is there any ballistical advantage to a .357mag vr a .38 +P in a 2" snubby?

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - is there any ballistical advantage to a .357mag vr a .38 +P in a 2" snubby?

Posted: 6/3/2008 4:45:31 PM EDT

Some say yes, some say no.

It seems like the .357 has a lot more power behind it, but i wonder if its wasted?

Posted: 6/3/2008 4:47:09 PM EDT

Sure some pressure is wasted in a revolver with a 2" barrel. But get a .357 Mag revolver anyways so you can shoot .38 Special too.

Posted: 6/3/2008 4:48:12 PM EDT

In the same length barrel, 357 always beats 38.

Posted: 6/3/2008 4:53:52 PM EDT

Quoted:
In the same length barrel, 357 always beats 38.

While this is technically true, the trade-off in muzzle blast and recoil is believed by many (including me) to be too high.

To really get the extra velocity and power of a .357 Magnum, you need a long barrel.

Otherwise, you just get very loud noises and a lot of recoil.

Posted: 6/3/2008 4:53:54 PM EDT

I've been meaning to go shoot some 38 and 357 loads from my snubbies over my chronograph.

The velocity will be higher, I just don't know how much higher.

Posted: 6/3/2008 4:58:17 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:
In the same length barrel, 357 always beats 38.

While this is technically true, the trade-off in muzzle blast and recoil is believed by many (including me) to be too high.

To really get the extra velocity and power of a .357 Magnum, you need a long barrel.

Otherwise, you just get very loud noises and a lot of recoil.

In a self defense situation that is a two edged sword.

While it is a nuisance to the shooter it is also a major psychological factor to the person you are shooting at if perchance you should miss .
I would want the edge it can give you if my life was on the line .

Posted: 6/3/2008 5:05:57 PM EDT

As for the shorter bbl on the .357: there are some ammo companies making ammo that will make up for the difference. This is faster-burning ammo that is designed for short barreled revolvers.

Posted: 6/3/2008 5:13:33 PM EDT

Quoted:
As for the shorter bbl on the .357: there are some ammo companies making ammo that will make up for the difference. This is faster-burning ammo that is designed for short barreled revolvers.

What brands?

Posted: 6/3/2008 5:23:03 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:
In the same length barrel, 357 always beats 38.

While this is technically true, the trade-off in muzzle blast and recoil is believed by many (including me) to be too high.

To really get the extra velocity and power of a .357 Magnum, you need a long barrel.

Otherwise, you just get very loud noises and a lot of recoil.

Once again I agree with the good guy (op!)
My 2" carry gun (why else would you want a 2" gun?) is an air weight 38 and with 38+p it is all I want. Would a similar weight 357 gun have more power ,yes , but I don't feel I have the ability for multiple aimed shots in any kind of rapid fashion.
I shoot a 3" 629 44 mag (it is a heavy gun) fairly well and it snorts pretty good but the lightweight 357's are just plain nasty.

Now I have a l frame 686 with a 3" barrel that shoots well but it isn't real usefull for a carry gun with the full size grip frame and a full lug barrel.

Folks may buy and shoot what they want but I look on this current of supper lightweight
higher powered guns and can't but think they are one shot wonders because the average shooter is going to be so hurting after the first shot that further shots will be misses.

Posted: 6/3/2008 6:22:27 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:
In the same length barrel, 357 always beats 38.

While this is technically true, the trade-off in muzzle blast and recoil is believed by many (including me) to be too high.

Agreed. The small increase in velocity isn't worth the much larger (perceived) recoil and muzzle blast.

-Troy

Posted: 6/3/2008 6:24:10 PM EDT

A 2" .357 will make you go blind if fired at night.

Not very wise.

Posted: 6/3/2008 6:24:36 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:
As for the shorter bbl on the .357: there are some ammo companies making ammo that will make up for the difference. This is faster-burning ammo that is designed for short barreled revolvers.

What brands?

Speer makes a Gold Dot loading especially for short-barreled .38's that is tuned to work very well.

www.speer-ammo.com/products/short_brl.aspx

-Troy

Posted: 6/3/2008 6:28:24 PM EDT

Quoted:

In a self defense situation that is a two edged sword.

While it is a nuisance to the shooter it is also a major psychological factor to the person you are shooting at if perchance you should miss .
I would want the edge it can give you if my life was on the line .

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, but I don't think anyone could tell the difference on the receiving end. Miss or a hit.

Posted: 6/3/2008 6:51:53 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:
In the same length barrel, 357 always beats 38.

While this is technically true, the trade-off in muzzle blast and recoil is believed by many (including me) to be too high.

To really get the extra velocity and power of a .357 Magnum, you need a long barrel.

Otherwise, you just get very loud noises and a lot of recoil.

Once again I agree with the good guy (op!)
My 2" carry gun (why else would you want a 2" gun?) is an air weight 38 and with 38+p it is all I want. Would a similar weight 357 gun have more power ,yes , but I don't feel I have the ability for multiple aimed shots in any kind of rapid fashion.
I shoot a 3" 629 44 mag (it is a heavy gun) fairly well and it snorts pretty good but the lightweight 357's are just plain nasty.

Now I have a l frame 686 with a 3" barrel that shoots well but it isn't real usefull for a carry gun with the full size grip frame and a full lug barrel.

Folks may buy and shoot what they want but I look on this current of supper lightweight
higher powered guns and can't but think they are one shot wonders because the average shooter is going to be so hurting after the first shot that further shots will be misses.

Um, why not? I have a 2.5" M66(K frame) that I carry occasionally. It's not significantly smaller than an equivalent L frame. I'm not particularly well built for concealed carry, but it's easy enough to conceal.

Posted: 6/3/2008 6:54:50 PM EDT

Probably more worth it for the ability to shoot a wider variety of ammo than ballistic advantage.

I don't know what the odds are of finding yourself with a box of 357 and your snubby (that may or may not be able to shoot it) in some weird situation but it's possible.

Posted: 6/3/2008 6:56:08 PM EDT

Quoted:
A 2" .357 will make you go blind if fired at night.

Not very wise.

yup, deaf too.

+p for me...

Posted: 6/3/2008 6:57:28 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:

In a self defense situation that is a two edged sword.

While it is a nuisance to the shooter it is also a major psychological factor to the person you are shooting at if perchance you should miss .
I would want the edge it can give you if my life was on the line .

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, but I don't think anyone could tell the difference on the receiving end. Miss or a hit.

Yeah. In <2" barrels I just use regular .38s, not even P+

Shot placement and follow-up is a hell of a lot more important than the fps increase you'd get in +P or .357 mag (I'm talking out of my ass, but pretty sure about it

)

Posted: 6/3/2008 7:06:29 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:

In a self defense situation that is a two edged sword.

While it is a nuisance to the shooter it is also a major psychological factor to the person you are shooting at if perchance you should miss .
I would want the edge it can give you if my life was on the line .

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, but I don't think anyone could tell the difference on the receiving end. Miss or a hit.

+p in an aluminum frame with small grips isn't really pleasant....and that was with hearing protection and during the day.... at night and /or without hearing protection- you may be startled by the difference. Seriously.

IIRC, you'd need at least a 4ich barrel for the .357 or +p to be worthwhile.

Posted: 6/3/2008 7:10:21 PM EDT

Quoted:
A 2" .357 will make you go blind if fired at night.

Not very wise.

I've fired mine at night and had no such problem.

Posted: 6/3/2008 7:11:30 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:

In a self defense situation that is a two edged sword.

While it is a nuisance to the shooter it is also a major psychological factor to the person you are shooting at if perchance you should miss .
I would want the edge it can give you if my life was on the line .

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, but I don't think anyone could tell the difference on the receiving end. Miss or a hit.

+p in an aluminum frame with small grips isn't really pleasant....and that was with hearing protection and during the day.... at night and /or without hearing protection- you may be startled by the difference. Seriously.

IIRC, you'd need at least a 4ich barrel for the .357 or +p to be worthwhile.

SP101 FTW

Posted: 6/3/2008 7:13:41 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:
In the same length barrel, 357 always beats 38.

While this is technically true, the trade-off in muzzle blast and recoil is believed by many (including me) to be too high.

To really get the extra velocity and power of a .357 Magnum, you need a long barrel.

Otherwise, you just get very loud noises and a lot of recoil.

Wasn't it Jeff Cooper who said, "..a short barreled .357 is nothing but a loud .38"?

HH

Posted: 6/3/2008 7:22:23 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:

In a self defense situation that is a two edged sword.

While it is a nuisance to the shooter it is also a major psychological factor to the person you are shooting at if perchance you should miss .
I would want the edge it can give you if my life was on the line .

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, but I don't think anyone could tell the difference on the receiving end. Miss or a hit.

+p in an aluminum frame with small grips isn't really pleasant....and that was with hearing protection and during the day.... at night and /or without hearing protection- you may be startled by the difference. Seriously.

IIRC, you'd need at least a 4ich barrel for the .357 or +p to be worthwhile.

SP101 FTW

I'd take the 3 inch .ver if I had a choice.

Posted: 6/3/2008 7:26:24 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:

In a self defense situation that is a two edged sword.

While it is a nuisance to the shooter it is also a major psychological factor to the person you are shooting at if perchance you should miss .
I would want the edge it can give you if my life was on the line .

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, but I don't think anyone could tell the difference on the receiving end. Miss or a hit.

\
You could cook them with the muzzle blast at close range .

Posted: 6/3/2008 7:26:52 PM EDT

Tag for Old_Painless's testing not gunstore jibba jabba.

Doc

Posted: 6/3/2008 7:47:36 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:
In the same length barrel, 357 always beats 38.

While this is technically true, the trade-off in muzzle blast and recoil is believed by many (including me) to be too high.

To really get the extra velocity and power of a .357 Magnum, you need a long barrel.

Otherwise, you just get very loud noises and a lot of recoil.

I've always believed a 2'' .357 is just a hard kickin' .38 spl. So i agree.

Posted: 6/3/2008 8:08:11 PM EDT

Performance of similar .38 and .357 rounds are nearly identical in gelatin and therefore in tissue.

Posted: 6/3/2008 8:16:36 PM EDT

With QUALITY hollowpoint rounds, i.e. Gold Dots or similar, out of a 2 inch gun, I think there is a definite difference in velocity, as well as recoil For most people, the .38 +P round will be every bit as effective, and will provide for much quicker followup shots. Two .38 JHPs are better than 1 .357, as long as all the rounds reach important parts of the bad guy.

With that said, my larger guns (S&W N frames, 4+ inch barrels) are loaded with .357 rounds, not .38 +Ps.

Posted: 6/3/2008 8:19:37 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:
In the same length barrel, 357 always beats 38.

While this is technically true, the trade-off in muzzle blast and recoil is believed by many (including me) to be too high.

To really get the extra velocity and power of a .357 Magnum, you need a long barrel.

Otherwise, you just get very loud noises and a lot of recoil.

You forgot lower hit probability on follow up shots as well.

Posted: 6/3/2008 8:21:45 PM EDT

Quoted:

Quoted:

In a self defense situation that is a two edged sword.

While it is a nuisance to the shooter it is also a major psychological factor to the person you are shooting at if perchance you should miss .
I would want the edge it can give you if my life was on the line .

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, but I don't think anyone could tell the difference on the receiving end. Miss or a hit.

+p in an aluminum frame with small grips isn't really pleasant....and that was with hearing protection and during the day.... at night and /or without hearing protection- you may be startled by the difference. Seriously.

IIRC, you'd need at least a 4ich barrel for the .357 or +p to be worthwhile.

SP101 FTW

I'd take the 3 inch .ver if I had a choice.

I agree. I like my 2.25" version, but I wanted a 3" when I found this one. For ~$250 OTD, I wasn't going to pass this one up though. Eventually I'll get a 3".

Posted: 6/3/2008 8:23:13 PM EDT

Quoted:
With QUALITY hollowpoint rounds, i.e. Gold Dots or similar, out of a 2 inch gun, I think there is a definite difference in velocity, as well as recoil For most people, the .38 +P round will be every bit as effective, and will provide for much quicker followup shots. Two .38 JHPs are better than 1 .357, as long as all the rounds reach important parts of the bad guy.

With that said, my larger guns (S&W N frames, 4+ inch barrels) are loaded with .357 rounds, not .38 +Ps.

Any of my .357's that stay loaded are stoked with 125 grain SJHP magnum loads.

Posted: 6/3/2008 8:29:01 PM EDT

I went retro, from a 357mag S&W 640 2" to a 38spl Model 36 3". It is more shootable, which translates to better accuracy. If I feel the need, the old FBI load (38spl+P, 158 gr, LHP) is good PD round.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - is there any ballistical advantage to a .357mag vr a .38 +P in a 2" snubby?

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