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Posted: 5/3/2001 1:57:20 PM EDT
If you are building a 15 be careful where you buy your kit. I ordered two kits this last winter, one 16in post ban one 20in pre ban. Both were to be 1 in 9 chrome bore, that was stressed at least twice in the conversation and I believe an Email follow up was placed to insure proper product. I have had failures to extract with both finished rifles. The rate of malfunction with the 16 was terrible though it was quite accurate. I spoke with the owner of the business today and was told that the company "has not had any chrome bore kits in a year, to a year and a half" Their ad in SGN still has chrome bores listed. In answer to my disbelief the owner told me that "he could send the barrels out to be lined, but it would take about two months"
Link Posted: 5/3/2001 4:14:58 PM EDT
BTT so Alex will see there was no conspiracy...
Link Posted: 5/3/2001 4:52:04 PM EDT
Alex, do you mean "Model 1 Sales"? Never seen an add for Number 1 Sales, maybe some new company? If It was Model 1 sales, they were perfect for me. I love my 20" kit. No chrome, but great accuracy with cheap ammo, not one malfunction yet except for the disconector that I had to hone right in the beginning. I would recommend them to any one looking to build a kit gun. guns762
Link Posted: 5/3/2001 8:02:47 PM EDT
Yeah 762, sorry I don't do well when I'm pissed. I had just got off the phone with the owner of Model 1 and realized that I had been lied to more than once: When I ordered the kits, when I had made my first inquiry and when I had Emailed the company. Only on the last call had he admitted that he had not had chrome bores in stock for over a year. I know that my situation will never be like the grunts in VN trying to clear a failure to extract under fire but I had planned to use my 15's as defense rifles. I got 1 in groups with one rifle, but jams do make you think.
Link Posted: 5/3/2001 8:09:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/3/2001 8:08:35 PM EDT by Getsome]
If you think Number 1 Sales stinks then you wouldn't believe the shit they are putting out in Number 2 Sales!
Link Posted: 5/3/2001 8:33:30 PM EDT
I ordered a 20" post ban kit a couple of years ago from Model 1 sales. There was a few mistakes on the order, and it took them awhile, but they did get the right parts to me. My rifle had horrible extraction problems for about the first two years. Now she works like a dream and I have hardly had any failures, so I wrote the failures off as break in. Just my $.02.
Link Posted: 5/3/2001 9:20:42 PM EDT
Sorry to hear about your misfortune, and if they told you over the phone that the bore was chromed then I guess they misled you. But to be accurate I am looking at the ad now and it reads " 1:7 A2 Chrome Lined OR 1:9 HBAR Match Grade Barrel". I know when I ordered from them over the phone about a month ago I spoke to a woman and (at the risk of sounding sexist) questioned if she was knowlagable or just a secratry. I do have to say I am happy with my kit, I only had it out once but I put 100 rounds through it without a failure yet. Good luck I hope they can straighten things out for you.
Link Posted: 5/3/2001 9:29:51 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/3/2001 9:32:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Getsome: If you think Number 1 Sales stinks then you wouldn't believe the shit they are putting out in Number 2 Sales!
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You think Number 2 sucks, you should shop at Number 10 Sales! Aviator
Link Posted: 5/3/2001 10:16:46 PM EDT
Alex let me know the discounted price for your Model 1 uppers. I love it when someone can't get something to work and I get to reap the benifits of thier disaster.
Link Posted: 5/4/2001 4:13:58 AM EDT
Yeah, when I ordered my kits I had talked to a woman too. That is why I followed up with an Email to try to ASSURE that I got what I ordered. Talking to the owner a couple of weeks ago I asked about the chrome and he brushed me off talking about polishing the chamber, ect. They know they screwed me and just tried to shine me on. They ARE number 10 in my book. I should have learned my lesson not to try to save money on something important
Link Posted: 5/4/2001 4:20:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By alex: I should have learned my lesson not to try to save money on something important
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No shit!
Link Posted: 5/4/2001 8:44:29 AM EDT
How many times do we have to say it: Bushmaster Armalite Merlin
Link Posted: 5/4/2001 10:48:13 AM EDT
Merlin- BM and ARM are waaaay overpriced! Any company that asks retail of $915 (BM) and $1004 (ARM) for an AR15 is crazy! (even if you can find them cheaper, I don't have near that money). If you use quality companies and parts you can build a very nice rifle for $600-700. JT Distributing is reputable, and reasonably priced. I used an Oly barrel, with FN upper, FN bolt and a RRA lower. Rifle cost me $600. (never burped once, except for mag problems). Then I got cheap and bought A M1S carry handle. Rifle was shooting 12" high at 25 yards!!!! That is 4 feet at 100yards! I call them up to send it back, and the secretary argues with me for 15 minutes that Gunsmoke sells DPMS uppers, and DPMS are .003 lower than other A3s. I called Ed and he said that that was total BS. (she also argued about the ship date, which I verified I was right with UPS) To boot, she didn't know what an aperture is! ME: "Ma'am I ordered the carry handle with the A2 aperture" HER: "Well we sent you the A2 aperture, it just had National Match sights" THE APERTURE MAKES IT A2 or NM!!! They are a bunch of morons who make shit for products and I will never deal with them again. Rant off: James
Link Posted: 5/4/2001 1:15:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/4/2001 1:18:27 PM EDT by guns762]
Counterstrike is right! The add does say 1:7 chrome lined OR 1:9 HBAR. It does not say you can mix and match. I have to say that my experience was perfect with Model 1, but I was not interested in a 1:7 twist so the I felt the chome lined was a trade off for the 1:9 and accuracey. My kit arrived in only 4 days starting from the day of order, and I live in B.F. Wyoming. When I placed the order, I talked to a gentleman who answered all my questions including the stupid ones. My rifle shoots 3 shot 3/4" groups with cheap surplus ammo at 100yds, NM sights. Since I fixed the disconector that kept the trigger from engaging, I have not had ONE foul up or jam. The upper matched my Bushmaster Lower perfectly. I would definatly buy again from Model 1, as long as it was non-chrome! guns762
Link Posted: 5/4/2001 1:23:38 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/4/2001 7:14:00 PM EDT
Those were the MSRP. Around here (Charlotte) a new BM goes for $800 (16" a2) to $900. The nearest gunshop to me wants $300 for a complete lower (hell no!). I don't buy local because it is automatically 6.5% more (sales tax) and they are nice but overpriced. James
Link Posted: 5/4/2001 7:27:05 PM EDT
Search Criteria Manufacturer: Bushmaster Click the Item # to see details on particular item. Results of Inventory Search Item # Manufacturer Description Quantity Availability Your Price Sale Ends PCWA2X-14M4MY Bushmaster A2 M4 CARB W/Y-COMP MB 223 21 3 days or less $821.39 05/07/01 PCWA3X-14M4MY Bushmaster A3 M4 CARB W/Y-COMP MB 223 12 3 days or less $843.59 05/07/01 XM15E2S-16SC Bushmaster E2S SHORT CARBINE 223 16IN 22 3 days or less $732.59 06/15/01 PCWA2S-14AK Bushmaster E2S SHORT CARB W/AK MB 223 15 3 days or less $765.89 06/15/01 PCWA3S-14AK Bushmaster A3 SHORT CARB W/AK MB 223 32 3 days or less $815.84 06/15/01 XM15E2S-20T Bushmaster E2S TARGET RIFLE 223 20IN 30 3 days or less $743.69 06/15/01 PCWA2S-20C Bushmaster E2S TGT RFL 223 20IN CAMO 0 contact retailer $810.22 PCWA2S-20AK Bushmaster E2S TGT RFL 20" W/AK MB 4 3 days or less $799.14 XM15E2S-20VM Bushmaster E2S V-MATCH RIFLE 223 20IN 2 3 days or less $821.38 PCWA2S-20DCM8 Bushmaster DCM COMPTITION 223RFL 20IN 15 3 days or less $1,109.92 PCWA2S-16D Bushmaster E2S DISSIPATOR 223 16IN 6 3 days or less $765.88 PCWVMS-16 Bushmaster V-MATCH RFL 223 16IN 0 contact retailer $799.16 PCVMS-16FAH Bushmaster V-MATCH CARB 223 16IN FLTD 0 contact retailer $854.64 PCWA3S-16 Bushmaster E2S-A3 SHORT CARB 223 16IN 25 3 days or less $788.09 06/15/01 PCWA3S-20 Bushmaster E2S-A3 TARGET RFL 223 20IN 19 3 days or less $788.09 06/15/01 PCWA3S-20C Bushmaster A3 TGT RFL 223 20IN CAMO 0 contact retailer $860.18 PCWVMS-24AH Bushmaster E2S V-MATCH RFL 223 24IN 0 contact retailer $825.66 M17S Bushmaster M17S BULLPUP RFL 223 0 contact retailer $632.62 AR-MAG-10 Bushmaster MAGAZINE 223 10RD 16 3 days or less $16.10 06/15/01 AR-MAG-10-REPLC Bushmaster MAGAZINE 223 10RD 0 contact retailer $16.10 PCWVMS-24FAH Bushmaster E2S-VMATCH RFL 223 24IN FL 1 3 days or less $832.49 05/10/01 PCWVMS-20FAH Bushmaster E2S-VMATCH RFL 223 20IN FL 1 3 days or less $821.39 05/10/01
Link Posted: 5/4/2001 8:27:18 PM EDT
Originally Posted By rifleer1: Merlin- BM and ARM are waaaay overpriced! Any company that asks retail of $915 (BM) and $1004 (ARM) for an AR15 is crazy! (even if you can find them cheaper, I don't have near that money).
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Suggested list, maybe. I've seen most retail at about 75% of MSRP. My Bushlite, or is that Arm-master (Bushmaster lower and Armalite upper) was bought as seperate halves. The complete Bushmaster lower was $250 to my door from AA, and the Armalite upper was $500 for the kit (complete upper, lower parts kit and a set of green furniture) at a gun show a couple of months later. The only reason I gave that much was because nobody there had Bushmaster uppers, only complete rifles - and they were priced around $700-750. I figured the extra parts and two sets of furniture at the same total price might come in handy some day. Anyone else that had uppers only were the generics (EVERYBODY called them FN), and I even heard one guy bragging that he bought his parts from 3 or 4 suppliers and put them together in his garage - and it showed. Thanks, but no thanks. We've got a saying at work (computer retail): Good, Cheap, or Fast - pick two of the three. Here it would be: Good, cheap, or reliable.
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