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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/11/2005 1:59:46 PM EDT
anyone know the answer to this or if its even true?
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 2:07:12 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 2:07:24 PM EDT
I think its because of the original mating pair had weak genes and the genetic bottleneck is catching up. Too much inbreeding.

Ok I dont know. Tag for the answer.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 2:13:56 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 2:14:55 PM EDT
So they don't bind when they wear tighter pants.

I mean, duh!
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 2:17:55 PM EDT
There's 84 track shoes on the left, 82 on the right, but I have no idea why.

Kharn
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 2:23:08 PM EDT
I think it was originally built for circle track racing and was later converted to military use. They kept the one longer track because it helps them turn sideways inside those big planes so they can carry more of them.

Link Posted: 8/11/2005 2:23:20 PM EDT
Trying not to steal the thread, but how is the Bradley doing over in Iraq? From what I understand, it is doing a pretty good job. Any feedback on this?

vmax84
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 2:35:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/11/2005 2:36:49 PM EDT by centermass181]
True.
the tranny pulls harder on one side, I dont remember why, I want to say something to do with the torsion bar suspension, if you had the same amount, youd get mad track slap on the right side.

changing track pads is wickid fun.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 2:43:38 PM EDT
it couldn't handle a full power shot from Squat dog and it stunted the growth of the right side, obviously
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 2:46:59 PM EDT
For traversing around hills. Everyone knows this, it's the same reason cows back home have shorter legs on one side.
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 2:48:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Weiseguy:
I think it was originally built for circle track racing and was later converted to military use.




Link Posted: 8/11/2005 2:51:01 PM EDT
I guess nobody knows
Link Posted: 8/11/2005 3:03:38 PM EDT
I can't answer your question, but you are correct the right track is shorter. When I was with < top secret spec-op name eliminated > we always sat on the right side so we would get to the combat zone faster......
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 12:56:17 PM EDT
Ya'll are so full of crap!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The right side has the 84 shoes where the left side has the 82. The road wheel arms (road wheels are attached to) use torsion bars for the supporting element (similar to a Cheby front end). The torsion bars go across the width of the vehicle and are offset left to right. Which means that the right side has the rear torsion bar which translate into a road wheel which is 3-4" further back than the rear on the left side.

On a side note after the T-151's get a few miles on them the bushings become worn and the number of shoes WILL vary from 84 to 80 on the right side to 82 to 78 on the left. Oh, "T-151" is the model of the track shoe on the BFV. This is also the same set up used on the MLRS and a similar set up on the M113, M1, M88, M60 wait a minute, its that way on all tracked combat vehicles, just different models of shoes with different counts.

Hows that for the answer?
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 12:58:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Kuntry:
Ya'll are so full of crap!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The right side has the 84 shoes where the left side has the 82. The road wheel arms (road wheels are attached to) use torsion bars for the supporting element (similar to a Cheby front end). The torsion bars go across the width of the vehicle and are offset left to right. Which means that the right side has the rear torsion bar which translate into a road wheel which is 3-4" further back than the rear on the left side.

On a side note after the T-151's get a few miles on them the bushings become worn and the number of shoes WILL vary from 84 to 80 on the right side to 82 to 78 on the left. Oh, "T-151" is the model of the track shoe on the BFV. This is also the same set up used on the MLRS and a similar set up on the M113, M1, M88, M60 wait a minute, its that way on all tracked combat vehicles, just different models of shoes with different counts.

Hows that for the answer?



The "wheelbase" is slightly longer on the right. ANd for the reason above.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:07:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Keith_J:

Originally Posted By Kuntry:
Ya'll are so full of crap!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The right side has the 84 shoes where the left side has the 82. The road wheel arms (road wheels are attached to) use torsion bars for the supporting element (similar to a Cheby front end). The torsion bars go across the width of the vehicle and are offset left to right. Which means that the right side has the rear torsion bar which translate into a road wheel which is 3-4" further back than the rear on the left side.

On a side note after the T-151's get a few miles on them the bushings become worn and the number of shoes WILL vary from 84 to 80 on the right side to 82 to 78 on the left. Oh, "T-151" is the model of the track shoe on the BFV. This is also the same set up used on the MLRS and a similar set up on the M113, M1, M88, M60 wait a minute, its that way on all tracked combat vehicles, just different models of shoes with different counts.

Hows that for the answer?



The "wheelbase" is slightly longer on the right. And for the reason above.



Track vehicles don't use the term "wheelbase". You have total vehicle length, air transportable length and track contact surface area. The reason wheelbase isn't used is due to the nature of torsion bar operation the "wheelbase" is never the same constantly changing based on terrain and vehicle load.

Next question for all ya'll smart folks: Is a BFV pushed or pulled by the final drives?
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:09:48 PM EDT
Damnit, Kuntry got to this thread before I did. He is entirely correct, of course.

Any tracked vehicle with torsion bar suspension will not be entirely symmetrical. It's not a very good drawing, but you can make it out on this Abrams diagram for example.



It appears that not many tankers actually realise this (I had to educate my entire platoon on the fact!), but that might be because the M1 manual dictates 78 blocks per side. To compensate for this, the compensating arm is almost invariably extended further on one side than the other, just nobody notices.

NTM
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:17:52 PM EDT
Is a BFV pushed or pulled by the final drives?

Well, the drivewheel is at the front, so I'm assuming 'pulled'. (i.e. most tension on the top of the track, going over the idler wheel at the back, and the idler wheel then pushes the whole thing forward on the track)

A fun one for those who don't know, is to look at a picture of a T-34 and try to figure out where the drivewheels are. WWII were the days where just because the engine was at one ended didn't necessarily mean that the transmission and drivewheels were at the same end.

NTM
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:22:40 PM EDT
Gah,

Had a Major ask one of the other SGTs in my company one time how many track shoes were on each side of the M113. The other SGT came to ask me, figuring I had it in my head. I said, "Hell if I know." So, I figured I ought to find out why the MAJ wanted to know and asked him.

He said, "How do you know your track tension is correct without knowing the correct number of shoes?"

My answer, "I follow the instructions in the TM, sir."

Yup, location of torsion bars is the reason there are differing numbers of shoes. Also, this caused a very slight drift in the M113 FOV, somewhat to the right, as I recall - seemed I was always nudging the left lat at road speed on hardball.

Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:23:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Kuntry:
Ya'll are so full of crap!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The right side has the 84 shoes where the left side has the 82. The road wheel arms (road wheels are attached to) use torsion bars for the supporting element (similar to a Cheby front end). The torsion bars go across the width of the vehicle and are offset left to right. Which means that the right side has the rear torsion bar which translate into a road wheel which is 3-4" further back than the rear on the left side.

On a side note after the T-151's get a few miles on them the bushings become worn and the number of shoes WILL vary from 84 to 80 on the right side to 82 to 78 on the left. Oh, "T-151" is the model of the track shoe on the BFV. This is also the same set up used on the MLRS and a similar set up on the M113, M1, M88, M60 wait a minute, its that way on all tracked combat vehicles, just different models of shoes with different counts.

Hows that for the answer?



yeah right, and you said we were full of crap
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:25:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Kuntry:
Ya'll are so full of crap!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The right side has the 84 shoes where the left side has the 82. The road wheel arms (road wheels are attached to) use torsion bars for the supporting element (similar to a Cheby front end). The torsion bars go across the width of the vehicle and are offset left to right. Which means that the right side has the rear torsion bar which translate into a road wheel which is 3-4" further back than the rear on the left side.

On a side note after the T-151's get a few miles on them the bushings become worn and the number of shoes WILL vary from 84 to 80 on the right side to 82 to 78 on the left. Oh, "T-151" is the model of the track shoe on the BFV. This is also the same set up used on the MLRS and a similar set up on the M113, M1, M88, M60 wait a minute, its that way on all tracked combat vehicles, just different models of shoes with different counts.

Hows that for the answer?



Long time lurker, first time caller?


Welcome to the 'hood.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:26:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Manic_Moran:
Is a BFV pushed or pulled by the final drives?

Well, the drivewheel is at the front, so I'm assuming 'pulled'. (i.e. most tension on the top of the track, going over the idler wheel at the back, and the idler wheel then pushes the whole thing forward on the track)

A fun one for those who don't know, is to look at a picture of a T-34 and try to figure out where the drivewheels are. WWII were the days where just because the engine was at one ended didn't necessarily mean that the transmission and drivewheels were at the same end.

NTM



You are exactly correct!!!!!
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:28:56 PM EDT
If a Abrams is moving forward at 45 mph, how fast are the track shoes on the support rollers moving?
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:37:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/12/2005 1:38:42 PM EDT by SJSAMPLE]
On the top, 45mph.
On the road, 0mph.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:40:41 PM EDT
Nope...........
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:47:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SJSAMPLE:
On the top, 45mph.
On the road, 0mph.



Road correct, top 90 mph.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:54:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ASUsax:

Originally Posted By SJSAMPLE:
On the top, 45mph.
On the road, 0mph.



Road correct, top 90 mph.



+1
Old trick of mine
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 2:02:46 PM EDT
No takers for the T-34?

NTM
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 2:03:50 PM EDT
ding ding ding we have a winner. on the ground 0 mph on the support rollers double the vehicle speed.............

So if all this is true how fast are the road wheels moving?
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 2:11:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Manic_Moran:
No takers for the T-34?

NTM



Its driven from the rear "smooth" drive assy.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 2:11:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/12/2005 2:12:33 PM EDT by Manic_Moran]
45mph at the hub, one would wager.

Yep on the T-34. There's no 'sprocket wheel' in the traditional sense, instead using a friction-free system of rollers interlinking with the center guides.

NTM
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 2:11:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Kuntry:

So if all this is true how fast are the road wheels moving?



45 mph...

Link Posted: 8/12/2005 2:16:42 PM EDT
What is the ungoverned top speed of the XM1?
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 2:26:46 PM EDT
There was one tank design that didnt require its tracks to be in place to move. It could move while the tracks were mounted or it could move (under its own power) with the tracks removed. What was the name of this tank?
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 2:31:59 PM EDT
Tag to watch the DATs without the DA.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 2:56:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/12/2005 3:05:41 PM EDT by Manic_Moran]
I think I graduated most of the way to CDAT, with the BFT on my A1.

There were several tank designs which could run on either tracks or wheels. The most successful was the BT-5 series of Soviet light tanks. They were a development the earlier BT series, which themselves were based on one of Christie's designs.

France, Austria, England and Germany amongst others all had their own 'Wheel-cum-track' vehicles.

One of the tankers over on TankNet claims to have trialled an M1 at over 100mph in an experiment to see just how fast the thing would go. (No ammo, governor, early model without extra armour, and so on). Pretty much ripped it apart doing it though.

Not an acknowledged speed by the Guinness book of Records, however, probably because it was not a speed achievable by a generic tank.

My turn. What was the first production tank to enter full-scale service with a turbine engine?

NTM
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 3:10:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ASUsax:

Originally Posted By SJSAMPLE:
On the top, 45mph.
On the road, 0mph.



Road correct, top 90 mph.



Shit.
I forgot about that.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 3:17:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Kuntry:
There was one tank design that didnt require its tracks to be in place to move. It could move while the tracks were mounted or it could move (under its own power) with the tracks removed. What was the name of this tank?



Christie T-3
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 3:42:02 AM EDT
I was on Bradley's (cav version) for 4 years and I will guarantee you that we put equal shoes on each side and then adjusted the idler arm's for the correct tension.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 3:59:58 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Kuntry:
What is the ungoverned top speed of the XM1?



I dunno. What is the unladen airspeed of a swallow?


Woody
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 4:27:36 AM EDT
XM1=Experimental M1 Tank

Tank that can move with or without its tracks= Several of the Christie designs http://www.geocities.com/firefly1002000/christanks.html

Link Posted: 8/13/2005 4:50:24 AM EDT
What does the -10 say, out of interest? I was rather surprised when I looked it up and it said equal on both sides.

Turbine question seems to have stumped people for a short while

NTM
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 5:08:49 AM EDT
From what I understand (a few of my coworkers were associated with the M1 program), they never figured out the absolute top speed of an ungoverned M1. They got worried around 85-90mph and stopped, since if they threw a track at that speed it'd be all over for the crew.

Kharn
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