Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
PSA
Member Login

Site Notices
Posted: 4/27/2009 11:24:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/28/2009 4:40:09 AM EDT by KnightofTheOldeCode]
I've always heard they don't stand up as well as 1911s or more modern designs to high round counts.

Link Posted: 4/28/2009 9:29:40 AM EDT
Mine has lasted a very long time. It maybe has 8k through it with no excessive wear, I dont shoot it too much bc I prefer my 1911. It will last you a lifetime I would figure unless your shooting really hot 9mm and shoot hundreds daily. I am however not a gunsmith....
Link Posted: 4/28/2009 9:51:05 AM EDT
you can get alot of BS in hearsay.  especially on the www now,  you need a BS filter with everything.

i would take what you hear about the BHP with a grain of salt.   yes some guns may fail, but unless you get the complete history/mods/use of the gun, you really cant make an informed decision as to the true failure and or cause.

Link Posted: 4/28/2009 10:31:26 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/28/2009 10:37:53 AM EDT
I've put close to 8000 rnds through mine. Only problem was an extractor which claw(for lack of better terms) lost its tip,$20 fix
Link Posted: 4/28/2009 1:43:28 PM EDT
The BHP is just an elegant, beautifully designed handgun.

I took a 1968 T series to the range last Friday and put 150 rds of Fiocchi 115 gr fmj thru her. And 20 rds of Speer 124 gr Gold Dot.

Extremely accurate (even for a poor shot like me)!

No failures to feed or eject. It has never malfunctioned.

All  the brass landed in a very neat 24" circle on the ground about 8' to my right.

I can't really answer your question about the BHP's longevity but it's been sucessful with militaries around the world since 1935.

That's a long time.



Link Posted: 4/28/2009 6:58:29 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ikor:
A lot depends on ammo, frequency of shooting, etc. but I can guarantee this...you will never find a custom 'smith who works on both who will tell you when pushed hard that the BHP will be as trouble free with nearly as many rounds as a 1911. Remember, the 9mm is a higher pressure cartridge. The Brits had all sorts of problems with the ones the SAS used with the issue 2Z ammo before they switched to the Sig 226 and the FBI HRT also could not keep theirs running reliably with high round counts. I seriously doubt that many are ever fired more than 5000rd max...most far less. When run hard, the HP just does not hold up as well as most other 9mms...but they do feel good.

There's some truth here, but allow me to clarify and elaborate.

First, the 1911 is a more robust design, no doubt about that; I don't think ANY handgun in the history of handguns has a military service record to match the 1911.  However, if there's a second place, it most certainly goes to the Hi Power.  The Hi Power is an exceptionally well designed and well built pistol that will last many thousands of rounds.  My first gunsmithing job was working for a small arms importer where I had to go through, inspect, repair and Parkerize 10,000 Hi Powers; so one could say I've kinda been inside the Hi Power (Early '80's, company was Pacific International).  With very few exceptions, the Inglis Hi Powers that had been drug through WWII were all in servicable condition.  The early type barrels did occasionally crack a barrel at the barrel cam; this cam design was engineerd out in the 1950's (from memory, not totally sure about that date, but you get the idea).  Extractors would be found broken from time to time (Extractor was re-designed in the 1963?? model, and those you just plain don't see broken).  Sear springs were almost ALL worn to the point that if you dropped the slide on an empty chamber, the hammer would drop to half cock; this has been a persistent problem/non-probem from the beginning till today.  I say problem, because at some point, EVERY Hi Power will do this.  It's a non-problem because it almost NEVER happens while firing live ammunition.  It's also a common occurrance on pistols with light triggers.  

All in all, the Hi Power can take a high round count WHEN YOU FEED IT STANDARD PRESSURE AMMUNITION.  The problems arise when you start feeding them +P or NATO pressure ammo, and the Hi Power was designed in a time where no such thing really existed.  Hi Powers tend to be soft, which adds to the longevity of the Hi Power with standard pressure rounds because the steel is more ductile (meaning it will flex and give, rather than crack).  But when you begin feeding it NATO pressure ammunition, the Hi Power begins to have problems.  It really became a problem for NATO nations who adopted the higher pressure ammunition in the late '80's, which quickly began to kill off Hi Powers that had served with distinction for several decades prior.  Typically the most common problem was lug setback on the slides, and cracked locking cams on the barrels.  And often these problems weren't detected, so the guns remained in serivce until the slide began to crack at the rear of the ejection port (nearest the bolt face), or the frame began to have the slide rails crack and literally lift off (which was generally from a gun with a broken slide that they kept shooting).

So, feed a Hi Power standard pressure ammunition and it will out live you by many years.  Feed it +P and you'll kill one in sort order; simple as that.

FN has always been very slow to make upgrades to the Hi Power.  Mostly this is because it's the most successful and most widely used hangun in the history of handguns (it's the AK of handguns).  When FN makes a change, they affect the supply chain for literally dozens of military organizations across the globe.  The success of the Hi Power was somewhat it's un-doing as well.  So making changes are a difficult and very controversial thing for FN to do.  

Still, the Hi Power would be very much alive and well today if FN had kept pace with a world that doesn't stop.  A truth in business is that what you do today won't be good enough tomorrow.  The Hi Power has needed a metallurgical upgrade for a good two decades now, yet FN just won't do it on their 9mm guns.  The .40's are a very different story; they are tough as nails; well designed and well manufactured.  If you really like the 9mm +P concept, then buy a .40 Hi Power and drop in a .357 Sig barrel and you'll have an ass-kicker.  

I'd give anything to see FN introduce an aluminum frame (Scandium would be even better) Hi Power in .40, .357 Sig, 9x21 and 9mm.  Make it with a beavertail grip safety and use the trigger link that Bill Laughridge designed.  This would be a straight up kick ass pistol.
Link Posted: 4/28/2009 8:02:31 PM EDT
Information on BHP longevity and use of +P found here:

http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/Hi%20Power%20Longevity.htm


Link Posted: 4/29/2009 5:09:19 AM EDT
My real life experience with my first Hi Power. 17,000+ rounds all standard pressure factory and reloads. 90gr. to 147gr. and everything in between, including all types of bullet designs. The factory sear chipped and would cause the hammer to drop to the half cock notch on occasion. Pistol was stolen before I could affect the repair. No other problems with this gun. It always ran with the legendary Hi Power reliability too. The gun never malfunctioned in the 4 years i owned it, with the exception of the sear problem.
My current Hi Power only has about 3,000 rounds through it and as expected, no problems and runs dead nuts reliable. I trust the Hi Power above all others due to my personal experience with them, YMMV. Hope this helps.
Link Posted: 4/29/2009 5:21:39 AM EDT
I have shot the hell out of a couple of WWII Inglis Hi-Powers and they still seem good. I did break the extractor on a 1980's Browning.

Link Posted: 4/29/2009 6:18:07 AM EDT
Originally Posted By SS109:
I did break the extractor on a 1980's Browning.

Over-achiever

Link Posted: 4/29/2009 8:21:05 AM EDT
Dont have too much knowledge on the fact. I've shot the hi-power only a few times but love it.  My uncle has had his for over 30 years and still trusts his life with it daily.  I dont know what his round count is at but he does shoot regularly.  Its a good gun.
Link Posted: 4/29/2009 3:07:59 PM EDT
My Hi-Power made in 1979 and I picked it up in 1981 [round count low] has had just over 125,000 thru it and has just started to give me problems. Springs have bin replaced every 8 to 10 K on it. It has has a diet of handloads from mild to hot and the hot very rare, most of 124gr at 1000fps. She is my most reliable gun I had up to the last few months and  I have changed so much on it [new parts] and still jams, think it is time to find a good smith for her.
Link Posted: 4/29/2009 6:34:11 PM EDT
If you run pure +P+ (which is what NATO spec 9MM is very close to), any pistol's life span will be short.

With normal civ use and ammo, a BHP will outlast your grandchildren.
Link Posted: 4/30/2009 10:01:06 AM EDT
Excellent background - THANKS! This matches what is known in the USPSA world (where the Browning was an early favorite due to mag capacity, accuracy and realibility, but found lacking when a constant diet of really hot 9mm).  The 2 9mm guns that emerged as being able to handle a constant diet of +p+ 9mm are: custom 1911s with SUPPOERTED CHAMBER/RAMPED barrels and all clones of the 75 (the 75 shares a lot in common with BHPs).

As for all the fine Brownings & clones out there, everyone remember:

"All in all, the Hi Power can take a high round count WHEN YOU FEED IT STANDARD PRESSURE AMMUNITION"

Originally Posted By 3030ai:
Originally Posted By ikor:
A lot depends on ammo, . . .

All in all, the Hi Power can take a high round count WHEN YOU FEED IT STANDARD PRESSURE AMMUNITION.  The problems arise when you start feeding them +P or NATO pressure ammo, and the Hi Power was designed in a time where no such thing really existed.  Hi Powers tend to be soft, which adds to the longevity of the Hi Power with standard pressure rounds because the steel is more ductile (meaning it will flex and give, rather than crack).  But when you begin feeding it NATO pressure ammunition, the Hi Power begins to have problems.  It really became a problem for NATO nations who adopted the higher pressure ammunition in the late '80's, which quickly began to kill off Hi Powers that had served with distinction for several decades prior.  Typically the most common problem was lug setback on the slides, and cracked locking cams on the barrels.  And often these problems weren't detected, so the guns remained in serivce until the slide began to crack at the rear of the ejection port (nearest the bolt face), or the frame began to have the slide rails crack and literally lift off (which was generally from a gun with a broken slide that they kept shooting).

So, feed a Hi Power standard pressure ammunition and it will out live you by many years.  Feed it +P and you'll kill one in sort order; simple as that.


Link Posted: 5/2/2009 7:11:05 AM EDT

Thanks for the help all. I'm leaning more toward a 9mm 1911 as I prefer that platform.
Top Top