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Posted: 6/5/2008 10:39:53 AM EST
How, why, and when did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:40:35 AM EST
because it didn't work.
~Dg84
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:41:24 AM EST
1933 maybe?
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:41:55 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeVGunner:
How, why, and when did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?


Plenty of people enjoy alcohol and never have any issues with it. Personal accountability - this country needs more of it.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:42:27 AM EST
It ended like it came to be... congress passed an amendment and states ratified it.
It ended in 1933, perhaps in part due to the great depression.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:42:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeVGunner:
How, why, and when did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?


The negative social consequences of prohibition far outweighed the mere consequences of personal freedom and included but were not limited to:

Rise in organized crime.
Criminalization of law abiding citizens.
NASCAR.
Loss of personal freedoms.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:43:00 AM EST
People needed booze to get through the Great Depression. Those were depressing days
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:43:25 AM EST
Because this is the United States and we have freedoms.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:44:36 AM EST

Originally Posted By doorgunner84:
because it didn't work.
~Dg84


It still isn't unless you're part of a LE agency profiting from it.


I will gander that when BHO becomes POTUS, the War on Drugs will be over.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:44:55 AM EST
Prohibition gave us the Mafia, gangland warfare, the NFA and the Kennedy political family, while increasing the number of people abusing alcohol. Good riddance.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:46:19 AM EST
The core problem with it was that most people either wanted to drink alcohol themselves or did not care if other people did. It ran against a large majority of the population. No restrictive law can stand up to that.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:46:36 AM EST
Wikipedia has a good entry on a "why":


Many social problems have been attributed to the Prohibition era. A profitable, often violent, black market for alcohol flourished. Racketeering happened when powerful gangs corrupted law enforcement agencies. Stronger liquor surged in popularity because its potency made it more profitable to smuggle. The cost of enforcing Prohibition was high, and the lack of tax revenues on alcohol (some $500 million annually nationwide) affected government coffers. When repeal of Prohibition occurred in 1933, organized crime lost nearly all of its black market alcohol profits in most states (states still had the right to enforce their own laws concerning alcohol consumption), because of competition with low-priced alcohol sales at legal liquor stores.


Gee, what else resembles the above? Hmmm...
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:46:55 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/5/2008 10:47:12 AM EST by Frank_The_Tank]
Because it was predicted that the greatest drunk (Ted Kennedy) in the senate would someday become legally able to drink.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:47:41 AM EST

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:

Originally Posted By HeVGunner:
How, why, and when did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?


The negative social consequences of prohibition far outweighed the mere consequences of personal freedom and included but were not limited to:

Rise in organized crime.
Criminalization of law abiding citizens.
NASCAR.
Loss of personal freedoms.


The WOD is responsible for the same things and for the same reasons. Except for NASCAR.

If prohibition was enacted in the 60's or 70's, it would still be going strong, and the black market violence and mayhem would be tenfold.

People will always seek out a form of altered conciousness. There aren't anywhere near enough prison cells to put them all away.. But, instead of adjusting policy, .gov shits on more and more of your rights, and spends more and more of your hard earned dollars.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:49:19 AM EST
Does this really need to be explained?

Are you writing a paper and just want us to do all the work?


It ended because beer is good!
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:49:31 AM EST

Originally Posted By Gravity_Tester:

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:

Originally Posted By HeVGunner:
How, why, and when did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?


The negative social consequences of prohibition far outweighed the mere consequences of personal freedom and included but were not limited to:

Rise in organized crime.
Criminalization of law abiding citizens.
NASCAR.
Loss of personal freedoms.


The WOD is responsible for the same things and for the same reasons. Except for NASCAR.
If prohibition was enacted in the 60's or 70's, it would still be going strong, and the black market violence and mayhem would be tenfold.

People will always seek out a form of altered conciousness. There aren't anywhere near enough prison cells to put them all away.. But, instead of adjusting policy, .gov shits on more and more of your rights, and spends more and more of your hard earned dollars.


Rap
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:50:26 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeVGunner:
How, why, and when did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?
Seriously, do you really think negative social consequences should be the litmus test for our freedoms. Wasn't there a Stallone movie about that?

In fact, we should really look into legalization of many other drugs. There has been a war on drugs for as long as I can remember (I'm 37), and they are as accessable as ever. The pro drug war people cry 'more money, bigger penalties, etc...', but those clearly are "The beatings will continue until morale improves" types of solutions.

The war on drugs is one of the largest factors in the downfall of the Republican party.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:51:24 AM EST
In the United States, the term Prohibition refers to the period 1920 to 1933, during which the sale, manufacture, and transportation of alcohol for consumption were banned nationally as mandated in the Eighteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution. Prohibition of alcohol can also refer to the antecedent religious and political temperance movements calling for sumptuary laws to end or encumber alcohol use.

Following significant pressure on lawmakers as a result of the temperance movement, the United States Senate passed the Eighteenth Amendment on December 18, 1917. The "Volstead Act," the popular name for the National Prohibition Act, passed Congress over President Woodrow Wilson's veto on October 28, 1919 and established the legal definition of intoxicating liquor as well as providing for enforcement of Prohibition. The 18th Amendment was certified as ratified on January 29, 1919, having been approved by 36 states, and went into effect on a Federal level on January 29, 1920. Some state legislatures had already enacted statewide prohibition prior to the ratification of the Eighteenth Amendment.

As Prohibition became increasingly unpopular during the Great Depression, especially in large cities, Repeal was eagerly anticipated. On March 23, 1933, President Franklin Roosevelt signed into law an amendment to the Volstead Act known as the Cullen-Harrison Act, allowing the manufacture and sale of certain kinds of alcoholic beverages. The Eighteenth Amendment was repealed with ratification of the Twenty-first Amendment, on December 5, 1933.

The prohibition or dry movement began in the 1840s, spearheaded by pietistic religious denominations, especially the Methodists. The late 1800s saw the temperance movement broaden its focus from abstinence to all behavior and institutions related to alcohol consumption. Preachers such as Reverend Mark A. Matthews linked liquor-dispensing saloons with prostitution.

Some successes were registered in the 1850s, including Maine's total ban on the manufacture and sale of liquor, adopted in 1851. However, the movement soon lost strength, and prohibition was not a major political issue during the American Civil War (1861-1865). It revived in the 1880s, with the Woman's Christian Temperance Union and the Prohibition Party.

After the war, the Women's Christian Temperance Union was founded in 1873. The organization did not promote moderation or temperance but rather prohibition. One of its methods to achieve that goal was education. It was believed that if it could "get to the children" it could create a dry sentiment leading to prohibition. As it turned out, nationwide Prohibition was enacted (by the 18th Amendment) before nationwide women's suffrage was (by the 19th Amendment).


"Who does not love wine wife and song, will be a fool for his lifelong!" — a vigorous 1873 assertion of cultural values of German-American immigrants.In 1881, Kansas became the first state to outlaw alcoholic beverages in its Constitution, with Carrie Nation gaining notoriety for enforcing the provision herself by walking into saloons, scolding customers, and using her hatchet to destroy bottles of liquor. Nation recruited ladies as The Carry Nation Prohibition Group which Nation also led. Other activists enforced the cause by entering saloons, singing, praying, and urging saloon keepers to stop selling alcohol. Many other states, especially in the South, also enacted prohibition, along with many individual counties. Hostility to saloons and their political influence was characteristic of the Progressive Era. Supported by the anti-German mood of World War I, the Anti-Saloon League, through intense lobbying, pushed the Constitutional amendment through Congress and the states, and it went into effect in 1920.

Prohibition was an important force in state and local politics from the 1840s through the 1930s. The political forces involved were ethnoreligious in character, as demonstrated by numerous historical studies. Prohibition was demanded by the "dries" -- primarily pietistic Protestant denominations, especially the Methodists, Northern Baptists, Southern Baptists, Presbyterians, Disciples, Congregationalists, Quakers, and Scandinavian Lutherans. They identified saloons as politically corrupt and drinking as a personal sin. They were opposed by the "wets" -- primarily liturgical Protestants (Episcopalians, German Lutherans) and Roman Catholics, who denounced the idea that the government should define morality. Even in the wet stronghold of New York City there was an active prohibition movement, led by Norwegian church groups and African-American labor activists who believed that Prohibition would benefit workers, especially African-Americans. Tea merchants and soda fountain manufacturers generally supported Prohibition, thinking a ban on alcohol would increase sales of their products.

Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:51:43 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/5/2008 11:05:59 AM EST by Hiwathl]
Joe Kennedy was making Moolah off something that was Illegal at the time


*edited for clarity
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:53:13 AM EST

Originally Posted By Hiwathl:
Jack Kennedy was making Moolah off something that was Illegal at the time



Joe, not Jack
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:56:18 AM EST
So the goberment could make tax money
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 10:57:37 AM EST
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 11:13:30 AM EST

Originally Posted By Troy:

Originally Posted By HeVGunner:
How, why, and when did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?


Because (just as with illegal drugs today), the effects of Prohibition were FAR worse than the problems were before.

Before Prohibition, some people drank. Some were even drunks, and a percentage of those were violent. During and following Prohibition, NONE OF THAT CHANGED SIGNIFICANTLY.

What DID change is that far MORE people started drinking BECAUSE it was illegal. People are always curious about things that are banned, and there is a ton of evidence from all sides that drinking increased overall and that people who likely would never have drank before Prohibition started drinking regularly because it was "fun".

Also, along with the utter failure to prevent or even slow drinking, Prohibition introduced the following HUGE problems:

- People who drank illegally (because they recognized that Prohibition was a stupid law) generally lost faith in the law entirely. It created a rift between the police and citizens, and a general disrespect for many aspects of the law among the generally law-abiding.

- All of the money made by criminals who came in to meet the demand for illegal alcohol lead to unprecidented amounts of corruption at all levels of government. Bribes and pay-offs were everywhere, with entire police departments, and judicial branches taking bribes to look the other way, first for alcohol-related crimes, then for an ever-expanding network of related crimes, as the money fueled the expansion of the criminal empires.

- There was a big increase in violence between criminal organizations (which often caused collateral damage among civilians), violence towards merchants forced into "protection" rackets, and among anyone who had any peripheral involvement in any of the enterprises that were being taken over by the criminals.

So, Prohibition failed utterly at its goal of reducing alcohol consumption (and behaviors related to excessive alcohol consumption, such as domestic violence), while enabling massive criminal organizations and turning the public away from their previous support of the law.

And after almost 40 years of "Drug Prohibition", and hundreds of billions of dollars spent trying to enforce it, all of the same things are true. More people than ever use drugs, they are more widely available, they are more potent, and they have enabled a huge amount of corruption, violence, and apathy towards the law.

-Troy




Winner.


Well said.


CMOS
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 11:14:44 AM EST
Because people finally grew some balls told women to STFU!
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 11:15:03 AM EST

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:

Originally Posted By HeVGunner:
How, why, and when did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?


The negative social consequences of prohibition far outweighed the mere consequences of personal freedom and included but were not limited to:

Rise in organized crime.
Criminalization of law abiding citizens.
NASCAR.
Loss of personal freedoms.


Don't forget the Kennedy clan.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 11:20:28 AM EST
Basicly, people can make it easily.

A lot of people still were drinking,

And all prohibition did was make the mob rich.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 11:22:46 AM EST
Prohibition also changed what Americans tended to drink. Before prohibition most drinkers preferred beer and wine.

During prohibition it was "easier" to smuggle hard alcohol, and consumption of that went up significantly.

After prohibition the popularity of hard alcohol was established and people were loath to give up their cocktails.

Prohibition put a real dent in our wine industry. Wine consumption took decades to recover. Wine has continued to rise (for various social and "health" reasons) and hard alcohol may finally be on the decline. I don't have one shred of proof (pun) of that, however.

Cocktails, anyone?

Bottom line? Prohibition was a dismal failure.

Link Posted: 6/5/2008 11:38:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By Cheesebeast:
Prohibition also changed what Americans tended to drink. Before prohibition most drinkers preferred beer and wine.

During prohibition it was "easier" to smuggle hard alcohol, and consumption of that went up significantly.

After prohibition the popularity of hard alcohol was established and people were loath to give up their cocktails.

Prohibition put a real dent in our wine industry. Wine consumption took decades to recover. Wine has continued to rise (for various social and "health" reasons) and hard alcohol may finally be on the decline. I don't have one shred of proof (pun) of that, however.

Cocktails, anyone?

Bottom line? Prohibition was a dismal failure.



and what is ironic is most of the cocktails were invented to cover the flavor the the cheap booze
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 11:42:33 AM EST
Nothing in it for the .gov.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 11:43:46 AM EST
Because they realized it was beer-thirty.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 11:50:08 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/5/2008 11:51:19 AM EST by DLoken]

Originally Posted By HeVGunner:
How, why, and when did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?


Do you live in Utah or Saudi Arabia? See Chicago & Al Capone.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 11:50:43 AM EST
Alcohol is a helluva drug.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 11:53:17 AM EST

Originally Posted By patriot73:

Originally Posted By doorgunner84:
because it didn't work.
~Dg84


It still isn't unless you're part of a LE agency profiting from it.


I will gander that when BHO becomes POTUS, the War on Drugs will be over.


Do you really think so? Holy Shit. I just had a positive though re: BHO POTUS.

What does that mean?

I am confused.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 12:02:21 PM EST

Originally Posted By patriot73:
I will gander that when BHO becomes POTUS, the War on Drugs will be over.


Don't be so sure, the democrats are the ones behind Byrne grants.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 12:17:00 PM EST
Because people who hate booze are smarter than people who hate drugs.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 12:41:59 PM EST
My understand was that prohibition ended in no small part due to civic action in the jury box (which is to say jury nullification.)
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:12:19 PM EST

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:

Originally Posted By HeVGunner:
How, why, and when did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?


The negative social consequences of prohibition far outweighed the mere consequences of personal freedom and included but were not limited to:

Rise in organized crime.
Criminalization of law abiding citizens.
NASCAR.
Loss of personal freedoms.

+1
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:19:22 PM EST

Originally Posted By Gravity_Tester:

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:

Originally Posted By HeVGunner:
How, why, and when did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?


The negative social consequences of prohibition far outweighed the mere consequences of personal freedom and included but were not limited to:

Rise in organized crime.
Criminalization of law abiding citizens.
NASCAR.
Loss of personal freedoms.


The WOD is responsible for the same things and for the same reasons. Except for NASCAR.

If prohibition was enacted in the 60's or 70's, it would still be going strong, and the black market violence and mayhem would be tenfold.

People will always seek out a form of altered conciousness. There aren't anywhere near enough prison cells to put them all away.. But, instead of adjusting policy, .gov shits on more and more of your rights, and spends more and more of your hard earned dollars.



The current prohibition needs to go to.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:23:42 PM EST

Originally Posted By Troubl3shooter:

Originally Posted By patriot73:
I will gander that when BHO becomes POTUS, the War on Drugs will be over.


Don't be so sure, the democrats are the ones behind Byrne grants.



They will just make anti-depressents over the counter instead to keep us passified.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:25:53 PM EST

Originally Posted By HeVGunner:
... why, ....hen did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?


Popular opinion. Popular opinion has shaped the laws in this country. Enough people were pissed that it was prohibited, so it was made legal again. Enough people made a fuss about pot that it became illegal. Enough people made a fuss about teh gey marriage that states had marriage ammendments against it.... Other states are trying to allow teh gey marriage... Enough people made a fuss about EBRs and the 1994 Ban came about.... Same shit different day. Unless enough people get pissed and make a fuss against all of this gun grabbing, we are in trouble.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:26:27 PM EST
IMCO (in my cynical opinion) the Fed saw it as a means to a tax: they saw the gumbas and other runners making booku bucks. Uncle Sam wanted a piece of it.

Just like everything else.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:27:11 PM EST
b/c of the subsequent failure, violence, and such
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:30:13 PM EST
Because it pissed off the right people in the right places who had power... And best served the interest of others with power... The result was a synergistic movement to repeal it.


What, you actually think the fact that average Joe American didn't like it means shit? Or the fact it didn't work? Naivety.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:31:33 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/5/2008 1:34:46 PM EST by thedoctors308]
Because drinking alcohol is an ingrained portion of our culture, and as such it was almost impossible to enforce.

Now, I have only read the original post.
I'm curious as to see how many posts it takes until someone tries to say "this is why we need to legalize drugs mannn!"

ETA: Well, we had some pro-legalization posts, but not many pro-drug posts.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:35:19 PM EST

Originally Posted By Troy:

Originally Posted By HeVGunner:
How, why, and when did the prohbition of alcohol end? With all the negative social consequences of alcohol, why isn't it still illegal?


Because (just as with illegal drugs today), the effects of Prohibition were FAR worse than the problems were before.

Before Prohibition, some people drank. Some were even drunks, and a percentage of those were violent. During and following Prohibition, NONE OF THAT CHANGED SIGNIFICANTLY.

What DID change is that far MORE people started drinking BECAUSE it was illegal. People are always curious about things that are banned, and there is a ton of evidence from all sides that drinking increased overall and that people who likely would never have drank before Prohibition started drinking regularly because it was "fun".

Also, along with the utter failure to prevent or even slow drinking, Prohibition introduced the following HUGE problems:

- People who drank illegally (because they recognized that Prohibition was a stupid law) generally lost faith in the law entirely. It created a rift between the police and citizens, and a general disrespect for many aspects of the law among the generally law-abiding.

- All of the money made by criminals who came in to meet the demand for illegal alcohol lead to unprecidented amounts of corruption at all levels of government. Bribes and pay-offs were everywhere, with entire police departments, and judicial branches taking bribes to look the other way, first for alcohol-related crimes, then for an ever-expanding network of related crimes, as the money fueled the expansion of the criminal empires.

- There was a big increase in violence between criminal organizations (which often caused collateral damage among civilians), violence towards merchants forced into "protection" rackets, and among anyone who had any peripheral involvement in any of the enterprises that were being taken over by the criminals.

So, Prohibition failed utterly at its goal of reducing alcohol consumption (and behaviors related to excessive alcohol consumption, such as domestic violence), while enabling massive criminal organizations and turning the public away from their previous support of the law.

And after almost 40 years of "Drug Prohibition", and hundreds of billions of dollars spent trying to enforce it, all of the same things are true. More people than ever use drugs, they are more widely available, they are more potent, and they have enabled a huge amount of corruption, violence, and apathy towards the law.

-Troy


An excellent summary. I would add that "rotgut" liquor cooked up improperly also became a huge problem in this country, somewhat similarly to what we see today in Russia with the illegally produced vodka market there. People died or were seriously injured due to poor quality control and a lack of accountability on the part of illegal distillers. This problem continues here to this day, albeit to a far lesser degree, in the moonshine trade.

There are also lots of parallels to the war on drugs today, but one must remember that even the legalization of alcohol after years of prohibition didn't break the back of the organized crime syndicates that ran illegal booze. They had their nest egg and just moved on to other more lucrative trades like loan sharking, protection rackets, illegal gambling, etc.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:41:17 PM EST
Depression= lost income tax revenue for the .gov

Repeal prohibition= new source of revenue for the .gov
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:41:31 PM EST

Originally Posted By patriot73:
I will gander that when BHO becomes POTUS, the War on Drugs will be over.


Now that's CHANGE that can be appreciated.

The WOD only exists at this time because the current government does not want to admit that they're wrong or give up power. The effect of that is billions of our tax dollars wasted and a uncountable death toll.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:48:58 PM EST
Other than the hippie movement of the 60's, Prohibition did more for the loss of respect of authority than anything else. People resented police for taking away their alcohol. The police themselves were heavily involved in it too, so people didn't trust them. My great-grandfather was a police officer on Long Island during Prohibition. He got a call one Monday morning telling him not to go to work that day. The reason was that some other cops were going to receive a shipment of alcohol for themselves. They knew he wouldn't stand for it so they didn't want to have to shoot him.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:52:29 PM EST
Basically prohibition does not work.
Any outright ban or prohibition on a product creates a black market. This creates more problems.
Best example is illicit and illegal drugs. Many people get rich off the fact they are illegal. The U.S. Government spends billions combating it. Yet, those who want drugs get them. Not only drugs but other illegal items.
If someone wants it they will get it. Simple economics of supply and demand.
It's what will happen if they outlaw guns. As long as there is a demand, there will be a supplier.

Simply, it didn't work and the guberment could not enforce it.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:55:05 PM EST

Originally Posted By avenger44:
Basically prohibition does not work.
Any outright ban or prohibition on a product creates a black market. This creates more problems.


Then why aren't there nuclear bombs floating around on the US black market?

Ah: Because yes, Virginia, controls can sometimes work... Not foolproof... And not forever... But they can function.

And sometimes the other alternative is worse.

Alcohol isn't that way, however.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 1:55:49 PM EST
Even Jesus drank wine.....

Using the Constitution to enforce Prohibition was a profound act of stupidity.
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