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Posted: 10/31/2009 7:39:07 PM EST
So I am a person who does not have health insurance. I canceled mine about a year ago. My whole family does not have it. I was paying about 700 dollars a month for it and it was fucking ridiculous.

Now I put that 700 dollars a month in a seperate savings acount and use it for my medical needs. My family does not have any hereditary issues and we my wife and I are in our early twenties and live fairly healthy. Our daughter is also healthy.

So far I have ten thousand in that account. Every year I will manage to put that same amount in there Im sure. Visiting the doctor for checkups and when sick only costs us around 600 dollars a year.

WHY THE FUCK should I be forced to buy insurance? I don't want it. I don't need it. I will have enough money to cover most surgeries in the odd chance I need one. I am a low risk person who will not likely have any major injuries. If I did need something that was out of my price range I would gladlyy make arrangements to pay it and never miss a payment.

Within ten years at this rate this account will be worth 100 thousand dollars or so which sould be enought o cover almost anything as I get older. Only difference here is if something DOESN"T happen I can pass that wealth on to my children.Basically this legislation will tax me even though I am one of the people that has absolute zero cost on premiums because I simply pay my own way.

I was wondering if any of you web guys would condsider making a website for people like me and maybe we can bring a massive group lawsuit against the federal government if they force me to buy insurance or be taxed. I think it is a huge injustice to tax me for a problem I am doing more to solve than most. I am not going to pay their fucking tax and Im not going to buy fucking insurance I don't need.

If they want me to buy insurance they should drop all the fucking mandates of coverage so i can just buy a cheap plan that covers cancer or other rare deseases that are outrageously expensive. That is all I need.

This shit has me so fucking pissed off you guys have no idea. I swear to god if one of these asshats that is supporting this mandate that I buy insurance was in the same room as me they be shitting out their teeth a couple days later.

Link Posted: 11/1/2009 8:45:53 AM EST
I personally don't think that the bill, as it's currently worded would stand up in court. The dems think this falls under Artical I, Section 8 of the US Constitution. I don't think mandated health care falls under regulating commerce between the states, or providing for the general welfare, but I am not an attorney. I do think it would be interesting to see it challenged in the SCOTUS before Obamadinijahd has a chance to pick another Justice.

Good on you for having the discipline to set aside money for health care. It's too bad the .gov won't allow it to continue under this bill.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 8:57:42 AM EST
Originally Posted By Woodsrider:
I personally don't think that the bill, as it's currently worded would stand up in court. The dems think this falls under Artical I, Section 8 of the US Constitution. I don't think mandated health care falls under regulating commerce between the states, or providing for the general welfare, but I am not an attorney. I do think it would be interesting to see it challenged in the SCOTUS before Obamadinijahd has a chance to pick another Justice.

Good on you for having the discipline to set aside money for health care. It's too bad the .gov won't allow it to continue under this bill.


When doing the math going without insurance is the only way to go. The lifetime cost of buying the bloated insurance options available today are exponentially higher than the costs of damn near anything that could happen to you. I would buy insurance if I could buy a plan that just covered cancer or other chronic conditions or covered massive bills I wouldn't be able to pay off easily over time such as brain surgery or something. The reason insurance costs so much is because we are not allowed to buy plans like that. Preventative care costs almost nothing out of pocket and it shouldn't be mandated in insurance.

GOVERNMENT IS THE PROBLEM!
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 9:09:09 AM EST
There are catostrophic coverage plans out there, you just have to dig to find them.

Government is only about half of the problem. Lobbyists and special interest groups, and Insurance fraud are parts of the problem as well.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 1:14:44 PM EST
Originally Posted By Woodsrider:
There are catostrophic coverage plans out there, you just have to dig to find them.

Government is only about half of the problem. Lobbyists and special interest groups, and Insurance fraud are parts of the problem as well.


I have yet to find one that just covers what I want covered. All I want is cancer and surgery and treatment costs over 100 thousand dollars in a year. Doing some very rough math that kind of plan should cost about ten bucks a month if there was enough people pooled into it.
I would think if more people busted out a calculator to see the actuall lifetime cost of their insurance plans vs the actuall medical costs a person is likely to have in their life or even on a yearly basis NOBODY would buy health insurance as it is.

My old plan cost me almost 9 thousand dollars a year. I had it for five years. Thats 45 THOUSAND DOLLARS spent on healthcare for me and my wife and a kid. I went back and aadded up all the bills for those five years which included a surgery for a broken finger and e coli that my daughter got. Included all prescriptions and everything. I also did this at FULL price. Not the bartered down payment of the insurance but the actual bills before insurance. Also included yearly doctor visits and such for our preventative measures.

My total cost for that five years was just under 6 thousand dollars. So i payed 45 thousand dollars for six thousand dollars worth of treatment. If I kept on this path for the next fifty years considering a broke a bone every five years I would spend close to half a million dollars for 60 thousand dollars worth of care. You tell me if that makes sense. I think I would rather keep my half million in savings as that should cover damn near anything that could happen in my last years of my life. If I die peacefully and without heavy medical expenses that half million will pay off my kids houses and give my grandkids a college education as well.

FUCK THESE MOTHERFUCKERS! I think the whole idea of insurance and of government health benefits and mandates should be wiped off the map. Everyone should pay out of pocket and if you cannot afford the treatment you can take out an interest free loan from the government that will be payed out of your paychecks at a percentage that is fair to your income level. That way medicine works like a real market place driving costs down and inspiring real competition. For the poor the only thing free should be a yearly checkup. If you have a mojor surgery you are still on the hook for it even if it is only ifive bucks a paycheck for the rest of your life you still gotta pay your own way. I also think that faily should be allowed to volunteer for garnishments to care for someone in their family as well. Say your poor cousin needs a surgery. Everyone in the family can volunteer five bucks a paycheck or whatever towards the government LOAN that payed for the surgery.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 1:32:33 PM EST
Agreed, 10/10.

I canceled my coverage a year ago to help the company save a bit of money as things were tight. If they think they're going to force me to get coverage without locking me up they got another thing coming.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 6:15:20 PM EST
Originally Posted By allenNH:
Agreed, 10/10.

I canceled my coverage a year ago to help the company save a bit of money as things were tight. If they think they're going to force me to get coverage without locking me up they got another thing coming.


Well theres two of us. I bet if we get about ten thousand together that refuse to comply and file exempt we could cause big problems for these fuckers. I wish I knew how to build a website to attract a big group of us to work together on this. A lawsuit from ten thousand people or more would be a pretty big deal. This should concern the millions of people with HSAa and high deductible plans as well because I think they plan on setting the insurance requirement well above the minimum insurance plans that already exist.

Hopefully someone will organize a group against this soon.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 6:30:06 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2009 6:31:22 PM EST by thelaststand]
Originally Posted By Woodsrider:
There are catostrophic coverage plans out there, you just have to dig to find them.

Government is only about half of the problem. Lobbyists and special interest groups, and Insurance fraud are parts of the problem as well.


This is exactly what health insurance should be, just catostrophic insurance. All other stuff should be paid in cash, but the system has been so jacked up by the government and the idiot socialists that it's hard. Self payers often get discounts though, just go to private clinics and stay away from public hospitals that already redistribute the wealth which is why you pay 50 bucks for a bandaid because you pay for all the scum to have free bandaids. Our health care system is already socialist which is why it is so jacked up.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 6:31:52 PM EST
Originally Posted By victorgonzales:
Originally Posted By allenNH:
Agreed, 10/10.

I canceled my coverage a year ago to help the company save a bit of money as things were tight. If they think they're going to force me to get coverage without locking me up they got another thing coming.


Well theres two of us. I bet if we get about ten thousand together that refuse to comply and file exempt we could cause big problems for these fuckers. I wish I knew how to build a website to attract a big group of us to work together on this. A lawsuit from ten thousand people or more would be a pretty big deal. This should concern the millions of people with HSAa and high deductible plans as well because I think they plan on setting the insurance requirement well above the minimum insurance plans that already exist.

Hopefully someone will organize a group against this soon.


Count me in.
I don't have health insurance because I honestly cannot afford it.Being forced to buy it is literally going to bankrupt me.But since I don't vote "correctly", I guess it doesn't matter.Maybe The Messiah can bail me out.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 7:06:02 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2009 7:17:23 PM EST by victorgonzales]
so who here knows someone who will build a website we can all sign up to with a rollcall for impending lawsuit? I bet there are lawyers out there willing to take the case for publicity for fair rates if we had enough members to donate a small amount. Even without the lawsuit if the numbers got high enough for a petition it might get attention from RUsh, Beck, or hannity or all three which could boost the group to millions.

This is a rare opportunity to fight back since the federal government has not in history ever FORCED the american people to buy a product they don't want or else pay a fine. I think the movement could get millions in no time if it catches some publicity.

On another note without this mandate to shovel the cost of the new insurance rules onto us by adding us to a pool we don't want to be in these healthcare bills will crumble. This could be the weak spot where we bring this bitch down if we act fast enough.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 9:54:10 PM EST
Just a "heads up": The Washington Times has a pretty good opinion piece about whether government-mandated health insurance is constitutional:

http://washingtontimes.com/news/2009/nov/02/beware-the-health-insurance-police/

It seems pretty clear to me that government-manded insurance would be unconstitutional. The question is: are there enough clear-thinking Supreme Court justices who see things the same way and how many years would we have to wait for them to make a decision?
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 9:59:40 PM EST
My brother went from healthy, to ill in a summer and needed, to date, more than 100,000 dollars in medical care. Without insurance that would have been hard on my family. For most families, it would have been crushing.

I'm not in favor of the mandate, just be aware that ill health and massive bills are potentially closer than you think.
Link Posted: 11/2/2009 12:37:35 PM EST
Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
My brother went from healthy, to ill in a summer and needed, to date, more than 100,000 dollars in medical care. Without insurance that would have been hard on my family. For most families, it would have been crushing.

I'm not in favor of the mandate, just be aware that ill health and massive bills are potentially closer than you think.


Or another point of this, my co-worker in his mid-thirties, wrecked his bike while moving a flag for a fallen soldier and shattered his fibia in his leg. Between all the surgeries for pins, various casts, doc visits he has to have a hell of a bill. So you can just as easy get hurt too.

But let me make the point I am one who wants ZERO passage of health care bills right now and like the OP I wouldn't mind to do a little teeth-bustin' on some of these people.
Link Posted: 11/2/2009 7:54:14 PM EST
Im not stating insurance is a no go. Just that thes horrible situations you hear about would be cheap to insure against if that was the only type of thing covered. I can't go out right now and buy int a plan that only covers situations that cost more than 50 thousand dollars or I would because the odds would make it incredibly cheap.
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