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Posted: 2/19/2016 3:24:33 PM EST
During one debate the question was asked and the Trump haters quickly posted here "Trump doesn't know what a conservative is". Then someone else posted "No one in the GOPe is a conservative". Salon.com says this of Ted Cruz "Stop calling Ted Cruz a conservative: This self-promoting narcissist is a fraud and a nihilist
Labeling Cruz a conservative underestimates how dangerous he is. It's time we called out this Messianic crusader".

Basically everyone has disqualified everyone else as being a conservative. So what is the true and only definition of conservative? People here seem to have very strong opinions. How about some of you started defining it and we will see where the discussion goes.

The definition can't be generic like "respects the Constitution" because even Obama and Hillary claim to do that. For the 2nd amendment it would have been something like believes in the private ownership of all classes of firearms for all legal actives. What about background checks, waiting periods, taxes, felons in possession...etc. Can someone believe in requiring those things and still qualify as a conservative?

Cruz has said the federal background check system needs to be strengthened. It's an existing law, so is someone in favor of strengthening an infringement to a right a conservative?
Cruz said in an interview on "Fox News Sunday." "Right now a lot of states, a lot of local jurisdictions, are not reporting criminal convictions, not reporting mental health barriers to ownership. And so the federal database is not nearly as good as it should be. That would be a common-sense improvement."


A conservative someone who believes....
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:26:03 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2016 3:26:38 PM EST by Lug1]
The Constitution, small government, fewer regulations and government intrusions.

*I left out for me, total fiscal responsibility.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:29:11 PM EST
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:32:49 PM EST
• Freedom
• Faith
• Family
• Sanctity and Dignity of Human Life
• American Exceptionalism
• The Founders’ Wisdom and Vision
• Lower Taxes
• Limited Government
• Peace Through Strength
• Anti-Communism
• Belief in the Individual

as defined by Ronald Reagan

I'll go with these
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:37:03 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History

Pretty much. Everyone disagrees with each other on what a true conservative is. There has to be some common ground on the definition though. Also if someone follows the requirement 90% does that still count or does even 1% deviation from the definition count?

For example Ted Cruz preaches fiscal responsibility, yet on numerous occasions he has voted for bills with increased government deficit spending and no way to balance that spending. Of all the candidates he is more serious about it than anyone else, yet he doesn't follow it 100%.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:42:43 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By sydney7629:
• Freedom
• Faith
• Family
• Sanctity and Dignity of Human Life
• American Exceptionalism
• The Founders’ Wisdom and Vision
• Lower Taxes
• Limited Government
• Peace Through Strength
• Anti-Communism
• Belief in the Individual

as defined by Ronald Reagan

I'll go with these
View Quote

If you put less importance on human life and possibly limited government, then you have what Trump is saying.

Remove the importance on human life and it is close to what Ted Cruz says. Cruz has advocated carpet bombing areas where ISIS is at which will kill many innocent women and children. So he can't claim he respect all human life.


Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:46:06 PM EST
Salon.com. That's where i stopped reading.

You Trump guys and your fascination with salon, huffpo, and Bloomberg News as "sources".
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:46:43 PM EST
Nobody agrees on any political definitions.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:47:41 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By SWIRE:

If you put less importance on human life and possibly limited government, then you have what Trump is saying.


Remove the importance on human life and it is close to what Ted Cruz says. Cruz has advocated carpet bombing areas where ISIS is at which will kill many innocent women and children. So he can't claim he respect all human life.

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Originally Posted By SWIRE:
Originally Posted By sydney7629:
• Freedom
• Faith
• Family
• Sanctity and Dignity of Human Life
• American Exceptionalism
• The Founders’ Wisdom and Vision
• Lower Taxes
• Limited Government
• Peace Through Strength
• Anti-Communism
• Belief in the Individual

as defined by Ronald Reagan

I'll go with these

If you put less importance on human life and possibly limited government, then you have what Trump is saying.


Remove the importance on human life and it is close to what Ted Cruz says. Cruz has advocated carpet bombing areas where ISIS is at which will kill many innocent women and children. So he can't claim he respect all human life.




If you strike:
- Freedom
- The Founders’ Wisdom and Vision
- Limited Government

Reduce the importance of :
- Faith
- Sanctity and Dignity of Human Life


Then you have Trump. The first 3 you need to strike are entire basis of conservatism.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:48:03 PM EST
Ask Donald. He seems to have good grasp on conservationism.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:48:30 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By SWIRE:

If you put less importance on human life and possibly limited government, then you have what Trump is saying.


Remove the importance on human life and it is close to what Ted Cruz says. Cruz has advocated carpet bombing areas where ISIS is at which will kill many innocent women and children. So he can't claim he respect all human life.




View Quote View All Quotes
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Originally Posted By SWIRE:
Originally Posted By sydney7629:
• Freedom
• Faith
• Family
• Sanctity and Dignity of Human Life
• American Exceptionalism
• The Founders’ Wisdom and Vision
• Lower Taxes
• Limited Government
• Peace Through Strength
• Anti-Communism
• Belief in the Individual

as defined by Ronald Reagan

I'll go with these

If you put less importance on human life and possibly limited government, then you have what Trump is saying.


Remove the importance on human life and it is close to what Ted Cruz says. Cruz has advocated carpet bombing areas where ISIS is at which will kill many innocent women and children. So he can't claim he respect all human life.







Wrong answer

When has he advocated for limited government?
Freedom? I don't think his support of Kelo and healthcare mandates jive with that
Sanctity and Dignity of Human Life? Not if you're cutting checks to Planned Parenthood
Founding Fathers' Wisdom? Have you ever heard him speak of the constitution? Demonstrate any knowledge of it?
Lower Taxes? He is planning on raising taxes on the rich
Belief in the Individual? Again, not if he believes in Kelo and the heathcare mandates

This is only if you take him at his word on his CURRENT positions.

If you look at his past, you may as well throw them all out
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:49:21 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2016 3:55:22 PM EST by Thrasymachus]
An American conservative is a mixture of classical liberalism and conservatism. An American Liberal is a mixture of classical liberalism and socialism.

Neither of the ideologies that make up American conservatism or American liberalism mesh perfectly together, which is why there is such debate about what constitutes a "true conservative", or "true liberal".

ETA: Salon.com is staffed by functional retards who would fail an introduction to American government class due to their inability to construct a coherent argument. I hope their entire staff swims with an AIDs infested dolphin wearing a rusty cock ring.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:50:47 PM EST
I'd say that having Salon say that about Cruz more than proves that yes, in fact he is a Conservative.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:51:55 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By sydney7629:
• Freedom
• Faith
• Family
• Sanctity and Dignity of Human Life
• American Exceptionalism
• The Founders’ Wisdom and Vision
• Lower Taxes
• Limited Government
• Peace Through Strength
• Anti-Communism
• Belief in the Individual

as defined by Ronald Reagan

I'll go with these
View Quote


I like the sounds of this.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:53:48 PM EST
Try defining "libertarian"! Holy shit balls, that's an elusive target!
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:57:58 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Thrasymachus:
An American conservative is a mixture of classical liberalism and conservatism. An American Liberal is a mixture of classical liberalism and socialism.

Neither of the ideologies that make up American conservatism or American liberalism mesh perfectly together, which is why there is such debate about what constitutes a "true conservative", or "true liberal".

ETA: Salon.com is staffed by functional retards who would fail my introduction to American government class due to their inability to construct a coherent argument. I hope their entire staff swims with an AIDs infested dolphin wearing a rusty cock ring.
View Quote


I disagree with the American liberal. They are more mixed with communism than socialism. They want need the fedgov to tell them what they need/want. They care less about individual liberty than they do about being collectivist.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:58:37 PM EST


Conservatives are people whose primary moral axis is divinity/disgust, rather than well being/harm as in liberals or justice/injustice as in libertarians and others (fractured axis because of two party system). The correlation is so strong as to be the same thing. Although everybody possesses all three axis, in differing ratios, the primary one is by far the most powerful, the secondary axis is also apparent in peoples political opinions.

Disgust is actually really important, it's what protects us from disease and keeps our tribe strong. Millions of years of selection for the trait.

The political landscape makes a lot more sense once you understand this, people make all sorts of bad assumptions about others because they don't.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:02:15 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By USMC0928:


I disagree with the American liberal. They are more mixed with communism than socialism. They want need the fedgov to tell them what they need/want. They care less about individual liberty than they do about being collectivist.
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Originally Posted By USMC0928:
Originally Posted By Thrasymachus:
An American conservative is a mixture of classical liberalism and conservatism. An American Liberal is a mixture of classical liberalism and socialism.

Neither of the ideologies that make up American conservatism or American liberalism mesh perfectly together, which is why there is such debate about what constitutes a "true conservative", or "true liberal".

ETA: Salon.com is staffed by functional retards who would fail my introduction to American government class due to their inability to construct a coherent argument. I hope their entire staff swims with an AIDs infested dolphin wearing a rusty cock ring.


I disagree with the American liberal. They are more mixed with communism than socialism. They want need the fedgov to tell them what they need/want. They care less about individual liberty than they do about being collectivist.


The way you describe communism is really not communism, and is filled with normative assertions that are not empirical. They are socialist, and have been so since FDR.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:03:56 PM EST
The test for Conservatism is if and only if a new policy or law meets the enhancement of personal freedom AND also limits Government. A Conservative Candidate would be a person who uses this as a guide on any given subject or law.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:07:16 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2016 4:12:17 PM EST by SWIRE]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By OKSoda:
Salon.com. That's where i stopped reading.

You Trump guys and your fascination with salon, huffpo, and Bloomberg News as "sources".
View Quote

Oh, so you are saying is some people in this country don't count even though they vote. You just ignore the opinion of others who think differently than you do. How exactly do you expect to be an informed voter when you only listen to the people telling you what you want to hear? I'm pretty sure that is the definition of an ignorant voter not an informed voter.

The Cruzettes should love the description of Cruz that Salon.com gave him because they said he goes way beyond a regular conservative. Do those extreme ideals make up what a true conservative is? That source of information is valid for the discussion.

Why are so many here afraid to read articles from liberal magazines? Are you afraid they will turn you into a liberal? Sure they are completely biased and agenda driven but voters in this country still believe some of it, just like the 9/11 truthers or the birthers. Ignoring them makes a person ignorant of the real world around them. Listening to them doesn't require you to believe what they are saying. It is just information gathering in order to look at an issue from multiple angles and then make your own informed decision.





Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:07:46 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By OKSoda:
Salon.com. That's where i stopped reading.

You Trump guys and your fascination with salon, huffpo, and Bloomberg News as "sources".
View Quote

Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:09:53 PM EST
This thread illustrates why the left will win.

Conservatism is a range of values, not a point.

Liberals don't have nearly the focus on whether or not their guy is liberal or how liberal or this test or that test. They simply want to beat the right and that's how they vote.

we sit around and debate the meaning of conservative and then stay home from voting because our candidate isn't conservative enough. We get hung up on finding the perfect candidate.

Meanwhile, the left votes for the guy that isn't a republican and wins.

Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:11:17 PM EST
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Originally Posted By PanzerOfDoom:
I'd say that having Salon say that about Cruz more than proves that yes, in fact he is a Conservative.
View Quote

He goes way beyond Conservative as a Messianic Crusader would ignore the freedoms in the constitution, force religion, and kill/destroy/imprison those who don't fall in line. It would be a reverse ISIS. But the people in GD who push him the most seem to agree those things would be good things.


Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:15:45 PM EST
If you live on an island, all alone, with no other people on the island, and there is no government, you are a conservative.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:34:25 PM EST
Limited government listening in on all your phone calls.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:42:10 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History


So true, and yet at the same time insisting that if the GOP would just run a Real Conservative, a silent majority of like minded people would flock out of the woodwork and usher him into office in a landslide victory. All this from people who think most of this site isn't conservative.

Conservatism has always covered a wide spectrum from the Ricky Bobby types to the Thomas Sowell types, it's pretty foolish to think they really have much of anything in common.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:45:41 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Cucumbermonkey:
Nobody agrees on any political definitions.
View Quote



There's a reason Orwell referred to "meaningless words" - the people who use them have a vested interest in their being no agreed definition, and words without shared meaning are meaningless.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:48:13 PM EST
It seems synonymous with "flatlander."
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:50:20 PM EST
I really don't know anymore.

These days, I'm content to just let people assign whatever label they'd like to the whole of my political positions. If you want to know where I stand on something (and most importantly - why), just ask. When you're done, feel free to assign whatever label works best for you.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:51:53 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By SWIRE:

He goes way beyond Conservative as a Messianic Crusader would ignore the freedoms in the constitution, force religion, and kill/destroy/imprison those who don't fall in line. It would be a reverse ISIS. But the people in GD who push him the most seem to agree those things would be good things.




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Originally Posted By SWIRE:
Originally Posted By PanzerOfDoom:
I'd say that having Salon say that about Cruz more than proves that yes, in fact he is a Conservative.

He goes way beyond Conservative as a Messianic Crusader would ignore the freedoms in the constitution, force religion, and kill/destroy/imprison those who don't fall in line. It would be a reverse ISIS. But the people in GD who push him the most seem to agree those things would be good things.






What liberal sites have you been on that you actually believe any of that shit? He's going to force religion and kill/imprison those who don't get with the program?

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 4:58:40 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Top_Secret:


What liberal sites have you been on that you actually believe any of that shit? He's going to force religion and kill/imprison those who don't get with the program?

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
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Originally Posted By Top_Secret:
Originally Posted By SWIRE:
Originally Posted By PanzerOfDoom:
I'd say that having Salon say that about Cruz more than proves that yes, in fact he is a Conservative.

He goes way beyond Conservative as a Messianic Crusader would ignore the freedoms in the constitution, force religion, and kill/destroy/imprison those who don't fall in line. It would be a reverse ISIS. But the people in GD who push him the most seem to agree those things would be good things.






What liberal sites have you been on that you actually believe any of that shit? He's going to force religion and kill/imprison those who don't get with the program?

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


Careful. You don't want your political label challenged by people who use left wing media as news sources all the while using the same talking points as the ultra left.

Link Posted: 2/19/2016 5:01:57 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By SWIRE:

If you put less importance on human life and possibly limited government, then you have what Trump is saying.


Remove the importance on human life and it is close to what Ted Cruz says. Cruz has advocated carpet bombing areas where ISIS is at which will kill many innocent women and children. So he can't claim he respect all human life.

View Quote View All Quotes
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Originally Posted By SWIRE:
Originally Posted By sydney7629:
• Freedom
• Faith
• Family
• Sanctity and Dignity of Human Life
• American Exceptionalism
• The Founders’ Wisdom and Vision
• Lower Taxes
• Limited Government
• Peace Through Strength
• Anti-Communism
• Belief in the Individual

as defined by Ronald Reagan

I'll go with these

If you put less importance on human life and possibly limited government, then you have what Trump is saying.


Remove the importance on human life and it is close to what Ted Cruz says. Cruz has advocated carpet bombing areas where ISIS is at which will kill many innocent women and children. So he can't claim he respect all human life.

When you consider this tactic may save more human lives than it takes I believe it doesn't devalue human life at all.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 5:05:38 PM EST
Do you even John Locke "Second Treatise on Civil Government," Bro?
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 5:11:30 PM EST
The word is Conservative. To be a conservative one must attempt to conserve something. What? The use of government. Conservatives, first and foremost, want to conserve, to reduce, to minimize, the use of big government in its total scope and power. That's where freedom is found.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 5:15:47 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2016 5:16:13 PM EST by Snips]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Vne:
The word is Conservative. To be a conservative one must attempt to conserve something. What? The use of government. Conservatives, first and foremost, want to conserve, to reduce, to minimize, the use of big government in its total scope and power. That's where freedom is found.
View Quote


Conserving something doesn't mean reducing or minimizing it. it means protecting it.

If you want to conserve government power, that means you want to protect that power and prevent it from being eroded...

This isn't even talking about political ideologies, this is just the simple definition of the word conserve.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 5:28:19 PM EST
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Originally Posted By SWIRE:

If you put less importance on human life and possibly limited government, then you have what Trump is saying.


Remove the importance on human life and it is close to what Ted Cruz says. Cruz has advocated carpet bombing areas where ISIS is at which will kill many innocent women and children. So he can't claim he respect all human life.




View Quote View All Quotes
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Originally Posted By SWIRE:
Originally Posted By sydney7629:
• Freedom
• Faith
• Family
• Sanctity and Dignity of Human Life
• American Exceptionalism
• The Founders’ Wisdom and Vision
• Lower Taxes
• Limited Government
• Peace Through Strength
• Anti-Communism
• Belief in the Individual

as defined by Ronald Reagan

I'll go with these

If you put less importance on human life and possibly limited government, then you have what Trump is saying.


Remove the importance on human life and it is close to what Ted Cruz says. Cruz has advocated carpet bombing areas where ISIS is at which will kill many innocent women and children. So he can't claim he respect all human life.






I don't believe any of presidential candidates have a military background or a good grasp of what is or is not effective. That being said; the lives of America's sons and daughters aught to matter a whole lot more than the lives of future terrorists and those who raise them.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 5:30:50 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By OKSoda:
Salon.com. That's where i stopped reading.

You Trump guys and your fascination with salon, huffpo, and Bloomberg News as "sources".
View Quote
Yep. Disgraceful that they are being led into their madness by the most leftist hacks in the MSM.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 5:34:08 PM EST
Depends......do you mean social consercative....or fiscal? Or geopolitical? Or theological? This thread needs uuuuuggggeee clarification.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 5:34:34 PM EST
In before Bigstick61 and Thrasymachus?
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 5:41:41 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By SWIRE:

He goes way beyond Conservative as a Messianic Crusader would ignore the freedoms in the constitution, force religion, and kill/destroy/imprison those who don't fall in line. It would be a reverse ISIS. But the people in GD who push him the most seem to agree those things would be good things.




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Originally Posted By SWIRE:
Originally Posted By PanzerOfDoom:
I'd say that having Salon say that about Cruz more than proves that yes, in fact he is a Conservative.

He goes way beyond Conservative as a Messianic Crusader would ignore the freedoms in the constitution, force religion, and kill/destroy/imprison those who don't fall in line. It would be a reverse ISIS. But the people in GD who push him the most seem to agree those things would be good things.





According to Salon, ha!

Not far enough, should be pushing to repeal amendments 16&17, term limits for Congress and judges, balanced budget amendment among other things.

He is as Conservative as it will get in this race but alas he is a Constitutionalist; where again does it talk about forcing religion on people there again? I can't find it.

Trump magically found Conservatism when? Sometime last year?
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 5:47:31 PM EST
The root word is conserve and that's important. What defines conservatives and conservatism is a desire to preserve the constitution and it's original intent. Just as important is the desire to conserve the values and principles that are and were the underpinning of the constitution. Specifically:

-Individual freedom and liberty
Economic liberty (aka capitalism)
-Aggressively limited federal government
-rights are not granted by government. They exist independent of government.
-The primary role of government is to protect and preserve those rights.
-republicanism. (With a small r)
-Personal responsibility.


To name just a few. You'll notice I don't put any of the polar social issues in there. Opposing gay marriage for example is not conservative. Real conservatism is believing that we should all be able to do whatever the hell we want to do as long as we dont violate the rights of others. Real conservatism is believing the feds should have nothing to do with any kind of marriage.

That's why I don't like the term "social conservative" or "fiscal conservative". There is no such thing. There is just conservative or not.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 5:54:04 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2016 5:55:47 PM EST by Vne]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Snips:


Conserving something doesn't mean reducing or minimizing it. it means protecting it.

If you want to conserve government power, that means you want to protect that power and prevent it from being eroded...

This isn't even talking about political ideologies, this is just the simple definition of the word conserve.
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Originally Posted By Snips:
Originally Posted By Vne:
The word is Conservative. To be a conservative one must attempt to conserve something. What? The use of government. Conservatives, first and foremost, want to conserve, to reduce, to minimize, the use of big government in its total scope and power. That's where freedom is found.


Conserving something doesn't mean reducing or minimizing it. it means protecting it.

If you want to conserve government power, that means you want to protect that power and prevent it from being eroded...

This isn't even talking about political ideologies, this is just the simple definition of the word conserve.


If you've got a shaker full of salt on your dinner table and one person plans on conserving their use of it while another plans on using it liberally, who uses more salt? Replace salt with government.

I didn't say you are conserving government. I said you are conserving the use of government.

Conserve also means to prevent the wasteful overuse of...
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 5:57:59 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Vne:


If you've got a shaker full of salt on your dinner table and one person plans on conserving their use of it while another plans on using it liberally, who uses more salt? Replace salt with government.

I didn't say you are conserving government. I said you are conserving the use of government.

Conserve also means to prevent the wasteful overuse of...
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Originally Posted By Vne:
Originally Posted By Snips:
Originally Posted By Vne:
The word is Conservative. To be a conservative one must attempt to conserve something. What? The use of government. Conservatives, first and foremost, want to conserve, to reduce, to minimize, the use of big government in its total scope and power. That's where freedom is found.


Conserving something doesn't mean reducing or minimizing it. it means protecting it.

If you want to conserve government power, that means you want to protect that power and prevent it from being eroded...

This isn't even talking about political ideologies, this is just the simple definition of the word conserve.


If you've got a shaker full of salt on your dinner table and one person plans on conserving their use of it while another plans on using it liberally, who uses more salt? Replace salt with government.

I didn't say you are conserving government. I said you are conserving the use of government.

Conserve also means to prevent the wasteful overuse of...


Link Posted: 2/19/2016 6:05:41 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Thrasymachus:


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Originally Posted By Thrasymachus:
Originally Posted By Vne:
Originally Posted By Snips:
Originally Posted By Vne:
The word is Conservative. To be a conservative one must attempt to conserve something. What? The use of government. Conservatives, first and foremost, want to conserve, to reduce, to minimize, the use of big government in its total scope and power. That's where freedom is found.


Conserving something doesn't mean reducing or minimizing it. it means protecting it.

If you want to conserve government power, that means you want to protect that power and prevent it from being eroded...

This isn't even talking about political ideologies, this is just the simple definition of the word conserve.


If you've got a shaker full of salt on your dinner table and one person plans on conserving their use of it while another plans on using it liberally, who uses more salt? Replace salt with government.

I didn't say you are conserving government. I said you are conserving the use of government.

Conserve also means to prevent the wasteful overuse of...




Another definition straight from a dictionary: "To use carefully or sparingly."

You people do realize words have multiple meanings depending on their context right? Did you think they just chose that word at random to use as a label for a political mindset?
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 6:11:00 PM EST
I liked the old Berenstein world, the one where 90% of the population wasn't on the autism spectrum.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 6:26:54 PM EST
Belief in the Constitution and limited government.
Belief in free market capitallism
Charity for the needy are from the hearts of individuals (what would Hay-Seuss do?) instead of threat of incarceration by goobmint
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 7:12:02 PM EST
I like how people make up their own definition of conservatism so they don't have to admit to being a social progressive.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 7:53:38 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Thrasymachus:
An American conservative is a mixture of classical liberalism and conservatism. An American Liberal is a mixture of classical liberalism and socialism.

Neither of the ideologies that make up American conservatism or American liberalism mesh perfectly together, which is why there is such debate about what constitutes a "true conservative", or "true liberal".

ETA: Salon.com is staffed by functional retards who would fail an introduction to American government class due to their inability to construct a coherent argument. I hope their entire staff swims with an AIDs infested dolphin wearing a rusty cock ring.
View Quote


THIS
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 8:42:24 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Snips:


Conserving something doesn't mean reducing or minimizing it. it means protecting it.

If you want to conserve government power, that means you want to protect that power and prevent it from being eroded...

This isn't even talking about political ideologies, this is just the simple definition of the word conserve.
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Originally Posted By Snips:
Originally Posted By Vne:
The word is Conservative. To be a conservative one must attempt to conserve something. What? The use of government. Conservatives, first and foremost, want to conserve, to reduce, to minimize, the use of big government in its total scope and power. That's where freedom is found.


Conserving something doesn't mean reducing or minimizing it. it means protecting it.

If you want to conserve government power, that means you want to protect that power and prevent it from being eroded...

This isn't even talking about political ideologies, this is just the simple definition of the word conserve.


Conservative has acquired a more specific philosophical meaning in the Western political context. It's moved well beyond simple dictionary definitions (which people are foolish to use to define any sort of technical term; they make specialized dictionaries for such things, such as political dictionaries, medical dictionaries, and polytechnic dictionaries).
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 8:44:54 PM EST
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Originally Posted By adrock1:
The root word is conserve and that's important. What defines conservatives and conservatism is a desire to preserve the constitution and it's original intent. Just as important is the desire to conserve the values and principles that are and were the underpinning of the constitution. Specifically:

-Individual freedom and liberty
Economic liberty (aka capitalism)
-Aggressively limited federal government
-rights are not granted by government. They exist independent of government.
-The primary role of government is to protect and preserve those rights.
-republicanism. (With a small r)
-Personal responsibility.


To name just a few. You'll notice I don't put any of the polar social issues in there. Opposing gay marriage for example is not conservative. Real conservatism is believing that we should all be able to do whatever the hell we want to do as long as we dont violate the rights of others. Real conservatism is believing the feds should have nothing to do with any kind of marriage.

That's why I don't like the term "social conservative" or "fiscal conservative". There is no such thing. There is just conservative or not.
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You are right about the last statement. Conservatism is an over-arching idea, not something broken down into little areas. However, you are wrong about much of the rest. It should be noted that the effort to connect conservatism specifically to the U.S. Constitution in the currently practiced manner is fairly novel. It's about philosophical principles that predate and overarch the Constitution, the latter of which can either conform with them or be contrary to them, and in some ways it has been amended in a contrary fashion.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 8:48:11 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Bohr_Adam:



There's a reason Orwell referred to "meaningless words" - the people who use them have a vested interest in their being no agreed definition, and words without shared meaning are meaningless.
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Originally Posted By Bohr_Adam:
Originally Posted By Cucumbermonkey:
Nobody agrees on any political definitions.



There's a reason Orwell referred to "meaningless words" - the people who use them have a vested interest in their being no agreed definition, and words without shared meaning are meaningless.


The thing is, it's not a meaningless word in this context, but certain parties have endeavoured to turn it into one for their own political benefit (such as the so-called neoconservatives). To say so is to ignore decades of writing by the intellectual leaders of the Right.

I do think the phenomenon which has resulted in the word losing its meaning bears relation to a quote by Confucius: "When words lose their meaning, people lose their freedom." Look at which side twists language and uses euphemisms the most. It's not the Right.
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