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Posted: 10/11/2004 10:21:35 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/11/2004 10:21:47 PM EST by Airwolf]
And we created a whole new .gov org for shit like this?


www.10news.com/news/3799783/detail.html

Woman Upset With Screener's Request To Feel Her Breasts

Kingsford Drives Home Rather Than Submit To Airport Search

POSTED: 8:55 am PDT October 11, 2004
UPDATED: 3:15 pm PDT October 11, 2004

SAN DIEGO -- A woman said she drove home from Denver rather than submit to what she viewed as an intrusive search by airport security screeners.

Ava Kingsford, 36, of San Diego said she was flagged down for a pat-down search at Denver International Airport last month as she prepared to board a flight home with her 3-month-old son.

Kingsford objected when a female screener with the Transportation Security Administration told her, "I'm going to feel your breasts now."

"She was patting me down, and frisking me, and basically covering all parts of my body, my legs, and wanding me with the security wand. And when I thought she had completed her search, she looks at me and said, 'I'm going to be feeling your breasts now,'" Kingsford said. "I was stunned, and I said, 'I beg your pardon?!'"

Kingsford said when she told the screener that she was uncomfortable with it, more security agents and police officers arrived. They told her that she couldn't board her flight without submitting to the final step of the search.

"I was shaking, I was sobbing. I couldn't believe that this was happening to me. It was surreal. It was like out of a movie, with these guys yelling at me, telling me that, yes, she has to feel my breasts or I'm not getting on my airplane," Kingsford said.

They took her to a private area to continue the search, but she said she was still uncomfortable with them touching her breasts so she tugged down her shirt to show them that she wasn't hiding anything.

"And then they said, 'That's it. We're not going to complete the search and you're not boarding your plane,'" Kingsford said. "They escorted us out and said they didn't care how we got home, it wasn't their problem."

She and her fiance ended up renting a car for the 15-hour drive home.

The Transportation Security Administration said its screeners did nothing wrong.

The agency announced extra security measures last month in the wake of the mid-air bombing of two Russian jetliners. Authorities believe two women smuggled explosives onto the aircraft, possibly in "torso packs" underneath their clothing.

Bob Kapp, customer service manager for the TSA in Denver, said that to conduct a thorough pat-down search of women, "it does require going beneath, between and above the breasts."

Kapp said a few people have been a little bit alarmed by the procedure. But he called it "a sign of the times" that is probably here to stay.

Kingsford said she's anxious about boarding another flight any time soon.

"I don't see how they can get away with feeling women's breasts. I don't see how they can say it's part of their new security policy. It's an infringement, a violation, in my opinion. It's just wrong," Kingsford said.

Kingsford said she had nothing to hide, and the TSA agents could plainly see that.

"I was wearing a pretty form-fitting tank top. There's nothing really to be hiding. You could see my figure. I didn't have any packs. She had patted down my torso. She had completed the torso pat down and wanded me with a security wand but some reason she said she wanted to see my breasts," Kingsford said.

"It was uncomfortable and I felt violated. And the way we were treated when I didn't concede was like I was a criminal. It was an awful experience," she said.
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 10:24:29 PM EST
So long as they put up a front...
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 10:27:10 PM EST
WTF?? Who are these idiots screening. Let me just tell you, I boarded 3 flights in one day with a CRKT 8" folder. It's NOT a small knife. These friggin' people are idiots!
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 10:31:09 PM EST
They don't let me feel their breasts either
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 10:33:02 PM EST

screener with the Transportation Security Administration told her, "I'm going to feel your breasts now."


I use that one on girls at the bars all the time.
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 10:33:09 PM EST
And to think I put in for a TSA job.
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 11:07:30 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/11/2004 11:07:48 PM EST by Alien]
I'm sure she fit the profile of a terrorist. It's complete bullshit that they deliberately avoid SUSPICIOUS people who FIT the profiles of terrorists so as not to hurt their feelings, namely ARABS.
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 11:09:48 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/12/2004 5:06:47 AM EST by thebeekeeper1]

Originally Posted By Alien:
I'm sure she fit the profile of a terrorist. It's complete bullshit that they deliberately avoid SUSPICIOUS people who FIT the profiles of terrorists so as not to hurt their feelings, namely ARABS.



+1
<Removed>

- BG


Link Posted: 10/11/2004 11:40:04 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/11/2004 11:40:28 PM EST by OFFascist]
flying = teh suck, glad I'm able to drive to where I need to go.

It wouldnt really bother me if most airlines went out of business.
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 11:45:15 PM EST
Okay, when we got searched at Disneyland before our senior picnic, all they did was run their fingers between the breasts and underneath them quickly - they never actually touched them. I never heard of the kind of search where they actually need to feel you up.
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 11:46:00 PM EST
"OK..im gonna need you to put the titties on the glass"
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 12:16:24 AM EST
My wife and I are unwilling to go anywhere we can't drive. Air travel is not an option.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 12:23:45 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/12/2004 12:24:04 AM EST by m98codered]
I f*cking wouldn't want no gay s-o-b touching my nuts
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 12:24:07 AM EST

Originally Posted By Da_Bunny:
My wife and I are unwilling to go anywhere we can't drive. Air travel is not an option.


I'm with you, Bunny!

Maybe her husband should have offered for the female TSA agent to check under his cockandballs to make sure he didn't have any explosives taped there? I sure would have asked.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 12:30:19 AM EST
If I were the woman, I would have just lifted my shirt and showed them.

Of course, I have very little dignity to begin with.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 1:46:23 AM EST

Originally Posted By GabbasaurusRex:
Okay, when we got searched at Disneyland before our senior picnic, all they did was run their fingers between the breasts and underneath them quickly - they never actually touched them. I never heard of the kind of search where they actually need to feel you up.




Disneyland? This is just wrong.



Originally Posted By Da_Bunny:
My wife and I are unwilling to go anywhere we can't drive. Air travel is not an option.




I couldn't get used to the "cattle car" experience before 9/11. I refuse to fly at all now. Maybe if enough folks felt the same way they would make some real changes to security.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 1:54:53 AM EST
I do not fly at all anymore. I feel that what TSA does to American's in the name of screening is a violation of my civil rights and IMHO, any firm/company/corporation that is a party to/endorses/promotes/allows this kind of conduct in the name of "security" is unworthy of my AMERICAN greenbacks. They can make their millions without me.

This woman is not an arrested person, there was no cause to demand they feel her breastsm IMHO, it's as if they were demanding that she submit to sexual battery.

Link Posted: 10/12/2004 1:57:59 AM EST
Hoppy: It's funny the news media is spinning this as that people feel unsafe flying because of terrorist, but the reality is people don't like to be stripped search. The only thing the TSA isn't doing, is a body cavity search, so guess where the next bomb is going to be hiddened? This assuming that "everybody is a potential terrorist" and searching everybody is only going go so far before the airline industry collapses.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 2:22:27 AM EST
"You can feel mine if I can feel yours".

Would that be 'tit for tat", or in this case "tit for tit"?

I have never, nor will I ever travel by plane. Now I have even more motivation to stay the hell away from airports.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 2:31:22 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/12/2004 2:32:27 AM EST by Kharn]
The in-depth screenings happen to my coworkers and I all the time due to our travel office buying our tickets at the last minute. In the in-depth check you get wanded in addition to the door-way magnetometer. Any metal whatsoever will set those wands off, the girls get their underwires traced with a finger, men get their junk patted with the back of a hand due to zippers, etc.

The sad thing? We all carry ID marked "US Army Civilian" and have official travel orders signed by a Major (for the base CO), but since we're not active duty we arent exempt from the more indepth security checks. I've been waiting to be pulled into a back room and interrogated over some of the manuals in my bag, luckily none of the screeners seem to care what the manuals say, they just flip through'em looking for whatever.

Kharn
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 2:36:15 AM EST

Originally Posted By heARtbreaker15:
WTF?? Who are these idiots screening. Let me just tell you, I boarded 3 flights in one day with a CRKT 8" folder. It's NOT a small knife. These friggin' people are idiots!



Yup...flying back from Tampa to DC earlier this year, they questioned us about a lighter we had, and ended up confiscating it as a "dangerous item", yet the same lighter had just a few days earlier made it through security at RONALD REAGAN NATIONAL AIRPORT in DC!!! They also didn't check the bottle of water my wife was carrying...it could have been a flammable liquid and started a nasty fire. They didn't even open it or ask her to take a sip!

Remember...to professionalize, you must federalize!
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 2:36:35 AM EST

Originally Posted By 1911lover:
"You can feel mine if I can feel yours".



If you saw the fugly screeners I saw at Newark a few years ago, you would not want to be touched. Well, maybe if you were hard up.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 2:47:07 AM EST

Originally Posted By warlord:
Hoppy: It's funny the news media is spinning this as that people feel unsafe flying because of terrorist, but the reality is people don't like to be stripped search. The only thing the TSA isn't doing, is a body cavity search, so guess where the next bomb is going to be hiddened? This assuming that "everybody is a potential terrorist" and searching everybody is only going go so far before the airline industry collapses.




If we live in a world where women have to have their tits checked and dudes have to get a ball toss to enter Disneyland and go see Grandma for Christmas then the Tangos have won. It's just that simple.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 3:44:52 AM EST
Welcome to the new American Police State!

It's funny to make cracks about this stuff until it's your wife or your daughter.......been there!

TSA is nothing but buffoons and idiots.

"Homeland Security" my ass! The friggen borders are WIDE OPEN while TSA wants to grope boobs?
Ridiculous!

Get in line for your inspections people!........the "showers" are next!
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 3:47:23 AM EST

Originally Posted By alloy6061:
Welcome to the new American Police State!

It's funny to make cracks about this stuff until it's your wife or your daughter.......been there!

TSA is nothing but buffoons and idiots.

"Homeland Security" my ass! The friggen borders are WIDE OPEN while TSA wants to grope boobs?
Ridiculous!

Get in line for your inspections people!........the "showers" are next!



+1
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 3:52:36 AM EST

Originally Posted By Da_Bunny:
My wife and I are unwilling to go anywhere we can't drive. Air travel is not an option.



Yup, I vote with my wallet. They can kiss my ass.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 3:53:48 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 3:56:30 AM EST

Originally Posted By Airwolf:
The Transportation Security Administration said its screeners did nothing wrong.



+1 "no fly"
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 3:59:12 AM EST

Originally Posted By Airwolf:
The Transportation Security Gestapo Administration said its screeners did nothing wrong.

Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:02:23 AM EST

Originally Posted By heARtbreaker15:
WTF?? Who are these idiots screening. Let me just tell you, I boarded 3 flights in one day with a CRKT 8" folder. It's NOT a small knife. These friggin' people are idiots!




I wouldn't admit that.

iirc they've fucked over people who, hoping to notify them of a hole in security, come forward and tell them things like that.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:05:34 AM EST
Hey as long as they put up signs that say "we're going to anal probe search you if you want to fly" then they're ok, because you can always turn around and not fly.


And when they do the same thing on the interstates, it will likewise be ok.


There is no right to travel on publicly paid for roads and airways.





Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:17:13 AM EST
While I'm not an airline security screener, I am an MP and have been trained on searching people several times. I've had my nuts grabbed and ass checked dozens of times for training experience. You'd be suprised what you can hide, and checking everywhere IS necessary for a proper search. People just shouldn't whine. She should be happy that female was doing the search.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:18:27 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/12/2004 4:19:35 AM EST by CAMPYBOB]
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:23:26 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:25:18 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:28:29 AM EST
Yup, the feds have managed to make air travel a really, really, horrible and unbearable experience in police state harassment. Does anyone honestly think that the TSA is acting that much differently than the SS or the KGB? It's all about humiliation with a very real threat of force if you do not comply. Sickening.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:28:58 AM EST
Nuts, just plain nuts.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:31:31 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:33:23 AM EST
i don't feel compelled to go anywhere that requires such a personal search. if the price of a vacation or business trip includes being groped by a tsa employee, i'll either drive or stay home.

a member of my family is a commercial airline pilot. shortly after 9/11, he had his fingernail clippers confiscated while going through "security." he was in uniform, and on duty. five minutes later, he was sitting at the controls of a fully fueled 767. if you can trust the captain to safely fly a passenger jet, perhaps he might be allowed to trim his own nails, too.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:36:05 AM EST
I thought after the screener became USA Federal employees that this would improve, all we got was the "same old, same old," and just being paid more. Were the public given a screw job by Sen. Diane Fienstein.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:46:15 AM EST

Originally Posted By Kharn: I've been waiting to be pulled into a back room and interrogated over some of the manuals in my bag, luckily none of the screeners seem to care what the manuals say, they just flip through'em looking for whatever.

Kharn



They probably can't read them.

Bob
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:47:29 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/12/2004 4:49:06 AM EST by Tanker06]

Originally Posted By MagKnightX:
If I were the woman, I would have just lifted my shirt and showed them.


Way back when, after ETS'ing from Active duty, and waiting for my clearances to transfer to a decent
job, I worked as a supervisor for the company that did screening at Dulles International.

We had one woman who came through, set off the metal detectors, so we had her step to the side
while we tried to figure out what caused it. I asked her, "Do you have x, y, z.. etc on, as these can
set them off?" she get all excited.
"I don't have anything on that could set it off" and yanks her dress up over her head!
Great Googly-Moogly! Nope, she didn't have anything on.

Things like that kept it entertaining....

(Turns out that it was her watch)

ETA: Damn, I'm glad that I got out of that business long before it came to this! I still hesitate to
tell people that I did it for a few months, due to the bad connotations that the job has gotten now.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:52:15 AM EST
I'm still upset with TSA demanding that I take my tennis shoes before going through the metal detector. WTF ?

Why they hell couldn't whathisname been the bra bomber instead of the shoe bomber????

I'd have absolutely no problem with everyone having to take their bras off before going through the metal detector. I might even fly more often then

Link Posted: 10/12/2004 5:01:53 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 5:05:28 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/12/2004 5:06:19 AM EST by lawsec]
If the sheeple willingly submit to this, they deserve it.

But, when it comes to this, the terrorists have already won.

To many people of religious moral backgrounds, this sort of invasion in order to prove we are not terrorists is simply unacceptable. The terrorists have won by making it so inconvenient or impossible for good, moral people to fly.

Now, were we to single out anyone professing the RoP or of middle eastern origin for enhanced screeings, then we would be getting at the real problem. But that would not be fair...



Link Posted: 10/12/2004 5:09:51 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 5:17:42 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 5:20:19 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 5:21:25 AM EST


What we need is an Arfcom group buy on a block NetJet time. No TSA screening
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 5:29:16 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 5:54:05 AM EST

Yup, I vote with my wallet.

My employer did. We no longer have any customers that are farther than 8 hours away. We decided to give them up after three times in a row, our guys missed their flight due to being held-up by security. It cost us a lot of money, but saved us a lot of frustration.

Also, we're a courier (among several other things), and we found it impossible to get permission to carry-on a locked bag onto a flight. Some of our competitors still do it, but I don't know how. That security rule cost us several good customers.z
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