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Posted: 9/18/2004 7:12:55 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/18/2004 7:31:28 PM EST by guns762]
I just read the thread about the 12yr old that died from recoil of a .454. Today I took one of my students out to shoot. He is 18 and I had permission from his mother. He intends on buying his first gun, and wants a pistol. He had thought he wanted a 1911, Springfield Loaded, to be exact. I have one and several other models of handguns and offered to let him try them all.

What I can't understand is this. My student told me that his dad used to hand him a .44mag or some rifle, like a .30-06 when he was little and have him shoot it. Of course, he never wanted to shoot again. His father seemed to get enjoyment from seeing this happen. WTF?

This kid, up until today, had not wanted to shoot ever again. I started him on a .22, and we moved up through several handguns from there. He had a blast, loved the Champion that I let him try, and is intent on purchasing one now. He also liked shooting the AR and AK. He told me he never knew how much fun shooting could be, until today. His dad had tried to get him to shoot and hunt for years, but never was successful. He offered to let him have all of his guns a couple of weeks ago. Today the kid asked if he could take one or two out to shoot; dad found out I was taking him, and said....no.


I hear stories like this all the time about how some idiot lets his kid shoot a hard kicking gun for amusement. What in the hell are they thinking?

BTW, My student is absolutely a natural. The son-of-a-gun had great groups with every handgun I put in front of him. He darn near shot as well as I did, and in some cases, better! I have never seen someone do so well with a handgun so quickly. I was impressed!

Last note....my Makarov out shot everything else for me today....dang I love that gun. I had rapid fire groups at 25yds that were simply amazing.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:17:27 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/18/2004 7:17:54 PM EST by fight4yourrights]
It's like putting them in a 800 HP Camaro to learn to drive.


Doesn't make sense.


Maybe people think "give them an impressive gun" or "if they can handle this......"


I start people out easy - usually .22 LR, pistol or rifle
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:19:36 PM EST
I don't know why, but I'm with you. Giving a kid a big gun and then not understanding why they don't like to shoot seems to be a common occurance.

Remember the Alamo, and God Bless Texas...
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:24:35 PM EST
Some @$$holes think this is a right of passage for kids, but mostly it is just so the adults can have a sick laugh at little Johnny falling on his butt.

This is not a way to bring other youngsters into the shooting community.

And doing it to women, too. Why is this crap funny?

I don't think it is funny. I stop this BS when I see it.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:26:36 PM EST
Almost sounds like they didn't want their kid handling firearms and they were too damned lazy to teach him firearm safety. Otherwise it's stupid to make it that much of a negative experience.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:27:35 PM EST
BB gun. Air rifle. 22 caliber. That's the way to do it.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:28:58 PM EST
I'm a fan of introducing a kid to firearms with a .410.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:30:12 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/18/2004 7:31:33 PM EST by parshooter]

Originally Posted By guns762:
I just read the thread about the 12yr old that died from recoil of a .454.

What I can't understand is this. My student told me that his dad used to hand him a .44mag or some rifle, like a .30-06 when he was little and have him shoot it. Of course, he never wanted to shoot again. His father seemed to get enjoyment from seeing this happen. WTF?



Why didn't they "work their way up the caliber ladder", for the kid that was killed? That was my first thought. In addition to that, what fool would EVER let a 100lb kid shoot such a weapon?

Bottom line:
If you EVER take a newbie, and PARTICULARLY a newbie CHILD to shoot for their first time and hand them anything other than a .22,

YOU MIGHT BE A DUMBASS!

Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:30:31 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:31:12 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:37:17 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:38:55 PM EST
First gun I ever shot was my uncles 50 muzzle loader when I was 7 . My "father" put a heay charge in it and told me to shoot . It literaly knocked me on my ass . I didn't touch a gun again for five years . I didn't fire one for two more .

Than again this is the same fucker that taught me to swim by throwing me out of the boat and rowing for shore . "Life is tough son . You either succeed or you die ."

I swear to God the only lesson my father taught me was how not to raise my own children .
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:43:46 PM EST
Because they are idiots. My Dad never let me shoot his guns because he said they had too much 'kick'.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 7:58:38 PM EST
I am pretty sure the first gun I shot was a just a single pump BB gun, I liked it, but never really got too interested, and I had my own Taurus pump-action .22, but didn't know much about shooting or how to take care of it. I would go with my older brother to the shooting range sometimes, but the sound alone of his .30-06 kept me from ever really wanting to try anything bigger than a .22, and so for 8 years or so I was never interested in guns, then I went shooting with my cousin when I was 19 and shot his AR...and I was hooked.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 8:06:37 PM EST
Because they're damned idiots. Period.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 8:10:56 PM EST

Originally Posted By Kodiak-AK:

I swear to God the only lesson my father taught me was how not to raise my own children .




Thank God the Bombardier raised me.

I've met too many people my that can make honestly Kodiak's statement.

As for beating a kid up with recoil, They ought to make a 5 pound bolt action .50 BG and make asshole fathers shoot 200 rounds with it. Let dad see how funny it is.

I interceded one day at the range with a father and a lightweight '06 and 100 rounds.

Dad was wondering why the kid was all over the paper with the '06. I gave the kid my .22 and coached him back into the basics. With qa .22 the kid was a natural.

Dad asked why the little guy could shoot a .22 and not an '06.

DUH!!!!!!

I told dad to put he '06 away until the kid put on another 30 pounds.


Link Posted: 9/18/2004 8:18:51 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 8:26:47 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 8:29:04 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/18/2004 8:30:57 PM EST by 95thFoot]

Originally Posted By Ogre_4070:
Because they are idiots. My Dad never let me shoot his guns because he said they had too much 'kick'.



Well on the last part, at least for a kid anyway, he may have been right.

Anything above a .22 for a small kid is a lot to handle, and the sound and recoil of firing a big gun are frightening to a child, if they aren't ready for it. My middle son, 9, loves shooting my .62 cal flintlock, but only because I load it for him with a little charger made from a spent .45 shell. The gun, firing such a small load (20 grains?) goes "pop" and no recoil, but there is smoke, and he likes it, and, he hits the target at 10 to 25 yards. Of course, he really needs to shoot a small chipmunk or similar .22 rifle. Next thing on my gun shopping list....

My oldest, 12, shoots my AR regularly, probably more than I do. When I take him out shooting, it's usually him on the AR and me on a large musket or milsurp bolt action like a Lee-Enfield or a Mosin-Nagant. (bangbang bang bang BOOM bang bang bang bangbang bang BOOM......) He aced his Boy Scout riflery badge, and likes shooting. If his grades stayp up, I'll buy or give him a gun.

And yes, we all wear shooters' glasses (mine are prescription) and ear protection whenever we shoot.

Next project- get a pink .22 rifle for my 7year old daughter.....it's what she wants, or she won't go shooting. Hey, whatever works.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 8:55:05 PM EST
There was a twelve year old shooting a SOPMOD M4 at the AZ shoot I was at. his dad was somewhere else, I think standing back at a distance talking to someone. He was safe and efficient, and handled the auto bursts pretty well. He wasn't shooting the M203 though.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 9:04:46 PM EST
The same "over achieving" mentality regarding shooting and kids isn't unique to any one sport The same comparisons can be said for the football/hockey/soccer dad scrotes who try to push their kids beyond what
should reasonably be expected of them. I'm not saying we should be raising our kids to be a generation of pussies, but there is a limitaion and /or line where the parent(s) need to lay off and let the kids enjoy a sport rather than be turned-off or forced into it.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 9:09:24 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/18/2004 9:16:40 PM EST by yugosksfan]
The first gun I ever shot was my uncle's 12-gauge over and under with 3" Steel Shot Nitromags. When I pulled the trigger I tighened up and accidentally pulled the trigger again within a second. I landed 3 feet back on my butt. For most kids I guess that would make them dislike guns, but I thought that if that was the worst that could happen, then everything else would be a cake-walk.

ETA: I was 9 or 10 when this happened...
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 9:15:44 PM EST
Until I was 18 and able to buy my own firearms, I never shot. As much as I love guns my father never really took me out. I have horrible memories of sighting in my first 30.06...

I was 13. Remington 700 ADL with 4x Redfeild. My dad had a bench that was way to big for me at the time. I could hardly fit on the damn thing, not to mention it was uncomfortable. He made me shoot at the target I couldn't see without stretching out as far as possible. Forgot to add hes a very impatient person. By the time I was finally able to reach out far enough and actually get the damn thing somewhat on target, the poor bastard had me in tears as I squeezed the trigger and put the bullet through the bullseye...

As much as I hate to say it, I hate going shooting with him...but now I know my shit better than all, so I take everything he says, blow it right off my shoulder and do my own thing.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 9:21:28 PM EST
I remember being a kid and the first "gun" I shot was a 12 Ga. It knocked me on my ass and I dropped it in the mud and wound up cleaning the crap out of it (at the end of the day). Now, needless to say, I've respected every firearm that has ever come my way since.

That .454 was too much for both that boy and his family.. On the other hand, there are close to 300 million Americans here and some shit is bound to happen - I don't mean to diss anyone or sound cold, but.... OT out.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 9:33:50 PM EST
my wife's cousin and her 12 year old son came out from CT for a visit this spring. neither had ever shot before and naturally the mom was a little nervous. we started with the ak on a bipod, prone position. moved up to the CETME and the m1. they had a blast. we talked to them about a month ago the kid talked his dad into buying him a marlin .22 when they got back. and all three have gone to a gun safety/training class and really are enjoying themselves.

point is, if i had pulled out the .458 or .338 just for my own amusement they would never have taken an interest and the gun community wouldn't have 3 new members.

Link Posted: 9/18/2004 9:44:32 PM EST

Originally Posted By guns762:

I hear stories like this all the time about how some idiot lets his kid shoot a hard kicking gun for amusement. What in the hell are they thinking?




Just because someone was able to reproduce doesn't qualify them to be a Parent .
And it sure as hell doesnt remove the fact that they are an asshat
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 9:47:32 PM EST
I had a 12 year old shoot my dads .375 once. In all fairness, he weighs like 130 pounds and bothered me till I let him. Shot up all the ammo I brought too.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 10:25:55 PM EST
My uncle and dad did that to me. It was years ago so I can't tell you what kind of gun it was, but they gave me a gun that just about knocked me to the ground when I fired it. They then got a great laugh along with a few of my male cousins. I then got this guns are for boys thing in my head. Looking back I think that is exactly what they wanted me to get out of the experience. I come from an old fashioned family. I am only 24 and am already the only woman in the family to go to college. Women in my family cook, work in secretarial or nursing, and have kids. They don't say certain things, and they do not decorate the house, or serve a meal not approved by the husband. Ugh.
Link Posted: 9/18/2004 11:24:30 PM EST
that kids father is an idiot for letting his kid shoot a 454. First gun I ever shot was a 22 when I was ten, it was fun and had lots of adult supervision. First time I went hunting was a differrent story got to use my granpa's old 12 ga. fox double barrel. both him and my dad said it kicked like a Missouri mule. hard plastic recoil pad . it wasnt to bad to shoot my mossburg feels lick it has more kick than it . on the other hand took my nephewwho was 9 at the time to a turkey shoot a couple of years ago he kept pestering me to shoot kid has never shot before and I only had the 12 ga. with me . had to teach him to hold it properly first had him kneel down and use the rail to help him . He got knocked on his behind he laughed so did every one else but he wanted to do it again so i let him with me standing right behind him so he wouldnt get knocked over. the kid did good almost beat a guy who had been shooting for years. now he wants to go when ever I go to the turkey shoots or even hunting. of course his mother wont let him carry a gun hunting yet. so he goes for the walk and enjoyment with me
Link Posted: 9/19/2004 11:28:04 AM EST
a kid died from recoil? Link?
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