Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Posted: 8/30/2004 1:07:51 PM EST
Does anybody know the real, non-BS story about what happened to the gun store guy who gave the LAPD officers AR's so they could shoot the bank robber??
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 1:13:08 PM EST
IIRC, he had to close his shop down shortly after that happened.

If anyone else knows for sure, feel free to set me and all others straight on this.

I thought I remember reading an article that said not only he, but the longest run family owned gunshop in Oakland were closing down due to the PRKs restrictive gun laws. Especially the Oakland laws.

BTW, the TV movie about this COMPLETELY left out the fact that the LAPD got "assault weapons" from a CILVILIAN SOURCE and it turned the tide of the firefight.

In the TV movie, the LEOs just suddenly appeared with ARs.
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 1:18:01 PM EST

Originally Posted By gamesniper:
IIRC, he had to close his shop down shortly after that happened.

If anyone else knows for sure, feel free to set me and all others straight on this.

I thought I remember reading an article that said not only he, but the longest run family owned gunshop in Oakland were closing down due to the PRKs restrictive gun laws. Especially the Oakland laws.

BTW, the TV movie about this COMPLETELY left out the fact that the LAPD got "assault weapons" from a CILVILIAN SOURCE and it turned the tide of the firefight.

In the TV movie, the LEOs just suddenly appeared with ARs.



If you are talking about the movie '44 Minutes', then it definitely contained a scene in the gun shop, with officers picking up rifles from the dealer, all the while making anti-gun comments.

Link Posted: 8/30/2004 2:17:27 PM EST
It was B&B Guns. Both stores went out of business a few years later. They had horrible customer service.

BTW; none of the borrowed weapons were ever used to engage the bank robbers.
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 2:19:08 PM EST

Originally Posted By gamesniper:

BTW, the TV movie about this COMPLETELY left out the fact that the LAPD got "assault weapons" from a CILVILIAN SOURCE and it turned the tide of the firefight.

In the TV movie, the LEOs just suddenly appeared with ARs.



As I already said, the borrowed weapons were never fired. The ARs you refer to suddenly appearing were the SWAT guys, some still dressed in their PT gear, showing up.
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 2:19:19 PM EST

Originally Posted By AR15fan:
It was B&B Guns. Both stores went out of business a few years later. They had horrible customer service.

BTW; none of the borrowed weapons were ever used to engage the bank robbers.



I thought they were
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 2:31:44 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 3:09:02 PM EST
yep, as ar15fan said, it was B&B. in the good days before all the restrictions and bans started, they use to have racks of ar's, styer's, h&k's - lots of eye candy. then, the restrictions and bans started, and they started to cut back on their inventory. they're service kind of depended on if they thought you were actually going to buy or not. prices were close to, or slightly below msrp on most items, but i did get some good deals on some consignment guns there. rumour was that they got accused of some firearms law violations, which weren't true, and they closed down some time after that.

anyone know the real reason for their closure?

now, pretty much all that is left in LA is turner's sporting goods, and big5 as the only big chain stores with guns, and a few assorted smaller stores
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 3:10:59 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 3:38:29 PM EST
A guy from my high school class used to work in the B&Bs in Orange County. I went in there on leave once, and saw him standing there behind the counter. I did a double take, and went over to say "wassup!"

I never bought anything from there, personally, but I have a friend who did. He never commented on the customer service. My brother bought his Ruger Mk II Government model there, many years ago.
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 3:42:05 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 9:00:52 PM EST
"I need some two-two-three's!" I don't understand why they didn't just run the fuckers over with an armored truck.
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 9:07:01 PM EST

Originally Posted By Blue84S10:
"I need some two-two-three's!" I don't understand why they didn't just run the fuckers over with an armored truck.



[Dianne Feinstein]Those men are victoms of a gun crazed society[/Dianne Feinstein]
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 9:07:11 PM EST
There was one friggin gunstore in the entire city of Oakland?

WTF?
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 9:26:04 PM EST

Originally Posted By byron2112:
There was one friggin gunstore in the entire city of Oakland?



At one time there were at least three, Siegle's and two others, all within walking distance of each other.

But that was decades (literally) ago.
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 9:32:22 PM EST
Speaking of Siegle's Guns, Russ and Eric (who used to be the better employees) are now at Reed's Indoor Range in Santa Clara, CA. They've got a top notch facility there.
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 9:37:14 PM EST
I did buy a gun from the B&B store in O.C. and visited the B&B store that loaned those ARs during the Shootout. A friend of mine was buying a Sig210, and the service was good. They were selling out on their inventory before the ban. Most of the salesmen were complaining about the ban and how the store would go under after it. Before the ban, B&B prices were very good and there were a lot of people there. You had to take a number to be serviced and a lot of people complained about that.
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 9:37:25 PM EST

Originally Posted By AR15fan:
It was B&B Guns. Both stores went out of business a few years later. They had horrible customer service.

BTW; none of the borrowed weapons were ever used to engage the bank robbers.


There is a thread in the Kali-fornia's hometown forum on the very subject:
What happened to B&B?
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 10:19:43 PM EST

Originally Posted By warlord:

Originally Posted By AR15fan:
It was B&B Guns. Both stores went out of business a few years later. They had horrible customer service.

BTW; none of the borrowed weapons were ever used to engage the bank robbers.


There is a thread in the Kali-fornia's hometown forum on the very subject:
What happened to B&B?



Damn that's too bad... I have fond memories of B&B in the Valley. In the early 80's my dad use to take me, for a kid this was big deal. It was a great place, big open floor plan, high ceilings, a huge counter that wrapped around three sides, big stacks of bagged shot and accessories, safes on display on the floor, they had everything. They even use to have large taxidermy, a big grizzly and some other big game on the wall. I went back years later to get my first gun, it had really deteriorated. The lines were long, the stock was low, the service was poor (surly really), and the prices weren’t the best. It's sad to think my home has become such a commie state in such a short time. I'd love to buy that place and make another go of it, but many of the things I would be inclined to stock are banned. Plus the red tape is a nightmare I’m sure.

By the way, they had a gunsmith "Doc" who worked on all my dad’s revolvers. He was a magician, the sweetest double action jobs anywhere.
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 10:27:25 PM EST

Originally Posted By Moof:

Originally Posted By byron2112:
There was one friggin gunstore in the entire city of Oakland?



At one time there were at least three, Siegle's and two others, all within walking distance of each other.

But that was decades (literally) ago.



Wow! The population of my county isn't over 35,000, and there are three gunsmiths and six FFLs in a 25 mile area that I know of. -All small timers.
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 10:44:49 PM EST

Originally Posted By Gunplay:

Originally Posted By warlord:

Originally Posted By AR15fan:
It was B&B Guns. Both stores went out of business a few years later. They had horrible customer service.

BTW; none of the borrowed weapons were ever used to engage the bank robbers.


There is a thread in the Kali-fornia's hometown forum on the very subject:
What happened to B&B?



Damn that's too bad... I have fond memories of B&B in the Valley. In the early 80's my dad use to take me, for a kid this was big deal. It was a great place, big open floor plan, high ceilings, a huge counter that wrapped around three sides, big stacks of bagged shot and accessories, safes on display on the floor, they had everything. They even use to have large taxidermy, a big grizzly and some other big game on the wall. I went back years later to get my first gun, it had really deteriorated. The lines were long, the stock was low, the service was poor (surly really), and the prices weren?t the best. It's sad to think my home has become such a commie state in such a short time. I'd love to buy that place and make another go of it, but many of the things I would be inclined to stock are banned. Plus the red tape is a nightmare I?m sure.


CA gunners are the worst pussies around when it comes to guns. They talks alot but unfortunately that's all they do. I was at the Great Western Gun show a 6 years back, and I got into an agrument with a guy who belonged to the 50 Caliber Club, and I told him that HIS gun could be an assualt weapon etc. He swore up and down it won't be banned, well today, we are just one signiture away from the ban on 50 caliber guns.
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 11:06:35 PM EST

Originally Posted By gamesniper:

BTW, the TV movie about this COMPLETELY left out the fact that the LAPD got "assault weapons" from a CILVILIAN SOURCE and it turned the tide of the firefight.

In the TV movie, the LEOs just suddenly appeared with ARs.




Yeah, and the shootout at the start of S.W.A.T. was based on this, in the DVD( I dont know why I bought it), they have a deleted scene where the cops order the gunshop owner to "go and get some rifles out of the stash in the back, and dont tell us you dont have one".

Man that was irritating.

/PHil
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 11:40:34 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/30/2004 11:51:49 PM EST

Originally Posted By Troy:
It should also be noted that the LA County DA's office charged B&B with handing out guns without a background check and (then) 15 day wait on rifles.



Unbelievable!

Cocksucke­rs


As for gun owners, yeah, there are some idiots here, like everywhere else, but the main thing is that conservatives are simply outnumbered here. Liberals from all over the country come to the PRK to be with like-minded individuals (they often first come here to go to college, or if they're gay, to move into the Castro in SF), and this steady stream of liberals has resulted in a hugely lopsided population. Let's not even mention the illegal immigrants, many of whom end up voting anyway. Remember, Al Gore won the state by 1.5 MILLION votes in 2000, in an election that was widely regarded as being split right down the middle.

-Troy



Yeah,and all the ones that can't be squeezed in down there find their way up here to the "Greater Seattle Area",and fuck everything up.

Fortunatly,for the most part,we've been able to hang on to a majority as far as firearms issues go.

Pretty much screwed on every other issue.
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 12:25:46 AM EST
B&B in NoHo was run by two brothers. One was on the up & up, other was selling inventory out the back door. They got busted, investigated, forced out of business.
Service was poor / very uneven there, and they had their problem with counter-commandos, too.
Was a big store with a very broad selection and ok prices, for a lot of years.
Liked the huge-ass stuffed bear in the glass case (or was that Pony Express'? They're gone too, now)
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 8:04:28 AM EST

Originally Posted By Troy:
It should also be noted that the LA County DA's office charged B&B with handing out guns without a background check and (then) 15 day wait on rifles.



The DA doesnt charge anyone for anything without an initial crime report being written first by some LE agency. I've never even heard of the DA consideing charges against B&B for North Hollywood. The technical "violations" they commited are typically only investigated by Cal DOJ. Additionally, poice are exempt for the 15 day waite if they jump threw certain regulatory hoops.

I have read the official reports from North Hollywood. Spoken to many of the officers involved. and watched the training filnm LAPD made afterwards. They do reference the weapons being borrowed ffrom B&B, but make clear they were never used. There is no mention of any criminal investigation in B&B.
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 8:13:12 AM EST

Originally Posted By AR15fan:

................
I have read the official reports from North Hollywood. Spoken to many of the officers involved. and watched the training filnm LAPD made afterwards. They do reference the weapons being borrowed ffrom B&B, but make clear they were never used. There is no mention of any criminal investigation in B&B.



Was the film any good or a waste of time ? What were the main points of the film ?
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 8:23:45 AM EST
they were bushmaster rifles that were given out, i saw them for sale a few years back with documentation being offered that they were the actual rifles handed out to the prk officers
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 8:41:01 AM EST

Originally Posted By cm:
yep, as ar15fan said, it was B&B. in the good days before all the restrictions and bans started, they use to have racks of ar's, styer's, h&k's - lots of eye candy. then, the restrictions and bans started, and they started to cut back on their inventory. they're service kind of depended on if they thought you were actually going to buy or not. prices were close to, or slightly below msrp on most items, but i did get some good deals on some consignment guns there. rumour was that they got accused of some firearms law violations, which weren't true, and they closed down some time after that.

anyone know the real reason for their closure?


There was a thread in arf.com about this.

B&B Sales of North Hollywood and in Orange County was a great place to buy guns:

Super low prices BUT yes, customer service was NOT for the "newbie" or undecided.

They wanted VOLUME. They got it fom me. I bought an average of one gun a year there from 1980-2001. Then they closed. I read that they had "cash flow" problems and were running late on payments to gun distributors. The ""AWB" hurt them, as it did most every gun stores.



Link Posted: 8/31/2004 8:43:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By u-baddog:

Originally Posted By AR15fan:

................
I have read the official reports from North Hollywood. Spoken to many of the officers involved. and watched the training filnm LAPD made afterwards. They do reference the weapons being borrowed ffrom B&B, but make clear they were never used. There is no mention of any criminal investigation in B&B.



Was the film any good or a waste of time ? What were the main points of the film ?



It had alot of info the media either glossed over, or just plain got wrong. Things like number of wounds sustained by the bad guys and such. The main reason the film was made was to get cops to start carrying a gunshot trauma first aid kit in their vehicles. Looking back it seems silly, but before north hollywood we didnt carry anything bigger than bandaids in the patrol cars.
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 8:45:37 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/31/2004 8:48:00 AM EST by gamesniper]
Thanks for the info, guys.

BTW, I lived in northern PRK, I know how far it is to LA. I used to work in Oakland over by the BART office.

I fondly remember Chinese new years there. Because of the neighborhood, you never knew if it was gunshots you were hearing or fireworks.
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 8:49:04 AM EST
"I bought an average of one gun a year there from 1980-2001."

Hell, I bought an average on one gun a week there. Usually sale ad in hand. checked the OC register for sale ad in thursdays sports page. then drive to B&B and buy whatever was on sale, cheap, that week. I would keep what i realy liked, sell the stuff i wasnt thrilled with. It was a fun hobby going through a couple hundred guns a year, keeping the best dozen or so.

In one trip i bought a gun safe, Mini-14 Ranch, Sig P220 2-tone and a 870 on the same day. They were complaining about all the paperwork.

In one trip to Gold Coast I bought an M1A loaded, one Eagle arms lower, and 3 Oly lowers. Used to be when you bought multiple long guns you only paid one DROS fee.
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 9:10:39 AM EST

Originally Posted By Blue84S10:
"I need some two-two-three's!" I don't understand why they didn't just run the fuckers over with an armored truck.



There isn't exactly one on every street corner, and not every "armored truck" is really armored.
Link Posted: 8/31/2004 9:45:27 AM EST

Originally Posted By AR15fan:

Originally Posted By u-baddog:

Originally Posted By AR15fan:

................
I have read the official reports from North Hollywood. Spoken to many of the officers involved. and watched the training filnm LAPD made afterwards. They do reference the weapons being borrowed ffrom B&B, but make clear they were never used. There is no mention of any criminal investigation in B&B.



Was the film any good or a waste of time ? What were the main points of the film ?



It had alot of info the media either glossed over, or just plain got wrong. Things like number of wounds sustained by the bad guys and such. The main reason the film was made was to get cops to start carrying a gunshot trauma first aid kit in their vehicles. Looking back it seems silly, but before north hollywood we didnt carry anything bigger than bandaids in the patrol cars.



I know the thought process.
Top Top