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1/25/2018 7:38:29 AM
Posted: 11/13/2001 9:18:42 AM EST
I bought a Colt 20" HBAR, Flat top upper w/ carry handle at a gun show a month ago and now I am thinking about selling it or trading it for a m4 carbine. [>:/] [b]What are some of you guys opinion on which one is better to have? What are the [red]Pros and Cons[/red] of the two rifles?[/b]
Link Posted: 11/13/2001 9:24:25 AM EST
Why sell your HBAR? Buy a M4 upper from Bushy or any one of the other companies and get a M4 stock. You can put one together in a few minutes and have both rifles should your tastes change again.
Link Posted: 11/13/2001 9:27:51 AM EST
If I pay in the upwards of $400 for an upper, I could buy a complete gun for $300 more. I am trying not to spend too much money right now as I am working on some other projects. Like a Desert Eagle .50 AE and a nice combat shotgun. So I need to rationalize the funds.
Link Posted: 11/13/2001 10:05:39 AM EST
Link Posted: 11/13/2001 10:06:04 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/13/2001 10:01:21 AM EST by M4A3]
I have owned many carbines and several heavy barrel 20's. I sold every 20" upper I have owned, within 2 weeks of purchase date. I like the looks of them but since our range only goes out to 200yrds a carbine is just as accurate for my range and shooting style. Not to mention they look better and are more comfortable to shoot because of weight and size. A carbine is more feasible if using for home defense as well. I sold a few of my AR's to fund my preban M4 project and I couldn't be happier. Just my opinions...
Link Posted: 11/13/2001 10:26:46 AM EST
Originally Posted By Justice_Keeper: If I pay in the upwards of $400 for an upper, I could buy a complete gun for $300 more. I am trying not to spend too much money right now as I am working on some other projects. Like a Desert Eagle .50 AE and a nice combat shotgun. So I need to rationalize the funds.
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I say get the M4. I love all flavors of the M16, but the M4 is probably the best evolution of the design. If that's what you want, and you can't afford my previous suggestion, then do what you must to get a M4.
Link Posted: 11/13/2001 10:29:11 AM EST
The M4 is significantly lighter and shorter. The 20" is more lethal. Which is more important to you? It is a simple tradeoff. If I wanted a plinker or a rifle to flee with, I would get the M4. If I wanted a rifle to put people down, I'd get the 20". It has already been correctly pointed out that the obvious answer is to have both.
Link Posted: 11/13/2001 11:02:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/13/2001 10:55:05 AM EST by TheRedGoat]
Funny, I had just posted that I was considering trading my pre-ban M4 carbine for something like what you recently purchased... too bad you aren't in the Dallas/Fort Worth Area. [:(] I sent you an email, btw with a pic of my M4
Link Posted: 11/13/2001 11:10:44 AM EST
Link Posted: 11/13/2001 11:16:10 AM EST
Get one of each.
Link Posted: 11/13/2001 11:54:07 AM EST
If you ever have to fire without ear protection, you'll either be glad you have the 20 inch barrel or wish you had it...
Link Posted: 11/13/2001 2:59:22 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/13/2001 3:05:55 PM EST by imposter]
Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer: If i have to "put someone down" It will be with something heavier than a .223. Leathality will be very close between the 2 out to 300 yards or so. I've chrono'd both styles. Very litle difference inside 100yrds.
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Actually, there is a fairly significant velocity different between the two barrels (about 200 fps). The key is when they fall below 2500 to 2700 fps, which is the FMJ round quits fragmenting. I have also read that the effectiveness of SP bullets is reduced at that velocity level as well. While it is true both 20" and 14.5" will both fragment out to 100 yards, the M4 will not go much farther, while the 20" will get almost to 200 yards before it drops below 2500 fps. As to the lethality of the .223 I have no personal experience, but I can tell you that the .308 is overkill. Not that overkill is a bad thing, but I am sure something with less recoil and which weighs less would do the job. The trajectory of the 7.62x39 is going to limit your range, so it is not a real great alternative. The .223 is certainly lethal, and it is going to be easier to shoot accurately than heavier calibers. It is not going to make the horrendous holes that .308 soft points will, especially past 140 (M4) to 200 (20") yards. But you can still put a hole through your target, and I imagine even a little hold would suck. Justice_Keeper: I have both, and I like a lot about the M4. It would be somewhat easier to use at close range and it is a little handier. But I always find myself taking the 20" to the range. That could just be a function of how much I like the scope I have on it though (3xACOG). I also like the feel and look of it better, but that is entirely subjective. My 20" seems to be more accurate, but that should have little to do with barrel length. You can not go wrong with either the rifle or carbine. Make sure you handle an M4 before you decide to get rid of your rifle.
Link Posted: 11/13/2001 3:12:35 PM EST
Get one of each [img]http://wsphotofews.excite.com/010/xN/b4/SP/JM42546.jpg[/img] [img]http://wsphotofews.excite.com/006/xT/OM/sE/Km58973.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 3:25:23 AM EST
I agree with many of the posts above... If you can afford to do so I would buy both. The 20-inch HBAR is more accurate, jumps less, and would likely be the rifle I would want when the chips are down. With that said, I also have a rifle with the CAR stock and M4A2 upper which shoots very well, is very light, and functions 100% as does my 20-inch rifle. If your 20-inch rifle is a POST BAN.... find yourself a good pre-ban and set it as a carbine. That is the ideal setup! Good Luck!
Link Posted: 11/14/2001 4:09:29 AM EST
Thanks for allthe replies guys. The main use of my rifle or m4 would be close quarter work and maybe shooting at the range which doesn't go out past 200 yards. I don't see myself trying to take head shots at 3-400 yds. Therefore I think that the ideal gun for me would be the m4. I will take the advice of "imposter" and try to handle the m4 before I get one. A friend of mine just got back from a close quarter training class and will be putting on a competition for close quarters on Dec. 1 and I will get to handle the m4 as he has numerous ARs including a couple AR-10s. Thanks for all your inputs and replies. Justice_Keeper ________________________________________________ Can't we all just get along?
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