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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:01:33 PM EDT
[#1]
lots of ARs
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:02:04 PM EDT
[#2]
yep. watching the sure to be lies now...
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:03:15 PM EDT
[#3]
lmao..... they said the ATF was using the MP5 pistol, and then showed video of them entering using the full sized ones
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:06:28 PM EDT
[#4]
hmm, claiming the davidians were firing a barret at the feds
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:07:58 PM EDT
[#5]
did you see the "rodney king" sign they hung out one of the windows? dumbasses! all of them!
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:08:25 PM EDT
[#6]
"hmm, claiming the davidians were firing a barret at the feds"
They hell they were, that sound would have been audable on audio. They did have some .50's (supposedly), but what use is a .50 in an engagement like that? Better to have an assault rifle. |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:09:49 PM EDT
[#7]
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:12:59 PM EDT
[#8]
I think the ATF guy who got shot on the roof was hit with a Barrett shot through the wall of their arms room. |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:15:13 PM EDT
[#9]
in the video where they aer on the roof you could see rounds exiting the building leaving big holes |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:15:48 PM EDT
[#10]
According to Maj. Plaster, US Army Retired, there has been one (1) incident in the whole world of a .50 being used in a crime. An IRA sniper successfully engaged five British paras.
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:19:02 PM EDT
[#11]
That's right, a .50 has NEVER been used in a crime in this country.
Of course defending oneself from gov. thugs can hardly be considered a crime, except maybe to the criminals themselves. But since they make the stats, they would know, eh? Believe me, if that guy was hit by a .50, he would look like Blain from "Predator" after taking one to the chest! |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:29:42 PM EDT
[#12]
This show seems to be holding the party line that it was all the davidians fault. (spreading accelorent etc) And muddying the waters about what really happened. But there is a great movie called "Waco" that was made by impartial film makers which shows what really happened. Including flashes from full auto fire from the fbi. The man who invented fleer said it was gunfire. NOT sun reflections. This show is trying to put a bandaid on the murder of these people. Sad. Zen "This is my rifle, there are many like it, but this one is mine" |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:33:30 PM EDT
[#13]
Nope, blue on blue. |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:42:28 PM EDT
[#14]
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0738863424/103-3741584-4183028
 READ THIS BOOK |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:43:19 PM EDT
[#15]
Watch Waco: The Rules of Engagement. It will change the way you view the world.
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Posted: 9/28/2004 9:55:18 PM EDT
[#16]
Look at the film of the guy on the roof clearly. His buddies enter the room through the window. He blindly shoots through the window a few seconds later, he then is hit by small caliber fire comming back out of the room that his buddies went into. The shots were rapid fire and were similar to rapid semi auto or full auto. It could not have been a .50 cal.
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Posted: 9/28/2004 10:05:39 PM EDT
[#17]
We see the same video snippets over and over of the original ATF raid..........
Ask yourself..........where is the rest? Watch the Documentry, read the book, open your eyes.......  |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 10:07:14 PM EDT
[#18]
+1 |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 10:08:57 PM EDT
[#19]
a 308 could easily go thorugh that wall.
Any how if you look at all the photos etc where the line up the guns, you don't ever see a .50 cal I would think the ATF would have put it on a throne to prove their case if it was there. |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 10:15:15 PM EDT
[#20]
Waco as well as ruby ridge was a message from Klinton and the gun banners that "we will kill you" to enforce gun control. It was intimidation to all gun owning Americans. "Insist on exercising your rights and we will kill you and your families." Sad. Zen "This is my rifle, there are many like it, but this one is mine" |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 10:18:44 PM EDT
[#21]
Ruby Ridge happened under the Bush administration, although I sincerely doubt that POTUS was involved in it like he must have been during Waco. Clinton watched for 52 days. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:20:55 AM EDT
[#22]
while the gov. completely fucked things up and shared alot of the blame, the davidians also played a big role in bringing about their own demise. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:23:59 AM EDT
[#23]
That cinches it for me -- big holes ...................... 
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:28:04 AM EDT
[#24]
The fellow on the roof was shot by one of his own men who was spraying wildly inside the room that was called 'The Armory.' There were NO .50 cal shots made at any time during the standoff by the citizens at Mount Carmel Church. None. Understand? Eric The(Historical)Hun 
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:29:23 AM EDT
[#25]
The best part was when the FBI negotiator was talking to David Koresh and saying;
"David, we're concerned to see people in the windows with black masks and balaclavas. Do you know what that looks like?" Koresh, the stupid idiot that he was, should have said "Well, what the fuck ARE YOU WEARING?" Instead, he said "It looks like WAR!" |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:54:29 AM EDT
[#26]
Wasn't the Barret found disassembled and in its case when the burnout happened? |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:57:21 AM EDT
[#27]
Post from AZ_Hi_Desert:
Most likely, but I'm still trying to find that Dept of Justice listing of the weapons retrieved from the ashes of Mount Carmel. IIRC, there wasn't a single .50 cal weapon on that list. But I may be mistaken on that point. No one fired a .50 cal on any day of the raid/siege, and that I am certain of, at least. Eric The(StillSearching)Hun
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:06:30 AM EDT
[#28]
Eric:
Its my understanding that you know quite a bit about the Waco Incident. Was there a buzz around town that the ATF was going to raid the Davidians or was it a shock to the community? How did Waco react when the whole thing went down that February monring in 1993? |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:15:35 AM EDT
[#29]
Yup, I remember that list. BATFE listed everything, even #s of mag springs, but there were NO .50 firearms in the list. There were a couple parts and mags for a .50 cal., but no rifle. So either that Barrett went into the personal 'arms room' of a fed employee, or they lied about its existence. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:17:28 AM EDT
[#30]
Absolutely. It infuriated me...especially when that fucktard Schumer was talking. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:18:06 AM EDT
[#31]
Evidence lost doors missing false police statements in the reports who really cares what they say they found or did ALL LIES The only ones I trust would be the Texas Rangers that where on scene. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:22:49 AM EDT
[#32]
Well, to some it was a shock simply because everyone in the community had dealt with the Branch Davidians for more than 50 years out there at Mount Carmel, and had likewise dealt with the newer folks who had arrived, like David Koresh. They knew that the Branch Davidians were a 'different' group of Christians than they were (remember, Waco is the home of Baylor University, THE university for Southern Baptists), but no one expected what was to come down on February 28, 1993. The local paper had begun running a three part article on 'The Sinful Messiah' about some of the excesses of David Koresh and his followers. I think the second part was to run the very morning of the Raid. After the Raid, there wasn't a hotel/motel/restaurant/boardinghouse/cafe/bar/or nightclub that didn't do a brisk business with the LEOs, media, and flacks hanging around the place. Although it put a lot of money in the coffers of the City, the folks in Waco were embarrassed, I think, that this was occurring in their neighborhood. Most folks I know from Waco don't like to talk about it, at all. They think the entire incident gave the city an undeserved black eye. But they would also agree that the LEOs were at least as much responsible for the tragedy as the Branch Davidians had been. BTW, did you know that the Branch Davidian children were all regularly enrolled in Waco public schools? I had always assumed that they would have been home-schooled, but they weren't. This was truly among the blackest days in American History in my way of thinking. For even in light of Sept 11th, this was something not concocted in a cave in the Tora Bora Mountains of the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan, but in the private corridors and offices of Washington DC. Eric The(Lamentable)Hun
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:23:17 AM EDT
[#33]
Yup, guys who went in the window before him. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:24:21 AM EDT
[#34]
Does someone want to give us a quick rundown on what happened. I remember the incident but considering I was still under public school indoctrination I blindly belived the media clips I saw.
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:28:44 AM EDT
[#35]
As others have stated, you need to watch WACO: Rules of Engagement ASAP!!! |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:31:54 AM EDT
[#36]
Amen to that! And that will be the very first step in your education concerning this event. Eric The(HistoryIsABitch,ButIgnoranceIsABastard)Hun
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:46:04 AM EDT
[#37]
And the follow on video "WACO: A New Revelation". That's "IF" you want to know the truth.......if you're completely satisfied calling the Branch Davidians "kooks" and "nuts" and "they got what they deserve" then enjoy your ignorance. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:47:42 AM EDT
[#38]
Post from cyanide -
Amen to that! The Texas Rangers were also lied to by the ATF and the FBI on the scene! There was quite a bit of friction between the two groups, that continued long after the siege ended so tragically. You could also trust the late Jack L. Harwell, Sheriff of McLennan County, Texas. He knew the Branch Davidians and David Koresh better than any other LEO and he never thought that they were a problem, at all. Eric The(Historical)Hun
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:51:03 AM EDT
[#39]
The Branch Davidians were KOOKS and NUTS! But in this country, they had the RIGHT to be kooks and nuts and to own rifles of their choice. And they were murdered because they had the balls to excersise their rights. And the worst part is, ...... no one served a single day for murdering them. Klinton: murderer Reno: Murderer And all of the other murderers who got off scott free. Zen "This is my rifle, there are many like it, but this one is mine" |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 9:04:19 AM EDT
[#40]
I attended a conference in which Koresh' attorney spoke. During the standoff he was allowed inside to meet with Koresh. He said there were bullet holes in the roof that went into the floor. Confirming that they were fired on by helicopters before the initial raid.
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Posted: 9/29/2004 9:08:14 AM EDT
[#41]
Amen.......that includes you and me too! I had the pleasure to meet Dr. James Tabor recently at the University of North Carolina-Charlotte. Dr Tabor has written several books about WACO and was in the WACO documentaries. We had a real interesting discussion. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 9:54:59 AM EDT
[#42]
Damn BATF lied to the TXANG to get that Helo support, told em that there was a Meth Lab on site which would allow use of Mil assets in the "War On Drugs" As for firing from a helo.......of course ATF denies it, but an audio recording made on one of the helos supports the Davidians claims that shots were fired from a helo. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 9:59:28 AM EDT
[#43]
http://www.wizardsofaz.com/waco/picturethis.html
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Posted: 9/29/2004 10:05:31 AM EDT
[#44]
I'd forgotten about the front doors being 'missing' after it was all done... The Waco 'incident' has always smelled to high heaven. What was reported and what was reality was literally worlds apart. But then, I'm still waiting for Lon Horiuchi to face justice. 
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Posted: 9/29/2004 10:06:52 AM EDT
[#45]
I thought that clinton & reno had declared war on America back then. Arab terrorists were trying to bring down both WTC towers with a truck bomb and the ATF/FBI were out in the middle of nowhere attacking American "oddballs" w/guns. The 1990's were a very dark time. Scott |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 10:39:20 AM EDT
[#46]
Same here. I was in 9th grade and just watched it all on CNN. I'll have to check out these books. Thanks for the info, everyone. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 10:52:28 AM EDT
[#47]
ETH,
Any truth to the rumor that the two ATF guys that were killed were former Arkansas State Troopers that were supposed to testify in WhiteWater? Semper Fi! |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 10:59:39 AM EDT
[#48]
What makes you think that anything has changed? Have any of the FedGov liars been punished? Has Lon Horiuchi of Ruby Ridge ever been prosecuted? HELL NO! There WILL be another Waco/Ruby Ridge type incident.......the only question is when. AND the Branch Davidian survivors are STILL in Federal Prison! No, nothing has changed. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 11:02:00 AM EDT
[#49]
I've heard that one, but I have never seen any verification of the story. It would be rather farfetched to think that they were 'set up' to take a hit for the Clinton Team. Further, it's unlikely that Arkansas State Troopers were material witnesses to anything in the Whitewater investigation. Eric The(CheckingItOut)Hun
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Posted: 9/29/2004 11:12:01 AM EDT
[#50]
+50 |
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