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Posted: 6/17/2009 5:40:30 AM EST
I heard the tease on FOX but can't wait. I don't have time to research it now.

Link Posted: 6/17/2009 5:42:13 AM EST
A remarkable number of deluded fools think the government is competent, so to them it makes sense.
Link Posted: 6/17/2009 2:06:32 PM EST
Actually the Federal Reserve System isn't a government entity. This is a power grab by the global elite. Obama has been in their pocket from the beginning. Everyone who gives a shit about their country should at the very least watch this video presentation. The book is even better.

The Creature From Jekyll Island
Link Posted: 6/17/2009 2:12:55 PM EST

Originally Posted By RyanH:
Actually the Federal Reserve System isn't a government entity. This is a power grab by the global elite. Obama has been in their pocket from the beginning. Everyone who gives a shit about their country should at the very least watch this video presentation. The book is even better.

The Creature From Jekyll Island

'Creature' is Socialist Bullshit.... Check out the author's other works for confirmation....

The Fed is part public, part private.... And a very needed entity (as central banks go, ours is much better constructed - and much more insulated from political tampering, than most of the other major powers - esp Europe)..

The whole 'global elite' bullshit further betrays the populist-socialist origins of your statement... 'Evil corporations' & other crap like that...



As for the bill, we'll see where that goes... The only logical role for the Fed in terms of 'siezing' anything, would be to 'sieze' the assets of businesses who default on FED loans - essentually common forclosure....

They are not supposed to be a 'regulatory agency', other than deciding who to lend money to, and how much to lend...
Link Posted: 6/17/2009 2:33:08 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/17/2009 2:41:30 PM EST by RyanH]
I disagree. I haven't seen anything in Creature that suggests the author is pro socialism. The Constitution is pretty clear that one of the responsibilities of congress is to oversee our financial system so to turn it over to an international banking cartel to do with what they will is not only unconstitutional, it is dangerous.

It would be interesting however, to get other opinions on the book or at least the audio presentation. I'm always up for a reality check but I largely agree with what he had to say.

I don't think it's realistic to suggest that our currency be directly connected to gold anymore as it used to be. It can be attached loosely to hard currency but a 1:1 gold to the dollar ratio isn't realistic if you want your economy to grow. On the other hand, an economy that is built on the ever increasing amounts of debt (as our economy now is), will also not provide sustainability. So we need to find a way to do things that are less easily corrupted but also sustainable.

In other words, the endless creation of money from debt cannot continue but going back to the gold standard isn't realistic either.
Link Posted: 6/17/2009 10:29:28 PM EST

Originally Posted By RyanH:
I disagree. I haven't seen anything in Creature that suggests the author is pro socialism. The Constitution is pretty clear that one of the responsibilities of congress is to oversee our financial system so to turn it over to an international banking cartel to do with what they will is not only unconstitutional, it is dangerous.

It would be interesting however, to get other opinions on the book or at least the audio presentation. I'm always up for a reality check but I largely agree with what he had to say.

I don't think it's realistic to suggest that our currency be directly connected to gold anymore as it used to be. It can be attached loosely to hard currency but a 1:1 gold to the dollar ratio isn't realistic if you want your economy to grow. On the other hand, an economy that is built on the ever increasing amounts of debt (as our economy now is), will also not provide sustainability. So we need to find a way to do things that are less easily corrupted but also sustainable.

In other words, the endless creation of money from debt cannot continue but going back to the gold standard isn't realistic either.

First of all, the 'international banking cartel' line is bullshit... There's nothing 'international' about the Federal Reserve's structure... The closest 'truth' to this, is that all banks that handle USD have an impact on the money supply, and many of those are multinational corproations... But that's just capitalisim, not an evil conspiracy...

Second, the author of 'Creature' has written several similar books that portray a very left-wing bias... Which is expected from someone who considers an open-market monetary system to be an 'international banking cartel conspiracy'... This position is further spotlighted by the fact that EVERY SINGLE anti-Federal-Reserve politician wants government to directly control the money supply - either by an artificial peg to gold, or thru Keynsian pump priming...

Actual conservative, monetarist economics requires central banking to function.

As for the Constitutional argument, this is a red herring. If you apply the same standard to ALL Congressional powers that anti-FED advocates apply to the 'regulate the value' power, then every single executive department (Treasury, etc) is also unconstitutional, and Congress has to internally do every single activity in Art 1 Sec 8.... Which is ... The necessary & proper clause allows Congress to pass any law (And 'ANY' would include a law delegating Congressional powers to another entity) deemed nessisary & proper to the execution of Congressional powers....

And before you say 'But the FED is a private business' - 7 out of the 12 members of the Open Market Committe (the Board of Governors) are all Congressionally confirmed executive appointees... The Chairman is an executive appointee confirmed by the Senate - just like SecTreas or any other cabinet-level post....

As for money, money is just a way of measuring cost & debt, nothing more, nothing less...

The statement that 'debt based money is unsustainable' or that 'all fiat currencies fail' are both examples of 'If you repeat a lie enough times it becomes the truth'....

All major currency failures since the world dumped gold have been caused by political failures - NONE have been caused by central banking or 'printing too much money'.

The fact is, there are 3 things you can do with your money supply:

1) Open-market based, like the USD. Money supply regulated by an independant central bank

2) Pegged, money supply arbitrarily tied to some other commodity (foreign currency, gold, etc) by legislative edict.

3) Keynsian 'government money', issued by a legislative body & 'valuable' simply because the government spends & accepts payment with it...

Within (1) you have the variation as to weather the 'central bank' is a 100% government-controlled, political organiacation, or a public-private partnership (ala the FED)....

Within (2) and (3) you have the option of 'Banking legal' (fractional reserve) or 'Banking illegal' (no fractional reserve)...

The obvious problem of having fractional reserve banking without a central bank, is that the money supply can grow or contract out of control, based on what thousands of individual banks feel like doing today with regard to loans... There is no 'monetary policy' and no control - not even market based - over where the money supply goes....

The obvious problem of NOT having fractional reserve OR a central bank, is that you would have no banks, and credit would be almost impossible to get (this is the dark-ages/Islamic-style finance model)......

Which is why all major powers use (1), and 3rd-world nations MAY use (2) with the 'peg' being to a 1st-world currency (usually USD) not a metal or other commodity.

No one uses (3), but it is a favorite 'wish' of anti-FED populist-socialists in the US, due to it's reliance on government spending to create and maintain the money supply...

In the end the system as we have it is the best of all worlds - the FED's private 'elements' being a check against the sort of political stupidity that ruins currencies....
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