What does Al Queda really want?

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Posted: 9/10/2010 8:44:35 PM EDT

Perhaps I am being too "Western" here...but I've always thought of terrorism as impotent.

Yes, terrorists can blow up buildings, kill people and disrupt our economy. But they can never win.

There is no rational hope that Sharia law will ever prevail here, and I would think that they guys at the top of groups like Al Queda have to know this.

(I'm assuming for a moment that Bin Laden is not completely stoopid)

So...are their motives really "religious" or are they political? What's their angle, really? Are they trying to extort money or what?

I don't get it.

Discuss.

Posted: 9/10/2010 8:49:40 PM EDT

[#1]

What they really want is the extermination of everybody else and then war between their sub groups. Remember, they LOVE death but hate life. They are very liberal in that respect and it's this shared common ground that makes liberals love and respect them.

Posted: 9/10/2010 8:51:06 PM EDT

[#2]

Conversion or death. Always been that way since Muhammad. Check the history...

Posted: 9/10/2010 8:56:49 PM EDT

[#3]

Theocratic Fascism... That is the crucible of their existence.. Their entire mindset depends on war against the enemies of Islam. They would love nothing more to see the most successful nations on Earth be subjected to the shadow of the crescent moon.

They are literally mankind's oldest enemy.

I wish them all nothing but death and suffering.

Posted: 9/10/2010 8:57:36 PM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
Conversion or death. Always been that way since Muhammad. Check the history...

Yup, they want to kill us because we're not crazy muslims who think like them.
And the taliban is a perverted bunch of pedophile inbreads. Literally.
Mix that with a whole country full of them, and a few with lots of money, and blam.

Posted: 9/10/2010 8:59:29 PM EDT

[#5]

They find something to hate and they fight against it, even though it is an unwinnable fight. If we were to pull out of all Muslim countries tomorrow (military, business, tourism, government) they would still hate us.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:01:38 PM EDT

[#6]

A hug.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:01:40 PM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Conversion or death. Always been that way since Muhammad. Check the history...

Yup, they want to kill us because we're not crazy muslims who think like them.
And the taliban is a perverted bunch of pedophile inbreads. Literally.
Mix that with a whole country full of them, and a few with lots of money, and blam.

Makes sense to me.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:05:16 PM EDT

[#8]

Al Queda's immediate goal is to drive western influence out of the middle east. The larger goal is to establish truly "Islamic" governments, or more accurately, one large pan-Islamic government over the entire region. They want to unite and purify Islam, and western interests in that region put they, and us, at odds.

Stated larger goals are a bit out there, like building an islamic army in the middle east and wage an apocalyptic war cleansing all non-believers.

Taliban controlled (pre 2001) Afghanistan is a good model for what they would like the entire middle east to look like.

Could they be successful?

on the larger point of cleansing the world, and destroying the USA in the process, well i would not bet on that horse.

Could they successfully topple one, or several middle eastern dictatorships and replace them with religious rule? Yeah they probably could, if someone (us) does not have the resolve to stop them.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:06:28 PM EDT

[#9]

This was covered in the movie Independence day

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:06:53 PM EDT

[#10]

They want a Caliphate.

A big one.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:07:07 PM EDT

[#11]

They just want to kill people and act like barbarians. If they achieved all their "goals" of a purely Islamic existence on this planet, they would immediately set about killing each other over some other bullshit IMO.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:09:09 PM EDT

[#12]

The OP's question is framed with the assumption that members of Al Queda et al are in fact rational human beings with the ability to choose between right and wrong. All I can point out to you is that once a person sells their soul to the Devil, they no longer can discern between right and wrong, ergo they are no longer rational human beings. Their only ability now is to do evil, they cannot control what they do. They may not even enjoy what they are doing but they cannot stop because the Satanic force inside them compels them to do evil.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:13:11 PM EDT

[#13]

I've heard they'd like a nice glass parking lot!

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:14:51 PM EDT

[#14]

They want world caliphate. Basically a Islamic empire and they want to force everyone to be Muslims.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:16:14 PM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:

The OP's question is framed with the assumption that members of Al Queda et al are in fact rational human beings with the ability to choose between right and wrong. All I can point out to you is that once a person sells their soul to the Devil, they no longer can discern between right and wrong, ergo they are no longer rational human beings. Their only ability now is to do evil, they cannot control what they do. They may not even enjoy what they are doing but they cannot stop because the Satanic force inside them compels them to do evil.

or theyyre just insane evil ppl.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:16:45 PM EDT

[#16]

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:17:24 PM EDT

[#17]

It's been awhile, but didn't Bin Laden say on a couple of occasions that pulling our troops from their "Muslim Holy Lands" as well as a more balanced approach toward dealing with Israel/Middle East relations would end the terrorism from his group? There was probably more to it and this is what sticks in my mind. Seems to me that terrorism works much like kidnapping, without some demands being made there's little motive to commit the crime. Lying about what you want doesn't make much sense in that scenerio. Read the transcripts of his messages to the American public and maybe the answer is in there. What his agenda within the Middle East is, given our retreat from their politics, would be another topic.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:20:01 PM EDT

[#18]

Muslim domination of the entire world. To erect a mosque on the ruins of Ground Zero, to replace the Constitution with Sharia Law, to slaughter anyone who is not a follower.

Al Qaeda and the other terrorist groups are just the ones who speak out and don't give a damn. The others just sit quiet and hope.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:22:31 PM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:
It's been awhile, but didn't Bin Laden say on a couple of occasions that pulling our troops from their "Muslim Holy Lands" as well as a more balanced approach toward dealing with Israel/Middle East relations would end the terrorism from his group? There was probably more to it and this is what sticks in my mind. Seems to me that terrorism works much like kidnapping, without some demands being made there's little motive to commit the crime. Lying about what you want doesn't make much sense in that scenerio. Read the transcripts of his messages to the American public and maybe the answer is in there. What his agenda within the Middle East is, given our retreat from their politics, would be another topic.

Funny... Too bad you go back in time to around 711 and ask the Spanish why they were being invaded. Total domination is their goal.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:24:09 PM EDT

[#20]

They want all of us to die !!

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:24:19 PM EDT

[#21]

They want a few things, but at the top of the list:

1) Exterminate the west (Great Satan)
2) Fuck Goats
3) Have gay sex
4) Claim its all in the name of Allah

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:24:54 PM EDT

[#22]

Excerpt from an article about Thomas Jefferson and the Barbary Pirates:

The Americans wanted to negotiate a peace treaty based on Congress' vote to appease.

During the meeting Jefferson and Adams asked the Dey's ambassador why Muslims held so
much hostility towards America, a nation with which they had no previous contacts.

In a later meeting with the American Congress, the two future presidents reported that
Ambassador Sidi Haji Abdul Rahman Adja had answered that Islam "was founded on the Laws
of their Prophet, that it was written in their Quran, that all nations who should not have
acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon
them wherever they could be found, and to make slaves of all they could take as Prisoners, and
that every Musselman (Muslim) who should be slain in Battle was sure to go to Paradise."

For the following 15 years, the American government paid the Muslims millions of dollars for
the safe passage of American ships or the return of American hostages. The payments in ransom
and tribute amounted to 20 percent of United States government annual revenues in 1800.

Not long after Jefferson's inauguration as president in 1801, he dispatched a group of frigates to
defend American interests in the Mediterranean, and informed Congress.

Declaring that America was going to spend "millions for defense but not one cent for tribute,"
Jefferson pressed the issue by deploying American Marines and many of America's best
warships to the Muslim Barbary Coast.

The USS Constitution, USS Constellation, USS Philadelphia, USS Chesapeake, USS Argus,
USS Syren and USS Intrepid all saw action.

In 1805, American Marines marched across the desert from Egypt into Tripolitania, forcing the
surrender of Tripoli and the freeing of all American slaves.

During the Jefferson administration, the Muslim Barbary States, crumbling as a result of intense
American naval bombardment and on shore raids by Marines, finally officially agreed to abandon
slavery and piracy.

Jefferson's victory over the Muslims lives on today in the Marine Hymn, with the line,
"From the halls of Montezuma, to the shores of Tripoli,
We fight our country's battles in the air, on land and sea."

It wasn't until 1815 that the problem was fully settled by the total defeat of all the Muslim slave
trading pirates.

Jefferson had been right. The "medium of war" was the only way to put and end to the Muslim

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:27:53 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
It's been awhile, but didn't Bin Laden say on a couple of occasions that pulling our troops from their "Muslim Holy Lands" as well as a more balanced approach toward dealing with Israel/Middle East relations would end the terrorism from his group? There was probably more to it and this is what sticks in my mind. Seems to me that terrorism works much like kidnapping, without some demands being made there's little motive to commit the crime. Lying about what you want doesn't make much sense in that scenerio. Read the transcripts of his messages to the American public and maybe the answer is in there. What his agenda within the Middle East is, given our retreat from their politics, would be another topic.

It's a real hard issue, but the above is fairly accurate. The last election brought us Dumbo solely because of the issue of Iraq.

Way back when I studied counter-terrorism one thing we were taught was that it stops being about whatever they claim it's about and becomes solely about the violence. In other words, if our military pulled out of the Middle East, then there'd be some other damned thing we're not doing right to "justify" the continuing violence. Eventually, the violence itself becomes the end, and not the political aims originally set out.

They want to conquer and convert the world - a Caliphate. And their "in sha'allah" allows them essentially carte blanche into how they do it.

The real problem is that Feminism is singly responsible for every aspect of the collapse of the West. And on the plus side, some Muslims here seem to be bending over backwards to accommodate the Feminists, so hopefully their culture will be destroyed in a few years...

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:29:49 PM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:

Excerpt from an article about Thomas Jefferson and the Barbary Pirates:

The Americans wanted to negotiate a peace treaty based on Congress' vote to appease.

During the meeting Jefferson and Adams asked the Dey's ambassador why Muslims held somuch hostility towards America, a nation with which they had no previous contacts.

In a later meeting with the American Congress, the two future presidents reported thatAmbassador Sidi Haji Abdul Rahman Adja had answered that Islam "was founded on the Lawsof their Prophet, that it was written in their Quran, that all nations who should not haveacknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war uponthem wherever they could be found, and to make slaves of all they could take as Prisoners, andthat every Musselman (Muslim) who should be slain in Battle was sure to go to Paradise."

For the following 15 years, the American government paid the Muslims millions of dollars forthe safe passage of American ships or the return of American hostages. The payments in ransomand tribute amounted to 20 percent of United States government annual revenues in 1800.

Not long after Jefferson's inauguration as president in 1801, he dispatched a group of frigates todefend American interests in the Mediterranean, and informed Congress.

Declaring that America was going to spend "millions for defense but not one cent for tribute,"Jefferson pressed the issue by deploying American Marines and many of America's bestwarships to the Muslim Barbary Coast.

The USS Constitution, USS Constellation, USS Philadelphia, USS Chesapeake, USS Argus,USS Syren and USS Intrepid all saw action.

In 1805, American Marines marched across the desert from Egypt into Tripolitania, forcing thesurrender of Tripoli and the freeing of all American slaves.

During the Jefferson administration, the Muslim Barbary States, crumbling as a result of intenseAmerican naval bombardment and on shore raids by Marines, finally officially agreed to abandonslavery and piracy.

Jefferson's victory over the Muslims lives on today in the Marine Hymn, with the line, "From the halls of Montezuma, to the shores of Tripoli, We fight our country's battles in the air, on land and sea."

It wasn't until 1815 that the problem was fully settled by the total defeat of all the Muslim slavetrading pirates.

Jefferson had been right. The "medium of war" was the only way to put and end to the Muslim

BRILLIANT!!

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:33:38 PM EDT

[#25]

September 20, 2007 7:00 A.M.

What Does Bin Laden Want?

Al Qaeda dreams.

We’ve been arguing over al Qaeda’s aims since before 9/11. Some take Osama bin Laden’s specific complaints
seriously. But we shouldn’t, as we learned this month from his latest
rambling communiqué, which faulted America for seemingly everything —
global warming, high interest rates, shaky home mortgages, and free-market democratic capitalism itself.

Remember
that back in the 1990s, he declared war on America for three other
reasons: We had troops in Saudi Arabia. The United Nations had imposed
sanctions on Iraq. And America supported Israel. Now it apparently
matters little that there are neither embargoes of Iraq nor American
soldiers in Saudi Arabia.

In 2004, bin Laden objected to our logical conclusion that he
instead hated the West simply for its freedom. He posed this rhetorical
question: "Contrary to what Bush says and claims — that we hate freedom
— let him tell us then, ‘Why did we not attack Sweden?’”

I think we can now answer that by pointing out that al-Qaida has
just put out a $100,000 murder bounty on a Swedish cartoonist who was a
little too free in his caricatures of Islam. Note that Sweden has no
troops in Iraq or Afghanistan, lets in plenty of Middle Eastern Muslims
and wants no part of George Bush’s "war on terror.”

But then radical Islamists have also threatened Danish cartoonists,
Dutch filmmakers, German opera producers, and the pope. All have
nothing to do with Iraq or Afghanistan or Israel — but simply do things
that radical Islam finds blasphemous.

So aren’t these constantly changing gripes of al Qaeda’s just
pretexts for bin Laden’s larger hatred of Western-inspired freedom?

The truth is that bin Laden and al Qaeda want power for themselves,
and use religious grievances and shifting political demands to try to
achieve it.

In their worldview, Islam’s chance for a renewed united Muslim
caliphate was shattered into impotent warring nations by sneaky
19th-century European colonists. They now want to reunite modern Arab
nations into an Islamic empire run by the likes of bin Laden and his
sidekick, Ayman al-Zawahiri.

And they think they can pull it off for a variety of reasons.

First, al Qaeda claims its jihadists drove the Soviet Union out of
Afghanistan, leading to the unraveling of the Soviet empire. It doesn’t
matter that al Qaeda’s terrorists numbered only a few thousand and
played a minor role in the Afghan warlords’ victory. Instead, according
to al Qaeda’s propaganda, this tiny Arab legion would become the
vanguard of a world-conquering army that would move next against the
United States.

Second, bin Laden believes we will ultimately prove weak and suffer
the Soviets’ fate. That’s why he keeps talking about breaking up our
own states on the model of the now-defunct Soviet Union.

Past American hesitation in the face of attacks on our embassies,
military assets and diplomats convinced bin Laden as he plotted 9/11
that we would leave the Middle East to his jihadists. He sees us now
squabbling over the costs of Iraq, our counterterrorism measures and
Guantanamo Bay. So he still holds out hope that Americans will soon be
leaving the region in defeat, and letting down their guard at home.

Third, oil is now sky-high at $80 a barrel. In bin Laden’s view, the
longer he is at war, the higher the price of petroleum climbs. That
impoverishes Western infidels and ensures that plenty of Middle East
petrodollars can be siphoned off to madrassas, radical mosques and
terrorists.

Bin Laden also sees how the rival Muslim theocracy in Iran has turned its oil profits into a nuclear-weapons program.
He’d like to replace the present Gulf monarchies with self-professed
imams and jihadists. Such a single, united Wahhabi theocracy could dole
out its oil to subservient importers, and use the profits to acquire
enough weapons to unite the Arab world and prepare for the final war
against us.

Bin Laden’s problem then is not really tiny Israel or global warming or mortgage interest
rates, but an all-powerful and free West led by the United States. It
alone has the military and economic power to stop radical Islamists.
Plus, we bring the more powerful message of political freedom. And
American popular culture, with its informality and egalitarianism, is
sweeping the globe, seducing far more adherents than does rote
memorization of the Koran.

So, despite bin Laden’s bragging, America remains the big stumbling
block, the stronger horse. The United States alone ensures that bin
Laden stays a sick man babbling in a cave — and not a Muslim caliph in
flowing robes, with billions of dollars in oil under his feet and
weapons merchants lined up at his palace door.

Sound absurd? So once did the notion of a crater in Manhattan and $80 a barrel oil.

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/222224/what-does-bin-laden-want/victor-davis-hanson

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:35:34 PM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:

Perhaps I am being too "Western" here...but I've always thought of terrorism as impotent.

Yes, terrorists can blow up buildings, kill people and disrupt our economy. But they can never win.

There is no rational hope that Sharia law will ever prevail here, and I would think that they guys at the top of groups like Al Queda have to know this.

(I'm assuming for a moment that Bin Laden is not completely stoopid)

So...are their motives really "religious" or are they political? What's their angle, really? Are they trying to extort money or what?

I don't get it.

Discuss.

I'm not so sure.

Al Queda's initial objective was to force the US out of Saudi Arabia and overthrow the Saudi government, but now I think they'll settle for global jihad.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:36:51 PM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
What they really want is the extermination of everybody else and then war between their sub groups. Remember, they LOVE death but hate life. They are very liberal in that respect and it's this shared common ground that makes liberals love and respect them.

This just makes sense.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:41:05 PM EDT

[#28]

http://www.lib.ecu.edu/govdoc/terrorism.html#binladen
"The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies –– civilians and military –– is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque and the holy mosque [Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim. This is in accordance with the words of Almighty Allah, 'and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together,' and 'fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah.'
We –– with Allah's help –– call on every Muslim who believes in Allah and wishes to be rewarded to comply with Allah's order to kill the Americans and plunder their money wherever and whenever they find it. We also call on Muslim ulema, leaders, youths, and soldiers to launch the raid on Satan's U.S. troops and the devil's supporters allying with them, and to displace those who are behind them so that they may learn a lesson."
~ Osama Bin Laden, February 23, 1998

There ya' go "Kill The Americans" everywhere we are because... we had troops stationed in Saudi Arabia.
We're weren't at war with Saudi Arabia, our troops weren't massacring Muslims there - or anywhere.
We simply were "infidels" eating, sleeping and working in a MUSLIM nation - at the request of that nation's leader.
Period.
We simply existed in a place that offended OSAMA'S personal religious beliefs.
We were there legally and peacefully at the Saudi leader's request to protect Saudi Arabia from Saddam during Gulf War I who had already invaded, over-ran and looted and slaughtered the MUSLIM people of Kuwait.
Kill all Americans because OSAMA'S religious beliefs were offended.

Osama's "Letter To America" November 24th, 2002 http://observer.guardian.co.uk/worldview/story/0,11581,845725,00.html

Question: What are we calling you to, and what do we want from you?

Bin Laden's Answer:"(1) The first thing that we are calling you to is Islam."

.

.

.
"You are the nation who, rather than ruling by the Shariah of Allah in its Constitution and Laws, choose to invent your own laws as you will and desire. You separate religion from your policies, contradicting the pure nature which affirms Absolute Authority to the Lord and your Creator.
.
.
.
If you fail to respond to all these conditions, then prepare for fight with the Islamic Nation."

His FIRST demand is that we all become Muslim.
The rest of his demands were for us to reject our of freedom, Church/State separation etc. - the very foundations of our Constitutional Republic.
And so yes - they do hate us for our freedom.
And his threat - "respond to ALL of these" demands (including the first) or we will kill you.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:44:05 PM EDT

[#29]

Us. Dead.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:44:18 PM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:

Quoted:
It's been awhile, but didn't Bin Laden say on a couple of occasions that pulling our troops from their "Muslim Holy Lands" as well as a more balanced approach toward dealing with Israel/Middle East relations would end the terrorism from his group? There was probably more to it and this is what sticks in my mind. Seems to me that terrorism works much like kidnapping, without some demands being made there's little motive to commit the crime. Lying about what you want doesn't make much sense in that scenerio. Read the transcripts of his messages to the American public and maybe the answer is in there. What his agenda within the Middle East is, given our retreat from their politics, would be another topic.

It's a real hard issue, but the above is fairly accurate. The last election brought us Dumbo solely because of the issue of Iraq.

Way back when I studied counter-terrorism one thing we were taught was that it stops being about whatever they claim it's about and becomes solely about the violence. In other words, if our military pulled out of the Middle East, then there'd be some other damned thing we're not doing right to "justify" the continuing violence. Eventually, the violence itself becomes the end, and not the political aims originally set out.

They want to conquer and convert the world - a Caliphate. And their "in sha'allah" allows them essentially carte blanche into how they do it.

The real problem is that Feminism is singly responsible for every aspect of the collapse of the West. And on the plus side, some Muslims here seem to be bending over backwards to accommodate the Feminists, so hopefully their culture will be destroyed in a few years...

I agree. One thing to keep in mind is that a radical fringe group like this has no chance of conquering the world. Their customs are of little appeal to anyone so there would be much bloodshed before they ultimately succumbed if it really got that far that it gained any momentum. I also agree about feminism. I tell my wife every so often that it is when women got the right to vote that things really started going downhill.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:46:59 PM EDT

[#31]

Pussy.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:47:04 PM EDT

[#32]

Power. Islam doesn't care about time. Their methods are impotent now. What if they continue for the next 500 years? 1000 years? In Islam it does not matter. They can wait us out––it is an integral part of their religion. Remember, ever defeat Islamic forces faced in the last 1400 years had to be explained as either "allah is punishing you," or, "allah does not want this to happen yet, but keep trying––eventually he will want you to win."

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:48:06 PM EDT

[#33]

Quoted:
Pussy.

I think the answer is dick. Camel dick.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:54:29 PM EDT

[#34]

I don't really give a fuck what they want. I want them to die. Fuck justice, fuck prison time, death. Pure and simple.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:56:32 PM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:

This was covered in the movie Independence day

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Rw5MosKRm4

I was coming to post that LOL

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:58:44 PM EDT

[#36]

You don't have to ask arfcom, just read his various letters (like Macallen posted) or watch thier videos. I suppose the best ones are the ones with the Hippy kid from California whos now a jihadi!

I think his name is 'Shazzam the American' or something. Adam Gahdan.

His advice includes ––
Read the Koran obviously.
Read Noam Chomsky. (American communist. lefty.)
Stop global warming.

I'm not even kidding about that. They are not stupid. This Adam Gahdan (american al-queda) knows that right now the leftists are the biggest supporters in the USA of radical Islam. Real muslims are only 1% of the pop. So how much of a pool of help could they get from them? But they can get plenty of help from communists and leftists and hippys. They don't ask them to bomb anything, just corrode american will the way they did in Vietnam etc. But they can't really do that appealing to them from an Islamic perspective SO they try to "speak their language" about global warming, corporations being all, you know, corporationey. Stuff like that. They also get help from Paulbots, Troofers etc.

Posted: 9/10/2010 9:59:28 PM EDT

[#37]

kosher bacon

Posted: 9/10/2010 10:07:48 PM EDT

[#38]

PTA meeting in the near future.

Posted: 9/10/2010 11:30:20 PM EDT

[#39]

They want what every foreigner wants:

Our women, especially the blondes.

Clean underware.

Their own sex-goat.

Twelve virgin donkeys.

An autographed picture of Obama.

A good hot dog, hard to get in the middle east.

Posted: 9/10/2010 11:47:02 PM EDT

[#40]

Well for one, they want you to.........

SPELL THEIR NAME CORRECTLY, ITS AL QAEDA,
SOMETIMES SPELLED AL QAIDA,
BUT NEVER SPELLED AL QUEDA YOU INFIDEL!!

Posted: 9/11/2010 12:11:27 AM EDT

[#41]

Quoted:
Perhaps I am being too "Western" here...but I've always thought of terrorism as impotent.

Yes, terrorists can blow up buildings, kill people and disrupt our economy. But they can never win.

There is no rational hope that Sharia law will ever prevail here, and I would think that they guys at the top of groups like Al Queda have to know this.

(I'm assuming for a moment that Bin Laden is not completely stoopid)

So...are their motives really "religious" or are they political? What's their angle, really? Are they trying to extort money or what?

I don't get it.

Discuss.

The angle is power. They want to make it too expensive, in every way, for us to be a power player in the middle east. Then they want to infiltrate and gradually take over neighboring nations, with the expressed intent of eventually doing that to all of the world.

So like Pinky and the Brain, they're trying to do the same thing they do every night......Try to take over the woooooorld.

The scary bit is that if they move slow enough and whine about being repressed oppressed and depressed enough, we seem to let them make progress towards their goals. I really don't understand why we do that.

Posted: 9/11/2010 12:12:47 AM EDT

[#42]

Time, Love and Tenderness.

I don't know why a Michael Bolton song popped into my head when I read this thread title.

Posted: 9/11/2010 12:13:41 AM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:

Conversion or death. Always been that way since Muhammad. Check the history...

Pretty simple, actually...

Posted: 9/11/2010 12:19:45 AM EDT

[#44]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Conversion or death. Always been that way since Muhammad. Check the history...

Pretty simple, actually...

Unless you are a Christian, Jew, or Zoroastrian AFTER they have conquered your home and their law dominates. From a conservative Islamic perspective anyway.

Iran is a great example of how that works. When the Arabs conquered the Persian Empire, the Christians, Jews, and Zoroastrians living in Iran were allowed to continue living as they had in the past (though they were not allowed to evangelize or anything), but most Persians converted so they could get into government AND avoid the non-Muslim tax (which later changed to a non-Arab tax because so many figured out this obvious loophole). However, in the eastern empire, Buddhists were prevalent. They controlled (to the previous benefit of both the Persians and the Chinese) the eastern trade routes. The Muslims told them to convert or be killed since they were not people of the book.

Most of the died. And it's why I wear buddhist prayer beads as a necklace even though I'm a Christian––so I never forget what some would do to me (since I was born a Muslim, but became a Christian, I get auto-death) if they had the chance.

Posted: 9/11/2010 12:48:09 AM EDT

[#45]

Quoted:
Conversion or death. Always been that way since Muhammad. Check the history...