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Posted: 12/22/2002 4:08:23 PM EST
What models are out there - I'm leaning toward Glock 20.

What are the ballistic characteristics of this round?
Link Posted: 12/22/2002 8:07:26 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/22/2002 8:17:26 PM EST by Cerebus]
Not many new models. Glock 20 (full) and 29 (subcompact). S&W is still making the 610 revolver ...next on my handgun list. And Witness makes a model (or two) in 10mm ...unsure of their quality/fit though.

There are a multitude of S&W autos out there in various models. I own a S&W 1076 which shoots nice, but I'm not too crazy about the DA/SA. You can pick the S&W autos up for $400-$500. I also own a Colt Delta Elite ...by far my most favorite handgun I have EVER shot. If you can afford one, this is what I'd recommend. They're easy to find used, and every now and then I see a NIB on Gunbroker. Second to the Colt, I would recommend a Glock if you want a semi, or the 610 if you prefer a revolver.

Sites:

home.earthlink.net/~gnappi/

marina.fortunecity.com/harbour/347/10mm.html

Mostly informative, but some links to ballistic data.
Link Posted: 12/22/2002 11:10:03 PM EST
Ed Brown makes a 10mm 1911... but its uhh.. about 2500-2700 bucks SUPER NICE gun though
Link Posted: 12/23/2002 5:23:32 AM EST
The future of the 10mm is bleak. Get a 40S&W chambered pistol.
Link Posted: 12/23/2002 6:13:11 AM EST

Originally Posted By OldTiger:
The future of the 10mm is bleak. Get a 40S&W chambered pistol.



I disagree ...with both it's future being "bleak" and the recommendation of .40 short&weak all together. The fact that companies like EAA, Glock, Smith & Wesson, and smiths like Ed Brown are still making handguns in 10mm, makes it apparent that it's not going away any time soon.

The two main reason the short & weak was developed were increased capacity (vs. the 10mm) and the reduced recoil (the FBI's ladies couldn't handle the 10mm effectively). If those two "drawbacks" are a concern, then I'd recommend a 9mm over a .40 any day.

As for the .40's popularity ...I see it as a fad. All the gun manufacturer's want to push their new products, so they offer LE offices significant price breaks to trade in their old .45's and 9mm's for the fancy new .40. It's just having it's day in the sun right now, the fad will pass.

To clean_cut: You won't be disappointed with a 10mm. It's a powerful cartridge that's fun to shoot.
Link Posted: 12/23/2002 6:40:21 AM EST
Like the .41 Magnum, the 10mm is, I believe, under-appreciated. It is an excellent cartridge, but one that few makers build guns for and not likely to see any upsurge in popularity any time soon, if ever. To me, the real value of the 10mm is only found with high-end loads, where it can beat the pants off of either the .45acp or the .40. W/W Silvertips will easily clock 1250+ from 4-5in. barrels with no more recoil than 230gr. ball in the .45. If you want to reload, and take time to find brass, the 10mm can do anything either of the other calibers can do, and do it at much lower pressures than the .40 S&W. Unfortunately, the 10mm requires a full size frame a la the .45 and is virtually impossible to build in a compact model. The G29 is not what I consider "compact". All in all, the 10mm is mostly an "enthusiasts'" caliber.

The .40 ain't a fad by any realistic stretch of the imagination and it won't go away for a long, long time, probably never. It is a pratical and extremely popular defensive caliber with a wide variety of handgun models available to fire it. If you reload for it, you must be very careful as pressures can go "off the chart" quickly...see Sig 230's posts on this. If you are not really "into" handguns yet, get something other than the 10mm for a start. The 610 revolver can, of course, do it all, but in a pretty big, bulky package if concealment is a consideration.
Link Posted: 12/23/2002 6:59:29 AM EST
The 10mm is awesome. Factory ammo is available with a 180gr hollow-point at 1300fps, 180gr penetrator at 1320fps/ 697 ftlbs-e. Silvertips are 175gr @ 1290fps and only $10 dollars a box.

If you are feeling slow and weak you can switch out the barrel and shoot some .40SW cartridges with the switch of a barrel in an automatic.

Link Posted: 12/23/2002 6:20:47 PM EST
Clean cut

I've got a Glock 20 and like it alot. It's an accurate gun.

If I remember correctly, most all of the 10mm guns were based on large-framed guns designed for the .45.This caused some problems because the 10mm was more powerful than the .45. The Glock 20 on the other hand was designed as a 10mm gun, to handle the 10mm in particular. Only later did it come out as a .45. There are some others out there designed for 10mm, but other than the Bren10, I don't know what they are.

Full capacity magazines are expensive. The last time I bought some they were about $80.00, and that was about 5 years ago. I haven't seen any at the gunshows for quite awhile.
Link Posted: 12/23/2002 6:36:12 PM EST
A EAA fullsize 10mm has been on my to buy list for a while. I have never shot one but have handled a few. the fit and finish is quite good and the price is great. my only complaint about them is they are a double stack mag design and there are NO full capacity mags available. Maybe I'll get one after 2004.

Ben
Link Posted: 12/24/2002 2:29:39 AM EST

Originally Posted By ikor:
Like the .41 Magnum, the 10mm is, I believe, under-appreciated. It is an excellent cartridge, but one that few makers build guns for and not likely to see any upsurge in popularity any time soon, if ever. To me, the real value of the 10mm is only found with high-end loads, where it can beat the pants off of either the .45acp or the .40. W/W Silvertips will easily clock 1250+ from 4-5in. barrels with no more recoil than 230gr. ball in the .45. If you want to reload, and take time to find brass, the 10mm can do anything either of the other calibers can do, and do it at much lower pressures than the .40 S&W. Unfortunately, the 10mm requires a full size frame a la the .45 and is virtually impossible to build in a compact model. The G29 is not what I consider "compact". All in all, the 10mm is mostly an "enthusiasts'" caliber.

The .40 ain't a fad by any realistic stretch of the imagination and it won't go away for a long, long time, probably never. It is a pratical and extremely popular defensive caliber with a wide variety of handgun models available to fire it. If you reload for it, you must be very careful as pressures can go "off the chart" quickly...see Sig 230's posts on this. If you are not really "into" handguns yet, get something other than the 10mm for a start. The 610 revolver can, of course, do it all, but in a pretty big, bulky package if concealment is a consideration.



Ditto.

Want a 10mm? By all means go buy one.

.40 SW, once you have seen the wounding potential, you won't think of it as Short and Weak. I do NOT want to be hit by one.

If you are shooting bears, 10mm and up. Shooting for personal defense, think about over penetration.

Just my .02

TRG
Link Posted: 12/24/2002 10:56:13 AM EST
Dan Wesson is making a 10mm 1911. Here's a photo and some links about it.


danwessonfirearms.com/news.htm
www.1911forum.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=52
Link Posted: 12/24/2002 10:18:59 PM EST
Just teasing about the slow and weak, I wouldn't want to be shot by a BB gun if I could help it. I used to carry both a 629 and a Glock 17 when I went up in the mountains. Now I just carry a 10mm.



Link Posted: 12/25/2002 2:28:13 AM EST
As a little background info on the 10MM and the Bren 10

www.bren-ten.com/
Link Posted: 12/26/2002 3:42:05 PM EST
If I remember corectly a 40sw is 2mm shorter than 10mm.? 40 is to 10 what .380 is to 9mm
Link Posted: 12/26/2002 3:49:20 PM EST
I have Glock 20 and 29.
EAA Witness
Colt Delta Gold Cup
S&W 1006.

10 Rules.

Witness new was 350.00. I'd buy another.

MM419
Link Posted: 12/28/2002 4:03:52 PM EST
.45acp -- There can be only one.
Link Posted: 12/29/2002 4:32:24 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/29/2002 4:34:15 AM EST by GreyGhost]
I've got a 10mm Colt Delta Elite.If you read up on the ballestics you'll see it's an awesome round.Better than the .40 Short&Weak and because of the velocity more energy than a .45 I'm no giant--6'1" and the recoil is no problem for me.It's certainly no worse than the .45's I've shot.
Link Posted: 12/31/2002 10:21:47 AM EST
The 10mm Auto is definately not a cartridge for the faint-hearted. I bought my first one more than 10 years ago. As a foolish (and very poor) youth, I bought the cheapest one available, which was the AMT Javelina. This particular model was NOT up to the pounding that full-house loads put on a 1911 platform. In addition to the relatively poor quality of the frame, slide, etc., the Javelina had a poorly fitted barrel with an unsupported chamber. The 10mm Auto should really only be shot in a supported chamber. You should see some of the ugly head expansion I used to get with factory ammo!

That said about the Javelina, a very high quality 1911 in 10mm Auto, that is very tight and has had the supported chamber barrel handfitted, is a real joy to shoot. It will do almost anything you can ask a handgun to do. At the light end of the bullet weight spectrum, you can mimic the .357 magnum, but with a bigger bullet. Accurate Arms lists a load that goes faster than 1450 fps with a 135 gr JHP in a 5" barrel. At the heavy end, you can get nearly 1200 fps with a 200 gr JHP. This is getting into .41 Magnum territory. Other than brown bear, there isn't much that this couldn't stop. The S & W M610, which I also reload for (my brother's gun) is also very nice. It is incredibly strong and more forgiving on reloads.

My advice to you? Save your pennies and get a custom built 1911 (or the Ed Brown). Recent American Pistolsmith Guild inductee, Scott Mulkerin is also VERY experienced putting together 10MM 1911's. His website is www.sdmfabricating.com. Lot's of nice pics.

Good Luck!
Link Posted: 12/31/2002 10:51:21 AM EST
I don't understand the FBI the 9mm didn't do the job and some agents got killed so they got to the badass 10mm then decide its too much and go to the 40s&w? and now the swat guys have .45's.

Weird way of doing things.
Link Posted: 12/31/2002 6:39:09 PM EST
The ten mil and forty comparison is like saying you were shot with a .308 and a 30/06!

The .308 is supposed to be as powerful as the 30/06 right?

How about at about 900 yards and a 200 grn bullet? Same?

The ten mil shoots flat at about 80 yards,the 40 or forty five start downward long before that!


I guess I just love carrots and the 10 mil!


Bob (carrot)
Link Posted: 12/31/2002 6:46:12 PM EST
G20 is a great pistol, just make sure to wear foam earplugs under your normal ear protection, that sucker is loud!
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