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9/19/2017 7:27:10 PM
Posted: 8/7/2002 4:40:41 AM EDT
When Bush puts his foot up Saddam's ass, will it be under a declaration of war, or another BS activation/exercise of Presidential prerogative?
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 4:46:05 AM EDT
No, it will be a illegal war, just like the rest of the police actions we have done in the last 40 yrs. c-rock
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 7:07:54 AM EDT
No. Never. Not a chance. No declaration of war - that's just too scary for liberals. No.
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 7:08:49 AM EDT
I hope so~!
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 7:29:21 AM EDT
IMO, there will never be another declared war. The system is too easy to go kick butt when it suits us right now. For the last 30 years, they've all been happy wars, so no one worries about things like checks and balances, distribution of power, and things like that.
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 7:33:35 AM EDT
i hope so. but who knows anymore? might we offend a person, a group or an organization if and when we do? and will the offendee file complaints and eventually sue? an official declaration of war, in my opinion, is like a glove slap like the nobility used to do before the duel. [b] lets just get to it already.[/b]
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 7:34:35 AM EDT
Nope! The very last times the United States ever declared war on another nation was on December 8, 1941 (on Japan) and on December 11, 1941 (on Germany and Italy), after both of those countries declared war on the US! So does that mean the US has only engaged in illegal or unconstitutional wars since then? Nope. All the wars since then have had the backing of Congress. Period. And so will this one coming up in Iraq! Eric The(Historical)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 8:03:14 AM EDT
A congressional declaration of war has too much baggage that comes along with it.
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 8:11:03 AM EDT
The proper way to do this is take baghdad, and then say, "Oh by the way we declare war!"
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 8:12:07 AM EDT
All I want to see is a photo of Sadaam hanging from a tree.
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 8:28:57 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 9:00:56 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 9:13:01 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2002 9:24:21 AM EDT by Benjamin0001]
Aimless, regarding your second question. I don't know. I am hoping the reason it has taken this long is that they are mobilizing the military. Filling up the ranks and topping off equipment. I still have the feeling that we are undermanned by about 750,000 soldiers. Both the Marines and Army both could use another Tank Heavy Corp, at least. At least at least. I am worried about China taken serious advantage of America's somewhat weakened might. Ah yes, the Democrat and Clinton legacy rears its ugly head again. Ben My best friend and I would play chess alot, we were fairly matched players, and our games would develop usually along the same lines, there would be pawn structuring, someone would seize the middle of the board and we would back build meanuvering peices until our strategy seemed right and then this Huge confligration would develop over the course of three or four moves and would take about 8-10moves tops to resolve. This calm before the storm seems to fit what is happening over in the middle east. How are the peices positioned? Will the house of Saudi Fall when we invade Iraq? Will lebanon seek to make war with Israel. Will Syria send its army east into Iraq to hit the American Left flank? Will China take Taiwan in a suprise attack?Will it trigger a war between Pakistan and India??? Will the terrorism hit home with massive attacks on infrastructure throughour the United states? Will the Iraqis use CBR warfare?The list goes on and on. And if there is anysort of cordination between regimes and terrorists organizations then we will see these coordinated battles. Hmmmm? I don't know, I don't know?
Link Posted: 8/7/2002 9:37:21 AM EDT
Originally Posted By DoubleFeed: Don't y'all remember the Declaration of War on 16SEP01? We have been in a wartime situation since that date, and it clears us to drop bombs on whoever we need to. No further authorization needed. Unless somebody has information to the contrary.
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WAR IS PEACE FREEDOM IS SLAVERY IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH
Link Posted: 8/8/2002 7:41:18 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/8/2002 8:06:55 PM EDT
Double feed, how about a link to that declaration? Congress DID authorize action but as I remember it, FAILED to "declare war" in those terms. Too much insurance money on the line as "act of war" is not covered and to declare war they would have had to call WTC an "act of war". (Which it was, no matter how they weasel.) In as much as the UN is merely a 4th world mouthpiece and threat to freedom, who gives a flying f*** what they think?
Link Posted: 8/8/2002 9:26:23 PM EDT
Too much insurance money on the line as "act of war" is not covered and to declare war they would have had to call WTC an "act of war". (Which it was, no matter how they weasel.)
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Well, right next to "act of war" in almost every insurance policy ever written is "act of terrorism", and there's no weaseling about that one. The fact is, that the insurance companies CHOSE to honor those policies anyway. (In large part because the political climate is such that any Insurer trying to stick by the agreement at a time like this would risk extreme ire from the citizenry.) Whether or not they really had a choice I dunno. It's conceivable that a California tobacco jury would have tossed out the exclusion anyway. The fact of the matter is that the WTC debacle is precisely what the exclusion is intended for - something large enough to bankrupt an insurer. If Caleb's Kosher Pizza gets bombed, to the insurance company's bottom line - it's really no different than a gas leak explosion. They chose wisely to honor the policies. You can come back from bankruptcy - especially when the circumstances have a good chance of getting some federal money support.
Link Posted: 8/8/2002 9:43:53 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/8/2002 9:54:31 PM EDT
Good point, ORM-D. Will look into the "terrorism exclusion" but little doubt it exists as nearly every peril is excluded!! I also agree it was wise to pay up! The public would have crucified them! (Rightly so IMHO.) Allowing the rape of all ratepayers is bad enough. Many policies completely unrelted to 9/11 loses have been jacked several hundred percent. Thieves. Doublefeed - Didn't think they declared war. Just another authorization for them to backbeddle on. Weasel words were the direct link to 9/11. Just because Iraq wants to nuke us or bug us doesn't seem to matter nor does the fact it was mostly Saudis who were the hijackers.
Link Posted: 8/8/2002 10:42:12 PM EDT
No way. That would be a commitment.
Link Posted: 8/8/2002 11:42:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/8/2002 11:43:52 PM EDT by The_Macallan]
Originally Posted By DoubleFeed: agtm, I am NOT taking about that "don't you remember" kind of remembering. Very little notice was taken of the actual declaration of war made by congress. Nobody remembers this?
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There was the [url=http://www.house.gov/mthompson/hjr64summary.htm]Joint Resolution[/url] passed September 14, 2001 with all but one Berkley-Liberal traitor voting against it. I do remember a "declaration of war" was indeed written and sponsored by several conservatives in the House, but not voted on - it never made it to the floor; it was buried.
Link Posted: 8/9/2002 12:10:52 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/9/2002 12:54:56 AM EDT
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: So does that mean the US has only engaged in illegal or unconstitutional wars since then?
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You bet it does. Check Art. I, Section 8, and Article 2, Section 1.
All the wars since then have had the backing of Congress. Period.
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Doesn't matter if they have the "backing" of Congress(whatever that means), for the US to fight a war constitutionally, there needs to be a declaration of war. Period.
Eric The(Historical)Hun[>]:)]
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Historical? Perhaps you've forgotten about Madison, Washington, Jefferson, and that lot, because they would be aghast at your suggestion. Why would they go from having a king deciding to fight a war with the "backing" of Parliament to a president deciding to fight a war with the "backing" of Congress? They didn't exchange one king for another, and we should follow in their foot steps.
Link Posted: 8/9/2002 1:27:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DoubleFeed: Don't y'all remember the Declaration of War on 16SEP01? We have been in a wartime situation since that date, and it clears us to drop bombs on whoever we need to. No further authorization needed. Unless somebody has information to the contrary.
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There was NO declaration of war on September 16th. If there was, Rumsfeld would have become Secretary of War (unless Bush made a personnel change) and the Defense Department would become the War Department. For a declaration of war you have to have a state declare war against. We have not declared war against a state because the state is not what we are after: illegit regimes such as Saddam or the Taliban, or a group of people inside a country (al Qaeda). Don't believe the lie - excuses to take liberties away such as "we are at war" is not true since Congress has not declared war. Defend your liberties with your life.
Link Posted: 8/9/2002 2:11:30 PM EDT
No need. We'll just enforce the terms of their surrender from 1991. Because they violated those terms, we are obligated to ENFORCE them. This is just a continuation of the original Gulf War.
Link Posted: 8/9/2002 2:35:02 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Cincinnatus: No need. We'll just enforce the terms of their surrender from 1991. Because they violated those terms, we are obligated to ENFORCE them. This is just a continuation of the original Gulf War.
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THE WINNER!!![beer]
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