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Posted: 12/16/2016 12:25:15 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/16/2016 12:26:06 PM EST by SnackbarJihad]


Letter to the editor


As the founder of the Home Defense Foundation, in 2013 and 2014 I led the effort to partially re-write Louisiana Statutes RS 14:19 and 14:20, which have the often misunderstood "stand your ground" provisions in them. You can read about this effort at the "Changing The Law" page on our website, HdfNola.org.

State Sen.Troy Carter and State Rep. Rodney Lyons are right to say this law needs improvement, although not in the way they might imagine. Currently, all the "stand your ground" provision does is give you a legal right to stay where you are when you are about to be attacked. In other words, there is no duty to retreat, as in other states. Although the provision allows you to meet force with force, it does not state that the force may be disproportionate. You are not allowed to respond to a punch to your shoulder with a bullet to your attacker's head.

The improvement this law needs is a specific provision allowing for a warning shot, which is currently missing. In my opinion, many rage-type shootings could be avoided if the armed participant was able to send a starting "wake up message" to the other party. A warning shot does this. It says: "Stop. Back off. I AM GIVING YOU A WARNING. Let's both calm down and re-assess."

Mike Weinberger,

Founder, Home Defense Foundation

New Orleans
View Quote
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:36:03 PM EST
Is Louisiana not a Castle Doctrine state?

In Ohio we can shoot anyone breaking/broken into our occupied dwelling/vehicle. No need for warning shots.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:38:23 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/16/2016 12:40:00 PM EST by VA-BlkRifle]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FlatDarkEarf:
Is Louisiana not a Castle Doctrine state?

In Ohio we can shoot anyone breaking/broken into our occupied dwelling/vehicle. No need for warning shots.
View Quote

stand your ground applies anywhere you happen to be, no?

in any event, my warning shot hit him in the face, sorry. I was really shaken/shaking at the time.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:38:36 PM EST
Ya, not happening.

Partial good idea, but mostly bad idea.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:40:03 PM EST
What? Let fly with a random non aimed round?

What could possibly go wrong?
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:40:26 PM EST
Double Tap
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:41:42 PM EST
That guy is a fucking dumbass.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:42:41 PM EST
Fucking idiots
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:44:51 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/16/2016 12:45:24 PM EST by mojo]
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:45:37 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By CavScout8:
Ya, not happening.

Partial good idea, but mostly bad idea.
View Quote


Uh no its all bad...
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:46:31 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By VA-BlkRifle:

stand your ground applies anywhere you happen to be, no?

in any event, my warning shot hit him in the face, sorry. I was really shaken/shaking at the time.
View Quote


Castle Doctrine and Stand your Ground are different

Castle Doctrine means you shoot as soon as they enter. In fact, you can shoot while they try to enter - an armed hoodlum was breaking down a veteran's door this year in Columbus. The old vet shot him through the door. DOA. No charges, not even arrested.

Stand your Ground simply means you have no duty to retreat. So, say someone confronts you with a knife. You could risk your life by running and learn the hard way if he's faster than you - or you can shoot him in the face. Stand your Ground doesn't mean you can shoot whenever - unlike Castle Doctrine, they have to pose an eminent risk to your life.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:47:24 PM EST
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:47:34 PM EST
Has he considered where that warning shot may end up?
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:51:03 PM EST
Who would know. The 2nd shot was the warning shot
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 12:53:00 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ARDestructo:
Has he considered where that warning shot may end up?
View Quote


No that's why he suggested it... and his "opinions and knowledge" of guns and shooting are probably gleamed from cop movies from the 80' and 90's

- Clint
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:04:43 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/16/2016 1:07:11 PM EST by jsriolo]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FlatDarkEarf:


Castle Doctrine and Stand your Ground are different

Castle Doctrine means you shoot as soon as they enter. In fact, you can shoot while they try to enter - an armed hoodlum was breaking down a veteran's door this year in Columbus. The old vet shot him through the door. DOA. No charges, not even arrested.

Stand your Ground simply means you have no duty to retreat. So, say someone confronts you with a knife. You could risk your life by running and learn the hard way if he's faster than you - or you can shoot him in the face. Stand your Ground doesn't mean you can shoot whenever - unlike Castle Doctrine, they have to pose an eminent risk to your life.
View Quote


Actually, in Ohio the "Castle Doctrine" just means that you have no duty to retreat from your residence or car. In order to use deadly force in self defense you still need to establish that you were not at fault and that you were in imminent danger of great bodily harm or death. Ohio concealed carry manual. We do not have "Stand Your Ground" in Ohio.

That being said, how do i get the NRA and Instructor tags under my name?
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:08:17 PM EST
i read it as saying that this law allows one to fire a warning shot, not require that they fire one.  i don't see much of a problem there
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:10:57 PM EST
That sounds like a great idea...not. Way to get an innocent bystander shot dead. We have had 2 road rage shooting death incidences and this article likely applies to rhe latter instance. In both instances, the aggressor was killed...irregardless of who caused the road rage. If neither of the aggressors had exited their cars and approached the other driver, neither would be dead. These were bad judgment calls in the heat of the moment.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:15:40 PM EST
Stupid
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:20:39 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/16/2016 1:21:13 PM EST by spidey07]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jsriolo:


Actually, in Ohio the "Castle Doctrine" just means that you have no duty to retreat from your residence or car. In order to use deadly force in self defense you still need to establish that you were not at fault and that you were in imminent danger of great bodily harm or death. Ohio concealed carry manual. We do not have "Stand Your Ground" in Ohio.

That being said, how do i get the NRA and Instructor tags under my name? <img src=http://www.ar15.com/images/smilies/smiley_abused.gif border=0 align=middle>
View Quote


Then you don't have any castle doctrine laws. The very basis of castle doctrine is you are legally presumed to have reasonable fear of bodily harm or death if they are forcibly attempting to enter or have already unlawfully entered the dwelling. KY is pretty strong and is worded for anywhere you "dwell" along with your mode of transportation. So don't try to remove a guy from his skateboard or he can legally shoot you in the face.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:24:56 PM EST
I like to know that my bullet is not going to hit a stray target.

Hence, no warning shot. It would be dangerous.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:26:25 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mcantu:
i read it as saying that this law allows one to fire a warning shot, not require that they fire one.  i don't see much of a problem there
View Quote


Bullets never ever miss.

They always hit...something.

Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:27:41 PM EST
Can't wait to see what happens when the warning shot richochets off the ground and kills some bystander. The ignorance of people making laws like this are boundless.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:30:40 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By spidey07:


Then you don't have any castle doctrine laws. The very basis of castle doctrine is you are legally presumed to have reasonable fear of bodily harm or death if they are forcibly attempting to enter or have already unlawfully entered the dwelling. KY is pretty strong and is worded for anywhere you "dwell" along with your mode of transportation. So don't try to remove a guy from his skateboard or he can legally shoot you in the face.
View Quote


This is a good point. While it is called the "Castle Doctrine" in Ohio it sounds like the equivalent of "Stand your ground" (but only at home!) in other states.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:37:33 PM EST
Florida already has a warning shot law.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:39:10 PM EST
There's probably no chance that this would lead to people being killed by stray bullets. 
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:41:57 PM EST
In Texas the policy for CHL holders is the first time your target knows you are exercising your right to apply deadly force is when they see your muzzle flash.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 1:45:53 PM EST
LOL "warning shot" - what a dumb fucking thing to do; this guy is a total idiot
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 2:09:17 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/16/2016 2:16:08 PM EST by BigeasySnow]
Originally Posted By SnackbarJihad:
<img src=http://www.ar15.com/images/smilies/anim_rofl.gif border=0 align=middle>

Letter to the editor


As the founder of the Home Defense Foundation, in 2013 and 2014 I led the effort to partially re-write Louisiana Statutes RS 14:19 and 14:20, which have the often misunderstood "stand your ground" provisions in them. You can read about this effort at the "Changing The Law" page on our website, HdfNola.org.

State Sen.Troy Carter and State Rep. Rodney Lyons are right to say this law needs improvement, although not in the way they might imagine. Currently, all the "stand your ground" provision does is give you a legal right to stay where you are when you are about to be attacked. In other words, there is no duty to retreat, as in other states. Although the provision allows you to meet force with force, it does not state that the force may be disproportionate. You are not allowed to respond to a punch to your shoulder with a bullet to your attacker's head.

The improvement this law needs is a specific provision allowing for a warning shot, which is currently missing. In my opinion, many rage-type shootings could be avoided if the armed participant was able to send a starting "wake up message" to the other party. A warning shot does this. It says: "Stop. Back off. I AM GIVING YOU A WARNING. Let's both calm down and re-assess."

Mike Weinberger,

Founder, Home Defense Foundation

New Orleans
View Quote
View Quote


Never heard of this dipshit or his cockamamie "organization".

ETA: it appears his hearts in the right place and that he does have some political momentum. Just dreadfully ignorant and untrained. Sad for a group that trains new shooters.

And no mention of the NRA. Awesome.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 2:12:46 PM EST
Warning shot, so now some passerby is going to take a bullet so the criminal can still keep doing criminal things?
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 3:03:27 PM EST
My appreciation of the law is - you are either invited in, or carried out, your choice. I am good either way.
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 3:14:52 PM EST
Warning shot? LMAO.....NO!
Link Posted: 12/16/2016 3:42:42 PM EST
The extremely brilliant tactician Joe Biden says shoot a double barrel shotgun in the air and the combined armed forces of the entire world would scatter in fear.

I wonder if Obama knows he could just set outside and shoot a shotgun in the air, which would cause Russia to immediately confess to rigging the election and simultaneously awarding the Presidency to Hitlery Clinton.
Link Posted: 12/17/2016 4:17:14 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/17/2016 4:20:06 AM EST by SnackbarJihad]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By efpeter:
The extremely brilliant tactician Joe Biden says shoot a double barrel shotgun in the air and the combined armed forces of the entire world would scatter in fear.

I wonder if Obama knows he could just set outside and shoot a shotgun in the air, which would cause Russia to immediately confess to rigging the election and simultaneously awarding the Presidency to Hitlery Clinton.
View Quote





edit: How the heck do youtube links work?
Link Posted: 12/17/2016 4:36:56 AM EST

Two warning shots to the chest.

Next one means business.





Link Posted: 12/17/2016 4:38:31 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ARDestructo:
Has he considered where that warning shot may end up?
View Quote


That's the problem.
Maybe in a rural area, Maybe.
Any other place, almost always a terrible idea.
Link Posted: 12/17/2016 4:39:54 AM EST
Will they specify the approved direction for the warning shot in the legislature?
Link Posted: 12/17/2016 4:45:28 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/17/2016 4:47:29 AM EST by Mach]
She is right you know,

A warning shot to the head can be a very effective deterrent.
Link Posted: 12/18/2016 8:36:33 PM EST
Looks like somebody thought this was already a law.

link
Link Posted: 12/18/2016 8:51:40 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Ventilator:
That guy is a fucking dumbass.
View Quote


This.
Link Posted: 12/18/2016 8:56:43 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Dsimpson04:
Florida already has a warning shot law.
View Quote


And we all died. It was terrible.
Link Posted: 12/18/2016 9:02:36 PM EST
The only explanation I can think of is that it was just a warning letter.
Link Posted: 12/18/2016 9:05:25 PM EST
If you have a pump shotgun would racking the slide work in place of a warning shot?  
Link Posted: 12/18/2016 9:05:40 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Mossberg:


And we all died. It was terrible.
View Quote




Everyone here was saying the same stuff when Florida's was proposed. I haven't even heard of the law being used yet.
Link Posted: 12/18/2016 9:19:37 PM EST
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