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Posted: 9/21/2004 8:54:08 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/21/2004 9:08:18 AM EST by EagleArmsHBAR]
I read the Glock post as was surprised that so many have 9mm pistols. So let's do a trusty non-scientific poll to see what you prefer in a Glock. I myself have a G23 .40. I know, I know the 1911 is King of the Pistols, I have 4 of them, but there is some reasons you might want a pistol that can carry more than 8-10 rounds. I myself think 9mm is underpowered for a carry gun, of course I carry a PPK sometimes. So let's hear it 9mm or .40 S&W?

Link Posted: 9/21/2004 8:55:57 AM EST
Get both. G19 and G23.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 8:56:55 AM EST

Originally Posted By Jeepster:
Get both. G19 and G23.



What he said. But my 9 is a 26.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 8:58:18 AM EST
G23 here.


ByteTheBullet (-:
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 8:58:46 AM EST
I'm a G23C carrier here. 10 rounds seems plenty for me with a compact pistol, and now that I can afford to get some 13 rounders! hell I'm so giddy I dont know what to do with myself!.
9mm sucks, I've seen its performance(granted it was military ball) I'm not impressed with it. I'd take the extra punch of the .40 any day.
now .347 sig, thats a whole other breed of 9mm spewing round, me likes that round.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 8:58:59 AM EST
G17, I never feel undergunned. Shot placement, shot placement, shot placement.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 8:59:55 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/21/2004 9:00:31 AM EST by Zaphod]
I don't have a Glock (yet), but there is a G23 on my wishlist!

My only concern about it is the incessant KABOOM stories. I wish I could get facts rather than crap, but I'll save that for some other thread....
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:01:32 AM EST
Fock Glock. Get a real pistol. Springfield XD-40!
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:02:01 AM EST
Get both.

Sig P239 (.40) and Browning HiPower (9MM).

The .40 is a hot-assed round, no matter what anyone says about "short & wimpy".

The next time you're out with someone that has a .40, watch where the bullets impact downrange after punching paper. Reach-out-and-touch ability.

And, once again, for all those that think 9MM is no good for personal defense, step forward, show yer big balls, and volunteer to be shot with one.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:02:33 AM EST

Originally Posted By Hokie:
G17, I never feel undergunned. Shot placement, shot placement, shot placement.



I am looking for one myself!

I have always thought if I wanted/needed a .40 caliber bullet I would get the 10mm!

BigDozer66
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:02:46 AM EST
SIG 229. The end.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:03:39 AM EST
I voted 9mm, but then why step up only part of the way with 10mm/40 S&W rounds costing twice the price.......

I carry 45 apc in a G30, G21s or 1911s. No flash in the pan caliber choices here, I'll stick with rounds that are more common and definately easier to obtain and reload, and far less likely to go KABOOM!YMMV

Mike

Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:03:59 AM EST

Originally Posted By gamesniper:
Get both.

Sig P239 (.40) and Browning HiPower (9MM).

The .40 is a hot-assed round, no matter what anyone says about "short & wimpy".

The next time you're out with someone that has a .40, watch where the bullets impact downrange after punching paper. Reach-out-and-touch ability.

And, once again, for all those that think 9MM is no good for personal defense, step forward, show yer big balls, and volunteer to be shot with one.



Are you going to 'nut up' and let someone shoot you with a .45 ACP?

BigDozer66
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:05:22 AM EST

.40 S & W leaves bigger holes.

Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:06:48 AM EST

Originally Posted By lippo:
.40 S & W leaves bigger holes.




.02 inches bigger.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:08:28 AM EST
If I want a "big bullet" in a pistol I'll go 45ACP otherwise I'll go 9mm, personally, I think the 40cal is useless, not big enough to be a 45 and to big to be a 9mm. The only good 40 was the 10mm, that baby hit like a .357Mag and in some loading more like a .41Mag. The ol' 40 "Short & Weak" just never did quite do it for me. Another plus for the 9mm is that it's cheaper to shoot, you can find ammo anywhere on the planet and with some of the +p loads it's in the low to mid 90% range for one shot stops, ya' don't get much better then that from a handgun. Now that the AWB is over you'll be able to get standard caps again so I think the 9mm will be making a come back.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:09:33 AM EST
I like my USP 40. I have never had a problem for as long as I have had it, almost up to 1000 rounds.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:12:34 AM EST

Originally Posted By mppppp:

Originally Posted By lippo:
.40 S & W leaves bigger holes.




.02 inches bigger.




40 S&W = .400" dia.
9mm Para = .355" dia.

difference is .045"
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:14:58 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/21/2004 9:15:30 AM EST by chuckhammer]

Originally Posted By mppppp:

Originally Posted By lippo:
.40 S & W leaves bigger holes.




.02 inches bigger.



Not so.

.400" - .355" = .045"

But, more important is the difference in frontal area.

Pi * (0.400^2) / 4 = 0.1257 in^2

Pi * (0.355^2) / 4 = 0.0990 in^2

That's makes a .40 hole 27% larger than a 9mm hole.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:15:06 AM EST
Not going to get into the 9 v. 45 (.40) but there are a lot of people on the wrong side of the grass that thought 9's were nothing to worry about.

I can't stress enough - shot placement, shot placement, shot placement!

Carry want you are comfortable with and proficient with. End of lecture.

Semper Fi!
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:16:47 AM EST
I don't want both! I already have too many different calibers to mess with!

.223
5.45 X 39
7.62 X39
.308
12 ga
20 ga
.410
.22 LR
.22 Short
.380 acp
.45 acp
.40 S&W
.22 Mag
7.62 X 54R
.38 special
.357 Mag
44 mag
8mm Mauser
7.7 Jap
7.62 X 25mm
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:17:39 AM EST
40 cal for sure.
1000s of rounds through my Glock22C not one problem.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:18:08 AM EST
I'm a huge fan of the .40 as a defensive cartridge.

I'd take one over a 9mm any day.....

except that all things being equal, the .40 is harder to control.

So I'd recommend a .45 (in my subjective opinion, it's easier to control the .45), but not in a glock........

Why were we discussing glocks again?

Get a .45 1911 and be done with it.

If you can't handle a .45, get a 9mm Hi-Power.

If you want something reliable, hard-hitting, easy to handle, but holds more than a 1911 and shoots a bit flatter (I shoot handguns at varmints on a regular basis) than a .45, get a .40 Hi-power.

Where were we...oh, yeah, glocks....if you must have one, get a 9mm.

Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:20:19 AM EST

Originally Posted By EagleArmsHBAR:
I myself think 9mm is underpowered for a carry gun,




Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:21:32 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/21/2004 9:29:57 AM EST by Hokie]

Originally Posted By EagleArmsHBAR:
I don't want both! I already have too many different calibers to mess with!

.223
5.45 X 39
7.62 X39
.308
12 ga
20 ga
.410
.22 LR
.22 Short
.380 acp
.45 acp
.40 S&W
.22 Mag
7.62 X 54R
.38 special
.357 Mag
44 mag
8mm Mauser
7.7 Jap
7.62 X 25mm



Yet another wonderful thread by EagleArmsHbar. You know, you should sell one of your guns to pay for a membership here. This way you'd help curb the cost of all the bandwidth you waste on this board.

That, and you could use the "Search" function.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:21:59 AM EST
.40, more practical than 9mm
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:24:38 AM EST

Originally Posted By arowneragain:
I'm a huge fan of the .40 as a defensive cartridge.

I'd take one over a 9mm any day.....

except that all things being equal, the .40 is harder to control.

So I'd recommend a .45 (in my subjective opinion, it's easier to control the .45), but not in a glock........

Why were we discussing glocks again?

Get a .45 1911 and be done with it.

If you can't handle a .45, get a 9mm Hi-Power.

If you want something reliable, hard-hitting, easy to handle, but holds more than a 1911 and shoots a bit flatter (I shoot handguns at varmints on a regular basis) than a .45, get a .40 Hi-power.

Where were we...oh, yeah, glocks....if you must have one, get a 9mm.




Just think, you can pick up a Para-Ord. now and get full caps for it at more reasonable prices so hell yes, go with the 45ACP in a Para-Ord. or even a Glock 21, that way you'll have the best of both worlds. Lots of rounds and BIG bullets too.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:28:10 AM EST
As long as 9MM is the NATO standard, ammo will be plentiful.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:32:17 AM EST
Get Both um I mean just get a .45 and stop worrying.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:32:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By TNFrank:

Originally Posted By arowneragain:
I'm a huge fan of the .40 as a defensive cartridge.

I'd take one over a 9mm any day.....

except that all things being equal, the .40 is harder to control.

So I'd recommend a .45 (in my subjective opinion, it's easier to control the .45), but not in a glock........

Why were we discussing glocks again?

Get a .45 1911 and be done with it.

If you can't handle a .45, get a 9mm Hi-Power.

If you want something reliable, hard-hitting, easy to handle, but holds more than a 1911 and shoots a bit flatter (I shoot handguns at varmints on a regular basis) than a .45, get a .40 Hi-power.

Where were we...oh, yeah, glocks....if you must have one, get a 9mm.




Just think, you can pick up a Para-Ord. now and get full caps for it at more reasonable prices so hell yes, go with the 45ACP in a Para-Ord. or even a Glock 21, that way you'll have the best of both worlds. Lots of rounds and BIG bullets too.



Frank, I said 1911. Those double-stack things ain't 1911's. Bulky, hard to carry, heavy as a lead balloon, cast frame, series 80 trigger, not terribly reliable from what I've seen......

And a glock is still a glock, and G21's still kaboom....

Dang it, here I go again....wasting my time with frank.

I guess a para-ordnance would be ok if you had gorilla hands. Mine aren't exactly small, but I prefer single-stacks. If you need more than 7 (actually, 8+1) rounds of .45, you are in trouble.....of course, who said you couldn't switch mags? They make extra mags, y'know...
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:33:15 AM EST

Originally Posted By Hokie:
G17, I never feel undergunned. Shot placement, shot placement, shot placement.



EXACTLY! Shot placement is more important than caliber--whichever you shoot most accurately with.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:33:25 AM EST
I can shoot 9mm faster and more accurate than .40

Only hits count.

G26 for me.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:36:44 AM EST
BD66: I'm not badmouthing ANY caliber. I don't want or desire to get shot with ANYFUCKINGTHING-that includes a goddamn .22 and even a Red Ryder BB gun.

I own .40, .357, .45, 9MM (2) & .380. I carry them all, except for the .357 (too big). Yes, I actually even feel relatively safe with the .380.

So, NO, I'm not gonna ball up and volunteer to get shot with a .45. I rarely toot my own horn but I believe I have more sense than that.

The point I think you're missing is that too many people here badmouth the 9MM (EXCEPT when it's fired from an MP5 variant-kinda funny, huh?) but I still don't think there's anyone here that would want to be shot with one.

Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:39:32 AM EST
10mm
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:44:48 AM EST
Sorry, Hook, didn't see your post.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:45:34 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/21/2004 9:46:28 AM EST by EagleArmsHBAR]

Originally Posted By GC456:
Get Both um I mean just get a .45 and stop worrying.



Like I said in post #1 of this topic, I Already have 4 1911 pistols!

Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:48:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By TNFrank:
If I want a "big bullet" in a pistol I'll go 45ACP otherwise I'll go 9mm, personally, I think the 40cal is useless, not big enough to be a 45 and to big to be a 9mm. The only good 40 was the 10mm, that baby hit like a .357Mag and in some loading more like a .41Mag. The ol' 40 "Short & Weak" just never did quite do it for me. Another plus for the 9mm is that it's cheaper to shoot, you can find ammo anywhere on the planet and with some of the +p loads it's in the low to mid 90% range for one shot stops, ya' don't get much better then that from a handgun. Now that the AWB is over you'll be able to get standard caps again so I think the 9mm will be making a come back.




Not to start a flame war, but just out of curiosity, exactly HOW is the .40 useless?
Local LE uses 40s and they've killed a lot of bad people with them. The round must be doing something right.
I also don't get how people who choose the .45 over all, then drop down to the 9 for their second choice when the .40 is so much closer to .45 performance than the 9.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:48:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By markl32:
I can shoot 9mm faster and more accurate than .40

Only hits count.




<----- Hence the screen name
P226 & P239, ETC.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:50:55 AM EST
9mm is cheaper to practice with. Glock-22 and Glock-23 are really nice guns for the .40 though.

GunLvr
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:55:56 AM EST

Originally Posted By EagleArmsHBAR:
I don't want both! I already have too many different calibers to mess with!

.223
5.45 X 39
7.62 X39
.308
12 ga
20 ga
.410
.22 LR
.22 Short
.380 acp
.45 acp
.40 S&W
.22 Mag
7.62 X 54R
.38 special
.357 Mag
44 mag
8mm Mauser
7.7 Jap
7.62 X 25mm



Then why ask about the 9mm? You already own a .40. Stop drinking and posting will you?
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:58:17 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/21/2004 9:58:32 AM EST by EagleArmsHBAR]

Originally Posted By Hokie:
Then why ask about the 9mm? You already own a .40. Stop drinking and posting will you?



I am asking what yall prefer, I don't need to ask to see what I prefer I already know I will never buy a 9mm. Just curious what yall like.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 9:59:27 AM EST

Originally Posted By EagleArmsHBAR:

Originally Posted By GC456:
Get Both um I mean just get a .45 and stop worrying.



Like I said in post #1 of this topic, I Already have 4 1911 pistols!

www.ezarchive.com/ezarchive/AssetFile.aspx?id=125207&time=632313747235156250



Looks to me like you need to sell one of the 4, and use the funds to get better sights, trigger, etc, on another one, and then you'll be good to go.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 10:03:04 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/21/2004 10:18:53 AM EST by EagleArmsHBAR]

Originally Posted By arowneragain:
Looks to me like you need to sell one of the 4, and use the funds to get better sights, trigger, etc, on another one, and then you'll be good to go.



OK here are the 1911s from left to right
1. Rock Island mil spec
2. Colt Combat Commander
3. Springfield Factory Comp heavily modified by Wilson Combat with BO-MAR sights
4. Colt Series 80 Super heavily modified by Wilson Combat with BO-MAR sights

The two done up by Wilson are super slick 100% reliable and damn accurate. The Commander is 100% reliable and very accurate as is. The RIA is, well a RIA. No problems with it but it is not as nice as the others.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 10:08:20 AM EST

Originally Posted By cjl32:

Originally Posted By mppppp:

Originally Posted By lippo:
.40 S & W leaves bigger holes.




.02 inches bigger.




40 S&W = .400" dia.
9mm Para = .355" dia.

difference is .045"



my bad.
.045 inches bigger.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 10:08:37 AM EST

Originally Posted By EagleArmsHBAR:

Originally Posted By arowneragain:
Looks to me like you need to sell one of the 4, and use the funds to get better sights, trigger, etc, on another one, and then you'll be good to go.



OK here are the 1911s from left to right
1. Rock Island mil spec
2. Colt Combat Commander
3. Springfield Factory Comp heavily modified by Wilson Combat
4. Colt Series 80 Super heavily modified by Wilson Combat



Sell the Rock Island, get a set of Novak night-sights on the colt series 80, have the trigger de-80'ed, get a good holster, and then you'll soon get over the whole glock thing......

But if you insist on having a glock, get a 9mm.

Surely you won't be carrying the stupid thing, just shooting it on occassion, and 9mm ammo is cheapest.....no use plinking with a .40 or .45 when you could have a 9mm, besides, 9mms don't KB.


<---loves to argue about this, whether he's completely right or not.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 10:11:57 AM EST
The in between .40SW seems like an answer to a stupid question. The FBI was unhappy with the performance of .38 Specials and 9mms during the Miami Massacre, and jumped on the 10mm bandwagon, then discovered that smaller agents couldn't take the recoil and desk jockies didn't want to carry a full sized, S&W semi-autos.

An easier and cheaper and more effective solution would have been to authorize agents to load their .357's with .357, instead of the mandated .38 special round, and to permit those agents who wanted a heavy semi auto to carry a 1911 or double-action SW auto, both of which were available in lighter, shorter barrel models.

I had a Glock .40 for awhile. The recoil was sharp and "cheap" ammo was non-existant. I sold it after putting only a couple boxes thru it.

I have a Glock 21 and 30 in .45ACP as well as a G34 and G26 in 9mm. f I want a biggee I grab a .45. If I want a compact carry gun or an easy recoling pistol for an afternoon on the range, I grab one of the 9mms

CKMorly
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 10:26:32 AM EST

Originally Posted By gamesniper:
And, once again, for all those that think 9MM is no good for personal defense, step forward, show yer big balls, and volunteer to be shot with one.



I'm not about to let someone shoot me with a pellet gun, either, but that doesn't mean I'm going to carry one for self defense.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 10:36:34 AM EST

Originally Posted By EagleArmsHBAR:
but there is some reasons you might want a pistol that can carry more than 8-10 rounds.



What be they?

In a defensive situation where a handgun is appropriate, it is all going to be over before you need 8 rounds, one way or another.

I can think of several reasons for a 9 mm:

1) Pilot's weapon. You can carry more 9 mm than .40 or .45.
2) Survivalist. It makes sense to have something in all of the common calibers, particularly military rounds with widespread usage and good deals on bulk ammo purchases.
3) CCW--a very compact 9mm would be good for concealed carry. We are talking single column mag here, of course.

So, from my perspective 9 mm has some logistics advantages, but that is about it.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 10:37:37 AM EST
.40S&W with Corbons.
Link Posted: 9/21/2004 10:40:27 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/21/2004 10:50:11 AM EST by BigDozer66]

Originally Posted By gamesniper:
BD66: I'm not badmouthing ANY caliber. I don't want or desire to get shot with ANYFUCKINGTHING-that includes a goddamn .22 and even a Red Ryder BB gun.

I own .40, .357, .45, 9MM (2) & .380. I carry them all, except for the .357 (too big). Yes, I actually even feel relatively safe with the .380.

So, NO, I'm not gonna ball up and volunteer to get shot with a .45. I rarely toot my own horn but I believe I have more sense than that.

The point I think you're missing is that too many people here badmouth the 9MM (EXCEPT when it's fired from an MP5 variant-kinda funny, huh?) but I still don't think there's anyone here that would want to be shot with one.




I din't miss the point GS! Hence the at the end of the sentence.

We all believe we have more sense than that!

My wife owns a .32 and a 9mm.
I own a .22LR (2), .380, .44 magnum and .45 (3)!

I have disliked (well liked less!) the 9mm-.40 offerings not because of the round but because of the 'attitude' that came to prevalence with them.
That attitude is mostly characterized as the "Spray and Pray" mentality!

Most always in a defensive situation shot placement is better than spraying the 'hood!

BigDozer66


Link Posted: 9/21/2004 10:44:58 AM EST

Originally Posted By mppppp:

Originally Posted By lippo:
.40 S & W leaves bigger holes.




.02 inches bigger.



1mm bigger!

BigDozer66
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