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Posted: 11/25/2014 10:10:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/25/2014 10:10:58 PM EDT by Lancelot]

I'll be the first to admit I am far from an expert on the AR platform. I am, however, curious as to what design improvements, new products, extra part durability, etc... could be made to make it a better design and/or more useful?
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 10:30:02 AM EDT
Removal of the Forward Assist.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 10:33:46 AM EDT
The damn detent and spring retaining the front hinge pin. Gotta be a better way. That and the charging handle is awkward with a scoped gun.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 10:35:14 AM EDT
I'd like to see a cyclic trigger weight on the third selector position, combined with a .015 reset
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 10:42:59 AM EDT
Originally Posted By wildx007:
Removal of the Forward Assist.
View Quote


^ this ^
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 10:44:11 AM EDT
Weight reduction. Computer assisted design, engineering experience with the AR platform, and materials should be able to impact a decent weight drop without sacrificing durability and/or safety. A mountainbike is not a gun, but even those MTB models that can jump off a cliff and not snap like a twig have gone from 50lbs. down to 30lbs...with maybe even more reliability and durability. I think there's room for losing pork on these guns.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 10:49:21 AM EDT
Addition of a piston system
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 10:49:43 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ARTNC10:
Weight reduction. Computer assisted design, engineering experience with the AR platform, and materials should be able to impact a decent weight drop without sacrificing durability and/or safety. A mountainbike is not a gun, but even those MTB models that can jump off a cliff and not snap like a twig have gone from 50lbs. down to 30lbs...with maybe even more reliability and durability. I think there's room for losing pork on these guns.
View Quote
This thread might be for you:
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_118/625051_ULTRA_light_weight_picture_thread____the_under_6_crowd_.html
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 10:50:01 AM EDT
Originally Posted By sbt12:
Addition of a piston system
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It already has a piston.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 11:17:38 AM EDT
Originally Posted By sbt12:
Addition of a piston system
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And some type of "collapsible" stock.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 11:26:32 AM EDT
Originally Posted By sbt12:
Addition of a piston system
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http://www.ar15.com/content/page.html?id=535

Issue everyone a KAC SR-16 Mod 2 and you have the perfect gun. Until then our new M4A1's will be fine.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 12:13:17 PM EDT
Ambi everything as a standard
no forward assist
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 12:23:37 PM EDT
I've seen a few companies producing lowers with threads in the detent/spring hole for the rear take down pin. Then they put an Allen screw behind the detent and spring. Now whenever you decide to remove the receiver end plate you don't have a spring flying out and it also stays in place when your trying to install the receiver end plate. I've also seen these Allen screws in place of the roll pin that traditionally holds the bolt release in place. The way I see it, those are simple design enhancements that don't hinder "user preference", don't add to weight, and don't significantly change the design of the weapon. Things like that should become the new standard across the board.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 12:25:48 PM EDT
Why the forward assist hate? I've had to use mine several times
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 12:45:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/25/2014 12:46:03 PM EDT by glockr]
Originally Posted By wildx007:
Removal of the Forward Assist.
View Quote


You meanlike this ?
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 12:46:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/25/2014 12:46:53 PM EDT by dangerdan]
Originally Posted By wildx007:
Removal of the Forward Assist.
View Quote
I've actually had to use my F/A....so no.

And it wasn't at the range punching paper


Link Posted: 11/25/2014 12:57:02 PM EDT
As far as lightening the load, sure it can be done. But it's expensive so most of us opt out. We like our forged receivers, cause they're strong n cheap. Yet an $80 carbon lower is only 3.2oz. But most don't run them, because wev think it won't be strong enough. You could go billet, they'll be strong enough as far as most are concerned, but they're expensive and I don't see the weight as an issue.

As for practical improvements? I got nothing. Usually I'm fine with the at, it's only after I try and enjoy a new product that I question how we've gone without this for so long.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 1:00:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/25/2014 1:01:48 PM EDT by kiddsf]
Carrier with lessened contacting area to the upper receiver.

IMO the only improvement needed to a 'DI' AR system is a design that lessen the surface contact between the carrier and upper receiver, basically a 'sand cutter' carrier or LMT's Enhanced carrier.

We all know oil is required for a 'DI' rifle to run reliably b/c of the more than necessary contacting area between carrier and upper, if the contacting surface area is lessened the amount of oil needed for the rifle to run reliably will be less. Also, the cut out area would help to scrape away the carbon and dirt, extending the reliability period.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 1:52:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By kiddsf:
Carrier with lessened contacting area to the upper receiver.

IMO the only improvement needed to a 'DI' AR system is a design that lessen the surface contact between the carrier and upper receiver, basically a 'sand cutter' carrier or LMT's Enhanced carrier.

We all know oil is required for a 'DI' rifle to run reliably b/c of the more than necessary contacting area between carrier and upper, if the contacting surface area is lessened the amount of oil needed for the rifle to run reliably will be less. Also, the cut out area would help to scrape away the carbon and dirt, extending the reliability period.
View Quote


This is a VERY common misconception about the carrier, so don't feel bad. It already has them in the form of four narrow ribs running lengthwise on the body of the carrier. The round portion of the carrier does not contact the upper and there is a lot of empty space there for dirt.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 2:01:34 PM EDT
I say bolt catch/release like on the LWRC IC lowers.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 2:08:48 PM EDT
Originally Posted By spdldr:
Originally Posted By kiddsf:
Carrier with lessened contacting area to the upper receiver.

IMO the only improvement needed to a 'DI' AR system is a design that lessen the surface contact between the carrier and upper receiver, basically a 'sand cutter' carrier or LMT's Enhanced carrier.

We all know oil is required for a 'DI' rifle to run reliably b/c of the more than necessary contacting area between carrier and upper, if the contacting surface area is lessened the amount of oil needed for the rifle to run reliably will be less. Also, the cut out area would help to scrape away the carbon and dirt, extending the reliability period.
View Quote


This is a VERY common misconception about the carrier, so don't feel bad. It already has them in the form of four narrow ribs running lengthwise on the body of the carrier. The round portion of the carrier does not contact the upper and there is a lot of empty space there for dirt.
View Quote

No, no, no, that's not what I'm talking about.
I'm talking about the 4 surfaces on the carrier that makes contact with the upper receiver.
I brought up designs like the Sand Cutter carrier by KAC(wish those are available for my SR15 Mod1) and LMT E Carrier b/c they have less contacting surfaces on the 4 surfaces on the carrier.


Please look at the picture below of the LMT E carrier, the silver shiny part is the contacting surface which is much smaller than standard carrier.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 2:26:40 PM EDT
Why is wylde chamber not the standard?

Selector on safe regardless of hammer position

Stop pinning FSB’s on (except repo retro stuff)
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 2:35:18 PM EDT
Originally Posted By HatinHillbilly:
Why is wylde chamber not the standard?

Selector on safe regardless of hammer position

Stop pinning FSB’s on (except repo retro stuff)
View Quote
JARD triggers do this.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 2:49:29 PM EDT
A shoulder thing that goes up.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 2:58:13 PM EDT
MOAR Belt Fed Designs
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 3:03:20 PM EDT
Originally Posted By wildx007:
Removal of the Forward Assist.
View Quote




I see you've never had to use one.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 3:16:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By POINTMAN380:
MOAR Belt Fed Designs
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Belt fed designs are awesome, the whole 922o issue really puts a damper on it.

I have quite a bit of fun with my PMAG 40's though.

Link Posted: 11/25/2014 3:18:00 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MILSPEC556:
Originally Posted By wildx007:
Removal of the Forward Assist.
View Quote




I see you've never had to use one.
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Why would you? If a round won't go into battery it is ill advised to use a plunger to shove it in and close the action. Better to discard the round and go on.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 3:25:04 PM EDT
Originally Posted By joglee:
Originally Posted By MILSPEC556:
Originally Posted By wildx007:
Removal of the Forward Assist.
View Quote




I see you've never had to use one.
View Quote


Why would you? If a round won't go into battery it is ill advised to use a plunger to shove it in and close the action. Better to discard the round and go on.
View Quote
I like having them. In Iraq in 2008 I put a fresh magazine in my rifle, slapped the bolt hold open, and it didn't sound right. I realized the rifle hadn't went into battery, pushed the forward assist and emptied the magazine. Next magazine did the same thing, the third magazine did as well. Each time a push with the forward assist and I was shooting again. Thankfully I was at the range and no one was shooting at me.

IMO the mainspring needed replaced on the rifle, but I believe it met minimum length and the armory considered it fine.

I'm not saying it is 100% required, I could have pushed the carrier closed with my thumb, but I prefer to have the FA.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 3:26:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/25/2014 3:40:05 PM EDT by MILSPEC556]
Originally Posted By joglee:
Originally Posted By MILSPEC556:
Originally Posted By wildx007:
Removal of the Forward Assist.
View Quote




I see you've never had to use one.
View Quote


Why would you? If a round won't go into battery it is ill advised to use a plunger to shove it in and close the action. Better to discard the round and go on.
View Quote


This makes zero sense. you make it sound nice and calm and on your terms. How about you go quote that BS to dangerdan as well, who has had to use his forward assist in combat. You lose a huge portion of dexterity when somebody is firing at you, as well as the ability to choose between options, you resort to your training. Muscle memory. Forward assist.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 4:19:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/25/2014 4:23:54 PM EDT by dangerdan]
Originally Posted By MILSPEC556:
Originally Posted By joglee:
Originally Posted By MILSPEC556:
Originally Posted By wildx007:
Removal of the Forward Assist.
View Quote




I see you've never had to use one.
View Quote


Why would you? If a round won't go into battery it is ill advised to use a plunger to shove it in and close the action. Better to discard the round and go on.
View Quote


This makes zero sense. you make it sound nice and calm and on your terms. How about you go quote that BS to dangerdan as well, who has had to use his forward assist in combat. You lose a huge portion of dexterity when somebody is firing at you, as well as the ability to choose between options, you resort to your training. Muscle memory. Forward assist.
View Quote

Rifles get dirty and your bolt dries up. Now what?

I'd rather have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

Link Posted: 11/25/2014 4:23:29 PM EDT
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Yeah, I've seem some decent 15 platform weights. I guess I should have indicated my response was directed more at AR-10's. The OP said "AR platform", but he might have been inclusive of the AR-15 only.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 5:06:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/25/2014 5:17:19 PM EDT by joglee]
Originally Posted By dangerdan:
Originally Posted By MILSPEC556:
Originally Posted By joglee:
Originally Posted By MILSPEC556:
Originally Posted By wildx007:
Removal of the Forward Assist.
View Quote




I see you've never had to use one.
View Quote


Why would you? If a round won't go into battery it is ill advised to use a plunger to shove it in and close the action. Better to discard the round and go on.
View Quote


This makes zero sense. you make it sound nice and calm and on your terms. How about you go quote that BS to dangerdan as well, who has had to use his forward assist in combat. You lose a huge portion of dexterity when somebody is firing at you, as well as the ability to choose between options, you resort to your training. Muscle memory. Forward assist.
View Quote


Rifles get dirty and your bolt dries up. Now what?


I'd rather have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

View Quote


Sounds like we need new rifles If you have to forward assist rounds into the chamber when they get dirty.(kidding, though my M4 has had a number of stoppages)

Seriously though, they can cause issues and have broken and locked up weapons, and you can use the scallop cut in the carrier where the dust cover detent gets engaged as a FA.

I have personally never needed it, but I have only been to Afghanistan twice and was lucky enough to get a newer M4. I just prefer to stay away from it, and ran grease so I never had to worry about my bolt drying up.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 5:11:03 PM EDT
The M16 pretty much had it perfect! Everything since has just mucked it up. I wish more companies made gats with A1 sights, LW barrels, maybe triangle handguards.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 5:16:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/25/2014 5:19:46 PM EDT by dangerdan]
Originally Posted By joglee:
Originally Posted By dangerdan:
Originally Posted By MILSPEC556:
Originally Posted By joglee:
Originally Posted By MILSPEC556:



I see you've never had to use one.
View Quote


Why would you? If a round won't go into battery it is ill advised to use a plunger to shove it in and close the action. Better to discard the round and go on.
View Quote


This makes zero sense. you make it sound nice and calm and on your terms. How about you go quote that BS to dangerdan as well, who has had to use his forward assist in combat. You lose a huge portion of dexterity when somebody is firing at you, as well as the ability to choose between options, you resort to your training. Muscle memory. Forward assist.
View Quote


Rifles get dirty and your bolt dries up. Now what?


I'd rather have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

View Quote


Sounds like we need new rifles If you have to forward assist rounds into the chamber when they get dirty.

Seriously though, they can cause issues and have broken and locked up weapons, and you can use the scallop cut in the carrier where the dust cover detent gets engaged as a FA.

I have personally never needed it, but I have only been to Afghanistan twice and was lucky enough to get a newer M4. I just prefer to stay away from it, and ran grease so I never had to worry about my bolt drying up.
View Quote


You must have been a fobbit.
I have never seen or heard of a forward assist causing any problems
And it doesn't matter whether the weapon is new or old...



Grease and/or thick oil makes dirt stick better. Your asking for a bad day in dusty/dirty environments.



Link Posted: 11/25/2014 5:27:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By joglee:




Sounds like we need new rifles If you have to forward assist rounds into the chamber when they get dirty.(kidding, though my M4 has had a number of stoppages)

Seriously though, they can cause issues and have broken and locked up weapons, and you can use the scallop cut in the carrier where the dust cover detent gets engaged as a FA.

I have personally never needed it, but I have only been to Afghanistan twice and was lucky enough to get a newer M4. I just prefer to stay away from it, and ran grease so I never had to worry about my bolt drying up.
View Quote

That is the first I have ever heard of anything like that with the FA

Grease in a sandy environment? Seriously?
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 5:30:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By AASG:
The M16 pretty much had it perfect! Everything since has just mucked it up. I wish more companies made gats with A1 sights, LW barrels, maybe triangle handguards.
View Quote


Really now? Tell that to the guys who's rifles jammed up in Vietnam.

Also, besides a minimal weight increase, what is the downside of a FA? I don't think I've ever seen a case where the FA caused a failure. I'm sure it's happened, but also few and far between.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 5:33:47 PM EDT
It doesn't happen often but it could. I never used mine and every course I have taken when I am home have also always said to avoid the FA. I figure there is a reason why the people who teach courses and such do not teach using it.

But I am far from an expert.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 5:48:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By joglee:
It doesn't happen often but it could. I never used mine and every course I have taken when I am home have also always said to avoid the FA. I figure there is a reason why the people who teach courses and such do not teach using it.

But I am far from an expert.
View Quote


Are you that guy who would talk about the super secret XM15 with drain ports or some thing like that???
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 5:49:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By dangerdan:
Originally Posted By joglee:
It doesn't happen often but it could. I never used mine and every course I have taken when I am home have also always said to avoid the FA. I figure there is a reason why the people who teach courses and such do not teach using it.

But I am far from an expert.
View Quote



Are you that guy who would talk about the super secret XM15 with drain ports or some thing like that???
View Quote


Clearly not, because I have no idea what you're talking about.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 5:50:01 PM EDT
I'd like to see a lower designed (and appropriate lower parts kit) that accepts a belt, so you can have clip-fed lowers and belt-fed lowers. THAT would be cool.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 6:58:26 PM EDT
I have also used the forward assist on a very dirty rifle. I will not buy a non range only AR without one.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 7:22:12 PM EDT
Originally Posted By dangerdan:
Originally Posted By wildx007:
Removal of the Forward Assist.
View Quote
I've actually had to use my F/A....so no.

And it wasn't at the range punching paper


View Quote

+1 here. Someone that advocates for no FA, has never slept in a patrol base being rained on all night. No matter how hard you try, shit's gonna get wet eventually all the way through i.e. washing CLP off with rust setting in over a short amount of time. Ive used a FA more than once or twice. I'd rather have it and not need it, than have a sticky bolt that will not return to full battery from rust friction to do proper weapons maintenance during light hours vs a quick wipedown in the dark during priorities of work after you've been moving with 65lbs on your shoulders all day. But thats just me.....
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 7:28:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By takdriver:
I have also used the forward assist on a very dirty rifle. I will not buy a non range only AR without one.
View Quote



AS will I never. The Smith and Wesson M&P Sport is a good price point but i'll still be buying a blem Aero Precision upper for ~$45, grab a KAC RIS for $90 on eBay and still have a decent M4 clone for ~$700
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 7:28:53 PM EDT
I've used a FA a few times when the weapon gets wet and dirty in the woods. Never a big deal and I'd be fine without it, but a little tap and I'm ready to go, I like having it.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 7:38:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/25/2014 7:39:24 PM EDT by TaylorWSO]
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 7:40:11 PM EDT
Carbon fiber tension barrels
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 7:41:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/25/2014 7:42:27 PM EDT by dangerdan]
Originally Posted By TaylorWSO:
View Quote
Uppers should be made of magnets, same with bolt carriers.....frikken floating BCG, bro


Taylor, wtf is wrong with your post? nothing shows in your quote box, and now nothing in your post
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 7:51:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/25/2014 8:08:42 PM EDT by joglee]
So granted I have had issues with my M4 on occasion, but often it was my crappy issued mags and nothing that wasnt fixed with changing the mag and charging the rifle. My rounds sent down range in anger is also limited to a little over a thousand, with the rest on the flat range.

But to those who shoot a whole lot more than I do, is it really acceptable to in this day and age be saddled with a auto/semi auto rifle that becomes a single shot when dirty?

Personally and to stick to the topic I would want either the SR-15 mods to be introduced or add a op rod(or LWRC/416 upper) which are proven to be more reliable.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 7:52:36 PM EDT
Originally Posted By joglee:
View Quote

Sounds like we need new rifles If you have to forward assist rounds into the chamber when they get dirty.(kidding, though my M4 has had a number of stoppages)

Seriously though, they can cause issues and have broken and locked up weapons, and you can use the scallop cut in the carrier where the dust cover detent gets engaged as a FA.

I have personally never needed it, but I have only been to Afghanistan twice and was lucky enough to get a newer M4. I just prefer to stay away from it, and ran grease so I never had to worry about my bolt drying up.
View Quote

A forward assist broke the weapon? Get real.
Link Posted: 11/25/2014 8:00:19 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MILSPEC556:
Originally Posted By joglee:
View Quote

Sounds like we need new rifles If you have to forward assist rounds into the chamber when they get dirty.(kidding, though my M4 has had a number of stoppages)

Seriously though, they can cause issues and have broken and locked up weapons, and you can use the scallop cut in the carrier where the dust cover detent gets engaged as a FA.

I have personally never needed it, but I have only been to Afghanistan twice and was lucky enough to get a newer M4. I just prefer to stay away from it, and ran grease so I never had to worry about my bolt drying up.
View Quote

A forward assist broke the weapon? Get real.
View Quote


I've seen one case of it, and it was a not to smart guys rifle. Now maybe he had messed around with it, I am not sure. But seeing the bolt carrier get jammed up due to the plunger was something I wouldn't want to happen.

If the forward assist is really needed to keep a weapon running when it is dirty maybe it is time for a new weapon. Like I said I have a thousand or so rounds sent down range in anger, but that is my opinion.

I cannot think of any other weapon platform where I will have people say, when my rifle gets dirty I have to slam a plunger to keep it running in single shot mode.
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