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Posted: 1/6/2005 6:14:51 AM EDT
Informative piece on PBS last night in their series "Do you speak American?"

One serious linguist says that white urban kids like homophobic and mysogenistic rap because the see black urban males as:

1. more confident
2. much more sexually adept and successful
3. much more confident with the use of weapons, in particular firearms
4. much more willing to defend themselves

The linguist contends that young, white listeners of rap have an image of themselves as powerless and socially unsuccessful.

Fascinating to say the least.

Let the beatings begin!
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 6:18:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/6/2005 6:20:36 AM EDT by sonofbp]
Because the liberal white women raising them like to make them feel like they must rely on everyone else.
Someone attacks you = run and call the police.
See someone doing something illegal = call the police and hide.
Anything scary = call for help and flee/hide/place head in the sand.

The only thing the black female informs their children to rely on is .gov and nothing else.
The white and the black mothers are two sides of a democratic/liberal coin.

Lucky for me my mom would not let me rely on anybody but myself.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 6:18:28 AM EDT
A waste is a terrible thing to mind.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 6:20:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/6/2005 6:25:25 AM EDT by EPOCH96]

Originally Posted By sonofbp:
Because the liberal white women raising them like to make them feel like they must rely on everyone else.
The only thing the black female informs their children to rely on is .gov and nothing else.
The white and the black mothers are two sides of a democratic/liberal coin.




ETA: ok, saw the clarification below, never mind...

EPOCH
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 6:21:15 AM EDT
Oh, wait a minute. It's because parents are not responsible for their children anymore. They have no positive role models or people to look up to. This is what you get.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 6:23:35 AM EDT

Originally Posted By EPOCH96:

Originally Posted By sonofbp:
Because the liberal white women raising them like to make them feel like they must rely on everyone else.
The only thing the black female informs their children to rely on is .gov and nothing else.
The white and the black mothers are two sides of a democratic/liberal coin.




Glad to see you don't stereotype people

EPOCH


Not all people just liberals.
Not a racist just stating the overwhelming percentage of people that fall into that catagory.
I trust no one until they prove they are worthy.
The trick is to never stop giving people/anyone the chance to prove they are trust worthy.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 6:23:56 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/6/2005 6:25:55 AM EDT by Tactical_Jew]
One serious linguist says that white urban kids like homophobic and mysogenistic rap because the see black urban males as:

1. more confidenthahhahhahahha
2. much more sexually adept and successfulas long as taxpayers pay for their babies
3. much more confident with the use of weapons, in particular firearmsStandby for the "Gangsta tactical course" at Thunder Ranch"
4. much more willing to defend themselvesespecially when there are ten of them and one senior citizen who just cashed her ss check

Link Posted: 1/6/2005 6:29:11 AM EDT
They like it because it sucks.

Kids like anything their parents hate. And what is easier to hate than rap? The worst music, performed by some of the worst scumballs. It's perfect for rebelious youth!
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 6:40:31 AM EDT
IBTL..........

Link Posted: 1/6/2005 6:44:39 AM EDT
I think it's a part of youth's assinine feelings that they need to:

Rebel against their parent's 'normalcy'

Be different (which contradicts the next one)

Fit in with all the other kids

Follow fads


I think mostly it really roots in a general situation where parents are not parenting. They let their kids grow up with little to no guidance or participation. Throw the kids in front of the TV and go on about your life seems to be the status quo for many parents. After all, we're smack dab in the middle of the ME generation. Most people just can't be bothered taking time out of their own lives to take care of their responsibilities.

As for why kids choose gangsta rap... it's probably because a lot of other kids do. They know their parents don't like it, so it's cool.

(one of my cousins, who is now 17 I think... a couple years ago when I visited family, she had long blonde hair, and was growing into a beautiful young woman... [the women on that side of my family are all pretty much very good looking]... well, she then cut her hair all wacky, died it black, started wearing mostly black clothes... When I asked her about why she changed so much, she said she didn't want to be the pretty blonde, she wanted to be different. So I said "how, by looking like every other punk teenager?" - She had no answer to that one!)
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 6:44:56 AM EDT
I didn't say I approve of it or agree with it. Merely a departure point for discussion.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 6:45:16 AM EDT
Maybe it's as simple as spending too much time getting indoctrinated by MTV?
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 6:59:58 AM EDT
Word yo

That is the shizzle fo rizzle mah *izzle
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:06:02 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/6/2005 7:07:37 AM EDT by drache]

Originally Posted By Mahatma8Rice:
Informative piece on PBS last night in their series "Do you speak American?"

One serious linguist says that white urban kids like homophobic and mysogenistic rap because the see black urban males as:

1. more confident
2. much more sexually adept and successful
3. much more confident with the use of weapons, in particular firearms
4. much more willing to defend themselves

The linguist contends that young, white listeners of rap have an image of themselves as powerless and socially unsuccessful.

Fascinating to say the least.

Let the beatings begin!



What a load of pig crap!
These kids like it because they are pounded with it all day, every day. What the hell else do you think they're watching on TV?

You can't portray a black male in ANY negative way, or even infer that there might be something wrong with him, without being blasted by the NAACP for being a racist. Meanwhile, it's quite common and completely acceptable to cut down a white man. Heap upon him the negative sterotypes portrayed so nicely all over the friggin boob tube. (actually same goes for women, hispanics, native americans, asians, etc.) You can't portray ANY of them as stupid, lazy, alcoholics, without being blasted by the PC crowd. By all means though, feel free to portray a white male in that fashion. Nothing wrong with that at all. I mean after all, we are all fat, stupid, lazy, beer guzzling idiots that need a nice strong, smart, successful woman to make sure we don't blow ourselves up trying to light the grill or remind us to put our pants on before we leave the house.

Is it any wonder that these kids are looking up to black urban males then?
Hell, if I based my life off what I see on TV, I'd be emulating women. Seems to me you can't be intelligent unless you have tits.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:23:27 AM EDT
Every generation has its fad,

Elvis,

Hippies,

Disco,<­BR>
Big hair,

Flannel shirts,

Saggy pants and poor grammar...

ect...ect...


That being said, I would like to slap every one of the little foul mouthed bastards
I see in public acting like idiots.
I think Matthew_Q hit the nail on the head with what he said about most parents today.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:25:15 AM EDT
Drache,

Bingo! You are so correct. The white man on TV, whether it is in a series or on a commercial, is almost invariably portrayed as some sort clownish oaf. Men of color are cool, confident, and sexxy.

Let me warn you of one thing. It is dangerous to go against pop culture, particularly here at ARFCOM.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:28:15 AM EDT
Change the title of this thread "Rural White Kids and their Attraction to Shitty Country Music" and the reasons given will be pretty much identical.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:28:53 AM EDT
Part of the issue:

Urban is "in".

Kids are attracted to that which is popular (on the whole).

The only time you will see commercials that aren't "urban cool" is a commercial for Hidden Valley Ranch Dressing, a life insurance commercial, ect.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:30:44 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:33:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Mahatma8Rice:
Informative piece on PBS last night in their series "Do you speak American?"

One serious linguist says that white urban kids like homophobic and mysogenistic rap because the see black urban males as:

1. more confident
2. much more sexually adept and successful
3. much more confident with the use of weapons, in particular firearms
4. much more willing to defend themselves

The linguist contends that young, white listeners of rap have an image of themselves as powerless and socially unsuccessful.

Fascinating to say the least.

Let the beatings begin!



Serious and rap are an oxymoron. History will find nothing interesting about it except it had an extended life because the society as a whole extended adolescence into the 3rd decade. 30 year olds calling each other homey and wearing napkins on their head........damn....give me back the afro.....
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:34:19 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/6/2005 7:34:39 AM EDT by Matthew_Q]

Originally Posted By Dolomite:
Change the title of this thread "Rural White Kids and their Attraction to Shitty Country Music" and the reasons given will be pretty much identical.



So I guess rural white kids, being from the COUNTRY, shouldn't listen to COUNTRY music, which is usually made by WHITE guys and girls FROM THE COUNTRY.

White rural kids listening to country music is, for the most part 'normal'. Their parents listen to it and were probably raised on it.

How many urban white kids' parents were raised listening to gangsta rap? How many urban white people are now making, and are popular at making, gangsta rap?


Me, I'm all about saying 'fuck it', as long as the urban kids don't start playing out what they hear in the 'music' they choose to listen to. I don't care what they do. When I have kids, I intend to raise them, not ignore them. The more of their peers who waste there lives fucking off will leave more opportunities for my children to succeed.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:40:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Mahatma8Rice:
Drache,

Bingo! You are so correct. The white man on TV, whether it is in a series or on a commercial, is almost invariably portrayed as some sort clownish oaf. Men of color are cool, confident, and sexxy.

Let me warn you of one thing. It is dangerous to go against pop culture, particularly here at ARFCOM.



White men on TV (from Ozzie to Archie to Raymond) have always been mostly clownish (who's more clownish than Homer?) Arguably the biggest series black guy was Cosby, sort of a clown, compared to his wife. Being a thug and a misogynist and cool may just be a backlash against feminism.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:43:09 AM EDT
Lord, please make it stop!
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:49:04 AM EDT
Nothing against country fans (even though I really hate you), but look at the reasons given

1. more confident
2. much more sexually adept and successful
3. much more confident with the use of weapons, in particular firearms
4. much more willing to defend themselves



Simply reverse the tables. Cannot the same be said for Kenny Chestnut, Dwight Hokum, them fiddle players on Hee Haw, or even that weirdo that does the Monday Night Football intro?

(Why is he still doing that anyway? I swear he’s got pictures of Peter Jennings in bed with a goat or something)
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:55:16 AM EDT
Dolomite,

DISCLAIMER: I don't believe all country music is bad. Much of it is harmless and entertaining. Some of it is pure musical genious. Much of it is unimaginative, commercial crap (as is the case in virtually any genre).

And now, back to Dolomite................

I agree whole-heartedly. The only difference between most gangsta rap and most country music is that the country stuff at least has a melody and the videos are sometimes imaginative.

Rap is racist; advocates violence against women, white folk, and the police; and is quite vulgar.

Country romanticises adultry, drunkeness, self-destructive behavior, and violence against "them that done you wrong."

Hardly a wits worth of difference.

Let the beatings begin.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:57:19 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Mahatma8Rice:
Informative piece on PBS last night in their series "Do you speak American?"

One serious linguist says that white urban kids like homophobic and mysogenistic rap because the see black urban males as:

1. more confident
2. much more sexually adept and successful
3. much more confident with the use of weapons, in particular firearms
4. much more willing to defend themselves

The linguist contends that young, white listeners of rap have an image of themselves as powerless and socially unsuccessful.




I'd say these findings are skewed by a healthy dose of white guilt.

However, several years ago I got a Certificate of Absolution From White Guilt from Ken Hamblin.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 7:59:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Dolomite:
Nothing against country fans (even though I really hate you), but look at the reasons given

1. more confident
2. much more sexually adept and successful
3. much more confident with the use of weapons, in particular firearms
4. much more willing to defend themselves



Simply reverse the tables. Cannot the same be said for Kenny Chestnut, Dwight Hokum, them fiddle players on Hee Haw, or even that weirdo that does the Monday Night Football intro?

(Why is he still doing that anyway? I swear he’s got pictures of Peter Jennings in bed with a goat or something)



don't be bad mouthin' Hank now!
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 8:00:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Mahatma8Rice:
Rap is racist; advocates violence against women, white folk, and the police; and is quite vulgar.

Country romanticises adultry, drunkeness, self-destructive behavior, and violence against "them that done you wrong."



"In matters of taste, there is no dispute."

Puh-lenty of drug use, murder, misogyny, animal cruelty, and sinful lethargy in country music - and you don't have to look too hard to find it (the old guys were the best IMHO).

That's all I'm saying.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 8:09:54 AM EDT
Hip Hop culture is a very lucrative repackaging of the "counter culture."

ARH



Link Posted: 1/6/2005 8:10:18 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 9:05:22 AM EDT
MTV and other networks portraying Pukes like Snoop Dogg as a pillar of society. He and others like him are nothing more than Project trash that can talk fast and got noticed by an industry that has no moral boundaries.

So I guess you could say that greed is why White kids follow this pattern. Kids that young act like what they see and are taught. TV teaches Mo money
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 9:11:57 AM EDT
Kids are naive and gullible.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 9:38:11 AM EDT
I guess I shouldn't say I hate all country music. My Mom was a fanatic for Willie, and some of that rubbed off on me.

Then there's the Man in Black. His cover of the NIN song “Closer” really gets me pumped up, makes me want to smash things with my fists. It’s awesome.

When I was in Vegas a few years back I went to a K1 fight. A lot of rap in the intro music as the fighters came out believe me, some popular rock songs, but mostly rap.

However, there was this one Japanese fighter who had ABBA for his intro music. ABBA.

Obviously he didn’t care what the song “Dancing Queen” stood for – but the music apparently got him going – an example of music making a human being ready to dole out some good old ultra-violence: ABBA Who'd a thunk?

So, how can there be such a thing as bad music? Isn’t that sort of like bad guns?
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 9:42:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/6/2005 9:45:05 AM EDT by junker46]

Originally Posted By Tate:
Part of the issue:

Urban is "in".

Kids are attracted to that which is popular (on the whole).

The only time you will see commercials that aren't "urban cool" is a commercial for Hidden Valley Ranch Dressing, a life insurance commercial, ect.



But I wonder why it's so popular? Flame on, but I'm about ready for a -- how would it be defind? -- new 'change' in in our culture. 'Gansta,' 'urban,' or what ever has about run its course. Remember "top Gun' or "Urban Cowboy?'

Edit to add: why do white people feel the need to appologize (see begining post) if they have, or about to , comment about minorities?
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 9:58:26 AM EDT

I don't know what the original poster meant by "black urban males", this is not a term that I am familiar with? If he /she is talking aobut the Gangster type looking Wanna be Kids That listen to the foul languaged RAP CRAP. then I'll try and respond to the Post.

My Children are not allowed to listen to that CRAP. And If I ever catch my Kids walking around with their ass hanging half out of their pants....they will soon be walking around without any.

Link Posted: 1/6/2005 10:17:17 AM EDT
That's all they ever hear where ever they might go. They go to school and at the pep assembly it's played (edited), they go home and turn on the TV and its there topping the charts, they go to a party and the "cool" kids have it playin. I know some guys younger than I who don't even like rap, but they have the cds just to have in their car in case they want to impess some people. I would also say that a lot of them just seem to like it for reasons beyond me.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 10:21:17 AM EDT
I listen to rap. I like songs about violence. I also listen to Johnny Cash, David Allen Coe, Pantera, Marilyn Manson, and nearly anyone else who has a good song about killing somebody. This tends to make me feel better, while also allowing my to keep in mind that some people have a violent mindset regardless of what they do for a living, be it robbing people or writing songs.
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 10:40:04 AM EDT
Wow.

What was that term they used for rock music back in the ‘50’s?

It was always used when talking about what a danger rock was to teenagers at the time…

Anybody remember?
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 10:45:58 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/6/2005 11:05:33 AM EDT
Both annoy the sh#t out of me - notice that Tim McGraw recently did a "romance" song with Nelly........I am fed up with the pop culture in general. They {pop culture} are completely oblivious to the world they live in. I grew up around a lot of people who listen to country music. Many were about as useful as your "thugged out" pimple faced teenager driving a Honda Civic. Listeners of country music generally know how to shoot well - the numbers would rise however if whiskey wasn't so predominant..........I can respect OLD country music - but the modern shit is not much better then rap music. To country's credit, country music, with all its problems, tends to be me more proAmerican in nature - that is, those artists who stick to the roots of country music. There is NOTHING good in rap music.

Link Posted: 1/7/2005 4:23:26 PM EDT
I must admit, I do get a chuckle out of it. Hence the user name... Most of the time kids who act like "Gangsta's" do so because they don't have anything in place of that would give them a more genuine identity.

Sports, hobbies and music are great ways for younger people to get identity instead of MTVhing
It seems sometimes we try to analyze this stuff to put the blame on rap music, heavy metal and Jerry Springer when the answers are actually right in front of us.

If your kid has a confidence issue, try football. A sissy? Karate or Wrestling should do. Can't talk well in front of others? Try student senate or music. And here is the key point - HELP THEM DO IT.

Once they learn how to get themselves out of comprimising positions and build confidence the hard work is done. If they want to act like some MTV dirtball gangster after that, well then maybe they are mentally deficient and there is nothing you can do about it.

The bottom line is that kids acting like that are usually not the smartest and its not always thier fault. People that act like that are not genuine and most of them are harmless. If they are not harmless and really do take up the "Gangsta" way of life, well they will get a real street education fast. Gangsta's of any type aren't that tough when they are put in comprimising positions in a jail or hospital...

Word.
Link Posted: 1/7/2005 4:32:30 PM EDT
anything that pisses off mommy and daddy will be popular with kids.
Link Posted: 1/7/2005 4:35:05 PM EDT
Wow,

I think I'll dust off my old cd 'Straight Outta Compton'


fond memories....
Link Posted: 1/7/2005 4:52:09 PM EDT
... Where do you think black urban males got it from?

... The Beastie Boys why of course!

Link Posted: 1/7/2005 5:01:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DoubleFeed:

Originally Posted By Dolomite:
Nothing against country fans (even though I really hate you), but look at the reasons given

1. more confident
2. much more sexually adept and successful
3. much more confident with the use of weapons, in particular firearms
4. much more willing to defend themselves



Simply reverse the tables. Cannot the same be said for Kenny Chestnut, Dwight Hokum, them fiddle players on Hee Haw, or even that weirdo that does the Monday Night Football intro?

(Why is he still doing that anyway? I swear he’s got pictures of Peter Jennings in bed with a goat or something)

LMAO! You don't listen to much country, do you?
Right off the top of my head, there are all of about 4 or 5 songs that mention guns in any context. Only one of them is newer than about 20 years old.
Country music is about drinking, love and lack of, and country life, so self defense and guns are rarely mentioned. I also haven't heard very many songs in country music talking about success or being confidant and sexy.
Two VERY different kinds of music. You can contrast all day long, but the only comparison is that both use some kind of sound producing device and vocals. That's it.


No guns? Do you even listen to Johnny Cash? Is there a Cash album that doesn't have guns on it?
Link Posted: 1/7/2005 5:41:27 PM EDT
The original study probably has an element of truth in it. Think of ten year old kids with a superman cape on. They're acting in ways they couldn't otherwise. The gangsta rapper videos are kind of like superman comics, only with blow, hos, and glocks. Timmy Whitebread gets to say "Yo, bitch, I said sprinkles on this forzen yogurt!" at the mall, something he couldn't do otherwise.

Of course, the gansta videos have about as much to do with reality as the superman comics do. And the kids look like damn fools. Fifteen years from now most of them will cringe at the photos taken of them now.
Link Posted: 1/7/2005 5:46:59 PM EDT
Defining Deviancy Down ----- The late Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan
Link Posted: 1/7/2005 5:53:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Mahatma8Rice:
Informative piece on PBS last night in their series "Do you speak American?"

One serious linguist says that white urban kids like homophobic and mysogenistic rap because the see black urban males as:

1. more confident
2. much more sexually adept and successful
3. much more confident with the use of weapons, in particular firearms
4. much more willing to defend themselves

The linguist contends that young, white listeners of rap have an image of themselves as powerless and socially unsuccessful.

Fascinating to say the least.

Let the beatings begin!



I've always said those exact things.

White kids like rap because it's a backlash. They've been told to be pussies, to watch Queer Eye and get in touch with their feelings, and not to fight at school. Rappers might be wankstas but the image they portray, and the *feeling* you can get while listening to the music can make you think "yeah, I"m a badass mothafucka!" at least for a while.
Link Posted: 1/7/2005 5:56:31 PM EDT
1. more confident
2. much more sexually adept and successful
3. much more confident with the use of weapons, in particular firearms
4. much more willing to defend themselves

For a youngster (Male) of ANY color, what's not to like? THAT crap is what little boys DREAM of.
Link Posted: 1/8/2005 4:51:02 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/8/2005 4:57:49 AM EDT
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