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Posted: 10/1/2004 3:34:26 AM EST


Usually I tell them to STFU… they are great guys and all but Jesu… this same tired argument get’s old. Especially when I come in every year with a buck that required one shot. When will the .223 get the respect it deserves? The AR is a great platform to hunt deer. Every year I have to suffer thru comments like un-sportsmanlike, unnecessary, won’t kill reliably, ugly, unreliable. You know the usual “guns and ammo” crap.

They can argue the merits of 270 vs 30-06 vs 243 vs 308 all day. They talk about synthetic vs wood or Win vs Rem vs Savage till I get sick and walk out of the cabin.

Funny how they can accept an AR will kill a 150# hog but not kill a 125# deer.

I have gone to far at to take e few of them in the jeep and shoot a doe with the AR and then they confess “yea well.. it might make an OK “doe gun” but you can’t kill a “big buck” with it”.

WTF MF!!! Did you see the one I drug into camp last night? I shot that one with the same gun I shot that doe I just kill with.


hk940
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 3:43:50 AM EST
I used to think that my only option when rifle hunting deer was my Remington 700 BDL. One season I thought I was going to be too busy to go out so I lent my .308 to a friend for his hunt.

It turned out that I had three days open to go out. I didn't have my hunting rifle so I snagged my Bushmaster SAR. After most of the morning went to waste I started my way back to camp. That's when I saw a buck about 50 yards out. I took a shot and scored a heart / lungs hit. He took maybe 4 steps before he dropped.

I was impressed with my .223. I've since taken it out on other hunts. I don't have to worry about scuffing up my Custom Delux .308 since the Bushmaster is a rugged, durable weapon.

Link Posted: 10/1/2004 3:49:14 AM EST
You could always use the "only got the one gun" story.

Personally I wouldn't hunt deer here with an AR. I like a brush buster that doesn't destroy the meat. I use either my Dan Wesson 44Mag or a my Mossberg 870.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 3:49:22 AM EST
Stupid people. <sigh> I've never used an AR to hunt with. But I hate when people get all religious about other folks' choice of weapon. They're usually the same assholes who wound a buck in the ass, track it for all of five minutes and quit. Pick a weapon you're comfortable with, that has enough ooomph to make a clean kill and STFU about other people.

Guns don't hunt, people hunt.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 3:49:40 AM EST
I usually tell em AR15s are great for shooting stupid deer hunters.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 3:51:29 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/1/2004 3:52:19 AM EST by sonofbp]
Went hunting with a friend.
I took my FNFAL.
He took his Armalite AR.
While stalking around we came apon a good sized buck elk.
My friend is ex army and marine. Went through both sniper programs.
He managed to sneak around in front of the buck, down wind.
When he flicked the safety off the buck looked up right at him.
Just in time for the shot to go up his nose and out the back of his head.
Dropped right on the spot.
Collest thing Ive seen in a long time.
I will never drag that 12 pound rifle again, it will be my ar all the way.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 3:57:56 AM EST
i got the "who needs one of those" from an old timer once. pissed me off that he does not know how close he could be to losing his "deer hunting rifle" to gun grabbers.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 3:59:41 AM EST
Remember that most people's experience/knowledge of 5.56 is limited to either fragile rounds out of a varmint rifle or FMJ .223 shot through a mini-14. Neither of which could be called a reliable medium game round. Little or no experience with M193/M855 ball or SP rounds. Even most former militay (hell, current military for that matter) don't know how ball ammo performs within its fragmentation range. I'd shoot deer all day with my AR...but, I'd show up to hunt deer with my bolt gun. At 300 yards I know I can HIT a deer with either, but I trust the .280 to perform at that range. I want my limiting factor in range to be my accuracy with the rifle...not the performance range of the round.

"humanity" has nothing to do with it...personally, I think the damn pests should have as much game animal status as an armadillo.

I agree with the ugly. My favorite hunting rifle is the prettiest one I got...rosewood, engraving, etc.

Matter of fact, comparing even a well-tuned AR to a good bolt gun, I agree with reliable as well. Never had a bolt gun fail to chamber a round. Can't say that about the AR platform.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 4:00:06 AM EST
Actually, one of my fav things to do (and I started this about 10 years ago) is NEVER refer to a bolt action scoped rifle as a "DEER RIFLE". It is a "SNIPER RIFLE".

Hey man...nice sniper rifle.........that ain't no fucking sniper rifle...its a deer rifle. Sorry dude..but you got a high powered rifle with a scope...its a sniper rifle.....

Pisses them off to no end.........
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 4:00:18 AM EST
Only one county in NC allows deer hunting with .22 cal., so no 223 hunting for me.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 4:04:06 AM EST

Originally Posted By jwr6:
At 300 yards I know I can HIT a deer with either, but I trust the .280 to perform at that range. I want my limiting factor in range to be my accuracy with the rifle...not the performance range of the round.



Do you hunt in GA? Wondering where in GA you get 300 yard deer shots. Most of mine are inside 50 yards.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 4:12:46 AM EST

Male elk are called bulls, not bucks.



Originally Posted By sonofbp:
Went hunting with a friend.
I took my FNFAL.
He took his Armalite AR.
While stalking around we came apon a good sized buck elk.
My friend is ex army and marine. Went through both sniper programs.
He managed to sneak around in front of the buck, down wind.
When he flicked the safety off the buck looked up right at him.
Just in time for the shot to go up his nose and out the back of his head.
Dropped right on the spot.
Collest thing Ive seen in a long time.
I will never drag that 12 pound rifle again, it will be my ar all the way.

Link Posted: 10/1/2004 4:25:52 AM EST

Originally Posted By Cleatus:
i got the "who needs one of those" from an old timer once. pissed me off that he does not know how close he could be to losing his "deer hunting rifle" to gun grabbers.



Tell him he not only doesn't NEED to hunt, he doesn't have a RIGHT to either.

That should S him TFU.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 4:26:04 AM EST
.223 isn't legal for hunting in Washington. I need to get a 6.8.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 4:29:11 AM EST

Originally Posted By ar10er:
Male elk are called bulls, not bucks.



Originally Posted By sonofbp:
Went hunting with a friend.
I took my FNFAL.
He took his Armalite AR.
While stalking around we came apon a good sized buck elk.
My friend is ex army and marine. Went through both sniper programs.
He managed to sneak around in front of the buck, down wind.
When he flicked the safety off the buck looked up right at him.
Just in time for the shot to go up his nose and out the back of his head.
Dropped right on the spot.
Collest thing Ive seen in a long time.
I will never drag that 12 pound rifle again, it will be my ar all the way.




I knew that I am just very very sleepy, dont get out of work til 0930.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 4:49:42 AM EST
Them bolt guys are just pissed cause you get more thrusts per squeeze than they do.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 12:14:55 PM EST
Because there are a lot of bozos that can't make clean kills with a .223. It's a perfectly ADEQUATE round in it's envelope. Just a lot of the bolt guns have much bigger envelopes.

And there are a lot shooters that don't religiously shoot their "deer" rifles several times a month.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 12:19:45 PM EST
If one weapon did it all...We would never have excuses to purchase more.

"Well honey, That is my deer hunting rifle...I need one for bear now."

MT
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 12:28:32 PM EST
i go hunting once a year.......................deer/hog/whatever i see to shoot hunt. (our gas suppliers put it on and buy us all the beer and booze we can possibly drink so i never miss it)

anyway, two years back when i got my first AR (bushy 20" A3) i took it out there not to hunt with but to play...........anyway, most of the guys just had to have a go at it at the sight-in range

last year the main PR guy for our gas supplier bought that gun from me, he couldnt stand it anymore

wait until they see all my no-ban guns THIS year!!!!!!!
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 12:45:18 PM EST

Originally Posted By RAVYN:
Actually, one of my fav things to do (and I started this about 10 years ago) is NEVER refer to a bolt action scoped rifle as a "DEER RIFLE". It is a "SNIPER RIFLE".

Hey man...nice sniper rifle.........that ain't no fucking sniper rifle...its a deer rifle. Sorry dude..but you got a high powered rifle with a scope...its a sniper rifle.....

Pisses them off to no end.........



Heh, that's awesome.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 1:02:06 PM EST
To each their own. I just like the tradition of the bolt gun. I'll admit, for me hunting harkens back to the days of my grandfather, that’s the real reason I go (once a year for deer and once for upland birds). Same reason I use an sXs shotgun for game birds. If I was just out to make the kill, an AR or FAL would seem great choices; tell them to worry about their own rifles.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 1:08:37 PM EST

Originally Posted By RAVYN:
Actually, one of my fav things to do (and I started this about 10 years ago) is NEVER refer to a bolt action scoped rifle as a "DEER RIFLE". It is a "SNIPER RIFLE".

Hey man...nice sniper rifle.........that ain't no fucking sniper rifle...its a deer rifle. Sorry dude..but you got a high powered rifle with a scope...its a sniper rifle.....

Pisses them off to no end.........


Good one.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 1:20:39 PM EST
Since I have shot/killed just as many deer as the other guys have and at longer ranges and am by far the best shot out there nobody says anything to me anymore. Usually they all enjoy taking a few shots with it at the end of the day. It is definitely something different and breaks up the monotony.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 1:24:31 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/1/2004 1:25:37 PM EST by astrafire]

Originally Posted By PaDanby:

And there are a lot shooters that don't religiously shoot their "deer" rifles several times a month.



How many bolters have you seen at the range before deer season shooting targets at 100 hundred yard while standing?

At my range, none.

You know, the guys who are all mad that your shooting that evil black gun that ejects brass all over the place.

The guys who will sit at a concrete bench, plant there gun in a sandbag, squeeze off 40 rounds and call themselves ready for deer season. I do not think that I have ever fired less than 100 rounds during a range session and I go to the range at least 20 times a year.

I do not get it. Are they gonna set up at the rifle range and wait for deer to walk across.

My ten year old daughter shooting prone (collapsed stock) with open sights does better than a lot of bolters with their glossy leupold scopes. Some even have the nerve to make comments about how someday she will be able to shoot a real rifle like theirs.

However, I do appreciate that a lot of bolters have annual range membership and only show up once or twice year.


Link Posted: 10/1/2004 2:31:41 PM EST
I say, "What the hell does hunting have to do with it?"

I long ago got tired of the "Which is better for deer (or elk or whatever) .30-06 or .280?" arguments. About as meaningful as Chevy vs Ford vs Dodge.

I have an AR-15 because I LIKE it. End of discussion.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 2:47:26 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 2:47:36 PM EST
It is the same argument about carry guns...

Them old timers won't let ya grab anything that isnt .4#

There is no reasoning with em.


- BG

Before a flame war starts, anything less than a .45 is for women and children. I'm just making an analogy.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 2:50:42 PM EST

Originally Posted By astrafire:
The guys who will sit at a concrete bench, plant there gun in a sandbag, squeeze off 40 rounds and call themselves ready for deer season.




Dude, you had an extra "0" drop in your estimate of rounds expended.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 2:54:16 PM EST
In a number of states .22 caliber guns are ILLEGAL for deer hunting.

In North Carolina a lot of people hunting with 22 RIMFIRES! That is in areas down east, like Bladen County where any other rifles are verboten.

Any 22 caliber gun, centefire or rimfire, will kill a white-tailed deer.


I wouldn't hunt deer with a AR because I like the 6mm Remington too much!


Great cartridge with 100 grain loads!


CRC
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 2:55:04 PM EST
I hunt mainly with a pump not a bolt action anyway.

So go get them bolt action guys!

CRC
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 2:59:27 PM EST

Originally Posted By NAM:
Them bolt guys are just pissed cause you get more thrusts per squeeze than they do.





Roger that!

Link Posted: 10/1/2004 3:37:17 PM EST

Originally Posted By Cleatus:
i got the "who needs one of those" from an old timer once. pissed me off that he does not know how close he could be to losing his "deer hunting rifle" to gun grabbers.



The day after they finally outlaw semi-autos will be the day they start in on the bolt guns. Of course, they will first re-christen them "sniper rifles."

If the bolt snobs don't want to have to fight that fight, they should stand shoulder to shoulder with us as we fight our fight.

Link Posted: 10/1/2004 3:38:15 PM EST
Nope. Pump action rifles will be first after semis.

NOT BOLT ACTIONS!

CRC
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 4:11:13 PM EST
These might come in handy. They also can be had in 80-89 grains for those with enough twist
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 4:18:12 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/1/2004 4:19:54 PM EST by 30calTBLkid]
i have a 2 win mod 70's, one with a "shiny leapold" and the other with an m-4 weaver. both in 3006. i take both, sighted in for two differnt hand loads. optics fail and conditions change.
but i've also never hunted public land, and "deer camp" is never less than three days at a time.

but i also take either my mod 12 or 590 shotguns, in case i decide to hunt quail or dove if i get bored.

and you gotta have a .22 lr for rabbits or coons or teachin kids to shot rocks or frogs in the cattle tanks.

and an ak for runnin around at night shootin 'yotes or hogs.

all in all i roll to deer camp with at least 4 or 5 long guns. then theres the sidearms.

but i hunt cause it makes me feel better and i shoot cause i like it. i dont like to leave the practice range till i'm sore and tired. i'd say out of ammo too, but i always save something for the ride/walk home. damn arf com zombie threads got me nervous.

eta-oh yeah, and the old timers i know dont bitch. thats who i learned it from. thats why people in tx drive big pickups.
Link Posted: 10/1/2004 4:20:56 PM EST

Originally Posted By RAVYN:
I usually tell em AR15s are great for shooting stupid deer hunters.



Link Posted: 10/1/2004 4:21:33 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/4/2004 6:07:58 AM EST

Originally Posted By CAMPYBOB:
guys have posted pics of deer taken with 5.45 x 39.5. that 2/3rds the power of 5.56 x 45...give or take.

shot placement is everything.

that said, i still like the good old .30-06.



i hear you on the 06...

my reasoning is i shoot about 200 rounds of 06 a year.
i shoot 4000.00 of 5.56... seems obvious to me. it will kill and i know and trust the gun 100%.
Link Posted: 10/4/2004 6:17:03 AM EST
I usually just tell 'em:

"hold my beer and watch this..."
Link Posted: 10/4/2004 6:46:52 AM EST

Originally Posted By DarkCloud:
Only one county in NC allows deer hunting with .22 cal., so no 223 hunting for me.



This is incorrect. Any centerfire rifle is ok.

Link Posted: 10/4/2004 6:50:40 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/4/2004 6:51:22 AM EST by dpmmn]
When I did deer hunt, it has been about 15 years now, I used my BAR Safari 30.06, or My HK-91 (w/5 rd mag).................The first time I used the HK I got some pretty strange looks
Link Posted: 10/4/2004 6:52:49 AM EST
Well, what I try to do is show them how great the AR platform is, and try to get them to shoot it.

BTW, this is how I was introduced to ARs.

Whether not they hunt with an AR, or a 700 BDL, I could give a shit. I have not killed a deer with 223 yet, always prefered to have a larger hammer.

I may go after a doe with one this year though.


Link Posted: 10/4/2004 6:58:06 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/4/2004 6:58:29 AM EST by gamesniper]
Uh....I consider the .223 to be a little too light for deer-especially the mulies we have here. Besides, I shoot the hell out of my ARs, whereas one of my "deer rifles" (.270 or .30-06, both bolt guns) only go every 3rd or 4th shooting trip. But I DO shoot them fairly regularly-and NOT exclusively from a rest, either.

If I were to get drawn for javelina here, the AR would be the ONLY rifle I'd consider toting around all day, and I've YET to take a deer rifle when I 'yote hunt.

I usually take one of the ARs when I go up camping/hunting with my friends and they don't give me any shit at all. In fact, it's gotten to the point where invariably someone will ask, "So-what kind of shooting iron did you bring this time?"
Link Posted: 10/4/2004 7:22:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By astrafire:


The guys who will sit at a concrete bench, plant there gun in a sandbag, squeeze off 40 rounds and call themselves ready for deer season. I do not think that I have ever fired less than 100 rounds during a range session and I go to the range at least 20 times a year.




40 rounds? Shit, most of those bozos shoot maybe 10 and save the rest of the box for their "hunt". I personally think that most of the phenomena called "buck fever" is simply the fact that most deer hunters spend zero time practicing and conditioning themselves for proper gun handling under stress.
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