Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Site Notices
Arrow Left Previous Page
Page / 2
Posted: 9/28/2004 8:02:47 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/28/2004 8:04:40 PM EST by NYPatriot]
First off, I realize that not all gun dealers meet the description in the title & I understand that there is stupidity on both sides of the counter. If the shoe doesn’t fit, please don't cram it on for the sake of an argument.

With that out of the way however, I have to wonder why the retail gun world is rife with the rudest, stupidest, most dishonest assholes to walk the earth? Almost everyone can recall a personal gun show/gun store horror story where they were lied to, talked down to by some jerk who was as ignorant as they were arrogant, or were generally ignored in spite of having every intention of spending good $$$ in a particular establishment!

As consumers we have constant & incident free interactions with every type of business under the sun, yet walk into a gun store or gun show & it is not unreasonable to expect that the experience will end badly. How do gun dealers (as small businessman) get away with having such bad customer relations skills? How do they maintain a customer base being so rude, ignorant, dishonest, etc.? How do they turn a profit (or even break even) by asking astronomical prices for inventory that never seems to move?

Seriously, behavior & practices that absolutely would not fly in any other field of business seem to be commonplace with many gun dealers.

How & why is this tolerated???
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:03:46 PM EST
Its retail...not just gun dealers


SGatr125
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:04:11 PM EST
I wondered that last week too. I have to yell at them to get some attention. I guess they don't think a young guy has enough cash to buy anything.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:05:14 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/28/2004 8:06:12 PM EST by booshmaster]
They can do little else... Please note this is not a reflection of all gun dealers, just the scumbag ones. Have you noticed the attitude of these underachievers? They harbor a lot of resnetment at their failure in life and take it out on their customer.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:05:40 PM EST
It's all about the Benjamins, yo.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:06:01 PM EST
Its probably because most of their customers are assholes as well. Ask Steyr.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:06:06 PM EST
You know, part of the problem relates to the lack of fire-arms dealers. I know that in the last 10 years their numbers have shrunk, and may give the ones left, a better-than-thou attitude. But this can be expected in any industry - from golf carts to washer machines. Some people just honestly think they are better than others. The dealers that are total asses, at least in this area, are on their way out.

I can only say what I have seen as I wasn't old enough to buy guns 20 years ago. Someone may correct me about this - maybe this is an attitude that has been prevelant for many years.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:07:36 PM EST
It seems alot of them get buisness from people who go in with no idea what to get, and will pay whatever is asked.

How many dealers see people who know the prices/specs/other info on what they want alot. I expect alot of the business is someone who wants a rifle for huntng, or a 357. The dealer could probaly sell there people anything from a hipoint to a Mosin Nagat to an AR10T if they told them it was what they needed.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:07:43 PM EST

Originally Posted By sgtar15:
Its retail...not just gun dealers


SGatr125



Completely disagree with that. I've been in other hobbies where shows and mass exhibitor sales were not at all the cess pool of dishonest and shady dealers that most gun shows are.

Guns, for whatever reason, attract both the very best and the very worst kind of people...and some of those decide to make their business selling guns, unfortunately.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:08:31 PM EST
Most are assholes until they get to know you, then they lighten up and become very nice people.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:09:36 PM EST
I agree with you completely.

I think it has to do with the fact that most people actually know very little about firearms. Gun dealers know this and can assume a position of power over them. If they were smart, they would try to educate them and help them.

Even if the gun dealer is an ass and doesn't know what he's talking about either, the average customer is going to be too initmidated to question him. This allows the gun dealer to act like a jerk, tell lies, or totally ignore that person, because he knows he can get away with it.

I have worked with morons just like this and it always pissed me off.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:10:44 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/28/2004 8:11:08 PM EST by purplecheese]

Originally Posted By swingset:
Completely disagree with that. I've been in other hobbies where shows and mass exhibitor sales were not at all the cess pool of dishonest and shady dealers that most gun shows are



How do you explain car dealers?
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:11:05 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/28/2004 8:11:59 PM EST by NYPatriot]
Swingset...


Completely disagree with that. I've been in other hobbies where shows and mass exhibitor sales were not at all the cess pool of dishonest and shady dealers that most gun shows are.

Guns, for whatever reason, attract both the very best and the very worst kind of people...and some of those decide to make their business selling guns, unfortunately.



+1, which is why I posted this question in the first place. Like I said, behavior & practices that absolutely would not fly in any other field of business seem to be commonplace with far too many gun dealers.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:11:34 PM EST

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
I wondered that last week too. I have to yell at them to get some attention. I guess they don't think a young guy has enough cash to buy anything.



That is a huge mistake many dealers make. I was in a store one time, where there was a "kid", maybe 21, 22...who whipped out 2500 bucks to buy 3 guns. The dealer wasn't giving him much attention, and I'm surprised he sold anything to him. I've also seen some dirty, unkempt old guys at shows that have huge wads of cash. Ppl. selling things really need to learn not to just customers by their appearance.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:12:14 PM EST

Because they are ignorant, greedy and/or just plain stupid. I can't believe that some of them want to charge the prices they do, when I can go right down the road or get on the phone and get the same thing cheaper. I bet a lot of them get by, cause there are a lot of ignorant buyers out there. Not stupid, just ignorant.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:14:02 PM EST

Originally Posted By squeezecockerp7m8:

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
I wondered that last week too. I have to yell at them to get some attention. I guess they don't think a young guy has enough cash to buy anything.



That is a huge mistake many dealers make. I was in a store one time, where there was a "kid", maybe 21, 22...who whipped out 2500 bucks to buy 3 guns. The dealer wasn't giving him much attention, and I'm surprised he sold anything to him. I've also seen some dirty, unkempt old guys at shows that have huge wads of cash. Ppl. selling things really need to learn not to just customers by their appearance.



Guy gave me shit once for looking at a $2k preban AR, told me to buy a $600 Bushmaster. I told him all of my rifles were preban, I didnt care for post ban. he was very surprised.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:15:33 PM EST
You can get away with that more in places that people arent expieranced, I have seem the same thing in car related businesses.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:16:33 PM EST
I think some of their customers bring the worst out of them
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:18:22 PM EST

Originally Posted By dpmmn:
I think some of their customers bring the worst out of them



Good point there, consider how many times a week some have to deal with "Homie" (who probaly cant buy anything anyway since he is an oppressed Felon). He comes in and want to look at those 9s AKs and Glocks.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:18:44 PM EST
Car dealers lie cheat and steal because customers lie cheat and steal

Trust me
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:19:03 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/28/2004 8:24:23 PM EST by V-Rod]

Originally Posted By captainpooby:
Its probably because most of their customers are assholes as well. Ask Steyr.



I tend to agree. holding the gun sideways (gangster style) slaming the receiver shut, talking stupid shit would turn any dealer into a ass.

I tend to visit the same saleman that 1)knows their shit about weapons 2) give me good intel 3) suggest new products. 4) suck my ass because they know I have money to spend
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:19:36 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/28/2004 8:21:07 PM EST by MT_Pockets]
I think many of them are becoming frustrated by the unavailability of poduct to sell. You have a very small window of opportunity to get in on the latest "fadtacticalsuperblackeaglebearmagnum" before the rush to obtain one is over. Or it could be the extremely low profit margins on firearms with the increasing cost of shipping. Or maybe the the guy is so busy thinking about how he is going to maintain the $20,000 a year quota on 13 different manufacturers so he doesn't lose his Stocking Dealer status and discount. Or maybe ...ahhh Iguess that is enough.

But if they really don't enjoy it anymore they need to get out of it an let some fresh blood in...there is no reason to treat your customers poorly. I remember the kind of shops you are talking about...

and Don't go to a GunShow and expect one on one quality customer service.


MT

Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:20:34 PM EST
Maby most of them are recovering alcoholics? Yes I see this too and have wondered how they can stay in business. Guess what they dont... When some one moves in to the area and provides a honest and friendly service they will come back! I know this because I have 10x my business in the last 2 years. Lot of the times I do free work. Because I cannot feel good about charging for tightening down a set of base screws. But guess what. That customer comes back and spends $100's next time. And on top of that brings his buddies.

So in closing.. I think its genetic.. There just ass holes..
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:23:09 PM EST
Oh, and one more thing... how does one deal with people for a living & not see the need to maintain their personal hygiene? How do you open your doors for business without showering, brushing your teeth & hair, and putting on some clean cloths???
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:23:44 PM EST
I think a lot of dealers have a problem picking out the customers that actually know what they are talking about and want to give them business. The best times are when they try to give you some bullshit like "they dont make these anymore" uh dah dumbass but that still doesnt mean I want to pay $2000 for a gun that just has a flash Suppressor on it.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:23:46 PM EST
I walked out of LAWMENS SUPPLY in Coumbia, SC today. The clerk told a phone caller that as a matter of store policy, they would only sell " hi-cap" mags to LE. Now I am LE, but I disaree. What did I do? I voted with my few $$ and left.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:31:04 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:31:07 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/28/2004 8:31:33 PM EST by repub18]

Originally Posted By rock71:
I walked out of LAWMENS SUPPLY in Coumbia, SC today. The clerk told a phone caller that as a matter of store policy, they would only sell " hi-cap" mags to LE. Now I am LE, but I disaree. What did I do? I voted with my few $$ and left.




and thats the best we can do, they will realize it sooner or later

moral of all of the arguments "treat your customers as your #1 priority"

think of how much business the dealers on this site make off us, its because they are great at what they do and treat every customer as they are spending $3,000 with them
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:32:20 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:36:27 PM EST

Ego. Plain and simple.


Derived from what exactly... being fat, slovenly, intentionally dishonest, and stupid???
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:37:32 PM EST
Money talks, thats why.



Besides, they know everything.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:39:31 PM EST

Originally Posted By NYPatriot:

Ego. Plain and simple.


Derived from what exactly... being fat, slovenly, intentionally dishonest, and stupid???




did you have a run in with a bad dealer today???
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:42:57 PM EST
Tow truck drivers are just as bad.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:45:00 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/28/2004 8:45:41 PM EST by repub18]
the one dealer I will always go back to is Pace Outfitters in Altamonte Springs, FL. Chris the owners son once said to me "I dont run a meusem here" in reference to prices on mags and guns.


so if your in the area stop by
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:47:39 PM EST

did you have a run in with a bad dealer today???


Not today, but I have in the past (on a few occasions).

It's just that with all the gun show horror stories posted on these forums, coupled with the reluctance of some folks to concede that the AWB is dead, it's hard not to get frustrated with our "brothers in arms"!
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:49:34 PM EST

Originally Posted By NYPatriot:

did you have a run in with a bad dealer today???


Not today, but I have in the past (on a few occasions).

It's just that with all the gun show horror stories posted on these forums, coupled with the reluctance of some folks to concede that the AWB is dead, it's hard not to get frustrated with our "brothers in arms"!




Alot of your expierances sound just like most of mine, I used to think it only happened to me, until I came here
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:51:27 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/28/2004 9:10:20 PM EST by repub18]
the funniest thing I do to piss off asshole dealers is ask if the guns are full auto one by one.


Link Posted: 9/28/2004 8:57:43 PM EST

Originally Posted By repub18:
the funnies thing I do to piss off asshole dealers is ask if the guns are full auto one by one.






Link Posted: 9/28/2004 9:00:01 PM EST

Originally Posted By repub18:
the funnies thing I do to piss off asshole dealers is ask if the guns are full auto one by one.





I seen a few ARs and other guns priced soo high I thought they had to be FA
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 9:00:03 PM EST
Its funny, all the gun stores around here that I have been to have very helpful and knowledgeable staff.

Of course, I haven't been to Turners yet.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 9:07:12 PM EST

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
Course I run my business a little different than most, I don't think I'd survive as a typical gun shop.




Out of curiosity, how do you run your gunshop? I mean, whats your personal rules and regs?

Thanks
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 9:11:29 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/28/2004 9:29:49 PM EST by repub18]
tagged
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 9:45:37 PM EST

Not all gun dealers are ass'es.

I used to notice what bad attitudes many dealers had at stores, but especially at gun show.

Then I got a gun license and started selling off some of my collection in my military surplus store.

Part of the problem is that the profit margin on guns is practically non-existent.

I was selling dpms car-15 ar-15s in my store for $695.00 and dumb asses would come in and waste a bunch of my time asking stoopid questions and then say they were going to wait until the gun ban failed to buy them cheaper. I was making fifty buck a piece on those rifles. And I had assembled them myself, add in store overhead, rent, phone, advertising etc and it worked out to about O profit.

I was only doing it to get some guns out before the ban hit. As a service to my regular customers.

You would not believe the numbers of people who will waste your time. Do stupid things like ask to see an Ar and then field strip it, and then not be able to get it back together. And they have no intention of buying anything. (usually this type is just showing off for his dumb friends)

When a dealer sees this about one hundred times a day, he gets a bit jaded at times.

Especially when what you make on a gun is pretty small.

Most profit margins on retail stuff is about 40%. You buy it for 60 bucks and sell for 100 bucks.

With guns, you buy for 500 and sell for maybe 600.

Check out the wholesale prices in shotgun news and compare it to what dealers sell their guns for. It isn't much mark up compared to the rest of retail.

And don't forget. They aren't making that 40 percent by the time they pay city taxes, state taxes, federal taxes of all kinds. Rent on your store. Phone. Heat. Lights. Security. Shipping and insurance, and much more.

And then the 50th idiot of the day complains about the price of a gun you're selling that you are marking up about 50 bucks.

For most large sporting good stores, guns don't make money after they have paid the counter people wages floor space, etc. They only carry guns to bring in people who will hopefully buy something they have a decent mark up on.

If you want to see it from the other side, get a table at a gun show, and put out your gun collection at prices you are willing to sell them for and see what happens. By the time the 300th idiot of the day grabs one of your guns without asking, twirls it around and starts snapping the trigger (dry firing it) and pointing it at you and then puts it back down scraping it against one of your other guns you will see what I mean.

And when you go through this day after day, after day after day, it can burn you out.

Just a different point of view.

But through all of that, I managed to keep a good attitude believe it or not. Because I understand that a skilled retailer doesn't let idiots ruin his attitude or spoil tableside manner. I still remained friendly and open because that is what being a retailer is all about.


Zen

"This is my rifle, there are many like it, but this one is mine"

Link Posted: 9/28/2004 9:47:02 PM EST
Zen-

I like your makeshift sig line.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 11:45:30 PM EST
I used to always go to the same Shop around here to buy my guns.(then I got married I dont buy guns anymore) Service was always good, They treated me well. (except for one low life guy working there) but the owners always treated me well there. Thier prices were a little high on thier guns but I kept buying from there. Why cuase I liked the way they treated me. Sure I could of gotten stuff cheaper going to the big sporting good stores or the net. but like I said they trated me good, when I was looking for something they steered me in the right direction. ONe day I put a couple hundred on my Layaway bought some other stuff and ammo and when I went to use the range they were like dont worry about the range time its on us you spent enough money here today.
Link Posted: 9/28/2004 11:55:10 PM EST
... Sheese

... Wait until you have to deal with car or real estate salesmen
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 12:29:42 AM EST

Originally Posted By squeezecockerp7m8:

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
I wondered that last week too. I have to yell at them to get some attention. I guess they don't think a young guy has enough cash to buy anything.



That is a huge mistake many dealers make. I was in a store one time, where there was a "kid", maybe 21, 22...who whipped out 2500 bucks to buy 3 guns. The dealer wasn't giving him much attention, and I'm surprised he sold anything to him. I've also seen some dirty, unkempt old guys at shows that have huge wads of cash. Ppl. selling things really need to learn not to just customers by their appearance.



there is a local shop I still refuse to do business with for this same reason. I walked in the store and there was only one other customer and 3 old guys behind the counter after about 10 minutes of no offer of service , I began to ask a few questions and only got nothing, so I tok my 1300.00 and found a great mom and pop store who treated me right , and got lots of my business till CA pushed most of the mom and pop places out of business.... This was all about 10 years ago when I was 19
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 1:21:29 AM EST

Originally Posted By Guns_N_Shizzle:
Car dealers lie cheat and steal because customers lie cheat and steal

Trust me


There is an old saying in sales " Buyers are Liars"
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 1:21:30 AM EST
I blame the BATF and stupid laws for driving many of the good guys out of business. Many of the good guys just switch to another line of work rather that deal with the guberment hassle. In other types of businesses, competition would drive the crooks out of business. With all of the restrictions on the gun industry and slim margins created by unnecessary regulation limits competition.

If one donut shop is overpriced and full of jerks, another donut shop will open around the corner and steal all of the business away by offering good service at a reasonable price. It is not that easy to just open a gun store, due to all the regulations and even zoning. As a result, it is easier for a gun dealer to open a donut shop than a donut shop to start selling guns. Many people have little choice but to go to the local dealer, and they know it. They have no incentive to improve customer service, and will make a profit any way they can.
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 1:41:00 AM EST
Link Posted: 9/29/2004 2:42:38 AM EST

Originally Posted By Guns_N_Shizzle:
Car dealers lie cheat and steal because customers lie cheat and steal

Trust me



Two wrongs don't make a right.
Arrow Left Previous Page
Page / 2
Top Top