 1985 traded it, plus a little cash, for a Ruger Red Label 20 guage (one of the early ones with fixed chokes and blue receiver), which I still have, but I've always regretted selling that revolver. It was super accurate and seemed to especially like my .38 special reloads (4.8gr of WIN231, CCI primers, 158gr LSWC).



I've been keeping my eyes open for another 586 and a few days ago I won an auction on GunBroker for one. It's a no-dash in very nice shape. It's sitting at my FFL dealer and I've looked it over and handled it. I'm VERY happy with the condition it's in. I'm on a delay status (as usual) and hoping to pick it up soon.



This is a picture from the auction listing.








The gun looks much better in person. There is a little bit of scuffing and a couple of minor dings on the bottom of the grips, but I don't care since I'm either going to refinish or replace them anyway.



One thing that struck me as unusual were the sights. I've never seen a 586, except for a picture in a gun value guide, with a Patridge front & black rear sight. Even my first 586 had the Baughman red ramp style front and white outline rear sight. Now I'm wondering if this might be a very early version or if these sights were just an option I'd never heard of before.



I think I got a decent deal on the revolver. I paid $425 for it.





I'm happy!
Link Posted: 4/23/2009 5:07:38 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Clown_Gun:
DanTSX:  Congrats on your 586.  They are great revolvers!  One of the best designs to ever come out the the S&W shop, as far as I'm concerned!

I bought a 586 back in 1984 when I worked as a security guard. In 1985 traded it, plus a little cash, for a Ruger Red Label 20 guage (one of the early ones with fixed chokes and blue receiver), which I still have, but I've always regretted selling that revolver. It was super accurate and seemed to especially like my .38 special reloads (4.8gr of WIN231, CCI primers, 158gr LSWC).

I've been keeping my eyes open for another 586 and a few days ago I won an auction on GunBroker for one. It's a no-dash in very nice shape. It's sitting at my FFL dealer and I've looked it over and handled it. I'm VERY happy with the condition it's in. I'm on a delay status (as usual) and hoping to pick it up soon.

This is a picture from the auction listing.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n93/mike98321/SW586.jpg

The gun looks much better in person. There is a little bit of scuffing and a couple of minor dings on the bottom of the grips, but I don't care since I'm either going to refinish or replace them anyway.

One thing that struck me as unusual were the sights. I've never seen a 586, except for a picture in a gun value guide, with a Patridge front & black rear sight. Even my first 586 had the Baughman red ramp style front and white outline rear sight. Now I'm wondering if this might be a very early version or if these sights were just an option I'd never heard of before.

I think I got a decent deal on the revolver. I paid $425 for it.


I'm happy!



Wow!  very nice!   I thought that maybe that partridge sight would be the same one that I have on my K-17, but it wasn't.  Maybe it was something a smith put on there.  I don't know why someone would change it out.  Maybe they managed to bend the one that comes built with the barrel.



Earlier in the thread I was posting my preference for Colt, but not able to find one with the features I wanted.  Well, today in my nonstop (and unscuccessful) search for ammo, did I find a very nice MKIII 4" colt trooper for $475  Oh, well, maybe i'll do it the arfcom way and get both  Not this week though, gotta keep saving and get more reload equipment.
Link Posted: 4/23/2009 8:14:02 PM EDT
Should I use that wax if I am going to be shooting this gun?


Sure, it makes it much easier to clean.


maybe that partridge sight


FYI, it's a "Patridge" front sight, capital "P" and no "r" before the "t."  It was a man's name, not like the bird.  It's a common confusion.
Link Posted: 4/23/2009 10:43:21 PM EDT
I have a Patridge installed on my Dan Wesson Model 44.  I like them so much better than ramped sights.
Link Posted: 4/23/2009 11:25:15 PM EDT
I brought mine home today. I can't believe how clean this thing is! The previous owner(s) took VERY good care of it.




Link Posted: 4/24/2009 12:21:41 AM EDT
Very nice 586. I owned an identical 6 inch 586 myself, that an old man had purchased new many, many years ago, fired a few rounds of .38s, then thrown it under the seat his truck. The finish on one side was an absolute mess, and merely OK on the other side. It shot like you wouldn't believe, though. I don't remember why I sold it, but I wish I hadn't. I'll lay hands on a another 6 inch and a 4 inch 686 soon, I hope. I have a hand-me-down 681 sitting in the safe that belonged to my wife's father until recently.
Link Posted: 4/26/2009 7:59:18 AM EDT
686,586 etc are great guns...I am a S&W guy but do own a few Colts, including a 8" MkIII nickle with 8" barrel........call me a sucker for shiny stuff


but its a tact driver, trigger not as good as a Smith but can deal with it, it was $250 so I had to get it

also got a 8" Anaconda....but for $300 who would say no?

have a eary 60's Tropper, its beat to crap, but its an amazing gun, also a Lawman(70's)

want a bit of both.......my Smolt
Link Posted: 4/27/2009 8:14:57 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Landpimp:
686,586 etc are great guns...I am a S&W guy but do own a few Colts, including a 8" MkIII nickle with 8" barrel........call me a sucker for shiny stuff
http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL1600/691553/9227619/283861653.jpg

but its a tact driver, trigger not as good as a Smith but can deal with it, it was $250 so I had to get it

also got a 8" Anaconda....but for $300 who would say no?

have a eary 60's Tropper, its beat to crap, but its an amazing gun, also a Lawman(70's)

want a bit of both.......my Smolt
http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL1600/691553/9227619/294332869.jpg


what the?


Thats just a Colt Barrel on that right?  But it is pinned at the frame and at the lug?    That is pretty cool!


But what is the story behind it?
Link Posted: 4/28/2009 7:37:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Clown_Gun:
DanTSX:  Congrats on your 586.  They are great revolvers!  One of the best designs to ever come out the the S&W shop, as far as I'm concerned!

I bought a 586 back in 1984 when I worked as a security guard. In 1985 traded it, plus a little cash, for a Ruger Red Label 20 guage (one of the early ones with fixed chokes and blue receiver), which I still have, but I've always regretted selling that revolver. It was super accurate and seemed to especially like my .38 special reloads (4.8gr of WIN231, CCI primers, 158gr LSWC).

I've been keeping my eyes open for another 586 and a few days ago I won an auction on GunBroker for one. It's a no-dash in very nice shape. It's sitting at my FFL dealer and I've looked it over and handled it. I'm VERY happy with the condition it's in. I'm on a delay status (as usual) and hoping to pick it up soon.

This is a picture from the auction listing.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n93/mike98321/SW586.jpg

The gun looks much better in person. There is a little bit of scuffing and a couple of minor dings on the bottom of the grips, but I don't care since I'm either going to refinish or replace them anyway.

One thing that struck me as unusual were the sights. I've never seen a 586, except for a picture in a gun value guide, with a Patridge front & black rear sight. Even my first 586 had the Baughman red ramp style front and white outline rear sight. Now I'm wondering if this might be a very early version or if these sights were just an option I'd never heard of before.

I think I got a decent deal on the revolver. I paid $425 for it.


I'm happy!


I've got a no dash sitting here that has the Patridge front site too.  I'm not in front of my books, but I believe the Patridge was the initial sight on the no dash models, and the red ramp cam in a little later.

My -2 is the ramp, and is the only one I shoot, as the no dash is in unfired condition.

I'll have a 4" model one day, and any others I can get for a reasonable price.  I love the action on them, and love target shooting with them.

I just haven't got my DA work down.
Link Posted: 4/28/2009 8:30:52 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Clown_Gun:
I brought mine home today. I can't believe how clean this thing is! The previous owner(s) took VERY good care of it.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n93/mike98321/SW_586.jpg


Very nice, when the L frames first came out I bought one just like that (6 inch with the Patridge front sight) for my wife.  Superb gun, very accurate.

And I agree $450 is good price these days for any decent 586. I don't remember the last time I saw one for sale.

Link Posted: 4/28/2009 10:30:45 PM EDT




Originally Posted By DanTSX:





But what is the story behind it?


Used to be a somewhat common practice. Many people considered Colt barrels with their increasingly tightening rifling to be more accurate than Smiths, but Smith actions to be better for heavy amounts of shooting. Combining the two was considered a way to get the best of both worlds.

Link Posted: 4/29/2009 6:05:41 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Warhawk:
Originally Posted By Clown_Gun:
I brought mine home today. I can't believe how clean this thing is! The previous owner(s) took VERY good care of it.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n93/mike98321/SW_586.jpg


Very nice, when the L frames first came out I bought one just like that (6 inch with the Patridge front sight) for my wife.  Superb gun, very accurate.

And I agree $450 is good price these days for any decent 586. I don't remember the last time I saw one for sale.



They go in spurts.  I looked and looked and looked and never found one.  Then one day several were on GB and on auction arms, and I found one in a pawn shop.

In short order I had three new smiths!

Right now, it looks like there are just a few out there.  I'm waiting for a decent 4" to show up. It will be MINE!
Link Posted: 4/29/2009 10:19:08 PM EDT
Congrads on the 586. Really nice gun.

$450 is a good price, oh my how times have changed. When I first started looking at revolvers 20 years ago, the 4" &  6" 686s were going for ~$300, and the 586s were ~$200. I bought a SS Colt Python instead at double the price of a 686.
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