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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 11/29/2005 5:14:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/2/2005 6:26:56 PM EDT by jmn69]
I just fired my used BYP Bavarian P7 PSP today. Gun was very clean and well lubed.

50 rounds of mixed wolf and blaser aluminum no problems. Let her cool down for 10 minutes.

Followed by 35 rounds of Gold Dot 124gr +p. 2nd round of the Gold Dot from a full mag got hung up and ftf. No problems after that. I shot 4 rounds of old hydrashok with no problems either. However, my confidence is shaken in turning this into my new CCW to replace the G19.


So much for the fixed non-tilting barrel being uber-reliable in feeding.
My Glock 19 never did this after shooting probably 100 rounds of the stuff.

JMN69
Link Posted: 11/29/2005 9:54:29 PM EDT
do you use wolf ammo in your carry gun?
Link Posted: 11/30/2005 6:04:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/30/2005 6:04:46 AM EDT by OG10807]
It was posted a while back that some AR's had problems digesting brass case ammo right after firing wolf steel case stuff. maybe this is a similar situation?
Link Posted: 11/30/2005 10:29:47 AM EDT
you can send me that junky jamin P7 if that would make you happy :D
Link Posted: 11/30/2005 11:03:54 AM EDT
This was the first time the gun was shot by me so I wanted to try a variety of ammo to test for reliability. I won't be shooting wolf through it anymore.

John
Link Posted: 12/2/2005 6:07:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/2/2005 6:07:56 AM EDT by fla556guy]
If it shoots 100% with everything else but wolf, then maybe it's just a wolf problem, with isn't a problem in all actuality. I say this because you aren't going to be using wolf in a situation where you don't have time to clear that FTF, and the practice clearing that FTF might be an important skill. Just don't use wolf for Self Defense.
Link Posted: 12/2/2005 6:27:38 PM EDT
Thats the problem, the Wolf worked great. Its the expensive Gold Dot 124 Gr +p that jammed it.
Link Posted: 12/3/2005 5:25:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/3/2005 5:26:13 AM EDT by MaddMan]
jmn did you even read this post, or skip right over it? It my not have been the gun but the ammo you shot before the good stuff.

Also did you inspect your ammo or did you just load it up?



Originally Posted By OG10807:
It was posted a while back that some AR's had problems digesting brass case ammo right after firing wolf steel case stuff. maybe this is a similar situation?

Link Posted: 12/3/2005 4:56:36 PM EDT
The chamber of the p7 is fluted, so if your Wolff ammo had the soft lacquer on it then it is entirely possible that the lacquer came off and clogged the flutes in the chamber-that is why you never shoot Wolff in a fluted chamber. Being steel the steel did not expand to the point that it caused extraction problems but when you went back to the softer brass casings then with the flutes being clogged, the brass was not "floated" on a cushion of gas like it needs to be, hence the jam. If your ammo was not the lacquer coated crap then it could be caused by excessive dirt in the gas piston and gas port.
Wolff is pretty dirty and if it causes a reduction in gas flow to the piston from all the crud then you did not get enough gas to retard the opening of the pistol, and then when the pistol tried to extract there was too high a pressure in the chamber and once again, a jam.
The P7 uses a gas system that is opposite to most gas operated firearms, it uses gas to retard ejection, not aid it.
Link Posted: 12/10/2005 3:54:42 AM EDT
Your confidence is shaken because of ONE ftf? I'd give it a second chance before relegating that P7 to the trash heap.
Link Posted: 12/10/2005 3:55:17 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/10/2005 4:03:50 PM EDT
Some HP's do not feed well in certain guns as well. I would not write the gun off because one product did not work unless you are hung up on that round being the only round that you intend to carry for some reason. It is alot cheaper to find round that the gun likes than find a gun that the rounds likes.

Did you notice any deformation on the bullet? Did they fit into the mag as well as the other ammo?



Link Posted: 12/12/2005 3:03:38 PM EDT
wolf is CRAP! in a p7.no steel cases !
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 4:45:01 AM EDT
I took it out again and shot another 35 rounds of Gold Dot 124 gr +p's without incident. The gun is very snappy with this +P ammo, subjectively more so than with my XD9 or G19.

They fit in the mag just fine. The one that got hung up before did have a noticeable gouge on it where it got stuck on the barrel ramp.
Link Posted: 12/16/2005 9:15:35 AM EDT
I do not understand why anyone in their right mind would shoot Wolf...

PURE GARBAGE!

Treat a quality piece like an HK better than that.

Anyone who respects their firearms (regardless of what it costs) should NOT shoot that Wolf SHEET!!!!!!

For range use in 9 mm go to Wal Mart and buy the Winchester White Box, from 9.50 - 11 per box of 100.

Link Posted: 12/17/2005 8:39:43 PM EDT
Some guy gave me crap about shooting WOlF in my $1000 AR at the range the other day.
He said "its hard on the extractors"!

I told him that if I wanted his opinion I would have asked for it, and I can buy another extractor for $7! 1000 rounds of Wolf in .223 saves about $60 anyway.
Link Posted: 12/17/2005 9:19:14 PM EDT
You wanna fire garbage?

Then dont bitch when your toys dont work.
Link Posted: 12/18/2005 11:07:15 AM EDT

Originally Posted By JYogi:
You wanna fire garbage?

Then dont bitch when your toys dont work.



The wolf worked fine in his gun, did you not read that part?
Link Posted: 12/18/2005 4:19:02 PM EDT
Yeah and did you not read the part where the Wolf most likely caused the later problems due to the build up of the soft lacquer clogging up the flutes?

Try taking a minute and reread Big Bores post and you will see exactly why it did not fire after the Wolf...

Maybe you aren't aware of how the P7 is a fluted barrel and how the P7 uses a gas system like no other.
Lets not mention how easily the dirt from the Wolf would also clog the gas port and piston.

Thing's that make you go Hmmm........
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 6:50:02 AM EDT
It's known that Blazer aluminum jams in HK P7's. It's the fluted chamber.
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 5:01:16 PM EDT
Blasphemy!!!!!! Wolf in a P7? Why, lord, why?

The P7's an engineering marvel and a work of art. Please feed it brass at least!
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 9:14:40 AM EDT
Sorry for offending you guys. I will not shoot WOLF through the p7 anymore. I just did it that one time to test the gun for function with "various brands of ammo". Thanks for the feedback.

JMN69
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 9:17:31 AM EDT
I couldn't jam my SIG P226 mixing up a bunch of Wolf then White box, Corbon and UMC FWIW.

It's not a picky eater.
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 3:35:16 AM EDT
In the interest of carry/not carry ... Just what action or effort was needed to clear your P7 and get it (quickly) back in working order ? I'm guessing you didn't have much trouble w the clearing ???
+1 on NOTHING is unjammable. FWIW my P7M8 failed to eject completely the very 1st round I squeezed off, but I had barely touched the ambi mag release with my offhand thumb, and it never happened again. I also shot a 500 round class one time with reloads and didn't clean for the first 300-350 rounds. Had one failure to eject. Those are the only 2 "problems" mine has ever had in over 5000 rounds of a lot of different kinds of ammo. Stay safe
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 9:14:28 AM EDT
All I had to do to clear the misfeed was to tip the gun sideways and pull the slide back. The misfed shell fell out and a new one was fed in through the mag.

I shot over 5000 rounds through my G19 with no malfunctions using all sorts of brass cased and BLAZER ammo. ..... until I shot WOLF for the first time through it. Then I got 3 failures during the 50 round box of WOLF.
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 11:11:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/22/2005 11:39:34 AM EDT by JYogi]
Again, that just goes to show...

DONT SHOOT WOLF IT IS GARBAGE!

Everyone who wants to brag their gun runs great with it... GOOD FOR YOU!
Your gun sure wont last a long time if you keep putting the laquer through it.

If a Glock wont eat it you know it is bad.
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 12:20:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By JYogi:
Again, that just goes to show...

DONT SHOOT WOLF IT IS GARBAGE!

Everyone who wants to brag their gun runs great with it... GOOD FOR YOU!
Your gun sure wont last a long time if you keep putting the laquer through it.

If a Glock wont eat it you know it is bad.



Well, they do have that polymer stuff.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:43:10 PM EDT
I did a little mini torture test on my used P7 PSP about a year ago. It was a relatively well used gun that had never had the little piston cleaned as I never had the carbon scraper tool which is usually included with P7's.

I put 1000 rounds of winchester white box down range as quickly as could be allowed. Minimal cool downs, only gave it a rest when the gun actually became too hot to hold. That's once every 300-350 rounds or so. The only other cool downs were reload cool downs which might have been 15 seconds or so at most. My friend was with me so we'd take turns emptying a mag while the other man loaded the remaining mag.

I used two magazines. One factory new and one I had assembled from some rusty mag parts I obtained with the gun.

I experienced one malfunction, a failure to feed, at around 600 rounds. It was from the magazine assembled from rusty spare parts.

Surprisingly, even when the gun was incredibly hot, and terribly dirty, accuracy stayed pretty consistant.

As has already been stated, what you experienced was almost certainly ammunition induced failure. If you don't trust your life to the gun, I'm in the market for a new one, just drop me an IM.

Link Posted: 1/1/2006 5:18:07 PM EDT
Did any of you read the original post? He experienced a FAILURE TO FEED, not a failure to extract. Gummed up flutes is not the cause.

MBR
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 8:24:50 AM EDT
His FTF seems to be a ammunition problem. Try some more or different ammo. I always like HydraShoks. Didn't use Gold Dots out of my PSP P7 since they came out after I traded mine years ago. Did have trouble with the CCI Blazer and never used it again. Also keep lead bullets out of mine. It was the most accurate 9mm I ever owned.

CD
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