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Posted: 4/25/2001 7:38:09 PM EDT
Hey guys,
  Been seeing all the advice been giving out lately, and thought I would ask for some of my own. Here is the Deal, I will be turning 19 in June, and need some advice on what to do with my life, Job Wise.

I like to work on computers, drive, love the outdoors, but, heres the hangup. Hate school. I would also like to be finaceally well off, I was thinking some sort of IT career? What can you guys tell me about getting into Networking and such? Is school (college) mandatory?
  Ideally, Someday, I would like to work for myself... I was thinking maybe a Landscaping Buisness? Or computers... I am just looking for some suggestions right now. I need to hear some succsessfull stories! Talk to me fellas!

Link Posted: 4/25/2001 7:43:33 PM EDT
United States Air Force.
Link Posted: 4/25/2001 7:45:19 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/25/2001 7:46:56 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/25/2001 7:47:46 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/25/2001 7:53:12 PM EDT
It sounds to me like you are interested in computers, but would be better off in a landscaping/construction type job. It would be very hard for you to get a technical career, i.e. computer tech, without going to school. If you like the outdoors, think about sitting behind a computer screen all day long. Better yet, try it someday, get up at 8:00 am and sit in front of your computer to 5:00pm. If you can stand it then maybe a computer career is right for you. If you are like me then you will last about an hour and a half. As far as landscaping/construction goes, the best way to get involved in it is to just get an entry level job doing it. You will find out within a week or so if this is for you. If you stay with it then you will learn the "in's and out's" of the business while getting paid for it. Also as you move up in the company you will be able to make some of the major decisions on your own and therfore "try" new ideas with someone else's money. This is a very effective way of learning what works and what doesn't BEFORE you actually go out on your own and start your own business. Whatever you decide to do, give it 100% all of the time, and you will succeed.  Good Luck!!
Link Posted: 4/25/2001 8:06:38 PM EDT
13 BOOM BOOM! Not many jobs for Artillery on the outside, but it sure is fun while you're in! Or you could go 19K; once you try an M1, you'll never want to leave the Army. Hell, we used to look forward to going to the field!
Link Posted: 4/25/2001 8:08:43 PM EDT
Hey guys, Thanks for the responses.. A few questions..
 Garand Shooter, Where did you learn to design websites? Must I be artistcally talented? Or is it more other stuff like learning HTML? Where can I do that? I would like to teach myself...

Whats 11B and 12B. I actually thought about going into the Army as a Warrant Officer, and then trying to get some schooling for an IT career, but I am not sure..

Schv, I was in construction, loved it.. I planned on doing it for life, and then I got hurt. Messed up my ankle pretty bad, decided it wasn't for me.. What about my own Landscaping Buisness, How attainable is that?

Thanks guys, this is helping!
Link Posted: 4/25/2001 8:12:42 PM EDT

You might want to go and study yourself for A+ Certification then do Network + or I Net+. These are all very easy to do yourself and will get your foot in the door of any small company. Once you have a year or so of experiance you can easily find a company that will hire you and send you to school for your MCSE or CCNA or some higher level Cert. Those are where the big bucks are. I started in computers after 8 years in the Army about 5 years ago and now have more certs and skills than I can count. At this point I could pretty much write my own ticket. Not a bad way to go, and I have very little time in a classroom. Plus, all the classroom time has been paid for by others that I work for.

Link Posted: 4/25/2001 8:24:50 PM EDT
Private Joker,

Depending on if your ankle is still messed up or not, your own landscaping business is very obtainable. You must be prepared to work your ass off getting it off the ground, getting contracts, pleasing your customers, (once you acheive growth) obtaining good employee's, etc. To be succesfull I would go to a local community college and take some basic business classes, such as business management, advertising, business math, salesmanship, etc. These will help you run a more professional business. Get a job with a local landscaping company, there you will be able to meet your future customers, suppliers, employees, and in general, people in the business. You will gain experience in landscaping, the benefeit of that is obvious. If you work hard and dedicate yourself to success, then you should be able to branch out into your own business within 3 to 7 years. Remember you will have to buy your own equipment, trucks, materials etc. so while working save as much money as you can, and build a good credit history. So that when you have the neccesary experience, you will have some working capital(cash), and a good credit history for a business loan.
Link Posted: 4/25/2001 8:45:10 PM EDT
Correct me if I am wrong, but at the career center at my college, I read somewhere that the field of computers (like programming in C++, Java, fortran, hardware servicing, etc.) are the only professions that does not really require any college if you study on your own and you are good at it.  

In fact, I also read from another source that there are thousands of people doing just that making good money without even stepping foot on a college campus.  It seems young people straight out of high school who learned programming on their own are starting at $40,000 at year. I really don't know if that is true in any state.  Maybe that still happens somewhere in Silicon Valley in California.  

Maybe do some research and check into this. I don't know if you mean studying on your own is the same as going to school and hating it. Either try that route or go into selling [b]Amway products![/b]  Ha ha. I don't know much about Amway products.  People are always approaching me in the malls, though.

Good luck.  [:)]

Link Posted: 4/25/2001 10:09:29 PM EDT
You can get a job in Software Quality Assuarance as a Black Box Tester. A lot of people get their start at Game companies, testing the latest computer games. And yes...such testing DOES require a PLAY Through AND Playing in Real time on Local Area Networks and over the internet.

So...you can get paid money just for playing computer games!

No special talent other than being able to totally screw up things.
If you have a "knack" for breaking things on the computer and can reproduce the software bugs that you find..then you can get a job in QA.

Typical pay: is about 40k per year in CA.

If you learn some programming languages such as Java, C/C++ and learn how to work on Operating systems such as Linux, then you can get a better paying job as a White Box Test Engineer.
Typical pay (in CA) is 100k.

Having a degree really helps..but if you manage to somehow get the experience and are good, then ultimately it isn't a barrier. But it does make things easier.

Launching a career in the tech industry without a college degree, is VERY difficult but not impossible.

Link Posted: 4/25/2001 10:59:47 PM EDT
Do timeshare marketing. It's very easy, it allows you to travel and they pay for your housing. My wife makes a grand a week in 30 hours and I did too before I started my business. Hell a grand a week part time to give people free stuff. Nothing better in my humble opinion.  [+]:D]
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 1:09:15 AM EDT
Well, nothing comes easy. In order to make the big $$$ you have to become a highly skilled "expert", no matter what field you're in. You could be an expert machinist, an expert welder, an expert lawyer, an expert engineer, whatever. The fact is, to become an expert at anything usually requires some education. Moreover, in many fields even if you are a self-taught expert, some won't take you seriously unless you have a degree. For instance, most engineering disciplines.

It's true you can become a C++/Java guru on your own, but there will be a hell of a lot more doors open to you if you have a degree as well. A lot of companies won't even look at you if you don't have a BS. Many prefer an MSCS if programming is your field (for software development).

The economy in Silicon Valley is not anywhere near where it was 2 years ago. In fact, they're even laying off their Indians now. It must be bad if cheap, foreign laborers is being sent home. But by the time you're ready to work, the economy will probably be in better shape.

Anyway, if you like the outdoors, maybe 9-5 in-house IT is not your field. However, there are IT guys who spend a lot of time in the field, traveling to customer sites out-of-state and things like that. That's fun for a while at least.

As far a making money in networking, the engineers make good pay. I don't think the admin guys make nearly as much. However, my brother works with a contractor who started out as a network administrator. Now he has eight guys working for him. He gets the contracts and pays his guys salaries. I think he makes over $250k a year and I'm sure he'll make more as his business expands. But he's the man -- the buck stops at his desk.

Unfortunately, the market is pretty much full of MCSE's these days. It's a good start, but it's not enough to get a job. The best route in that field is to try to get a job as a "cable boy" and take the classes at night. Most employers would rather hire a guy with two years experience than an MCSE with none or very little. So, if you can get any IT job now, that's the first thing to do.

As far as pay, if you want to live anywhere near Silicon Valley you need at least $60k a year. Most of the software engineers I know are in the $100k-$150k range and they are NOT living high on the hog. The PRK drains every last cent out of you. Worse yet, they want your guns.
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 3:52:22 AM EDT
If you want to go the computer route, you will have to go to school. You need enough training to at least get a job, then you can learn as you go. Junior College at a minimum. You will never get to the point where you know all you need to know and don't have to study ever again.
Get used to it. You'll need the money to buy guns.
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 4:33:48 AM EDT
become a man-whore.
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 5:00:14 AM EDT
become a man-whore.
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Oh,Man,Can't breath.....laughing to hard...

But hey it could work,he already has the name..

"Hello,I am Private Joker,I am your male gigalo..."
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 5:02:18 AM EDT
Actually, I have never been to college and have had no problems at all finding jobs in the IT business. When going to school for IT stuff, they just can't create courseware as fast as the industry changes. This creates a problem where everything you are learning is at least 1 or 2 years old right off the bat. Not good in the IT business.

Link Posted: 4/26/2001 5:03:20 AM EDT
13 BOOM BOOM! Not many jobs for Artillery on the outside, but it sure is fun while you're in! Or you could go 19K; once you try an M1, you'll never want to leave the Army. Hell, we used to look forward to going to the field!
View Quote

I knew a guy that was a M1 driver and HATED it he said the tanks were hot, smelly,and filthy.
He signed up for them cause thats were a sign-up bonus was and he though,"cool I can race tamks over sand dunes at full speed,like the comercial!"
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 5:05:09 AM EDT
enlist 11b
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Hey,TJ,your at VMI,right?

So you gonna enlist after college or you going for your commision?

What is VMI like?Was it hard to get into?
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 5:06:55 AM EDT
If you want to get into the computer business without a formal education, you will probably do to work for a temp agency and have them place you somewhere that may be willing to hire you. This way you can get experience building pcs, doing break-fix stuff, learning software packages, etc.

Once you have the experience you can go anywhere. Speaking from experience, companies will overlook your lack of formal education if you have the experience.

The computer industry has been very good to me. I make more now at 25 than my dad did with the local fire department when he retired this year.

On the education side, my brother in law went to a 2 year tech school and got a electrical cert. and now after 10 years in the business, makes 150k a year. So the education does help......
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 5:13:03 AM EDT
What are you gonna do with your life?!?!?!

Link Posted: 4/26/2001 5:20:43 AM EDT
Hmmm.....Wants to earn the big bucks, but not interested in aquiring the education to justify it.  Sounds typical of today's youth.  Join the Army as a Warrant Officer?  Why stop there?  A Colonel would be better.

Son, go down to your local MEPPS center, get your physical, ship out, get a haircut, and do your time with your collar flapping in the breeze.  Pain builds character.  You sound like you need discipline to ultimately achieve your lofty goals.  Left right left right left right left.....
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 5:21:18 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 5:22:53 AM EDT
Buy the LEGP rifle, you will see the light my son.
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 5:23:09 AM EDT
All this free advice is worth exactly what you pay for it.

If you really want some good advice, send me $ 10,000.00 and I will give you some really good advice.

If interested email me for my address.

Link Posted: 4/26/2001 6:14:42 AM EDT
Private Joker--  I'm a 22yr old college student, graduating in May.  Do you want specific advice about college/benefits/drawbacks?

Link Posted: 4/26/2001 6:30:28 AM EDT

At 19, you are still young and got a long way to go.  Good career, success and financial independence don't come overnight. It got to be build one step at the time.  One can work hard at it and can achieve his goal. So you got lots of time in you to prepare yourself, and with a "proper attitude", you can and will get what you want.  Learn the trade, and learn it well for when the opportunity come knocking. IT and computer related fields is a way to go. That's the future that everyone is heading.
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 6:38:09 AM EDT
Honestly?  Take a year or two off to go work in some of the fields you are interested in.  This is the best time in your life to live cheaply and with relatively few responsibilities.  Figure out what you enjoy doing and map out what schooling you will need (and you will need some schooling).  You'll find once you go back to school after taking a break you'll be more focused and able to appreciate the experience.

Or join the military.... but go advanced electronics.
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 6:47:40 AM EDT
Join the NYPD! 40+ hours of work a week for one of the smallest paychecks compared to other Dept's in the US. No chance for the "good deatils" unless you have a hook. The general public either loves you or hates you, usually it's the latter.....on second thought,  forget it.  Damn I'm depressed now. Seriously though if you can get past that Police Work is pretty damn cool and other Dept's in the US pay better!
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 7:08:27 AM EDT
You could also consider a career in the police force here in Cincinnati. [@:D]
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 7:09:58 AM EDT

On the contraire, I applaud you for what you do.  We the "Public" do not hate you, we "need" you.  I for one, can never able to do what you do.  You got to have "Super Human" quality in you to put up with all the hassles in your work for a miserable pay. Yes, we the "Public" are angry at time and said things we don't mean, but when SHTF comes, you are the first we come running to.
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 7:10:52 AM EDT
I'm sorry for the last comment. I shouldn't have!
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 7:20:07 AM EDT
You could also consider a career in the police force here in Cincinnati. [@:D]
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I thought that was hillarious.

Also, I don't hate my job at all...I've done more crazy things and met more people(famous and normal, hey it's NYC!!!) that I could go on an on and on...

Link Posted: 4/26/2001 7:22:25 AM EDT

On the contraire, I applaud you for what you do.  We the "Public" do not hate you, we "need" you.  I for one, can never able to do what you do.  You got to have "Super Human" quality in you to put up with all the hassles in your work for a miserable pay. Yes, we the "Public" are angry at time and said things we don't mean, but when SHTF comes, you are the first we come running to.
View Quote

I appreciate that. Thank you.
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 9:23:48 AM EDT
Hey guys,
  Wow, 30some responses! I apprecieate it! I really love this board! I am thinking more and more about this computer thing.. 60k in Silcon Valley may not be alot, but here in Wisconsin, I could live good! Especially if I have a Mrs. Joker making as much! I think I am going to try and teach myself HTML, then probably Java. Sounds like something I can acheive. Ideally, I would like to get into a company with advancemet oppurtunities (Who doesn't) I know my way around the inside of a PC pretty well, so something along the lines of HardWare Installs would be perfect for me..

PreBans, I would love to hear about college's ups and downs. If I could do it w/ tech school, I could probably manage. I guess it all boils down how bad I want it. The idea of making 60-100k a year doing something I love, Just sounds to good to be true!

Thanks alot guys! Keep the info coming!

Link Posted: 4/26/2001 10:59:36 AM EDT
actually sasquatch and i were looking to hire another starship pilot to fly to the alderon system....

seriously though - you have the world at your feet - you can do anything you want.  personally i'd go backpacking around far a few months, europe, australia see the world - the us dollar goes really far in bali.

for me i wonder sometimes if i should of taken the offers i had to go to west point and the air force academy.... ah well.  well pj wish i could of been more help - but all i can offer is that "follow your heart" be happy life is short

Link Posted: 4/26/2001 11:32:12 AM EDT
Private Joker,

I was faced with the same decisions 20 years ago and joined the Air Force. I never did well in school and really had no idea what I wanted to do.  Computers came along and I chose to jump in early and learn from the beginning.  I am fortunate to have a decent paying job in Information Systems (IS) without college.  However, everyone that works for me has at least a 2 year degree.  It's going to be hard to get started without a degree but the AF will help you pay for it if you decide to go.  Try to get an IS AFSC if you decide to enlist.
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 7:14:02 PM EDT
Hey guys,
   Looks like I might have to do the Unthinkable... More schooling. An IT career sounds good... Will I be able to acomplish this w/ Tech school? I don't need any 4 year BS do I?
I need some more info, any good websites?

Link Posted: 4/26/2001 7:51:48 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/26/2001 8:18:58 PM EDT
Anybody mention Management in Information Systems (MIS) yet?

As far as work loads go in college, its about the best Difficulty of curriculum vs. Income payout ratio that you can find in the computer field.  I'm a Comp. Engineer, but it's kicking my ass.  While I have better opportunities down the road for both job placements and increased pay, MIS and CSE's get almost equal income when both enter the job world.  Plus MIS are usually in demand no matter where you look.

As far as enlisting for paying for school, that's not my specialty as to what you should do (ask some current/ex-grunts here what field might suit you best), but nonetheless this is a good option for when you finally GO to school with that money.  Just my two cents since I'm always in contact with these guys, not to mention my roommate is MIS major as well.

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