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Posted: 6/16/2001 2:10:10 PM EST
I can honestly say that NONE of my friends have joined the military, I don't even think I have any distant acquaintances in the Military. I know a couple national guard guys but that's about it. I work very close to a Federal building and there are always Navy and other Military personnel around and they ALWAYS have a southern accent. I even meet some of these guys at the gym and they are always from South Carolina or Texas or somewhere. Why is it that more Southerners seem to be in the Military? Or am I way off base here?
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 2:15:21 PM EST
I know tons of guys who are either in or have been in the military. I guess we just like to shoot machineguns and kick ass. Plus, when we decide its time to invade the north the training will come in handy... Michael "The South Will Rise Again" VanSant
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 2:18:36 PM EST
Maybe we have more respect for our country and feel a sense of duty.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 2:23:50 PM EST
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 2:33:31 PM EST
Southerners don't want to get out of the South. Check the census. Nobody is leaving and many from other parts are coming here.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 2:38:15 PM EST
My guess is that it has more to do with going to college. Around here at least 70%+ go on to college. I think we have something like 117 colleges in Massachusetts alone. The mentality is also to look down on someone who joins. People think, what you couldn't get into college? Or, what you can't afford it? Please don't take this as a slam but that is what people think around here, I have no idea what it is like in other parts of the country. Hell, maybe it goes back to Vietnam when the uneducated and poor were sent because the rich could just go to College. I really don't know. Personally, I find the Military very interesting but I can't get past the political BS. It is obvious that money makes the world go round and the same goes for the Military today. When you learn about all the Bullshit with Nixon and Vietnam it makes me sick. Also the Gulf war makes me shake my head. I think our guys did an awesome job, but they should not have been there in the first place. Our guys died because of assholes in office. That is not Patriotic. How about the poor Rangers and special forces guys left all over the world because some mission went wrong or some politician sold them out. To me, being under the control of some politicians is not my idea of patriotic. Now WWII was the stuff heroes are made of, the true protection of the US. I respect the Military and the safety, protection, and security they provide. I know that I sleep well at night because they help provide a safe and secure country with order. The thought of being in Clintons army just scared me though.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 2:45:09 PM EST
Originally Posted By raf: Or maybe they just wanted to get out of the South, and the service was a way to do it on somebody else's dime. [;)]
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People in Military Service earn that "dime" as you call it. Futhermore they and their families put it all on the line when ordered to.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 2:48:58 PM EST
Originally quoted by GeoffM24
. When you learn about all the Bullshit with Nixon and Vietnam it makes me sick. Also the Gulf war makes me shake my head.
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Geoff, Democraps always mention Nixon if reference to Vietnam. They conveniently forget that he finally got us out and that Johnson never made any effort to do so. It was Kennedy who got us in the first place and I believe that part of the reason he was assassinated was because he was going to pull us out. I am not a Nixon fan, but let's get it right.
I think our guys did an awesome job, but they should not have been there in the first place
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I don't have a problem with us having been there, but we weren't allowed to win. If Johnson had turned it over to the military and let them wage full blown war ala the Persian Gulf, we would have been out of there in 2 or 3 years with a victory. I may be wrong about the time frame, but I do know that all the places the politicians placed off limits didn't help.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 2:48:59 PM EST
Originally Posted By LARRY G: Southerners don't want to get out of the South. Check the census. Nobody is leaving and many from other parts are coming here.
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Yep, all of my friends that joined that are out now have all came back. Most of them bought some guns as soon as they got home too. Also, it seems an overwhelming majority went to either the Marines or the Army. In fact, I don't think I know one person that has joined either the AirForce or Navy. I just picked up a friend a couple of weeks ago at DFW that just got out that was comming back from Hawaii, Marine SGT. Wester. Actually, most of the people I know do it for the excitement. Then they come back here and go to school. I had planned on the Army after I went to school, but I got married and had some kids along the way. Now the military isn't really an option because of the pay difference between it and the private sector for a college graduate. Hard to raise a family on military pay and I wouldn't want them to have to go through that. I was going to do it strictly for the excitement and the challenge. I planned on going infantry. I think another thing that it has to do with is the way of life down here. There are lots of people who live outside the big cities that grow up hunting and camping and being outside a lot. Lots of us like having it hard and being miserable in the rain while we are cold and hungry. Being outside and doing hardwork. To some the military just seems to be a natural choice. Maybe a lot of this is the same up north though as well. I really don't know since Ive never spent much time outside of Texas or do I really know a great deal of people from the north. Thats what I think anyways. Michael
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 2:53:08 PM EST
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 2:56:42 PM EST
When I was in the Army, the general opinion of why there were more guys from the South than the north who volunteered was simple. It was because of the heat! Why would a young man from a state with a reasonable summer temperature want to go to the South to go through basic training in the heat? For us Southerners, we're already here, so it didn't matter. Of course, this was long before the Army had any airconditioned buildings on the base, so my info could be a bit out of date. ;) I used this question as an excuse to call my nephew. He has been in the Army for five years now, and is currently stationed at Fort Jackson in Columbia, SC. He agreed that the heat might be a factor, but for the vast majority of the people he surveys (he handles benefit paperwork), they joined the Army to get help paying for college. (in his opinion) There are lots more poor guys in the South that can't afford to continue their education, so they get the Army to help them. Things have changed quite a bit over the past few years, if that's why guys are joining-up. Another data point, about 10 years ago while between jobs, I helped-out a local Navy recruiter. The very first thing he would always mention to a prospective soldier was that the government would give you lots of money towards college after you completed your stint. I saw several parents talk their kids into joining just because of this fact.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 3:02:11 PM EST
The mentality is also to look down on someone who joins. People think, what you couldn't get into college? Or, what you can't afford it?
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Who is that patriotic senator from Taxxachusetts? Maybe that's where they picked up the attitude. - I'm from the south (S.C.) - Parents couldn't afford to send me to college - Enlisted in '77 - Earned a two year degree in '86 - Learned a college education is more about, "Pay your [b]fee[/b], get your B and earn a degree" - Retired after 21 as an E-8 - Work 7-8 months a year; spend the rest traveling, shooting, hunting and doing whatever I darn well please while many white collar graduates I attended HS with chase a dollar
To me, being under the control of some politicians is not my idea of patriotic.
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Hmmmm Eddie
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 3:06:17 PM EST
Larry, you are right they all handled it poorly, hell Johnson couldn't take the heat and didn't even run for a second term. I'm still not sure why Bush didn't finish the job. Zoom, Recruiters are beggers now, nobody wants to go into the army. That's why they haven't met there recruitment numbers in years and are now taking GEDs. The army is now taking ANYBODY to fill the spots which is giving the real warriors a bad name. Like I said it is all about the money.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 3:17:35 PM EST
Although I don't like what Ted has done in his personal life he holds a shit load of power in the Senate and gets Massachusetts lots of Federal dollars. Since most politicians are money hungry liars don't you think it makes sense to fight fire with fire? In a better world men like him would not be there, but we do not live in that world. Hell he could't even get a FID if he wanted, how F#(ked up is that? I don't know about you but I learned a great deal while earning my 4 year degree. It has also opened many doors for me.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 3:23:39 PM EST
GeoffM24....Most of the guys who served in combat in vietnam were not poor drafties DAV and the VFW commissoned a study not too long ago on vietnam vet statistics most of those names on the wall were middle class boys...with a year of college and volunteerd for vietnam not drafted...A good share of the guys in both platoons I served with were volunteers not only for the Army but also volunteered for duty in vietnam...There were quite a few guys from the south but the state that gave up the most combat casualties per captia was California...My pa was from Ga. and was a combat vet of both WWII and Korea the south was hard hit during the depression as it hadnt recovered from the Cival War and Northern occupation and the cruelty of Re-construction..the military had always been an honorable way for a man to make a living and get an education after..
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 3:23:51 PM EST
The way I was raised in the "Volunteer State", when you got out of High School you either went to college or into the military. Then I let the Army pay for my education. My Son did the same with the Navy. Both of us were proud to serve!
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 4:02:55 PM EST
Two reasons, down south there are a higher ratio of folks "raised right" and a higher ratio of "BAD ASSED MOTHER FUCKERS"!!!!!! YEEEE GD HAWWWW!!! Proud Southerner, Five O. See ya'll! :)
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 4:19:35 PM EST
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 4:30:22 PM EST
I am from MA, also was in the Army. I seen a good mix of people while in. I have met alot of good guys and a few pricks. OSA
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 4:46:11 PM EST
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 5:27:43 PM EST
There is a basketful of reasons ---why the southern individual decides to join the military. I am from a military family that dates back to the civil war. I felt that I owed this wonderful country of ours something. It seems that nowadays--there are some individuals that are always wanting something from her--but without giving in return. Maybe it should be made mandatory to serve in some branch of service. Just food for thought...........
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 5:34:00 PM EST
I had enlisted after living 18 years in Wisconsin. The "Military Accent" is a fact... Hell, 20 years later I still say "y'all" You pick it up fast and easily.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 5:43:24 PM EST
JUBALE: Maybe it should be made mandatory to serve in some branch of service. Just food for thought........... I respectfully disagree. My service, my father’s service, my brother’s service, my uncles’ service, etc. were voluntary commitments of free men to place the welfare of our country above our selves. Mandatory conscription is involuntary servitude, no matter how you fancy it up. Just my opinion.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 5:47:11 PM EST
I should have been a little more specific. I don't know any younger then say 40. My Dad was in the Navy for example. I was more so referring to the post Vietnam group. As for joining the military now, it is far to late. There is no way I could keep the standard of living corporate America is now providing for me. Plus I really like the way my life is going. If I was to ever go into the Military I would have gone to VMI or West Point.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 6:08:33 PM EST
It's just the Scots-Irish heritage of the South. We are just made that way. Just look at the percentage of gun ownership in the Old South! Fierce sense of pride that a major defeat in a civil insurrection and an army of occupation sure as hell didn't mitigate! You DO KNOW we're collection weapons for SOMETHING, don't you?[:D] If first you don't secede, try, try again. Eric The(WannaTry2OutOf3?)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 6:21:39 PM EST
Originally Posted By 9divdoc: GeoffM24....Most of the guys who served in combat in vietnam were not poor drafties DAV and the VFW commissoned a study not too long ago on vietnam vet statistics most of those names on the wall were middle class boys...with a year of college and volunteerd for vietnam not drafted...A good share of the guys in both platoons I served with were volunteers not only for the Army but also volunteered for duty in vietnam...There were quite a few guys from the south but the state that gave up the most combat casualties per captia was California...My pa was from Ga. and was a combat vet of both WWII and Korea the south was hard hit during the depression as it hadnt recovered from the Cival War and Northern occupation and the cruelty of Re-construction..the military had always been an honorable way for a man to make a living and get an education after..
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I don't know anything about any study but when I was drafted in 1965 the 4th Infintry Div. was down to skeleton crew strength. The ranks were filled with draftees, many were promoted up right away to sargent as squad leaders, and we went to war in a very short time. Majority draftees. I have friends who served in the 9th Inf. Div and things were the same there. My whole neighborhood back home was emptied out of 19 year olds. I have no reason to believe that the majority of KIA were not draftees. Not that it matters. Stupid ass war run by even stupider ass politicians. President Johnson didn't want to be the first American president to lose a war so he quit . What a typical Democrat trick. Get all those guys killed then sneak off. I love this country, thats why I went and did my part but the crooked ass lying politicians all suck donkey. You won't see any of their kids out there humpin a rucksack and carring a rifle. If they try to draft my kids the first question I'm gonna ask is are we in this to win or just keep some crooked politician in office. You can guess what will follow after that.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 6:22:33 PM EST
My perspective on this is most people from the South look on the military as an honorable profession, not at all looked down on. Add to this a deep sense of duty to country and you have in interesting combination. Consider also this "sense of duty to country" even after the "War of Northern Aggression" still exists. Interesting indeed. From a personal perspective, which coincides with many men and women I know, anybody worth their salt should be willing to fight for their country/community. Anyone that is not willing does not deserve the same consideration. It also personally peeves me to see the Federal Government continuing to cut back the G.I. Bill for educational and V.A. hospital benefits. Rant off.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 7:04:37 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/16/2001 7:06:57 PM EST by gt6plus]
FTA!!!! I Joined for the weapons!!! really it was to change the direction of my life, I am originally from upstate N.Y. and wasn't much on going to school. I joined when I was 23 and loved every minute of it. 2.5 years on the beach in Italy, 1 year In Georgia(Benning) with a 4 month rotation in Panama. Plus a nice deployment to Homstead Fla. for hurricane Andrew relief/security. I was an M.P. and my military experience has always looked good on my resume. Fun Travel and Adventure.
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 7:28:11 PM EST
Originally Posted By Ponyboy: I know tons of guys who are either in or have been in the military. I guess we just like to shoot machineguns and kick ass. Plus, when we decide its time to invade the north the training will come in handy... Michael "The South Will Rise Again" VanSant
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Umm, just waiting for supplies eh? [;)] Aviator [img]www.dredgeearthfirst.com/aviator.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 7:37:40 PM EST
Originally Posted By GeoffM24: I'm still not sure why Bush didn't finish the job.
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No offense, but that one always gets me. Nobidy wanted to "Finish the job" more than those of us that were over there. The reason we did not was that: 1: We had me the conditions that were wisely set at the outset of that particular "war". Kuwait was liberated. 2: Taking him out would have casued a serious power vacum in a very unstable part of the world. Sometimes the devil you know, is better than the devil you don't know. 3: All the news coverage of the "HIghway of Death" (most of it was only vehicles, most Iraqis had run into the desert) was turning the American people agains continuing. Aviator [img]www.dredgeearthfirst.com/aviator.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 7:39:56 PM EST
Originally Posted By FedGunner: I had enlisted after living 18 years in Wisconsin. The "Military Accent" is a fact... Hell, 20 years later I still say "y'all" You pick it up fast and easily.
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Concur. From Iowa before the Army.. Aviator [img]www.dredgeearthfirst.com/aviator.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 7:58:51 PM EST
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 8:15:03 PM EST
Originally Posted By Aviator:
Originally Posted By GeoffM24: I'm still not sure why Bush didn't finish the job.
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No offense, but that one always gets me. Nobidy wanted to "Finish the job" more than those of us that were over there. The reason we did not was that: 1: We had me the conditions that were wisely set at the outset of that particular "war". Kuwait was liberated. 2: Taking him out would have casued a serious power vacum in a very unstable part of the world. Sometimes the devil you know, is better than the devil you don't know. 3: All the news coverage of the "HIghway of Death" (most of it was only vehicles, most Iraqis had run into the desert) was turning the American people agains continuing. Aviator [img]www.dredgeearthfirst.com/aviator.gif[/img]
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The liberal press strikes again. Too much killin goin on here. Folks are enjoyin this war too much. We are winning for a change. Got to stop. That highyway of death was just too much. I'm not sure where I heard it but about the time of the highway of death there was some news report that the Russian Generals were just mad as hell that we tore up their clients army and the russian tanks and equipment so bad. There was uncomfirmed speculation that a Ruskie General might do something crazy, without authorization, like launching a nuke at IFOR, if we had gone on to Bagdad. All this loose talk bout stuff like this plays on our politicians minds. They are reluctant to throw even a small nuke for fear of starting the big one. WW III. But I would bet my money that if Margret Thatcher was calling the shots we would be water skiing on the Euphrates right now instead of flying over and getting telephone poles (sams) shot at our jet pilots every day.[beer] That Lady had more balls than any six other world leaders back then. [-!-!-]
Link Posted: 6/16/2001 8:40:06 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/16/2001 8:44:17 PM EST by Sukebe]
Originally Posted By Aviator:
Originally Posted By GeoffM24: I'm still not sure why Bush didn't finish the job.
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2: Taking him out would have casued a serious power vacum in a very unstable part of the world. Sometimes the devil you know, is better than the devil you don't know. Aviator [img]www.dredgeearthfirst.com/aviator.gif[/img]
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U.S. foreign policy in the middle east has always counted on unstability to maintain a balance of power in the region. If we had completely crushed Iraq then we may very well had been back at it with Iran. BTT. When I was in the USMC They NYC area seemed to have the largest representation of people from one region. I met alot of guys from the south and southwest. But I never really considered those to be the same. Lets face it Arizona is not Alabama.
Link Posted: 6/17/2001 3:13:54 AM EST
From a personal perspective, which coincides with many men and women I know, anybody worth their salt should be willing to fight for their country/community. Anyone that is not willing does not deserve the same consideration.
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The difference between a citizen and a civilian. Eddie
Link Posted: 6/17/2001 4:56:33 AM EST
I lived in one of the poorest counties in TN. No jobs but the sawmills and garment factories. I wanted to do something other than either of those two choices. I joined right out of high school. Was in the 82nd for 11 yrs. Damn glad I did it too! Got to see the world where I otherwise would have only seen the Tn/KY line. Mostly you will see the southerners joining because it's one of the few ways out of poverty. Mil life isn't 5 star hotels, but it's a way to a somewhat better start.
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 2:54:23 AM EST
No offense to the yankees on the list, and I realize that this is a generalization - and generalizations are usually a bad idea. Perhaps there are more people from the south joining for the same reason that you will not see roving gangs of *men*(f*ucking unemployed rodents sucking up my tax money) groping women and tearing their clothes off in Ft. Worth like you do in NYC - right in front of other *men*. A sense of duty. Tate
Link Posted: 6/18/2001 3:29:47 AM EST
Originally Posted By LS1Eddie:
From a personal perspective, which coincides with many men and women I know, anybody worth their salt should be willing to fight for their country/community. Anyone that is not willing does not deserve the same consideration.
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The difference between a citizen and a civilian. Eddie
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Exactly!!
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