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Posted: 7/1/2012 7:39:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/1/2012 7:51:28 AM EDT by SoonerBorn]
A motorcycle is traveling at 100 mph down a road with a speed limit of 55 mph.  A SUV turns left in front of the motorcycle causing a collision.  Who is at fault in this scenario?



Edit:  To clarify, when turning left, I mean the SUV was heading in the opposite direction and was turning left off of the highway.












 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:40:56 AM EDT



Originally Posted By SoonerBorn:


A motorcycle is traveling at 100 mph down a road with a speed limit of 55 mph.  A SUV turns left in front of the motorcycle causing a collision.  Who is at fault in this scenario?





I would say the SUV



Not condoning the speeding of the motorcycle.





 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:41:13 AM EDT
A liberal would tell you that it's Bush's fault.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:41:39 AM EDT



Originally Posted By SoonerBorn:


A motorcycle is traveling at 100 mph down a road with a speed limit of 55 mph.  A SUV turns left in front of the motorcycle causing a collision.  Who is at fault in this scenario?







I would say that even though the bike was speeding, the SUV is at fault for failing to yield to the right of way.



<––––  NOT a LEO



 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:41:43 AM EDT
the turning vehicle is at fault
 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:42:06 AM EDT



Originally Posted By Chokey:


the turning vehicle is at fault  






 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:42:10 AM EDT



Originally Posted By Chokey:


the turning vehicle is at fault  






 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:42:41 AM EDT
you'd think it'd be the one breaking the law who's at fault
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:43:52 AM EDT
Motorcycle.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:44:30 AM EDT
Was it an illegal turn?
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:45:18 AM EDT
Illegal speed caused the accident.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:45:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/1/2012 5:17:04 PM EDT by mkboog]
If there is a collision at a left turn, unless the person ran a red light, it will always usually be the fault of the person turning. If by left you meant a lane change, then it would be the fault of the motorcyclist. Also, if you are ever at a intersection and the person that as the right away waves you on, DO NOT DO IT. If they then go and hit you it will be your fault.

 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:45:36 AM EDT
How is the SUV supposed to be able to tell when it is safe to turn if someone is doing almost twice the speed limit?

Was it a perfectly straight and flat road and the motorcycle had his headlight on even though it was a noon and not a cloud in the sky?

I live at the top of a hill. I get people flying down my street doing 40+ and the speed limit is 25. Sometimes the timing is just right that I don't manage to see them as I'm pulling out of my driveway. They also can't see the road when I'm stopped and backing into my my driveway. They get pissy in both instances
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:45:40 AM EDT
Not enough information. Did the SUV turn red when it had a green light and the bike didn't? Was there a blind curve or a hill?

If you meant that the car just whipped out a left turn across the path of oncoming traffic, then the car is at fault even though the motorcycle was speeding.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:49:23 AM EDT
A liberal would say "It was nobody's fault, but we should reduce the speed limit on that road to 35 mph."

Of course, they would also want to know the race of the motorcyclist and the MV driver, and open an official investigation into whether or not either party had sufficient opportunity to become "as proficient as their own potential permitted" in the operation of their respective vehicle, or if a lack of (free) government programs prevented this.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:49:33 AM EDT
With the information given, the turning vehicle is at fault.  There is not really enough to state this 100% though, as the scenario doesn't detail whether there are vision obscurements for the SUV which would render the motorcycle invisible at the start of the turn (e.g., the SUV sees clear road to a nearby bend of the highway and turns, but the motorcycle then swings around the bend and hits the SUV––-had the MC been doing something close to the speed limit it would have come into view with plenty of time for the SUV to complete the turn, but since it was going 2X the limit, the SUV driver doesn't have enough time.)
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:51:04 AM EDT



Originally Posted By Ndenway:


you'd think it'd be the one breaking the law who's at fault
Not how it works. Trust me, since my wife started working as an auto insurance adjuster at USAA, (well she has been promoted to subrigation and now 1st part injury since then), I have learned that outcomes to many situation are not what you would think.



 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:52:00 AM EDT
Motorcycle

 The driver of the car has less chance of seeing the bike at that speed.
Motorcyclist broke the law first.
  Just my opinion.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:52:19 AM EDT
i'd give it to the asshat biker.. who say's the bike is even visibly seen from the suv..
any small dips in the road? slight bend? sun location?  too many variables..
100 + leaves a short amount of time for choices to be made..

now a plain flat road, a highly visibly and seen bike that is close to the intersection and not a mile down the road..  for which the suv just guns it at that point.. then yeah the suv better be held accountable..
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:52:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/1/2012 7:53:35 AM EDT by Strongbow]
Suicycle.

The SUV driver, when checking clearances, sees the 2-wheeler at a safe separation, assuming reasonable speed of the bike.  It would be difficult to ascertain the excessive speed in the quick glance associated with a clearing check.  

Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:53:12 AM EDT



Originally Posted By scotchymcdrinkerbean:


With the information given, the turning vehicle is at fault.  There is not really enough to state this 100% though, as the scenario doesn't detail whether there are vision obscurements for the SUV which would render the motorcycle invisible at the start of the turn (e.g., the SUV sees clear road to a nearby bend of the highway and turns, but the motorcycle then swings around the bend and hits the SUV––-had the MC been doing something close to the speed limit it would have come into view with plenty of time for the SUV to complete the turn, but since it was going 2X the limit, the SUV driver doesn't have enough time.)


Does not matter unfortunately.



 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:53:13 AM EDT
What color was the motorcycle?
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:53:54 AM EDT
Probably the motorcycle.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:56:14 AM EDT
Originally Posted By WrenchBender:

Originally Posted By SoonerBorn:
A motorcycle is traveling at 100 mph down a road with a speed limit of 55 mph.  A SUV turns left in front of the motorcycle causing a collision.  Who is at fault in this scenario?



I would say that even though the bike was speeding, the SUV is at fault for failing to yield to the right of way.

<––––  NOT a LEO
 


In this state traveling in excess of the posted speed means you forfeit right of way.


46.2-823. Unlawful speed forfeits right-of-way.

The driver of any vehicle traveling at an unlawful speed shall forfeit any right-of-way which he might otherwise have under this article.

Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:56:38 AM EDT
Lots of missing facts . . . . . But that's normal in questions like this.

No one expects that someone would be doing twice the speed limit, so if you are looking to see if you have the time/room, it would be normal to expect you have x amount of time to make the turn.  The suv probably would have made the turn just fine if the other guy had not been speeding

If you are DUI and are involed in a accident NO MATTER what the DUI guy is found at fault.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:57:12 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/1/2012 7:58:06 AM EDT by Chokey]





Originally Posted By pilotman:





Originally Posted By WrenchBender:
Originally Posted By SoonerBorn:


A motorcycle is traveling at 100 mph down a road with a speed limit of 55 mph.  A SUV turns left in front of the motorcycle causing a collision.  Who is at fault in this scenario?












I would say that even though the bike was speeding, the SUV is at fault for failing to yield to the right of way.





<––––  NOT a LEO


 






In this state traveling in excess of the posted speed means you forfeit right of way.
46.2-823. Unlawful speed forfeits right-of-way.





The driver of any vehicle traveling at an unlawful speed shall forfeit any right-of-way which he might otherwise have under this article.






can you prove he was speeding? probably not, but you can prove that the SUV turned in front of the motorcycle





 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:57:26 AM EDT
I would say the SUV is at fault. But it's entirely possible the SUV driver saw the motorcycle and deemed there was enough room to safely turn since he couldn't tell the motorcycle was going 100mph from just a quick glance.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:57:34 AM EDT
The accident would be the fault of the person who made the left turn in front of the motorcycle.

The left turn person would get a ticket for failure to yield to traffic.
The motorcyclist would be cited for speeding and probably reckless driving.

The insurance companies would fight it out for years.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:58:11 AM EDT



Originally Posted By rudinater:


Lots of missing facts . . . . . But that's normal in questions like this.



No one expects that someone would be doing twice the speed limit, so if you are looking to see if you have the time/room, it would be normal to expect you have x amount of time to make the turn.  The suv probably would have made the turn just fine if the other guy had not been speeding



If you are DUI and are involed in a accident NO MATTER what the DUI guy is found at fault.


Nope. Not true. Not in most states.



 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:58:47 AM EDT
i would say the SUV UNLESS the motorcycles speed made it impossible to see him, IE blind curve
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:59:14 AM EDT



Originally Posted By KA3B:


The accident would be the fault of the person who made the left turn in front of the motorcycle.



The left turn person would get a ticket for failure to yield to traffic.

The motorcyclist would be cited for speeding and probably reckless driving dead.



The insurance companies would fight it out for years.


I responded to an accident almost just like this when I was a volunteer.

The motorcycle wasnt quite going 100 MPH but was dead about 300 feet down the road.



 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 7:59:53 AM EDT
Insufficient information:  Which vehicle was on a treadmill?
While the rule-of-thumb is that left-turners are at fault, causation most likely lies with the speed.  The distance between the SUV and the motorcycle would likely have been sufficient to avoid a collision had the motorcyclist been driving closer to the speed limit.  Both parties' reaction times were reduced to ineffective spans by the motorcyclist traveling at closer to double than not the speed other drivers would reasonably expect him to be at.


 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:00:57 AM EDT
Going that much over the posted speed is 'reckless operation' all bets are off. The SUV driver could not have made an appropriate distance estimation if they assumed the cyclist was traveling at posted speed.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:02:03 AM EDT
Since the motorcycle rider is probably killed in this scenario, I'd blame him!
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:02:32 AM EDT



Originally Posted By VRMN8R:





Originally Posted By KA3B:

The accident would be the fault of the person who made the left turn in front of the motorcycle.



The left turn person would get a ticket for failure to yield to traffic.

The motorcyclist would be cited for speeding and probably reckless driving dead.



The insurance companies would fight it out for years.


I responded to an accident almost just like this when I was a volunteer.

The motorcycle wasnt quite going 100 MPH but was dead about 300 feet down the road.

 


Yeah, there was a local accident last night which prompted my question.  The collision killed both the driver and the person on the passenger side of the vehicle.

 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:03:14 AM EDT



Originally Posted By SoonerBorn:





Originally Posted By VRMN8R:




Originally Posted By KA3B:

The accident would be the fault of the person who made the left turn in front of the motorcycle.



The left turn person would get a ticket for failure to yield to traffic.

The motorcyclist would be cited for speeding and probably reckless driving dead.



The insurance companies would fight it out for years.


I responded to an accident almost just like this when I was a volunteer.

The motorcycle wasnt quite going 100 MPH but was dead about 300 feet down the road.

 


Yeah, there was a local accident last night which prompted my question.  The collision killed both the driver and the person on the passenger side of the vehicle.  
Both were DRT at the accident I went to.





 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:04:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Chokey:

Originally Posted By pilotman:
Originally Posted By WrenchBender:

Originally Posted By SoonerBorn:
A motorcycle is traveling at 100 mph down a road with a speed limit of 55 mph.  A SUV turns left in front of the motorcycle causing a collision.  Who is at fault in this scenario?



I would say that even though the bike was speeding, the SUV is at fault for failing to yield to the right of way.

<––––  NOT a LEO
 


In this state traveling in excess of the posted speed means you forfeit right of way.


46.2-823. Unlawful speed forfeits right-of-way.

The driver of any vehicle traveling at an unlawful speed shall forfeit any right-of-way which he might otherwise have under this article.


can you prove he was speeding? probably not, but you can prove that the SUV turned in front of the motorcycle
 

phyhsics n shit

guess you could hook the pipes up to a test engine and see how loud they were too
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:04:57 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Chokey:

Originally Posted By pilotman:
Originally Posted By WrenchBender:

Originally Posted By SoonerBorn:
A motorcycle is traveling at 100 mph down a road with a speed limit of 55 mph.  A SUV turns left in front of the motorcycle causing a collision.  Who is at fault in this scenario?



I would say that even though the bike was speeding, the SUV is at fault for failing to yield to the right of way.

<––––  NOT a LEO
 


In this state traveling in excess of the posted speed means you forfeit right of way.


46.2-823. Unlawful speed forfeits right-of-way.

The driver of any vehicle traveling at an unlawful speed shall forfeit any right-of-way which he might otherwise have under this article.


can you prove he was speeding? probably not, but you can prove that the SUV turned in front of the motorcycle
 


I'd think 600+ lbs traveling 100 MPH leaves a dent of a different size than that same 600+ lbs traveling 55. Location of the body would probably be different too
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:06:21 AM EDT
The motorcyclist because at 100mph he outran the sound of his pipes.  Any driver making a turn into or across traffic has to judge the speed distance etc to be able to safely make turn. An excessively speeding vehicle makes this much more difficult.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:13:18 AM EDT
Stupid motorcyclist.  I say stupid because doing 100 mph on public roads is fucking stupid.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:13:30 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 556therapy:
The motorcyclist because at 100mph he outran the sound of his pipes.  Any driver making a turn into or across traffic has to judge the speed distance etc to be able to safely make turn. An excessively speeding vehicle makes this much more difficult.


100 mph is supersonic now?

Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:14:11 AM EDT
Bike...  Once you're up to 100mph, you're on your own. I find people have very shitty judgement of your approaching speed even when you are doing the limit.

Turning driver most likely saw the bike way in the distance and thought he had plenty of room/time to make his turn.

How was he supposed to know the bike was going warp factor one?
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:14:56 AM EDT


James Dean.


Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:15:31 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Shooter62:
Motorcycle

 The driver of the car has less chance of seeing the bike at that speed.
Motorcyclist broke the law first.
  Just my opinion.


Yep, no driver is expected to take into account somebody going 100mph. They would not even be in the zone you are scanning to judge if you are clear to turn.

Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:15:54 AM EDT



Originally Posted By 556therapy:


The motorcyclist because at 100mph he outran the sound of his pipes.  Any driver making a turn into or across traffic has to judge the speed distance etc to be able to safely make turn. An excessively speeding vehicle makes this much more difficult.


So 100 MPH is Mach 1?



 
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:15:58 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Strongbow:
Suicycle.

The SUV driver, when checking clearances, sees the 2-wheeler at a safe separation, assuming reasonable speed of the bike.  It would be difficult to ascertain the excessive speed in the quick glance associated with a clearing check.  



The rider would be an idiot in that situation, but you're not supposed to take a quick glance and then enter traffic. You are supposed to look so that you can see what is there.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:17:14 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Chokey:

Originally Posted By pilotman:
Originally Posted By WrenchBender:

Originally Posted By SoonerBorn:
A motorcycle is traveling at 100 mph down a road with a speed limit of 55 mph.  A SUV turns left in front of the motorcycle causing a collision.  Who is at fault in this scenario?



I would say that even though the bike was speeding, the SUV is at fault for failing to yield to the right of way.

<––––  NOT a LEO
 


In this state traveling in excess of the posted speed means you forfeit right of way.


46.2-823. Unlawful speed forfeits right-of-way.

The driver of any vehicle traveling at an unlawful speed shall forfeit any right-of-way which he might otherwise have under this article.


can you prove he was speeding? probably not, but you can prove that the SUV turned in front of the motorcycle
 


Of course they can. Science, how does it work?
They either measure the skid marks or you can tell from how big the dent is.

Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:17:18 AM EDT
Originally Posted By mkboog:

Originally Posted By 556therapy:
The motorcyclist because at 100mph he outran the sound of his pipes.  Any driver making a turn into or across traffic has to judge the speed distance etc to be able to safely make turn. An excessively speeding vehicle makes this much more difficult.

So 100 MPH is Mach 1?
 


Depends on the altitude.

Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:17:33 AM EDT
Ordinarily, SUV driver.  However, given the reckless excessive speed, the motorcyclist.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:17:36 AM EDT
Pie.
Link Posted: 7/1/2012 8:19:18 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Hogtruckie:
Bike...  Once you're up to 100mph, you're on your own. I find people have very shitty judgement of your approaching speed even when you are doing the limit.

Turning driver most likely saw the bike way in the distance and thought he had plenty of room/time to make his turn.

How was he supposed to know the bike was going warp factor one?


Because objects appear larger the closer they are and the rate at which the object gets bigger is proportional to the speed of the object.

Motorcyclist is being dumb but the turning vehicle is at fault.

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