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Posted: 9/15/2009 8:10:14 AM EST
Like most people, I l ove me some cop shows on TV and nowadays there are a million of them. I've always wondered though, when they serve a warrant or for any reason come into your house to look around and they destroy stuff, if you aren't charged or convicted, do they have to pay to fix it? I would imagine they don't, but I would be pretty pissed if they cut up my couch and kicked holes in my walls and found nothing.

On some of the SWAT shows they even show them using an APC. They hook that thing up to some tow straps and this big steel bar, then they smash your windows in and hook the bar inside the window frame and the tow straps to the front screen and throw the APC in reverse which rips your door down and pulls the window frames out leaving HUGE holes in the house. Sometimes they find drugs, sometimes they find a few joints and sometimes they find nothing. So now you have tens of thousands of dollars in damage to your house and they just say oh well and leave.

So what's the deal? Is there ever any kind of compensation if they don't find anything or if you aren't charged or convicted? Technically, under the law, you are innocent until proven guilty, so if you aren't conviccted, under the law you are innocent. I could see the cops making an argument if they did charge you but you were found not guilty, but if they don't even find anything are you still shit out of luck? Too bad, you have to come up w/ the $20k to fix your house? Usually it isn't that bad, but they usually at least cut up some couches or pull apart walls or spray chemicals on stuff. Too bad or what?
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:14:58 AM EST
I'm guessing probably not, unless you're the right color.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:16:31 AM EST
If I am remembering this class correctly (it was like 3 years ago and I wasn't paying a lot of attention) my professor said his old department would pay for those things if they didn't find what the warrant was going for.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:18:36 AM EST
Originally Posted By Mall-Ninja:
I'm guessing probably not, unless you're the right color.


Cue the joker "not sure if serious" pic
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:19:12 AM EST
You could probably file suit and win if you were innocent.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:25:08 AM EST
if they come into your house and rifle through your stuff and scratch/ding/chip/tear open, and take a bunch of stuff, then you go to court, and the case is finally dismissed... this is what they do for you


























NOT CRAP!

they keep your stuff, and give you bs reasons why they keep it, I use to be a fan of leo's.... not anymore
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:33:27 AM EST
Originally Posted By avengeusa:
if they come into your house and rifle through your stuff and scratch/ding/chip/tear open, and take a bunch of stuff, then you go to court, and the case is finally dismissed... this is what they do for you

NOT CRAP!

they keep your stuff, and give you bs reasons why they keep it, I use to be a fan of leo's.... not anymore


coughCAVALRYARMScough
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:34:27 AM EST
Originally Posted By Mal_means_bad:
Originally Posted By avengeusa:
if they come into your house and rifle through your stuff and scratch/ding/chip/tear open, and take a bunch of stuff, then you go to court, and the case is finally dismissed... this is what they do for you

NOT CRAP!

they keep your stuff, and give you bs reasons why they keep it, I use to be a fan of leo's.... not anymore


coughCAVALRYARMScough


and me
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:39:45 AM EST
Cops wouldn't ever do that to someone who's not a dangerous criminal
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:46:34 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:46:58 AM EST
Originally Posted By razor11056:
Cops wouldn't ever do that to someone who's not a dangerous criminal


yeah, good thing they got me and cav arms before we did something bad, you gotta be safe, it is for the children

Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:47:59 AM EST
Years ago, my friend had his house broken into. The St. Peters MO PD recovered the goods and kept it as evidence in the case. Long after the case was over, he tried to get his TV back. They kept stonewalling for literally a couple of years.

One day he went down there and saw his TV....up on a mount in the corner of some type of lounge for the cops.

To Protect and Serve........no wonder people have a bad opinion often of LEOs.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:51:03 AM EST

Originally Posted By avengeusa:
Originally Posted By razor11056:
Cops wouldn't ever do that to someone who's not a dangerous criminal


yeah, good thing they got me and cav arms before we did something bad, you gotta be safe, it is for the children


What they get you for?
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:52:47 AM EST
Originally Posted By realengr:
Years ago, my friend had his house broken into. The St. Peters MO PD recovered the goods and kept it as evidence in the case. Long after the case was over, he tried to get his TV back. They kept stonewalling for literally a couple of years.

One day he went down there and saw his TV....up on a mount in the corner of some type of lounge for the cops.

To Protect and Serve........no wonder people have a bad opinion often of LEOs.


No fucking way.


If that happened to me I think I would have flipped the fuck out.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:55:50 AM EST
Local PD here knocked down the front door of a house a few years ago durring a drug raid. Problem was, it was one block OVER from the house they had the warrant for. They nailed everything shut when they realized the mistake, in an attempt to give the homeowners some semblance of security for the remainder of the night. But the home owners had to pay for the repairs. Actually, the home owners insurance had to pay for the repairs. Lawyer said that PDs are exempt from restitution unless they were grossly negligent, and busting the wrong house in the dark, at night, with a warrant, while amped up on adrenaline, did not constitute “grossly negligent”.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 8:57:04 AM EST
technical violation, less than a misdemeanor, could have gotten a 1000 dollar fine, wrong sticker on a laser product, the fda chose not to fine me and was happy that i became compliant with the regulations regarding proper labeling

the fda did not do the raid, the dod did, with every other alphabet group they could find, took stuff, kept it, and ruined me

the sad thing is that they could have been polite, showed up at the door, and talked, but they chose to make a mess about it



they still ruined my business, and bankrupted me
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:02:08 AM EST
Originally Posted By vaughn4380:
Local PD here knocked down the front door of a house a few years ago durring a drug raid. Problem was, it was one block OVER from the house they had the warrant for. They nailed everything shut when they realized the mistake, in an attempt to give the homeowners some semblance of security for the remainder of the night. But the home owners had to pay for the repairs. Actually, the home owners insurance had to pay for the repairs. Lawyer said that PDs are exempt from restitution unless they were grossly negligent, and busting the wrong house in the dark, at night, with a warrant, while amped up on adrenaline, did not constitute “grossly negligent”.


We'll nail the door back up for you, but I don't think we can do anything about your dog.

Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:02:59 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/15/2009 9:05:19 AM EST by NimmerMehr]
The State does not make mistakes.

If the State makes mistakes, then the State is liable.

If the State is liable, then an agent of the State has to be blamed.

If an agent is going to be blamed, then said agent will be fired.

If someone is going to be fired, then they will not be making money.

People do not like to not be making money.

Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:03:15 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/15/2009 9:05:15 AM EST by EternalVigilance]



This thread pisses me off. I support LE and I root for the good guys...but holy fucking shit.


Is it that fucking hard to simply carry insurance so that you can do the right thing in case officer snuffy fucks up?
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:05:58 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:06:08 AM EST
Originally Posted By EternalVigilance:



This thread pisses me off. I support LE and I root for the good guys...but holy fucking shit.


Is it that fucking hard to simply carry insurance so that you can do the right thing in case officer snuffy fucks up?


I use to give a metric ton of cash and free stuff to leo's

not now, but the mil guys i still take care of
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:07:18 AM EST
We pay for the stuff we break, whether or not the person is eventually cherged and convicted or not.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:09:07 AM EST
Originally Posted By avengeusa:
technical violation, less than a misdemeanor, could have gotten a 1000 dollar fine, wrong sticker on a laser product, the fda chose not to fine me and was happy that i became compliant with the regulations regarding proper labeling

the fda did not do the raid, the dod did, with every other alphabet group they could find, took stuff, kept it, and ruined me

the sad thing is that they could have been polite, showed up at the door, and talked, but they chose to make a mess about it



they still ruined my business, and bankrupted me


I heard about this second hand from a member here awhile ago, total bullshit how they did you. Are you still a dealer? I've bought an eotech or 2 from you in the past.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:10:21 AM EST
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Originally Posted By EternalVigilance:



This thread pisses me off. I support LE and I root for the good guys...but holy fucking shit.



If you have a valid warrant then the damages are not the responsibility of the PD.



why would it NOT be the pd's fault?

so you are searching a building..... do you open every single gun accessory, light, laser, optic and whatever else you find, even when in clear packaging and toss it in a F*&%$ pile on the floor on top of all of the other now damages stuff?

I hope not, there is something we use to learn when we were kids, it is called respect

If there is a suspicion of a crime there is a way to do a search with honor and integrity, and those who do not treat people with decency and honor are in need of being fired, or beaten to death, especially when the person who owns the property is giving them all of the info and cooperation asked
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:12:26 AM EST
Originally Posted By PBIR:
Originally Posted By avengeusa:
technical violation, less than a misdemeanor, could have gotten a 1000 dollar fine, wrong sticker on a laser product, the fda chose not to fine me and was happy that i became compliant with the regulations regarding proper labeling

the fda did not do the raid, the dod did, with every other alphabet group they could find, took stuff, kept it, and ruined me

the sad thing is that they could have been polite, showed up at the door, and talked, but they chose to make a mess about it



they still ruined my business, and bankrupted me


I heard about this second hand from a member here awhile ago, total bullshit how they did you. Are you still a dealer? I've bought an eotech or 2 from you in the past.


mind sharing the whole story?
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:17:54 AM EST
Do they give you a new dog after they shoot yours?
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:19:34 AM EST
Originally Posted By OLY-M4gery:
We pay for the stuff we break, whether or not the person is eventually cherged and convicted or not.


Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:21:10 AM EST
Originally Posted By Dragracer:
Do they give you a new dog after they shoot yours?


they did all have their guns out when my 2 rotties ran out the door, i did actually have a time when i honestly thought they would shoot them
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:22:49 AM EST
I know on my neighbor's house when they raided it they used that battering ram thing (handheld) and after everything was gone through and evidence documented they left. There was police tape up across the door but no door. A relative of these old neighbors came out with some plywood to screw it on what was left of the door frame.

About two weeks later someone else came out, unscrewed the plywood and went in. Seeing this I was going to call the cops but he did not appear to be a thug. I watched and when the guy came out I stopped him and asked him what he was doing. He was from the bank or some kind of rep; the house was being foreclosed on and the proceedings had started before the raid. Anyway he wanted to see the condition of the house so it could go back on the market. I was able to see inside and the place was ransacked. Don't know if the cops did it or the residents did. Something tells me it wasn't exactly organized to begin with.

The bank guy eventually returned with contractors to clean out the house and fix it up. Neighbor's never did come back (jail for most of them).
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:36:10 AM EST
Having the police power of the State behind means never having to say you're sorry
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 9:38:41 AM EST
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Originally Posted By EternalVigilance:



This thread pisses me off. I support LE and I root for the good guys...but holy fucking shit.



If you have a valid warrant then the damages are not the responsibility of the PD.



Then just who the fuck is responsible
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 6:44:28 PM EST
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Originally Posted By EternalVigilance:



This thread pisses me off. I support LE and I root for the good guys...but holy fucking shit.



If you have a valid warrant then the damages are not the responsibility of the PD.



And why not? The cops are the ones that went to the judge and said "Based upon the the finding of the investigation conducted by the XYZ PD, we believe the occupants of 123 Any Street have widgets in the house."
The popo are the ones that go get the judge out of bed to sign the fucking warrant. The are the ones driving the train, they damn sure should be the ones responsible.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 6:47:27 PM EST
wasn't there just a story awhile back, the swat raided some house, busted the door to shit, and then wouldnt replace it, then the house got broken into via the broken door...?
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 6:47:54 PM EST
If SWAT is busting down your door and setting off flash bangs, you have much more to worry about than paying for the burn marks and holes in the wall. I'm pretty sure they have a seriously good reason for wrecking your house, and have exuberant evidence to back it up.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 6:53:37 PM EST
Originally Posted By xpired:
If SWAT is busting down your door and setting off flash bangs, you have much more to worry about than paying for the burn marks and holes in the wall. I'm pretty sure they have a seriously good reason for wrecking your house, and have exuberant evidence to back it up.



Guilty or not...
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 6:54:05 PM EST
If they have an empty house after taking them to jail, I believe they have to board up the holes they made.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 6:54:33 PM EST
what if they're arresting someone other than the home owner? say they arrest some bank robber who is living in his mom's basement, would they reimburse the mother or does she get stuck with the bill AND knowing her kid is a scum bag?
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:04:28 PM EST


Originally Posted By avengeusa:
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Originally Posted By EternalVigilance:



This thread pisses me off. I support LE and I root for the good guys...but holy fucking shit.



If you have a valid warrant then the damages are not the responsibility of the PD.



why would it NOT be the pd's fault?

so you are searching a building..... do you open every single gun accessory, light, laser, optic and whatever else you find, even when in clear packaging and toss it in a F*&%$ pile on the floor on top of all of the other now damages stuff?

I hope not, there is something we use to learn when we were kids, it is called respect

If there is a suspicion of a crime there is a way to do a search with honor and integrity, and those who do not treat people with decency and honor are in need of being fired, or beaten to death, especially when the person who owns the property is giving them all of the info and cooperation asked


Because LEO can do what-ever-the fuck-they-want, and you can eat shit as far as LEO is concerned.

Ahhhh..the power of the badge.....respectttt mahhhhh auuthoritaaayyy!!!!!!!!
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:04:29 PM EST
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Originally Posted By EternalVigilance:



This thread pisses me off. I support LE and I root for the good guys...but holy fucking shit.



If you have a valid warrant then the damages are not the responsibility of the PD.




So let me get this straight.

If it turns out the warrant was based upon faulty/incorrect surveillance/info (nothing was found), so long as the Officers were doing their job in good faith, PD will not pay for damages?

Legal or not, that is morally bankrupt.

Knowing they are not liable, what is to keep officers from literally demolishing a house looking for nonexistant evidence when none turns up on a casual search?
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:08:48 PM EST
Originally Posted By rykn0w:
wasn't there just a story awhile back, the swat raided some house, busted the door to shit, and then wouldnt replace it, then the house got broken into via the broken door...?


Not sure, but there WAS one where some guy had his front door busted in by mistake (wrong address), they refused to replace it, he set the door out back behind his house until he could repair or dispose of it and had the city code inspector fine him because it was sitting out back.

Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:22:27 PM EST
AHAHAHahahhaHAHAHHAHAHha


Thats funny man, real funny. Government pay for your shit cause they fucked up! Thats a good one!


In all seriousness though IF YOU ARE LUCKY they might pay for the front door they busted in. All the heirlooms and shit the smashed hoping drugs were inside? fat chance. Really sucks for the law abiding because the more shit they tear up and turn over without finding anything, the more shit they are gonna tear up and turn over. While I'm sure the individual officers may feel regret for what they have done, don't expect them to personally help ya out, and the department will take the stance that it was all official business and they can't be held liable.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:31:45 PM EST
don't question it, just take it.


Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:42:25 PM EST

Originally Posted By LarryThePirate:
Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter:
Originally Posted By EternalVigilance:



This thread pisses me off. I support LE and I root for the good guys...but holy fucking shit.



If you have a valid warrant then the damages are not the responsibility of the PD.



And why not? The cops are the ones that went to the judge and said "Based upon the the finding of the investigation conducted by the XYZ PD, we believe the occupants of 123 Any Street have widgets in the house."
The popo are the ones that go get the judge out of bed to sign the fucking warrant. The are the ones driving the train, they damn sure should be the ones responsible.

Assuming the evidence is there, and there is a conviction, the damages are the responsibility of the convict...

If he had obeyed the law, there would have been no raid and no damages....

Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:42:52 PM EST
Originally Posted By xpired:
If SWAT is busting down your door and setting off flash bangs, you have much more to worry about than paying for the burn marks and holes in the wall. I'm pretty sure they have a seriously good reason for wrecking your house, and have exuberant evidence to back it up.


At the wrong address? The good reason was at another address. Wouldn't you call breaking and entering, brandishing, making terroristic threats, kidnapping, assault, etc. GROSS NEGLIGENCE?

So exactly who would you blame for the police smashing in the wrong door, and threatening people, throwing them on the ground, pointing guns at them, etc?
If I treated a person like that I'd be in jail FOREVER.

Police have no more legal power than any of us do, with the exception of being able to make an arrest for a misdemeanor without being witness to it. That's right, NO MORE THAN US. They are not special. In the US all laws are equally enforced, and apply to everyone equally. In theory. In reality..
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:44:35 PM EST
WhoooHooo. The best cop bashing thread of the day. There is so much ignorance in this thread its amazing.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:45:21 PM EST
I worked on a case for a client at a small firm right out of law school. SWAT and the cops got all hyped up for a bust as the COPS TV show was filming them. They tear open the front door, fire tear gas rounds through the window, catch part of the house on fire, and so on. Oopsie, wrong house, wrong address, to bad for you sucka. We were having to sue the city to get repairs the cops had caused and completely refused to pay for.

Another fun little one representing a black woman (race matters in this one). She was arrested for cashing a bad check at a supermarket. Based on brilliant detective work she was arrested and spent three days in jail, losing her job. Oopsie, to bad for you that the detectives never looked at nor cared about the evidence as there was a photo from the store clearly showing the license and that it was a black woman's and the person cashing the check and using that license was a white male. So sorry, best of luck to you.

Or the man I represented who was shot by a pissed off woman because someone had broken in to her business. Thinks it is my client and shoots him while he is running away from her property. He did not commit the crime, he was walking through, is retarded and was 38 with about a 7 or 8 year old capacity. He spends 3 weeks in the hospital and then is charged for attacking her. She tells the cops she was just pissed and wanted to get someone, lies on the stand in a preliminary hearing. He spends five months in jail awaiting trial and the DA wants him to plead to something he has no mental capacity to understand and did not do. They dismiss the charges three days before trial, release my client and never tell me.

Or the client beaten by three officers, whom I later catch on the witness stand lying about what happened in an effort to convict my client for something he did not do. And the corrections officer that was in cahoots with the "victim" to keep the client in jail so that his business could be cleaned out.

Or the cop who threatens in court to "get" a person found not guilty.

Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:45:52 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/15/2009 7:48:02 PM EST by Commander_Adama]
Doubletap
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:46:47 PM EST
Originally Posted By diverman:
WhoooHooo. The best cop bashing thread of the day. There is so much ignorance in this thread its amazing.


Pray tell, as I see none, just a baseless accusation without evidence. But then again, these are all isolated incidents.

Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:49:41 PM EST
Originally Posted By Ronnoc:
Originally Posted By diverman:
WhoooHooo. The best cop bashing thread of the day. There is so much ignorance in this thread its amazing.


Pray tell, as I see none, just a baseless accusation without evidence. But then again, these are all isolated incidents.



Yeah, it's cop bashing when you point out their inexcusable "mistakes".
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:50:55 PM EST
the only time i have heard of my department paying out huge sums of money either to settle a lawsuit or to avoid going to court and a public trial.

1 warrant service (non swat) on the wrong house detectives and city sued, detectives fired.
2 officer and city sued after k9 refused commands to stop and attacked and chewed on the wrong guy. guy now no longer has the use of his right arm.
Link Posted: 9/15/2009 7:53:23 PM EST
Originally Posted By 951bulldog:
Like most people, I l ove me some cop shows on TV and nowadays there are a million of them. I've always wondered though, when they serve a warrant or for any reason come into your house to look around and they destroy stuff, if you aren't charged or convicted, do they have to pay to fix it? I would imagine they don't, but I would be pretty pissed if they cut up my couch and kicked holes in my walls and found nothing.

On some of the SWAT shows they even show them using an APC. They hook that thing up to some tow straps and this big steel bar, then they smash your windows in and hook the bar inside the window frame and the tow straps to the front screen and throw the APC in reverse which rips your door down and pulls the window frames out leaving HUGE holes in the house. Sometimes they find drugs, sometimes they find a few joints and sometimes they find nothing. So now you have tens of thousands of dollars in damage to your house and they just say oh well and leave.

So what's the deal? Is there ever any kind of compensation if they don't find anything or if you aren't charged or convicted? Technically, under the law, you are innocent until proven guilty, so if you aren't conviccted, under the law you are innocent. I could see the cops making an argument if they did charge you but you were found not guilty, but if they don't even find anything are you still shit out of luck? Too bad, you have to come up w/ the $20k to fix your house? Usually it isn't that bad, but they usually at least cut up some couches or pull apart walls or spray chemicals on stuff. Too bad or what?


They never bust in on people who can defend themselves (ie. money,connections,ect).
If your a working stiff or just poor there is little risk to the cops some they do what they want.

I'll never understand why people think the Obamas of the world are some how more "big government" than the police.
They're all out of control and don't think they should be accountable to anybody.

If they did bust up your house and refused to pay for the damage there are people who can help.
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