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Posted: 8/11/2017 6:22:50 PM EDT
Always loved the 1911 and have decided I want to have one in 10MM.  Never to take a decision like this lightly, and determined to get something of a good quality....  So I have been doing research on the 1911 in 10MM and it has raised some questions which I thought I would ask of the knowledgeable people here.

There have been a few who believe the 1911 is not adequately designed to handle the 10MM with full power loads and its potential to cause excessive ware on this design.  Let me know what you all think.  

I am also curious as to what you all think of the Kimber Camp Guard.  It seems as though Kimber can be real hit and miss, more hits than misses, but just the same I would rather not be in the category of miss.  From the Camp Guards I have handled, it appears to be a pretty well built production gun.  I handled a Sig Tac Ops, wasn't too impressed with the trigger.

Dan Wesson sure seems to have developed quite the following and I am not afraid to shell out the extra money for one of these, in particular the Silverback or Valor.  Only problem with this is if I get one, the wife is sure to like it then I am getting another, which really isn't a problem!  

I haven't seen too much in regards to Wilson or Les Baer and I believe they are both currently producing a 10MM.  Are they worth the extra money over a DW?   3 Gs for a Baer and I assume the Wilson and Knighthawk is that or more.  I believe STI discontinued the 10MM.  

With the resurgence in popularity in the 10MM, there is quite a bit of reasonably affordable ammo out there from Sig, Federal and others.  Never been a fan of Armscor.  Just for practice and brass for loading, is the S&B a quality product or is it mostly crap?  I really don't want ammo which will blow gasses past the primer pocket... or cause any other issues.  Quality over quantity.

Anything else which I might be missing, or suggestions are greatly appreciated.
Link Posted: 8/11/2017 6:32:26 PM EDT
[#1]
While I am a fan of my Bear's and my Wilson, I would not buy a 10mm in either one of them.
Too much money for a gun I am not gonna shoot a lot. A 10 mm is cool but not what I am going to put 1000's of rounds through.
You may want to consider one of these:
Colt Delta Elite.
Link Posted: 8/11/2017 6:52:58 PM EDT
[#2]
Link Posted: 8/11/2017 7:13:08 PM EDT
[#3]
I'm sure everyone here thinks "Gun Tests" is a shit rag but Kimbers have been very, as in the best of the bunch, accurate and run like a sewing machine. My local gunsmith prefers them himself. He thinks they are very good. But then there's here...   ...Kimbers are shit.

I don't own one but I don't believe they are as bad as the echo in here. I'd consider one in 10mm.
Link Posted: 8/11/2017 7:13:33 PM EDT
[#4]
Yeah the Dan Wesson's are sweet!! Best production 1911 no doubt about it. Quality almost as good as a Wilson or Ed Brown, with half the price tag. I have a Valor model in 45acp and it's my favorite handgun. I have a Glock 20 10mm and I'm loving it. I might have to pick up another Dan Wesson Valor in 10mm. 
Link Posted: 8/11/2017 7:31:28 PM EDT
[#5]
I'd get a Dan Wesson if I wanted a 1911 in 10mm. I'm more of a Glock guy when it comes to 10mm. A friend has a Dan and a Wilson in 10 and they are safe queens.
Link Posted: 8/11/2017 7:33:52 PM EDT
[#6]
Colt Delta
Link Posted: 8/11/2017 8:51:10 PM EDT
[#7]
I was all set to buy a Delta Elite:  watched Gun Broker for months, rank ordered the sellers by total cost, was ready to go and then...I saw the Sig 220-10 "Emperor Scorpion".

I know, stupid name, but it's sitting at my FFL as I type.
Link Posted: 8/11/2017 9:52:58 PM EDT
[#8]
I considered the Glock and have a great respect for the guns.  They just don't fit my hand right.  

We purchased a Kimber Sapphire a year or so ago and its been flawless and accurate.  Just not sure if the Camp Guard is what I want in a 10MM.  He said he has sold several of the Camp Guards and so far every one has come back with great reviews and reports of very good accuracy.  He also is of the opinion the CG is the best quality production gun Kimber has made in quite some time.  I know this guy very well and have no reason to ever believe he would fabricate anything to try and get me to buy.  

So I stopped in at the shop where I do most of my buying and they came up with a Valor Commander in 10MM.  Used but damn near new condition with a price tag of about $1500.  Not sure a shorter barreled 10MM is the ticket as it tends to shine with the longer barrels.  He also quoted me a 5" stainless Valor at $1530 and a Silverback at $1940.
Link Posted: 8/12/2017 9:08:45 AM EDT
[#9]
My STI 10mm:

Attachment Attached File


I also have the Rock Island Commander in 10mm, love carrying it.

Certainly the Dan Wesson models are quality but they come with a price tag. The STI is just as good but $100s cheaper, IMO. Obviously Sigs are quality as well.

The $2500+ 10mm's are well out of my price range, so I never bothered to even look.  I do love my .45 Baer's though.

What you get depends on what you want to do with the gun. With my STI, I wanted accuracy. With my RIA Commander, I wanted to carry it.

I don't like the 6" long slide models, so I never looked at those. The Ruger & Remington will take a hit on resale, so I avoided those.

My .o2
Link Posted: 8/12/2017 11:48:13 AM EDT
[#10]
I too got the 10mm itch last year. I got the Dan Wesson silver back and love it. I'm sure there's other manufacturers that produces quality 10mms but dang this DW is is awesome. Check GunBroker for deals. Be patient and you can score a nice one very reasonable.
Link Posted: 8/12/2017 12:42:24 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Have a Dan Wesson (CZ) Bruin 10 with the 6" barrel. One of the best handguns I own. And I own quite a few.  Worth the money. Also have one of the new Ruger 1911 10mm. Very nice as well, but not like the DW.
View Quote
I also have a 10mm Bruin.  I was also thinking about picking up the Ruger.  

My thought was to have a LOCAL 1911 guy look at the Ruger.   Maybe change some parts out and clean it up.  Make it better.   Think that is a possibility?   I'm not paying Nighthawk prices to improve the Ruger.  

Edit.  I've had other (non 1911) guns he has done and they were fantastic.  However he is a 1911 guy, so it will be fine.

I also know the Ruger trigger won't be like the DW with the firing pin block and all.

I'm not even considering the Colt, even though I love Colt.

My other option was the Rock Island long slide and have him look it over.  

Thoughts?
Link Posted: 8/12/2017 5:07:21 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


I also have a 10mm Bruin.  I was also thinking about picking up the Ruger.  

My thought was to have a LOCAL 1911 guy look at the Ruger.   Maybe change some parts out and clean it up.  Make it better.   Think that is a possibility?   I'm not paying Nighthawk prices to improve the Ruger.  

Edit.  I've had other (non 1911) guns he has done and they were fantastic.  However he is a 1911 guy, so it will be fine.

I also know the Ruger trigger won't be like the DW with the firing pin block and all.

I'm not even considering the Colt, even though I love Colt.

My other option was the Rock Island long slide and have him look it over.  

Thoughts?
View Quote
My father recently picked up a Ruger SR1911 10mm.  I was actually impressed for the $730 he paid for it.

The slide to frame fit was tight.  The finish is nowhere near as nice as a Dan Wesson, but it's not a $1500+ gun either.  The sights are not the best. I would probably put a Dawson fiber optic front and adjustable rear on it.  There was no slop with the ejector like a couple of people have reported.  The beaver tail safety was fitted a little loosely. The trigger had very little creep and broke around 4.5 lbs.   All in all, it seems to be a decent gun for the money.  You might be better off finding one in a shop to look over rather than taking a chance on one off the net.

Eta: The Ruger is a series 70 gun, so no firing pin block.
Link Posted: 8/13/2017 9:22:50 PM EDT
[#13]
Attachment Attached File
This is my soon to be 10mm 6"
Link Posted: 8/14/2017 1:14:15 PM EDT
[#14]
OP, why no love for Armscor? My son's 10MM is awesome. Certainly not as nice as a DW or one of the other high-end guns but it works very well. The PI guns have come a long ways and RIA really stands behind there stuff.

It may be only a sample of one but my son's RIA worked perfectly out of the box, unlike his STI that cost 3X as much.
Link Posted: 8/14/2017 3:49:31 PM EDT
[#15]
The new Colt Delta's are pretty nice. I picked one up and it ran like a sewing machine on the Sig and S&B ammo. It's currently at Evolution Armory for a dehorn and checkering.
Link Posted: 8/14/2017 6:31:37 PM EDT
[#16]
I recently joined this forum because of the information available on it.  Over the years, I often referenced the information in the the discussions, but finally made the plunge to become more informed and involved.  

Armscor ammo has a mixed reputation around here, and from what I have been gathering from a number of various individuals, the mixed reputation appears to not be justified.  The individual who put the bug into me to shoot 10MM uses Armscor regularly, and he is no idiot.  When my dealer mentioned to me he could order DW, I looked at him a little cross eyed as a close acquaintance had one with which he had enough trouble he finally disposed of it.  A separate discussion in the 1911 forum really shined a light on what his issues probably were, and not the fault of DW, but that of the owner not properly breaking in the gun.  Or, perhaps, he had a lemon.  Regardless, the reputation of DW customer service in these forums, he should have pursued it further.  

I have also been hearing some really good things about the Rock Island, so thank you for your post on this gun.  I probably will stick with a higher end USA manufacturer but it is good to know there is a quality product out on the market which will not break the bank.  

On another note, we shot my wife's Kimber 9MM this weekend.  It is one of the newer models which doesn't have the plastic mainspring housing and beaver tail.  This gun is really smooth and quite accurate.  I personally am leaning toward the DW Valor or Silver back, or maybe an STI Trojan but she will probably get the bug for a 10MM as well and she likes the two tone look of the Camp Guard.  So many choices......
Link Posted: 8/15/2017 5:58:28 PM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:
Always loved the 1911 and have decided I want to have one in 10MM.  Never to take a decision like this lightly, and determined to get something of a good quality....  So I have been doing research on the 1911 in 10MM and it has raised some questions which I thought I would ask of the knowledgeable people here. * * *

I am also curious as to what you all think of the Kimber Camp Guard. * * *
View Quote
Kimber 1911s, in most any caliber, are problematic junk.  Majorly avoid. You can thank me later.

* * *
* * * I handled a Sig Tac Ops, wasn't too impressed with the trigger.  * * *
View Quote


Of the other possible 10mm 1911s you mentioned,  the Sig Tac Ops is the best contender relative to price-point.  Triggers can be smoothed up rather easily by any competent 1911-smith, so there's really no issue there.  Plus, the 10mm Tac Ops is a railed gun, giving you the option of mounting a pistol-light, if needed. Not to mention, Sig includes 4 factory 10mm magazines in the case with the pistol.

Word, my dudenal.
Link Posted: 8/17/2017 3:46:21 PM EDT
[#18]
Grear point. The extra mags would be a plus.
Link Posted: 8/18/2017 12:01:59 PM EDT
[#19]
I was reading on a dedicated Sig forum (Sig Talk) and Point was the Tacops barrel does not have the support the 220 has.  It may bulge hotter 10mm offerings.   That was the consensus, I have no personal data to add.
Link Posted: 8/19/2017 10:57:58 AM EDT
[#20]
I thought my rock island commander was rather tame compared to what people say on the internet. Maybe a little more recoil that my .45. I haven't shot any monster loads though.
Link Posted: 8/20/2017 9:22:33 PM EDT
[#21]
Thanks for the info on the Tac Ops.  I have read a little about the chamber supporting for the 10MM and high power loads bulging cases.  Is the purpose of an unsupported chamber to increase the chambering  the round?  I have read the Delta Elite has one of the most open chambers.  Are these causing enough of an issue with the brass it renders it useless or just shortens the life of the case after sizing?  I can see how a bulged case can crack after only a couple of loads.
Link Posted: 8/22/2017 7:05:14 PM EDT
[#22]
From what I've read (no personal data), people are tossing DE brass.  Not worth the risk to reload.
Link Posted: 8/22/2017 7:43:53 PM EDT
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Thanks for the info on the Tac Ops.  I have read a little about the chamber supporting for the 10MM and high power loads bulging cases.  Is the purpose of an unsupported chamber to increase the chambering  the round?  I have read the Delta Elite has one of the most open chambers.  Are these causing enough of an issue with the brass it renders it useless or just shortens the life of the case after sizing?  I can see how a bulged case can crack after only a couple of loads.
View Quote
From what I know about reloading, once brass has bulged, it's not usable.

Unsupported chambers simply don't "wrap" a case as much as a supported one does. I'm not sure of the engineering reasons, if it's costs or feeding hollow points or what.

Sorry I wasn't more help.
Link Posted: 8/23/2017 8:50:23 PM EDT
[#24]
Anyone considering getting a 1911/2011 in 10mm (or any other 10mm semi auto) should make sure the barrel has a supported
chamber, particularly if you plan to use "hot" 10mm loads for defense or hunting...

Also, remember that the 10mm factory loads tend to be pricier than many other semi auto cartridges, so reloading is almost a
must...or have deep pockets if you plan to practice a lot.

It's a great round and the temptation to built a nice 10mm Auto Pistol is also very great...

Good luck troopers.
Link Posted: 8/24/2017 1:57:22 PM EDT
[#25]
Haven't noticed any bulging of the cases in my Delta. I've shot a bunch of the Sig ammo which is fairly warm.

I should get into reloading it, but my other 1911's at least give me extra trigger time in the platform.

I'm planning on CCW'ing it after it's back.
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