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Posted: 9/30/2011 6:35:26 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/30/2011 6:38:22 AM EST by OlKev]
And the social experiment within the military continues

US: military chaplains may perform same-sex unions

WASHINGTON (AP) –– The Pentagon has decided that military chaplains may perform same-sex unions, whether on or off a military installation.


PLUS!
After demise of ‘don’t ask,’ activists call for end to military ban on transgenders

With homosexuals now able to serve openly in the military, the gay rights movement’s next battleground is to persuade the Obama administration to end the armed forces’ ban on “transgenders,” a group that includes transsexuals and cross-dressers.

“Our position is that the military should re-examine the policy, the medical regulations, so as to allow open service for transgender people,” said Vincent Paolo Villano, spokesman for the 6,000-member Center for Transgender Equality.

The Servicemembers Legal Defense Network (SLDN), which pushed to end the military’s gay ban, is urging President Obama to sign an executive order prohibiting discrimination based on “gender identity.”
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 6:47:15 AM EST
Wait until they start forcing out the chaplains that don't want to perform the ceremony for Pfc. Slave & Sgt. Big Gay Al.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 6:55:51 AM EST
The military is just another federal job now...
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:06:26 AM EST
They are trying to destroy this country. No question about it.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:11:42 AM EST

Originally Posted By Hoodooman:
Wait until they start forcing out the chaplains that don't want to perform the ceremony for Pfc. Slave & Sgt. Big Gay Al.

Just like they force out the Baptists for not christening infants?
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:13:32 AM EST
Who could have seen that coming?
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:14:50 AM EST
Originally Posted By Pegasus6:

Originally Posted By Hoodooman:
Wait until they start forcing out the chaplains that don't want to perform the ceremony for Pfc. Slave & Sgt. Big Gay Al.

Just like they force out the Baptists for not christening infants?


So - did the repeal of DADT include provisions for objections on religious grounds? You are comparing apples to oranges.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:21:15 AM EST

Originally Posted By Hoodooman:
Originally Posted By Pegasus6:

Originally Posted By Hoodooman:
Wait until they start forcing out the chaplains that don't want to perform the ceremony for Pfc. Slave & Sgt. Big Gay Al.

Just like they force out the Baptists for not christening infants?


So - did the repeal of DADT include provisions for objections on religious grounds? You are comparing apples to oranges.

I am comparing one religious event that some chaplains prefer to not do to another religious event that some chaplains prefer not to do.

No one is going to force a chaplain to do a gay "marriage", just like no one forces a chaplain to do an infant christening.

The Chaplain's Corps will continue to serve the religious needs of all Soldiers, just like they always have.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:24:38 AM EST
So a male soldier can wear a woman's uniform now if he identifies as a woman?
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:25:37 AM EST
Originally Posted By AKengineer:
So a male soldier can wear a woman's uniform now if he identifies as a woman?


No, that's the next agenda to be forced through.

Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:25:53 AM EST
So a male soldier can wear a woman's uniform now if he identifies as a woman? Tell me this: can a person with a vagina that self identifies as a man still be banned from combat MOSs? That is the real repercussion of all of this silly shit.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:26:15 AM EST
Everyone in the Army dresses the same, how is someone suppose to cross dress?
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:27:02 AM EST

Originally Posted By DocBach:
Everyone in the Army dresses the same, how is someone suppose to cross dress?

Class A.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:27:30 AM EST
Originally Posted By AKengineer:
So a male soldier can wear a woman's uniform now if he identifies as a woman? Tell me this: can a person with a vagina that self identifies as a man still be banned from combat MOSs? That is the real repercussion of all of this silly shit.


What about She-Males?
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:27:48 AM EST
Originally Posted By DocBach:
Everyone in the Army dresses the same, how is someone suppose to cross dress?


Army doesn't have Female Class A's?

Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:29:17 AM EST
Originally Posted By DocBach:
Everyone in the Army dresses the same, how is someone suppose to cross dress?


Some female decides the tie tab is stupid, (it is), and is allowed to wear the male tie... or vice versa. Just wait and see, we'll do the same as many euro countries and get rid of the tie tab and female service caps; just standardize on wheel covers and ties.

Or maybe a guy wants to wear high heels and skirt...
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:30:06 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/30/2011 7:30:40 AM EST by DocBach]
Originally Posted By mac130:
Originally Posted By DocBach:
Everyone in the Army dresses the same, how is someone suppose to cross dress?


Army doesn't have Female Class A's?



oops, forgot about those, only time they get busted out is for the battalion christmas party, and all we've got is dudes in the Infantry so I'm not use to seeing women in Class As.

someone else put out a good point, probably going to be a loophole to try and get chicks who think they are men in combat arms. Just because you THINK you are a man doesn't make you one, if I THOUGHT I was something else then I was like say a martian or a Greek god or an elephant, people would think I had a mental disorder and bar me from enlistment.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:31:15 AM EST
Originally Posted By DocBach:
Everyone in the Army dresses the same, how is someone suppose to cross dress?


Carry an aid bag?



Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:31:22 AM EST
how long before they fire chaplains who refuse to perform same sex marriges?
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:31:43 AM EST

Originally Posted By Tony-Ri:
Or maybe a guy wants to wear high heels and skirt...

Or, more realistically, grow his hair out...

When the British opened their ranks to homosexuals, they had a General show up the next day in a woman's uniform. Apparently, he was serious.

That was told to me by a retired O-6. I presume it's true.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:32:36 AM EST

Originally Posted By Overdose:
how long before they fire chaplains who refuse to perform same sex marriges?

Why do you think they would do that?
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:51:31 AM EST
Haha good one.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:52:00 AM EST
Originally Posted By FightingHellfish:
Originally Posted By DocBach:
Everyone in the Army dresses the same, how is someone suppose to cross dress?


Carry an aid bag?





Haha good one.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:53:46 AM EST
Originally Posted By FightingHellfish:
Originally Posted By DocBach:
Everyone in the Army dresses the same, how is someone suppose to cross dress?


Carry an aid bag?







Stockings?
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:57:18 AM EST
I am pretty sure the DOMA still applies so.these service members still won't qualify for any dependent status.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 7:59:55 AM EST
Originally Posted By Pegasus6:

Originally Posted By Overdose:
how long before they fire chaplains who refuse to perform same sex marriges?

Why do you think they would do that?


It seems to be the natural progression of things.

Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:00:13 AM EST
How long before PFC Shithead skates on his PT test because he identifies himself as a female and wants to be scored under female standards?
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:04:00 AM EST
Originally Posted By divkat9:
How long before PFC Shithead skates on his PT test because he identifies himself as a female and wants to be scored under female standards?


That would be an interesting dilemma.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:04:06 AM EST

Originally Posted By Overdose:
Originally Posted By Pegasus6:

Originally Posted By Overdose:
how long before they fire chaplains who refuse to perform same sex marriges?

Why do you think they would do that?


It seems to be the natural progression of things.



I provided an example above where hte opposite has proven true. Can you provide an example of a Chaplain being removed for refusing to do a religious ceremony he did not believe in?
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:09:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/30/2011 8:09:16 AM EST by mac130]
Originally Posted By Pegasus6:

Originally Posted By Overdose:
Originally Posted By Pegasus6:

Originally Posted By Overdose:
how long before they fire chaplains who refuse to perform same sex marriges?

Why do you think they would do that?


It seems to be the natural progression of things.



I provided an example above where hte opposite has proven true. Can you provide an example of a Chaplain being removed for refusing to do a religious ceremony he did not believe in?


Give it time, it's only been a few weeks. Actually, I'm surprised they just haven't just banned Chaplains yet.

Religion has no place in Gov't after all.

Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:11:23 AM EST
So fucking happy I am out of the military.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:12:24 AM EST
The U.S. Military, now with more social engineering and social test platforms.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:14:59 AM EST
All the conservatives are leaving the military in droves to usher in the new socialist left controlled military.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:20:48 AM EST
So how long til an in the closet male officer gets moved up the chain of command by a democratic administration and then comes out and starts wearing a dress. Imagine a tranny trying to inspire our troops before battle. Damn were going down hill fast.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:24:21 AM EST

Originally Posted By DOBERMAN:
So how long til an in the closet male officer gets moved up the chain of command by a democratic administration and then comes out and starts wearing a dress. Imagine a tranny trying to inspire our troops before battle. Damn were going down hill fast.


Hmm...a twenty+ years secret democrat plot to produce the first gay general...

Or, we could wait a few years and it will happen "naturally". Hell, I bet there already is one...
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:29:20 AM EST
Originally Posted By Tony-Ri:
Originally Posted By DocBach:
Everyone in the Army dresses the same, how is someone suppose to cross dress?


Some female decides the tie tab is stupid, (it is), and is allowed to wear the male tie... or vice versa. Just wait and see, we'll do the same as many euro countries and get rid of the tie tab and female service caps; just standardize on wheel covers and ties.


The Air Force already allows women to wear the men's flight cap. But men cannot wear the women's flight cap. Equality.

Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:29:31 AM EST
Eventually they will ban chaplains - because chaplains are cost effective, and the government has no business being efficient.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:31:12 AM EST
Originally Posted By Hoodooman:
Wait until they start forcing out the chaplains that don't want to perform the ceremony for Pfc. Slave & Sgt. Big Gay Al.


They are already doing that for refusing to approve some of these other perversions. No need to wait on that. It will happen.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:31:22 AM EST
Originally Posted By AKengineer:
So a male soldier can wear a woman's uniform now if he identifies as a woman?


Kilinger approves!
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:36:13 AM EST

Originally Posted By mousehunter:
Eventually they will ban chaplains - because chaplains are cost effective, and the government has no business being efficient.


If chaplains were enlisted you might have a case. Making them officers makes no sense at all, since they never have command authority and are noncombatants. Civilian contractors could do the job at a massive cost savings, assuming anybody in DoD would even give a shit if all chaplains disappeared overnight.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:40:10 AM EST

Originally Posted By CCW:
Originally Posted By Hoodooman:

Wait until they start forcing out the chaplains


They are already doing that

Cite?
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 8:53:53 AM EST
Originally Posted By Chairborne:

Originally Posted By mousehunter:
Eventually they will ban chaplains - because chaplains are cost effective, and the government has no business being efficient.


If chaplains were enlisted you might have a case. Making them officers makes no sense at all, since they never have command authority and are noncombatants. Civilian contractors could do the job at a massive cost savings, assuming anybody in DoD would even give a shit if all chaplains disappeared overnight.


Ben, what's up?

I do believe the Chaplains will be cut eventually given the anti religion agenda that seems prevalent these days
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 9:08:33 AM EST
Originally Posted By OlKev:
And the social experiment within the military continues

US: military chaplains may perform same-sex unions

WASHINGTON (AP) –– The Pentagon has decided that military chaplains may perform same-sex unions, whether on or off a military installation.


PLUS!
After demise of ‘don’t ask,’ activists call for end to military ban on transgenders

With homosexuals now able to serve openly in the military, the gay rights movement’s next battleground is to persuade the Obama administration to end the armed forces’ ban on “transgenders,” a group that includes transsexuals and cross-dressers.

“Our position is that the military should re-examine the policy, the medical regulations, so as to allow open service for transgender people,” said Vincent Paolo Villano, spokesman for the 6,000-member Center for Transgender Equality.

The Servicemembers Legal Defense Network (SLDN), which pushed to end the military’s gay ban, is urging President Obama to sign an executive order prohibiting discrimination based on “gender identity.”


I'll take "Slippery Slope" for $1000 Alex !
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 9:11:27 AM EST
Originally Posted By divkat9:
How long before PFC Shithead skates on his PT test because he identifies himself as a female and wants to be scored under female standards?


Or wants a 1-2 day deferment on PT because its that time of the month and even though he is technically a male, he should be allowed it because all the girls do.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 9:15:07 AM EST

Originally Posted By mac130:
Originally Posted By Chairborne:

Originally Posted By mousehunter:
Eventually they will ban chaplains - because chaplains are cost effective, and the government has no business being efficient.


If chaplains were enlisted you might have a case. Making them officers makes no sense at all, since they never have command authority and are noncombatants. Civilian contractors could do the job at a massive cost savings, assuming anybody in DoD would even give a shit if all chaplains disappeared overnight.


Ben, what's up?

I do believe the Chaplains will be cut eventually given the anti religion agenda that seems prevalent these days

I've roomed with our chaplain for a month now (compared to some here that's not much, but's it's exponentially more than most on this site). Anyway, it seems like there are very few things that he does on a day-to-day basis that involve religion.

THe modern Chaplain has largely taken on the role of unit counselor/confidant.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 9:15:39 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/30/2011 9:16:30 AM EST by geekz0r]
What I am waiting to see is.... Whether or not this "may perform same-sex unions" turns into a "MUST perform same-sex unions" issue.


Now that the military is allowed to be openly gay and marry... what will happen if a chaplain refuses to perform the wedding due to religious beliefs


Will the couple have to find another chaplain... or will the military force the chaplain or punish him or her under the UCMJ?
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 9:16:56 AM EST

Originally Posted By geekz0r:

Will the couple have to find another chaplain... or will the military attempt to punish the chaplain under the UCMJ?


There are already religious activities that some Chaplians refuse to do without repercussion.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 9:21:55 AM EST
Originally Posted By Pegasus6:

Originally Posted By DOBERMAN:
So how long til an in the closet male officer gets moved up the chain of command by a democratic administration and then comes out and starts wearing a dress. Imagine a tranny trying to inspire our troops before battle. Damn were going down hill fast.


Hmm...a twenty+ years secret democrat plot to produce the first gay general...

Or, we could wait a few years and it will happen "naturally". Hell, I bet there already is one...


Not a 20+year conspiracy but affirmative action like for a current high ranking officer. And I'm sure youre right. There probably is a high ranking gay officer out there already.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 9:23:24 AM EST
Originally Posted By Pegasus6:

Originally Posted By geekz0r:

Will the couple have to find another chaplain... or will the military attempt to punish the chaplain under the UCMJ?


There are already religious activities that some Chaplians refuse to do without repercussion.


Which activities are you talking about?

And I'm asking about the marriage issue because there may be some who try to push the issue that the military is no longer allowed to discriminate based on sexual preference... they may try to push it in this direction as well.

After all, one of the bigger fears with DADT being gone was that commands may be pressured to not be painted as "gay bashing", so there may be some knee-jerk reactions in the works for those who do not support this new theme.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 9:23:43 AM EST

Originally Posted By OlKev:

After demise of ‘don’t ask,’ activists call for end to military ban on transgenders

With homosexuals now able to serve openly in the military, the gay rights movement’s next battleground is to persuade the Obama administration to end the armed forces’ ban on "transgenders,” a group that includes transsexuals and cross-dressers.

"Our position is that the military should re-examine the policy, the medical regulations, so as to allow open service for transgender people,” said Vincent Paolo Villano, spokesman for the 6,000-member Center for Transgender Equality.

The Servicemembers Legal Defense Network (SLDN), which pushed to end the military’s gay ban, is urging President Obama to sign an executive order prohibiting discrimination based on "gender identity.”

I see issues with the psychological side of this.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 9:24:11 AM EST
Originally Posted By Pegasus6:

Originally Posted By mac130:
Originally Posted By Chairborne:

Originally Posted By mousehunter:
Eventually they will ban chaplains - because chaplains are cost effective, and the government has no business being efficient.


If chaplains were enlisted you might have a case. Making them officers makes no sense at all, since they never have command authority and are noncombatants. Civilian contractors could do the job at a massive cost savings, assuming anybody in DoD would even give a shit if all chaplains disappeared overnight.


Ben, what's up?

I do believe the Chaplains will be cut eventually given the anti religion agenda that seems prevalent these days

I've roomed with our chaplain for a month now (compared to some here that's not much, but's it's exponentially more than most on this site). Anyway, it seems like there are very few things that he does on a day-to-day basis that involve religion.

THe modern Chaplain has largely taken on the role of unit counselor/confidant.


You kind of made my point for them being done away with then. Although I would hate to see them go.
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