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Posted: 12/11/2005 2:11:07 PM EDT
Does anyone here know one/is one? Is the pay good? I am just curious!
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 2:12:48 PM EDT
if you have to ask, then you dont have the credentials to become one
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 2:20:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TheRedHorseman:
if you have to ask, then you dont have the credentials to become one




Well, you do. Just one of the crappy PMC's that'll get you killed.
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 2:20:56 PM EDT
I'll give you $10 bucks to jump the fence at 1600 Penn. Ave.


And you have to be naked with a red watch cap and covered in honey.
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 2:21:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/11/2005 2:22:03 PM EDT by 1911greg]
yes the pay is good but you have to be very well trained and it is very dangerous.

Dale Gribble comes to mind
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 2:27:50 PM EDT
civilians without extensive training are dead in the water hard to get hired.

grunts without very specialized training are also gonna have a tough time getting into that kinda stuff. join the military and be a driver/gaurd for a col or high ranker. that stuff on your record helps with alot of the stuff they need right now with vip movement stuff.
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 2:45:32 PM EDT


It's not PC to call em "mercenaries" now days. Call em "civilian contractors".
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 2:48:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/11/2005 6:35:40 PM EDT by Combat_Jack]
There are two career fields here.

PMC's are not Mercenaries. They provide security, explosive removal and training to other countries.

Mercenaries engage in offensive action on the part of a country that is not their own.

Expect the line to blur even more in the future.
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 7:57:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 8:03:09 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
There are two career fields here.

PMC's are not Mercenaries. They provide security, explosive removal and training to other countries.

Mercenaries engage in offensive action on the part of a country that is not their own.

Expect the line to blur even more in the future.



yep...and it has been.....PMCs are growing out of control.....
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 8:23:54 PM EDT
Google Eeben Barlow.
One of the last real mercenary contractors that ended.
This guys company would take jobs anywhere. mostly in Africa and this was I think the last of these kind of groups that could be hired for a coup.
Disbanded in 1989
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 9:07:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TheTracker:
Google Eeben Barlow.
One of the last real mercenary contractors that ended.
This guys company would take jobs anywhere. mostly in Africa and this was I think the last of these kind of groups that could be hired for a coup.
Disbanded in 1989



Eeben.....Baaaad mo fo!!!!

Also google Executive Outcomes
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 9:32:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/11/2005 9:33:49 PM EDT by ErinMT]

Originally Posted By AIRBOSS4:

Originally Posted By TheTracker:
Google Eeben Barlow.
One of the last real mercenary contractors that ended.
This guys company would take jobs anywhere. mostly in Africa and this was I think the last of these kind of groups that could be hired for a coup.
Disbanded in 1989



Eeben.....Baaaad mo fo!!!!

Also google Executive Outcomes



EO was featured in a program put out by the History Channel. Story about them was awesome.

Cliffnotes from program...

Small group came in and kicked serious merderous rebel ass, messed up some ethnic cleanser with a vengence, UN said "grrrrr" and made them leave and stationed 10K UN PKs in the area. Rebels had the place back the way they liked it in a month.
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 5:48:48 PM EDT
MERCENARY: you are buying the individuals/company's loyalty.

CONTRACTOR: You are paying for certain skill sets. Be advised, most civilians do NOT posess the skill sets that the reputable, high end companies are looking for. For that matter most regular joe's/ grunts dont either.
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 5:54:42 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 6:13:21 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 6:21:44 PM EDT
Are there any laws about being a merc operating out of and residing in the U.S.?
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 6:23:11 PM EDT
I thought this thread was about the videogame
"blow shit up"
"blow more shit up"



Link Posted: 12/12/2005 6:27:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/12/2005 6:28:08 PM EDT by Spade]
Also feel free to buy a copy of my MA thesis if I publish it. It's gonna be about 5 Commando in the Congo.


Originally Posted By ErinMT:

EO was featured in a program put out by the History Channel. Story about them was awesome.

Cliffnotes from program...

Small group came in and kicked serious merderous rebel ass, messed up some ethnic cleanser with a vengence, UN said "grrrrr" and made them leave and stationed 10K UN PKs in the area. Rebels had the place back the way they liked it in a month.




Currently if I go PhD school, my thesis is gonna be about some part of that. If it goes into book form, feel free to buy it as well.
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 6:28:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bblake00:
I'll give you $10 bucks to jump the fence at 1600 Penn. Ave.


And you have to be naked with a red watch cap and covered in honey.



Dear FBI,

I never liked bblake00.

He's a bad person.

He is a traitor to the rupublic!

I don't have aything to do with the "Honey"

his cap is covred in.
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 6:34:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
There are two career fields here.

PMC's are not Mercenaries. They provide security, explosive removal and training to other countries.

Mercenaries engage in offensive action on the part of a country that is not their own.

Expect the line to blur even more in the future.

/\whs
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 6:36:23 PM EDT
Calling the job a mercenarie tells me youll never be a PMC.
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 6:40:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Burke888:

Originally Posted By Bob1984:
i18.photobucket.com/albums/b101/Bob_2002/DuSaugst.jpg


??



German for "You suck at the internet"
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 10:51:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By olyarms:
Calling the job a mercenarie tells me youll never be a PMC.




What if he really wants to be a mercenary, not a contractor?
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 10:56:36 PM EDT
I thought this was about the game also.

"I use 2 grenades......when I only need 1."
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 11:08:49 PM EDT
I know a guy who now does "security consulting for an international mining consortium". He originally was USMC Force Recon, then worked for "two government agencies". He spent the winter of 2001-02 in the mountains of Afghanistan. Sometimes his hair is shoulder-length with a full beard, and sometimes it's high and tight. He's home for a few weeks at a time, and then is gone for 2-3 months, most often in Africa, the ME or the Indian subcontinent.

He has quite an arsenal at home--.338 Lapua, Rem 700 .308, Les Baer AR all with Schmidt and Bender optics as well as multiple other rifles, subguns, and pistols. All his rifles are custom. He says he's good with the .338 out to about 1500m (I believe him).

Interesting guy, very intelligent, and one bad dude.
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 11:33:56 PM EDT
isnt simplydynamic a blackwater "contracter". i dont know much about it i just saw that video and recognised the rifle
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 12:19:56 AM EDT
Are you a bad enough dude to rescue the President?


WE'RE BAD!!!!



Seriously, I can only hope of going the PMC route someday.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 6:38:56 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 6:47:41 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/13/2005 7:16:15 AM EDT by bcw107]

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
There are two career fields here.

PMC's are not Mercenaries. They provide security, explosive removal and training to other countries.

Mercenaries engage in offensive action on the part of a country that is not their own.

Expect the line to blur even more in the future.



Example: Foreign Legions, Gurhka Regiment, use of Chinese Nungs in Vietnam, the countless foreign nationals from Mexicans to Somalis to Puerto Ricans that are in the US military.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 7:03:46 AM EDT
Step one: Get a Special Weapons MP-5 clone.

Step two: Get some cool cammies at the local surplus store.

Step three: Get a couple cases of beef jerky.

Step four: Set up a table at a gun show. This is how the network is entered.

Selling the jerky is just a front to give you an air of legitimacy while making contact with the insiders.

The secret handshake has all fingers extended except your ring finger, which is bent back toward your palm.

When you receive the secret mercenary handshake, the next step is to negotiate payment.

Good luck. You'll need it.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 7:05:58 AM EDT
If you want to be a mercenary, I think the Columbian govt has placed a bounty on the head of a drug lord if you want to go in the jungle and drag him out.

It would be close to a mercenary action and you've probably got an even greater chance of being killed
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 7:11:29 AM EDT

Originally Posted By NRose8989:
isnt simplydynamic a blackwater "contracter". i dont know much about it i just saw that video and recognised the rifle



Yes Travis is.

Former Marine as well.

Semper Fi!
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 7:13:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Sigurd:

Originally Posted By olyarms:
Calling the job a mercenarie tells me youll never be a PMC.




What if he really wants to be a mercenary, not a contractor?


Link Posted: 12/13/2005 1:13:13 PM EDT
Mercenary work goes back a ways, longest contract award goes to the Swiss pikemen who were contracted to guard the pope in medieval time and are still there today.

I did some research work into this in the mid 80s so forgive me If I don't recall it all.
The best known of the "modern era" mercenaries from post WWII though the mid 70's has to be Mike Hoare. He worked in africa....mostly.
take a look here.
http://www.historyofwar.org/articles/people_hoare.html
I remember in a time magazine article he said that he was receiving 27 grand a month in the mid 60's
although he was known to brag a bit.
what ended Mercenaries was an agreement that stated that mercenaries were to have no rights, no Geneva convention, no protection as POW's nothing. it was more than legal to execute them in the field when found or what ever else you wanted to do. Not good for a long term career.

There were some attempts to get around this, again mostly in Africa. and some made it work for a time.
Google for Executive outcomes out of SA and read that.

I have been a "Contractor" and this came up once in conversation while we were on patrol.
One of our number took high offense at the idea that we would be called mercenaries.
I told the guys, well we are not in ANY military force, we are not in service to a country, we are armed with orders to kill if needed, we are in uniform, but not in the uniform of ANY military service. and we are in a foreign country.
And most assuredly we are not here for the view. we are here for the money.
Meets any definition of mercenary I can think of.

Strange how it came full circle in 40 years.

NOI (in Europe and between contracts)


Link Posted: 12/13/2005 1:19:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Brohawk:
Step one: Get a Special Weapons MP-5 clone.

Step two: Get some cool cammies at the local surplus store.

Step three: Get a couple cases of beef jerky.

Step four: Set up a table at a gun show. This is how the network is entered.

Selling the jerky is just a front to give you an air of legitimacy while making contact with the insiders.

The secret handshake has all fingers extended except your ring finger, which is bent back toward your palm.

When you receive the secret mercenary handshake, the next step is to negotiate payment.

Good luck. You'll need it.



hah hah hah, that made my day.

-Ben
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 1:24:46 PM EDT
So how much do guys with prior special military training get to work for someone like blackwater? ie former rangers, seals, recon, etc.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 1:26:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/13/2005 1:29:19 PM EDT by _DR]

Originally Posted By g3shooter:
Does anyone here know one/is one? Is the pay good? I am just curious!




Napalm113? Is that you?

Link Posted: 12/13/2005 1:33:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By _DR:

Originally Posted By g3shooter:
Does anyone here know one/is one? Is the pay good? I am just curious!




Napalm113? Is that you?

tinypic.com/ilj3iw.jpg



This person worries me..........for some reason great photo!!!!!

Slug-O
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 1:45:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By az-ar:
So how much do guys with prior special military training get to work for someone like blackwater? ie former rangers, seals, recon, etc.



Never worked for Blackwater, have friends that do.
Short answer it depends.
what the job is, what your skills are, how many people can do the job, or want it (supply and demand), how fast you can leave, lots of things play into it.
I know some Force Protection contracts at 50 thow a year. one year contract.
Most of the Afghanistan/ Iraq contracts start at 10 thow a month. I have seen 90 day 3 month and one year contracts offered.
most CAN be tax free if you meet the requirements set out by the IRS.

the best money is always sh!t living conditions or imminent physical risk. Or both.

NOI
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 2:03:13 PM EDT
Why dont you call Blackwater and ask what to do to get in? They want future employees ,you'll be suprised what you can learn by asking . No company will hire you for a job your not qualified for but they will tell you how to become qualified. The back door to most "special ops " is emt trainning
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 4:21:59 PM EDT
Merc work sucks;

you have to work with 'foreigners' all the time

they don't speak english

they only pay in some off-brand local curreency that is worthless outside their borders.



Link Posted: 12/14/2005 5:38:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By az-ar:
So how much do guys with prior special military training get to work for someone like blackwater? ie former rangers, seals, recon, etc.



Starting is around $120k a year.

Talked to a former Marine who is working for Aegis Security here, doing PSD and he said he was making $145k a year.
3mos on, 1mo off.

We were like, goddamn.

Thats a lot nicer than $35k a year and possibly 6mos on, 2wks off and then 6mos again....depending on when your leave is.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 5:39:59 AM EDT
And once again, I know none of you would be able to get the job but if you could, try to get on the PSD for a security company.

Every other job, would just suck donkey balls.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 5:53:58 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 6:25:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By tyman:

Originally Posted By az-ar:
So how much do guys with prior special military training get to work for someone like blackwater? ie former rangers, seals, recon, etc.



Starting is around $120k a year.

Talked to a former Marine who is working for Aegis Security here, doing PSD and he said he was making $145k a year.
3mos on, 1mo off.

We were like, goddamn. hats



The problem with the 3 on 1 off deal is that you will pay US tax if you are in the US one month out of four. kind of cuts down on the incentive.
One of the major advantages to working out of the US is the tax free money. It is often played up by recruiters. Thing is you have to be out of the US 330 out of 360 days. they may forget to tell you this.
Not a problem if you know up front. but if you think you are going to be tax exempt AND be in the US 3 mos a year....
Just go visit a lot of the places you always wanted to.
Some of the guys have bought places around. Bulgaria is still cheep.

As to being paid in local script, Its called Euros and last I looked it is 1 to 1.20 US , yeah I can
live with that.


NOI
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 8:50:29 AM EDT
Cool, I'll try calling them or something.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 11:24:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/14/2005 11:25:05 AM EDT by nooneimportant]
Here, this will make it easy.
some of the players looking for all kinds of skills.

If you ARE former seal or SF the check into triple canopy. but if you ARE then you know guys who work for them.


http://www.blackwaterusa.com

http://www.civilianpolice.com

http://www.globalgroup.com

http://www.policemission.com

http://www.mpri.com

http://www.caci.com

http://www.zapeng.com


NOI
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 11:39:16 AM EDT




Originally Posted By Brohawk:
Step one: Get a Special Weapons MP-5 clone.

Step two: Get some cool cammies at the local surplus store.

Step three: Get a couple cases of beef jerky.

Step four: Set up a table at a gun show. This is how the network is entered.

Selling the jerky is just a front to give you an air of legitimacy while making contact with the insiders.

The secret handshake has all fingers extended except your ring finger, which is bent back toward your palm.

When you receive the secret mercenary handshake, the next step is to negotiate payment.

Good luck. You'll need it.

Link Posted: 12/14/2005 12:02:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/14/2005 12:23:08 PM EDT by Quien]
As a person that's in charge of some of these guys you casually call "mercenaries," I find the use of that word pretty ignorant. Do an internet search for mercenary and you'll get a bunch of websites about an xbox game and a bunch of left wing websites bashing the US.

I can't speak for all the PSD companies running around this country (I think there are 85+) Some of these PSD groups work for companies like Bechtel, Lucent, etc, but others are contracted by the US government.

I can talk about the government PSD guys, because I'm actually here doing just that. These are top tier folks, every last one of them (Blackwater, DynCorp, and Triple Canopy.) They are former operators, infantry, SWAT, former federal agents, all strictly screened by their company and overseen by Uncle Sam. Don't lump these guys, that have served their country with distinction in the past, and continue to serve at great personal risk to their lives, with some soldier of fortune schmuck running around Africa working for whoever will hire him.

They continue to serve this country with distinction but are looked down upon because they get paid more. Maybe if this country's Armed Forces hadn't been cripled by downsizing after the cold war, the use of contractors wouldn't be necessary. If that was the case I guarantee most of these guys would still be wearing camouflage.

ETA: Mercenary: A mercenary is a soldier who fights, or engages in warfare primarily for private gain, usually with little regard for ideological, national or political considerations. However, when the term is used to refer to a soldier in a regular national army, it is usually considered an insult, epithet or pejorative.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 1:38:41 PM EDT
Good post Quien.

A lot of these guys are former military and only got out because they can use the same skillset, in a similar job, and make $200,000 a year instead of $40,000. They still fight on the side of the coalition. Now, if an SF soldier sold his services to AlQaeda (not that one would!) he would be a mercenary, and a traitor.
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