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Posted: 8/19/2005 10:18:33 AM EDT
Those of us who have been around guns for a while have at one time or another encountered wierd and obscure guns, that despite having little success in the (American) market, still hold a place of interest in our minds.

I figured I would post a couple of mine and then ask everyone to post what their favorite odd or wierd firearm is.

First on my list has to be the H&K P7 series of pistols:





Whatever your opinion of them, you have to admit that they are unique! The first time I ever saw one was on the hip of a NJ state trooper. I was just beginning to get into guns and had no idea what in the heck the wierd pistols they carried were. Riding in the holster, the P7M8 looked like about half the gun, as if the trooper was only carrying the frame and had to pull the slide from somewhere else and assemble it before shooting.

Second on my list of wierd guns would have to be the 1912 Steyr pistol:



It is one of the few semi-auto pistols to have been designed to be fed via a stripper clip:




Third would have to go to the H&K SP-89 pistol:



Yes, it looks like an MP5, but for a (very) brief time it was actually marketed by H&K as a "large frame" 9mm semi-auto pistol. I still remember the H&K catalog that showed a gloved hand holding the SP-89 as if on a target range.

The antis had a hissy-fit about the SP-89 and soon put an end to its run in the gunshops, but a few did manage to get sold into civilian hands.

So what are your favorite wierd and obscure weapons???? Post pics if you can!

Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:23:16 AM EDT
I want a liberator
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:25:10 AM EDT
American 180



www.american180.com
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:25:35 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/19/2005 10:28:03 AM EDT by John_Wayne777]
Another gun I always found intriguing is the USAS-12 shotgun. I saw a brief glimpse of a TV show in NJ where one of the charachters was using a drum-fed shotgun that looked M-16ish, and desperately wanted one from then on.



Unfortunately, one cannot own a USAS-12 without getting special permits from the ATF. Still, it would be a fun toy....
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:26:55 AM EDT
The gyrojet pistol.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:28:07 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:28:20 AM EDT
British Welrod or S&W M59 'Hush Puppy'.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:29:01 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Cape_hunter:
airbornecombatengineer.typepad.com/photos/weapons_fireams/zeliska600nitrorevolverace.jpg



Definately a revolver I would like to handle if I could ever find one.

Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:33:48 AM EDT
I've always liked the P7/M8.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:37:18 AM EDT

The Martini-Henry single-shot rifle from the mid-late 19th century.


The Webley-Fosbury. A British semi-automatic revolver.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:37:27 AM EDT
I have several.
Here's just one:
http://www.9mmlargo.com/1910/

The Bergmann Bayard.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:38:19 AM EDT
Revolver Carbines:

Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:38:53 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Admiral_Crunch:
www.kimdutoit.com/images/Martini-Henry_Rifle.jpg
The Martini-Henry single-shot rifle from the mid-late 19th century.




That is one of the most awesome rifles ever. I'd love to own one. Then I could sit in the dark and fondle it, and think of Zulu's and Fuzzy Wuzzies.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:43:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:
That is one of the most awesome rifles ever. I'd love to own one. Then I could sit in the dark and fondle it, and think of Zulu's and Fuzzy Wuzzies.



I almost bought one a few years back. Now I wish I had. I can't afford one now. (Yes, I know that means I'd have even less money now, but who needs logic?)

I saw one fired on Tales of the Gun, and I instantly fell in love. I'd want to get one that's been re-chambered in .303 so I could actually shoot it.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:47:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2005 3:03:15 PM EDT by _DR]
The G11.

The worlds only successful caseless cartridge assault rifle ever designed.
It worked phenomenally well, but the program was dropped because it was expensive and the German Army saw "no need for modernization".
Damn shame.









Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:51:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/19/2005 10:53:12 AM EDT by osprey21]
Did someone say.. Obscure!?

I give you the I.O.G. SMG, aka the LOG !

This thing makes a Chauchat look like a Ferrari.

Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:52:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/19/2005 10:54:46 AM EDT by Aimless]
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:54:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By DzlBenz:
Revolver Carbines:

www.uberti.com/firearms/images/prod_sa-revolver-carbine.jpg



Bet those didn't get fired very much, else someone had a "smokin" palm.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:55:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Aimless:
Mateba gas operated revolver



I have been wanting to buy one of those for YEARS !!

But despite the coolness of a semi-automatic revolver, I can never quite justify it, since I know it would just sit in the safe.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:56:30 AM EDT
Beretta AR70
Wish I had the foresight to get one before the 1989 ban



Ditto for the Sig 550

Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:57:36 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:58:14 AM EDT
A Glock

A polymer handgun, the Glock was one of the first "tactical" handguns to enjoy wide popularity with American shooters.

The Glock was given minor updates as time went on in a vain attempt to compensate for it's hideous design - Something only a mother could love. But nonetheless, people still bought them.

Given it's tendency to explode, collecters are discouraged from firing these particular firearm relics.

Link Posted: 8/19/2005 10:59:00 AM EDT
The Lewis Light Machinegun.. Invented by an American, produced by the Belgians, and used primarily by the British.. The Germans in WW1 liked it too, and used captured examples extensively. They aint light though





They were the most portable effective MG in service 'til the BAR showed up.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:05:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/19/2005 12:03:07 PM EDT by sixgunsblazing]
always liked the Daewoo Max2
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:06:19 AM EDT
Webley-Fosbury Automatic Revolver. Clever design. Ultimately useless because it came out about the same time automatics were being adopted.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:06:22 AM EDT



because of my age, ALL class 3, and most of the worlds semi "assault weapons" are obscure. they were all banned before i had a chance to buy any of them, and the 20 yr-old used ones cost more than i'll ever be able to afford.


Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:10:02 AM EDT


Chinese Broomhandle Mauser pistol as used by warlords back in the early 30's - 40's
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:12:37 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:16:39 AM EDT


Marlin model 62 Levermatic in caliber 30 carbine or 256 mag. It's a short throw lever, well made & quite accurate.

Marlin made the model 56 .22lr "clip" fed, model 57 .22 tube fed and the model 57M .22mag tube fed.

I have a model 56 & I have been looking for a model 62. I'll have one when I find a cure for this dreaded Black Rifle Disease
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:17:05 AM EDT
I have an old Ithica 12 Gauge shotgun.

What's strange about it ,is it's a single shot with
a drop open breach ,and a lever !

Not that top breech lever ,but a full underside lever,
like the kind you see on an old Winchester rifle.

The ejection is so forceful ,you could take out the front teeth
of someone standing behind you with a fast lever action
shell ejection !

The first time I ever shot it ,the ejecting case caught my hat
and trew it up over my head.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:21:02 AM EDT
I always wanted a Bergmann auto pistol. And an Automag.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:21:29 AM EDT






Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:26:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/19/2005 11:33:26 AM EDT by BeetleBailey]
tag, now on to serach for that German scoped assault rifle

Nazi German FG-42 (Fallschirmjägergewehr 42)

Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:26:35 AM EDT


LeMat revolver
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:31:56 AM EDT


High Standard Model 10A .12guage

Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:34:37 AM EDT
My Favorites that I own are:

Steyr AUG
HK P9S
HK P7
HK 270 .22
HK 770 ( IMO still one of the best semi auto hunting rifles ever built)
Walther P5 (ejects brass to the left)

Favorites that I would like to own:

Beretta 1201MP3 box fed pump/semi auto
USAS 12
FN CAL (before the FNC)
Luger Carbine
Broomhandle Carbine
FAMAS
FN P90
FN 2000
HK VP70
Auto MAG

Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:38:51 AM EDT


The 4.5 mm SPP-1 Underwater Pistol is made in Russia for use underwater by frogmen. It was developed in the late 1960's. Underwater, ordinary-shaped bullets are inaccurate and very short-range. As a result, this pistol fires a steel bolt about 4 inches long. It has four barrels, each containing one cartridge. Its ammunition comes as a clip of four cartridges which is inserted into the pistol's breech. It is longer range and has more penetrating power than spearguns. Its barrel is not rifled; the fired projectile is kept in line by hydrodynamic effects. As a result, it is somewhat inaccurate when fired out of water.


Teh Best for Aquabumping!!
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:41:06 AM EDT
It's impractical as all Hell, but I've always liked the COP .357.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:44:13 AM EDT
+1 on the G11

I've also fancied the phased plasma rifle in the 40 watt range.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:46:52 AM EDT

Originally Posted By photokirk:
It's impractical as all Hell, but I've always liked the COP .357.



I came VERY close to buying one of those in the '80s... it came in a box that looked for all the world like the boxes Norelco razors came in at the time.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:50:54 AM EDT
Not really obscure, but I wouldn't mind getting a derringer.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:52:15 AM EDT
Thunder 5
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:52:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/19/2005 12:05:19 PM EDT by SirDrinksAlot]


If I could have only one rifle, ever and If I had the ability to buy an unlimited supply of ammo..that would be the rifle.


picture is gone now, but it was a AsVAL similar to the VSS
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 11:58:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/19/2005 12:17:31 PM EDT by Slash]
Johnson Model 1941 Rifle

world.guns.ru/rifle/rfl20-e.htm







Caliber: .30-06 (7.62x63mm)
Action: short recoil operated, rotating bolt
Overall length: 1156 mm
Barrel length: 558 mm
Weight: 4.3 kg empty
Magazine capacity: 10 rounds

Melvin C. Johnson, an American arms designer, developed his semiautomatic rifle by the mid-1938, and submitted it to the US Army trials. Trials and development of the rifle continued until the early 1940, when the Army Ordnance Board finally rejected the Johnson rifle as being too long and heavy, and potentially unreliable with the bayonet attached. Same year Johnson submitted his rifle for trials to the US Marine Corps, where it was tested against M1 Garand rifle. First tests results were good for Johnson, but later on the M1 Garand rifle was found superior to it. In 1941 Johnson named his rifle as "Model 1941", and the same year the Dutch Government ordered 70 000 rifles from Johnson for its West India colonies, fearing invasion from Japan. For this order Johnson created the Johnson Automatics Mfg plant. At about the same time USMC parachutists forces became interested in Johnson rifle, as it was easy to take down for compact carry during parachute drop, and then easy and quick to reassembly. As the Dutch colonies were already occupied by Japan, USMC procured many of M1941 rifles, made to Dutch order. Compared to M1 Garand, M1941 Johnson rifle had some good and some bad features. Good features were good accuracy, lesser recoil, and bigger magazine capacity with capability for reloading partially full magazine with loose cartridges. Bad features were a number of smaller parts which were easily lost during field stripping, and less available spare parts. Overall, about 30 000 of M1941 rifles were produced during the WW2. After the war, USMC returned all remaining rifles to the Netherlands Purchasing Commission.

Johnson M1941 is a short recoil operated, semiautomatic rifle. Barrel is locked by the rotating bolt with eight locking lugs, engaging into the barrel extension. On recoil stroke, bolt head is rotated to disengage from the barrel, and then barrel is stopped and returned into forward position with its own spring; bolt continues its way back to extract and eject the spent cartridge case and then to chamber fresh cartridge on its way forward. Return spring is located in the buttstock. The rifle is fed from fixed rotary magazine, which holds 10 cartridges. Cartridges can be loaded into the magazine via the loading port in the magazine at the right side of the gun, using the standard M1903-type stripper clips (2 clips with 5 rounds each) or loose rounds. Magazine can be refilled at any time either with the bolt open or closed. Magazine loading port is closed by the spring-loaded dust cover. It must be noted that pre-war Johnson rifles were available either with rotary or box magazines, but box magazine versions apparently are very scarce, as very few of these were produced. Rifle is fitted with two-piece wooden stock, steel handguards were integral to the receiver. Military rifles were equipped with proprietary detachable lightweight spike-shaped bayonets, as the standard knife bayonets were too heavy and affected the reliability of a recoil-operated mechanism. These bayonets had no separate "handle" and were hardly useful and provided only to fulfill military requirements.



Link Posted: 8/19/2005 12:02:17 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 12:02:45 PM EDT
LaFrance .45acp AR style carbine.



Link Posted: 8/19/2005 12:04:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/19/2005 12:13:03 PM EDT by HardShell]

Originally Posted By Doucheatron3000:
And just what are those? (way to choose some obscure firearms, although I do believe the middle one is a bullpup conversion of a Mossberg pumpgun). <<< Correct! >>>




Just 3 oddballs from my collection:

Bushmaster "Assault Rifle"

Bullpup Mossberg 12 Gauge

FMJ "Pocket Pal" (one of the oddest pistols I've ever come across...)
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 12:06:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DienBienPhu54:
www.thadscott.com/16090a.jpg

Chinese Broomhandle Mauser pistol as used by warlords back in the early 30's - 40's



That is mine. I just bought a Nepalese 7.63mm C-96, now I want a Bolo 9mm and a Shansei .45ACP.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 12:07:23 PM EDT
Favorite "oddball" gun is the Canadian Ross rifle, preferably a MkIII. Wonderful guns, just not suited for trench warfare.

Favorite obscure gun is the Sig AMT. I had one and had to part with it many years ago, I've been kicking my ass over it ever since. Superb firearm, all the way around.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 12:07:30 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WildBoar:
www.nps.gov/anti/images/handgun2.jpg

LeMat revolver



Cabela's was selling repros for $500 a few years ago. I should have bought one.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 12:14:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Slash:
Johnson Model 1941 Rifle
Johnson Model 1941 Rifle
world.guns.ru/rifle/johnson1941.jpg

world.guns.ru/rifle/johnson1941r.jpg world.guns.ru/rifle/johnson1941mag_p.jpg

Caliber: .30-06 (7.62x63mm)
Action: short recoil operated, rotating bolt
Overall length: 1156 mm
Barrel length: 558 mm
Weight: 4.3 kg empty
Magazine capacity: 10 rounds

Melvin C. Johnson, an American arms designer, developed his semiautomatic rifle by the mid-1938, and submitted it to the US Army trials. Trials and development of the rifle continued until the early 1940, when the Army Ordnance Board finally rejected the Johnson rifle as being too long and heavy, and potentially unreliable with the bayonet attached. Same year Johnson submitted his rifle for trials to the US Marine Corps, where it was tested against M1 Garand rifle. First tests results were good for Johnson, but later on the M1 Garand rifle was found superior to it. In 1941 Johnson named his rifle as "Model 1941", and the same year the Dutch Government ordered 70 000 rifles from Johnson for its West India colonies, fearing invasion from Japan. For this order Johnson created the Johnson Automatics Mfg plant. At about the same time USMC parachutists forces became interested in Johnson rifle, as it was easy to take down for compact carry during parachute drop, and then easy and quick to reassembly. As the Dutch colonies were already occupied by Japan, USMC procured many of M1941 rifles, made to Dutch order. Compared to M1 Garand, M1941 Johnson rifle had some good and some bad features. Good features were good accuracy, lesser recoil, and bigger magazine capacity with capability for reloading partially full magazine with loose cartridges. Bad features were a number of smaller parts which were easily lost during field stripping, and less available spare parts. Overall, about 30 000 of M1941 rifles were produced during the WW2. After the war, USMC returned all remaining rifles to the Netherlands Purchasing Commission.

Johnson M1941 is a short recoil operated, semiautomatic rifle. Barrel is locked by the rotating bolt with eight locking lugs, engaging into the barrel extension. On recoil stroke, bolt head is rotated to disengage from the barrel, and then barrel is stopped and returned into forward position with its own spring; bolt continues its way back to extract and eject the spent cartridge case and then to chamber fresh cartridge on its way forward. Return spring is located in the buttstock. The rifle is fed from fixed rotary magazine, which holds 10 cartridges. Cartridges can be loaded into the magazine via the loading port in the magazine at the right side of the gun, using the standard M1903-type stripper clips (2 clips with 5 rounds each) or loose rounds. Magazine can be refilled at any time either with the bolt open or closed. Magazine loading port is closed by the spring-loaded dust cover. It must be noted that pre-war Johnson rifles were available either with rotary or box magazines, but box magazine versions apparently are very scarce, as very few of these were produced. Rifle is fitted with two-piece wooden stock, steel handguards were integral to the receiver. Military rifles were equipped with proprietary detachable lightweight spike-shaped bayonets, as the standard knife bayonets were too heavy and affected the reliability of a recoil-operated mechanism. These bayonets had no separate "handle" and were hardly useful and provided only to fulfill military requirements.

www.angelfire.com/nh/milarm/images/json1.jpg






I just bought one for $2000.
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