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Posted: 1/3/2012 1:33:37 PM EDT
I'm sure you're familiar with the concept of a trunk gun. It's a gun you keep secured in the trunk of your car (or the cab of your truck, etc.) in case of an emergency away from home, when your CCW isn't enough, but you've got enough time to get to your vehicle. Such as civil unrest, rampaging shooter, terrorist attack, prolonged natural disaster, etc. - times when you need more accuracy or power than a handgun.

Yeah, we know, unlikely. But so are events that would require a CCW, but many of us do that too. I also keep a fire extinguisher in my kitchen, and a carbon monoxide detector in my bedroom.

However, most people can't afford to lose an AR15 with all the fancy doodads if the car gets stolen. I don't have a spare. I'd prefer a rifle-caliber semiauto, and plan to buy one for this purpose eventually, but in the meantime, I thought this would be an interesting discussion point. The shotgun currently lives in my trunk, but I'm contemplating switching.

The question is, which gun would be better to keep in the trunk, for someone who travels frequently up to 100 miles from home, both to big cities and middle of nowhere?



A standard 12 gauge pump shotgun, 18 inch barrel, with ghost ring sights and a sidesaddle. Buckshot spread is 12 inches at 20 yards, slugs 6 inches at 75 yards. Bandoleer of both holds about 30 shells.

OR

Ruger 10/22 with Tech Sights (essentially AR15 sights, designed for Appleseed training) and 25 round mags. Mag pouch holds 5-8 mags of high-velocity hollowpoints. Hold-over can compensate for range and hit pie plates out to 200 yards.



Keep in mind that, for me at least (and I may be wimpy), the recoil on the 12 gauge is hefty, and I don't know that I could get through 30 rounds of buck/slugs to save my life. I've got far more trigger time on the 10/22 than any other gun I own, and I make hits effortlessly on just about anything I can see. This gun may also need to be put to use by your wife/kids if you're travelling with family when SHTF hits.

The shotgun has power going for it.

The 10/22 has accuracy, capacity (on gun and reloads), low recoil, low weight, and familiarity going for it.

What say you?
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 1:44:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/3/2012 1:45:17 PM EDT by smullen]

Originally Posted By the_naked_prophet:
I'm sure you're familiar with the concept of a trunk gun. It's a gun you keep secured in the trunk of your car (or the cab of your truck, etc.) in case of an emergency away from home, when your CCW isn't enough, but you've got enough time to get to your vehicle. Such as civil unrest, rampaging shooter, terrorist attack, prolonged natural disaster, etc. - times when you need more accuracy or power than a handgun.

Yeah, we know, unlikely. But so are events that would require a CCW, but many of us do that too. I also keep a fire extinguisher in my kitchen, and a carbon monoxide detector in my bedroom.

However, most people can't afford to lose an AR15 with all the fancy doodads if the car gets stolen. I don't have a spare. I'd prefer a rifle-caliber semiauto, and plan to buy one for this purpose eventually, but in the meantime, I thought this would be an interesting discussion point. The shotgun currently lives in my trunk, but I'm contemplating switching.

The question is, which gun would be better to keep in the trunk, for someone who travels frequently up to 100 miles from home, both to big cities and middle of nowhere?



A standard 12 gauge pump shotgun, 18 inch barrel, with ghost ring sights and a sidesaddle. Buckshot spread is 12 inches at 20 yards, slugs 6 inches at 75 yards. Bandoleer of both holds about 30 shells.

OR

Ruger 10/22 with Tech Sights (essentially AR15 sights, designed for Appleseed training) and 25 round mags. Mag pouch holds 5-8 mags of high-velocity hollowpoints. Hold-over can compensate for range and hit pie plates out to 200 yards.



Keep in mind that, for me at least (and I may be wimpy), the recoil on the 12 gauge is hefty, and I don't know that I could get through 30 rounds of buck/slugs to save my life. I've got far more trigger time on the 10/22 than any other gun I own, and I make hits effortlessly on just about anything I can see. This gun may also need to be put to use by your wife/kids if you're travelling with family when SHTF hits.

The shotgun has power going for it.

The 10/22 has accuracy, capacity (on gun and reloads), low recoil, low weight, and familiarity going for it.

What say you?
Wow, tough descision... I don't feel really good with any of the choices...

I don't like the 12 ga option as short range and not enough ammo...

I don't like the 10/22 option as not much knockdown or penetration power..

I picked the .22 as I feel a few well placed .22 rounds are more effective than all the 12 ga rounds you could throw if they are not good hits...


Link Posted: 1/3/2012 1:47:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/3/2012 1:51:59 PM EDT by haydendavid380]
This is how I roll. Poll fail; no multiple weapons....



ETA- with rifle sights, you should have absolutely zero problems engaging targets at 100 yards. A shotgun is a decent urban weapon, so long as you're willing to put the effort needed to become proficient in their use. The only time I would want the 10/22 would be for extended SHTF where resupply wasn't a probability. In that case I'd also make sure I had a cheap sturdy suppressor for it.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 1:48:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/3/2012 1:50:51 PM EDT by ultramagbrion]
My choice is an AK-47 pistol for a truck gun. Kept in a small nylon case with 5 loaded mags under the rear seat of my quad-cab.



I cant seem to get a straight answer on whether or not you can keep loaded rifle mags in your vehicle here in Maine , even if you have a CCW . But I know you can keep loaded pistol mags if you have a CCW , so to avoid any headaches ( or at least in HOPES of avoiding headaches ) I carry my welded AMD build in a small nylon case with 4 or 5 mags . It's very portable , and I can take it inside with me at night , and even carry it around like a laptop if I wish .I've got very little money into it ,it's reliable and it's compact and light . Works well .

Of the poll choices , I chose the Mossberg .
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 1:52:25 PM EDT
you can keep a mix of rifled slugs, and buckshot with the shotgun for the most flexibility.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 1:53:00 PM EDT
I'd go with an SKS if you have one or a used junker WASR10.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 1:54:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By haydendavid380:
This is how I roll. Poll fail; no multiple weapons....

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y238/tboneguy915/df3f0f88.jpg

ETA- with rifle sights, you should have absolutely zero problems engaging targets at 100 yards. A shotgun is a decent urban weapon, so long as you're willing to put the effort needed to become proficient in their use. The only time I would want the 10/22 would be for extended SHTF where resupply wasn't a probability. In that case I'd also make sure I had a cheap sturdy suppressor for it.


WTF? We have identical AK's
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 1:58:57 PM EDT
I would much rather use a 10-22.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 1:59:56 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 9mmRandy:
Originally Posted By haydendavid380:
This is how I roll. Poll fail; no multiple weapons....

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y238/tboneguy915/df3f0f88.jpg

ETA- with rifle sights, you should have absolutely zero problems engaging targets at 100 yards. A shotgun is a decent urban weapon, so long as you're willing to put the effort needed to become proficient in their use. The only time I would want the 10/22 would be for extended SHTF where resupply wasn't a probability. In that case I'd also make sure I had a cheap sturdy suppressor for it.


WTF? We have identical AK's


I bet we don't have identical 870's
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:00:01 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:01:57 PM EDT
Originally Posted By HardShell:
Whatever firearm (1) you are most used to/effective with that can (2) be reasonably expected to stop a threat/serve in the expeted role.

I keep a basic AR and an 870 in each of my vehicles, but I have plenty of both. Those are what I am most trained/practiced/effective with.

My wife keeps a PCC and an 870 in her vehicles, again what she's used to and we have plenty of extras.

I personally think a cheap AK variant is an excellent choice for this role if money is an overriding issue.

Limited to your two choices, I would go with the shotgun (if both isn't practical).

JMHO.



I'm assuming pistol caliber carbine? Which one?

Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:05:30 PM EDT
The KelTec SUB2000 was another great little trunk gun and one I carried a lot , before I sold her .
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:05:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By haydendavid380:
This is how I roll. Poll fail; no multiple weapons....

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y238/tboneguy915/df3f0f88.jpg

ETA- with rifle sights, you should have absolutely zero problems engaging targets at 100 yards. A shotgun is a decent urban weapon, so long as you're willing to put the effort needed to become proficient in their use. The only time I would want the 10/22 would be for extended SHTF where resupply wasn't a probability. In that case I'd also make sure I had a cheap sturdy suppressor for it.


Sexy, but I see fail on epic proportions.

No first aid kit, jumper cables, fire extinguisher, case of water, spare set of clothes or a spare tire.

Gotta have some basic tools in addiition to sexy hardware.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:14:59 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:36:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/3/2012 2:38:52 PM EDT by Assaulter]
Shotgun. Every day and twice on Sunday. I wouldn't stake my life on a .22 unless it was the ONLY gun available. In this scenario, you have plenty of time to come to your senses and make the right choice.

ETA- Why isn't an AR15 the obvious choice in your poll? Too much recoil?
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:42:53 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Spartanatheart:
Originally Posted By haydendavid380:
This is how I roll. Poll fail; no multiple weapons....

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y238/tboneguy915/df3f0f88.jpg

ETA- with rifle sights, you should have absolutely zero problems engaging targets at 100 yards. A shotgun is a decent urban weapon, so long as you're willing to put the effort needed to become proficient in their use. The only time I would want the 10/22 would be for extended SHTF where resupply wasn't a probability. In that case I'd also make sure I had a cheap sturdy suppressor for it.


Sexy, but I see fail on epic proportions.

No first aid kit, jumper cables, fire extinguisher, case of water, spare set of clothes or a spare tire.

Gotta have some basic tools in addiition to sexy hardware.

You can't see what's in that black backpack

First aid is in my glove box. There is a liter of water in a camelback jug in that cardboard box (which is no longer in there due to the winter temperatures, if I need water, I'll eat/melt snow - I still have a decent contain for it in there) Space blanket, change of clothes, a couple pairs of wool socks, a handful of cr123's, a spare 6P, 6 Cliff bars, paracord, chem handwarmers, chemlights, there is an ASEK Gerber attached to the outside as well as two primary and two secondary magazines in pouches on the pack. There some sun screen and other miscellaneous items in the brown box.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:45:00 PM EDT
Originally Posted By HardShell:

Originally Posted By haydendavid380:

I'm assuming pistol caliber carbine? Which one?


SUB-9 in her SUV and Marlin Camp Carbine in her sedan's trunk –– they both use the same magazines as here EDC (S&W 9mms) and she likes that compatability, plus she prefers a PCC to an AR (always has) even though she's quite competent with a shotgun.




I like the continuity in her choices.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:46:22 PM EDT
Neither, but since those are your only options for now I'd go with shotgun and I'd have 3 bandoleers, 2 with buckshot and 1 with slugs.

My truck gun

Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:49:11 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Furyataurus:
Neither, but since those are your only options for now I'd go with shotgun and I'd have 3 bandoleers, 2 with buckshot and 1 with slugs.

My truck gun
http://i371.photobucket.com/albums/oo157/Furyataurus/001.jpg


Will those take all STANAG mags? all the pictures I see of those have those waffle type magazines.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:49:22 PM EDT
I voted for the Mossberg 500 but think that an H&R HandiRifle compact scoped .223 would be better.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:51:36 PM EDT

Originally Posted By the_naked_prophet:

Keep in mind that, for me at least (and I may be wimpy), the recoil on the 12 gauge is hefty, and I don't know that I could get through 30 rounds of buck/slugs to save my life.
What say you?


If your life is on the line, you won"t notice the recoil and the soreness in your shoulder won't matter. The guy shooting/stabbing you to death because you only shot him with a .22 a couple times will matter.

Load up your 500 with 8-shot 00 Federal Flite-Control to give it some extra range. My shotgun (with cylinder choke) shoots into 5" groups at 25 yards with the Federal which should be more than adequate for any ranges at which you'd actually get into a gunfight.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:53:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/3/2012 2:54:40 PM EDT by haydendavid380]
Originally Posted By Z06Kicks:

Originally Posted By the_naked_prophet:

Keep in mind that, for me at least (and I may be wimpy), the recoil on the 12 gauge is hefty, and I don't know that I could get through 30 rounds of buck/slugs to save my life.
What say you?


If your life is on the line, you won"t notice the recoil and the soreness in your shoulder won't matter. The guy shooting/stabbing you to death because you only shot him with a .22 a couple times will matter.

Load up your 500 with 8-shot 00 Federal Flite-Control to give it some extra range. My shotgun (with cylinder choke) shoots into 5" groups at 25 yards with the Federal which should be more than adequate for any ranges at which you'd actually get into a gunfight.


I don't like to bet my life on should be

Slugs are a need to have skill on shotguns. They triple the effective range and allows for 1 hole accuracy. If I could only have slugs, or only have buckshot, it'd be slugs.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 2:58:39 PM EDT
If you don't know which one you want, you might not be worth a shit with either one of them.

Just some food for thought.

Cheers
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 3:08:55 PM EDT
I don't like the choices either.

AR in 16" or less is just right.

AK is a no-go for me. Probably a stoopid reason, but for most people, the sight of an AK = BG.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 3:14:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MarineGrunt:
I don't like the choices either.

AR in 16" or less is just right.

AK is a no-go for me. Probably a stoopid reason, but for most people, the sight of an AK = BG.


If it comes to the point I'm swinging that kind of hardware; to hell with what people think. Also, people will freak regardless of what you have. Use what you're proficient with.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 3:28:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/3/2012 3:29:20 PM EDT by MarineGrunt]
Originally Posted By haydendavid380:
Originally Posted By MarineGrunt:
I don't like the choices either.

AR in 16" or less is just right.

AK is a no-go for me. Probably a stoopid reason, but for most people, the sight of an AK = BG.


If it comes to the point I'm swinging that kind of hardware; to hell with what people think. Also, people will freak regardless of what you have. Use what you're proficient with.


Less chance of blue on blue is what I was getting at. I could just see myself trying to save some cop's ass when his buddy shows up and shoots me in the anus.

Yeah, I agree though, shoot what you're comfortable with trumps all.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 3:38:48 PM EDT
Get a cheap Bolt Action Hunting Rifle in the back. You are more likely to need the Long Range accuracy than a Lot of close range Fire Power.














Impeach Obama for the Good of the Children.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 3:40:42 PM EDT
The answer is a cheapie WASR-10 with a wire romy side folder put inside a cheapie tennis bag + 2x 30rd mags.

Done.

.22lr for a trunk gun is
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 3:42:04 PM EDT
Sub2k that uses the same mags as your pistol.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 7:45:12 PM EDT
So I post a thread asking "which of these two guns til I can save up for an AR or AK," and all the responses are "get an AR or AK!"

Also, I admit a bit of a trick question. A powerful gun I can't shoot very well or practice with much, vs. a gun I shoot very well but isn't very powerful. I would have thought more folks would pick the gun I can shoot better. I understand many of you are choosing for yourself rather than me.

Honestly, about 5 slugs is my daily limit before the splitting headache and flinching make it difficult to get hits. I can stand 10-15 rounds of buckshot, but I don't practice much because it's so unpleasant.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 8:03:52 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 8:15:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/3/2012 8:17:02 PM EDT by CLICKBANGBANG]
Out of those two options, I'll take the shotgun. I have two 10/22s, two 500s, and an 870. But my 14.5" AR-15 is my truck/ ranch rifle.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 8:22:44 PM EDT
Originally Posted By the_naked_prophet:
So I post a thread asking "which of these two guns til I can save up for an AR or AK," and all the responses are "get an AR or AK!"

Also, I admit a bit of a trick question. A powerful gun I can't shoot very well or practice with much, vs. a gun I shoot very well but isn't very powerful. I would have thought more folks would pick the gun I can shoot better. I understand many of you are choosing for yourself rather than me.

Honestly, about 5 slugs is my daily limit before the splitting headache and flinching make it difficult to get hits. I can stand 10-15 rounds of buckshot, but I don't practice much because it's so unpleasant.


Shitty options. But of the two the shotgun wins IMO..

A shotgun is a very good all around weapon and hunting tool. The 10/22 is too but is way under powered and lacks the ability to take n flight food with ease.

As to defense, the shotgun wins again. The lack of extended range accuracy is not really that much of a deal breaker. Unless it zombies or complete SHTF you would be hard pressed to justify a shot past 25 yards. Ammo selection wins again over the .22.

Shitty options.

Save your money on expensive toys and spend it on ammo and training. There is no reason the 12ga should hurt you as much as it does. There are ways to shoot it that manage recoil very well without fancy brand name gadgets. Hell, go to Thunder Ranch and check out there shotgun instructor.. Little bitty Asian woman that can't be more than 85 pounds and rocks a 12ga all day long!
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 8:25:10 PM EDT
Fucking .22 all day/night long.
And I love my shottys....but I'm sneeky...
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 8:25:15 PM EDT


Really?

-JC
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 8:29:35 PM EDT
If it's a situation that you REALLY need a trunk gun. Your gonna be on unfamilar ground.

The shotgun has more 'don't fuck with this guy' attitude then carrying a little .22 down the road.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 8:30:51 PM EDT
12ga. keep slugs, buck, and birdshot on hand, for whatever you need to shoot.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 8:31:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/3/2012 8:32:12 PM EDT by wilNva]
Does your splitting headache come from not wearing hearing protection?

You also have the option of a 16 or 20 gauge is a 12 is too much for you. I would take a 20ga over a 10/22 for a trunk gun also. Not every shotgun has to be a 12.

20ga with slugs and buck is plenty lethal.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 8:35:16 PM EDT
Shotgun every time. A .22 is good for nothing when I'm trying to get home. I can always use bird shot if I need a .22 touch.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 8:53:03 PM EDT
Shotgun unless you think that the most likely emergency you'll run into is a pack of angry squirrels. Hell, even then, I 'd still prefer the shotgun.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 8:59:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/4/2012 3:23:48 AM EDT by the_naked_prophet]
Originally Posted By wilNva:
Does your splitting headache come from not wearing hearing protection?

You also have the option of a 16 or 20 gauge is a 12 is too much for you. I would take a 20ga over a 10/22 for a trunk gun also. Not every shotgun has to be a 12.

20ga with slugs and buck is plenty lethal.


I always wear double hearing protection, plugs and muffs. And I don't have a 20 gauge - by the time I save up to buy one, (or a combat shotgun class) I'm not too far from a PCC, AR, or AK to keep in the trunk.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 9:16:23 PM EDT
These choices suck. I'm going with the 10/22 just because you are not comfortable with the shotgun.

But that is a temporary suggestion. You need to find something you can afford, you can get comfortable with, and that's actually good for the job.

Watch the used rack at your LGS as well as the EE. Find a good deal on a pistol caliber carbine, lever gun, SKS, or AK.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 9:24:28 PM EDT
Of those 2 choices, I choose the 10/22.

Accuracy and rate of fire FTW.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 9:43:53 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ultramagbrion:
The KelTec SUB2000 was another great little trunk gun and one I carried a lot , before I sold her .


This is what I have. Mine is setup for Glock 17 magazines. I have 100+ rounds of 9mm at my disposal all neat and tidy in the factory Kel Tec zipper case. Pretty good choice IMO.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 9:50:20 PM EDT
The shotgun all the way, one suggestion though, get it threaded for chokes. The chokes will massively increase the useability of the shotgun for "non-social" work like small game and bird hunting in a SHTF situation.

A .22 is a .22, unless you like being severely handicapped in a SD situation or only have .22 (after all any gun is better then no gun) .22 is a very poor choice for SD.
Link Posted: 1/3/2012 10:18:48 PM EDT
12ga. or a battle rifle. I think I will add this one to the trunk as well as the FAL.

Link Posted: 1/4/2012 6:53:15 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/4/2012 6:58:50 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Archtaan:
12ga. or a battle rifle. I think I will add this one to the trunk as well as the FAL.

http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m608/archtaan/photobucket-3963-1325623335256.jpg


Now where did you get that...
Link Posted: 1/4/2012 7:03:40 AM EDT
Originally Posted By NwG:
A shotgun is a very good all around weapon and hunting tool. The 10/22 is too but is way under powered and lacks the ability to take n flight food with ease.As to defense, the shotgun wins again. The lack of extended range accuracy is not really that much of a deal breaker. Unless it zombies or complete SHTF you would be hard pressed to justify a shot past 25 yards. Ammo selection wins again over the .22.


I doubt most folks would be able to hit a flying bird with a shotgun without some pointers and practice. Most anybody should be able to hit small game that is sitting still with a 10/22. You'd be hunting for survival, not for sport, so you don't have to limit your shots to birds in flight to be sporting. Also, most defensive shotguns tend to have short open choked riot barrels, that won't pattern bird shot tight enough to hit a bird past 15 yards.

With some practice with a shotgun and foster slugs, you can make good hits out to 75 yards or more. Just remember to push the shotgun firmly into the pocket of your shoulder and lean into it and it won't kick quite as hard.

Link Posted: 1/4/2012 7:04:33 AM EDT
.22LRs are for plinking and small critters. I would not want to have only a .22lr if i actualy needed to defend my self.



a 22 may be better than a pointy stick but since your planning ahead seriously plan ahead.
Link Posted: 1/4/2012 7:16:19 AM EDT
Originally Posted By gunham:
Get a cheap Bolt Action Hunting Rifle in the back. You are more likely to need the Long Range accuracy than a Lot of close range Fire Power.













Impeach Obama for the Good of the Children.


Disagree. Event over in Iraq/Afgan., most engagements are below 300yds out (I seem to remember seeing somewhere the number is actually 200 yds, but you get the point). Also, if something/someone is past about 200/300 yds, they probably are not an immediate threat and you should probably choose "flight" instead of "fight".

JMHO.
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