I travel a lot for business and sometimes I lug my "toy box" with me and hit the range with my clients.
This week I'm flying from Florida into DC, then Las Vegas and back to DC.

When I usually fly with firearms I ask the gate agent for a declaration form.  I sign it, put in my case and lock it up and turn it over to the airline.  I follow the airline personnel to the TSA agent for screening.  The X-Ray my case, give me a thumbs up and off I go.   ....that's how it usually goes.

That wasn't the case at Reagan National today.  When I approached the US Airways ticketing agent, I asked for a declaration form, signed it and went to insert it into the case.  The US Airways ticketing agent asked me to open the case for inspection.  I said, "Do you really want me to open this case up?  Some people get freaked out by this stuff."   He said that "he needs to look down the barrels to make sure they're not loaded".  

I had the mental image of this fat guy holding an AR over his head with the barrel pointing into his squinting eye - "yup, this ones not loaded"

Trying to conceal the case contents from the public with my body, I discreetly pulled out an AR magazine and showed him that it was empty.  The agent said, "No, I need to examine the guns".   Hmmmmmm.   I have no intentions of handing any of my weapons to a complete stranger who probably knows zero about firearms safety.  
Again, using my body to shield the case contents from the view of the public, I pulled out two handguns, removed an empty magazine, opened the action and pointed to the empty hole in the breech.  I stuffed the handguns back into their foam cutouts and reached for the AR.  There was know way I was going to remove a "scary black rifle" from its case and wave it around for this guy.  I tilted it out of its foam socket and shoved my hand into the magwell to demonstrate that it was unloaded.   The gate agent seem satisfied with this and I locked the case back up.   Next he returns the case to my custody and asks me to meet him at the TSA X-ray station.  
My understanding is that once my luggage is tagged, locked and given to the airline I can't touch it again until I land at my final destination.

The contestant up for a Darwin award is a young round female TSA agent.  After she X-rays my bag I ask for a thumbs up - we good to go?
Nope, she waddles up to the line and asks for the keys to my locked case.  I assume that she wants me to join her in a screening area and unlock the case for her.  Nope, she wants me to give her the keys to my gun case so she can inspect it.   I begrudgingly obliged and watched as she rummaged my case looking for gawd knows what.  All of her screening was done behind a "privacy shield".  I could see her head & shoulders, but not the case.    She ran a cotton cloth over the interior of the bag and fed it to the chemical sniffer.    I wonder if the bag tested positive for gunpowder?  Hmmmm - do you think?  After two minutes of finger f***ing my gear she locked the case up and said we were good.

I stopped her and respectfully told her that I was uncomfortable with the screening as I was not able to see what she did.  I told her, that I have no idea if all of my gear is still in the case or if something I did not pack is now inside the case.  Her answer - "trust me".  She returned my keys.   Still not satisfied, I asked her to bring the case forward and demonstrate that all four latches were securely closed.  I also asked her to tug on both padlocks to demonstrate to me that there are indeed locked.

I'm no TSA expert, but I am "road warrior" and this wasn't my first firearms flight.  I'm pretty sure that screening and more importantly - the chain of custody - did not go by the book.

I'm writing this from the US Airways club at Reagan National.  Let's see what I find when I retrieve my gear at my next stop.

....and for the record - the case contained 2 NFA items - an SBR and a suppressor.  I had copies of my tax stamps and 5320.20 "transport" forms inside the case.


Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

Hmm. The one time I flew with a firearm, it was from Las Vegas to Reno with my AK.
They only asked to see the rifle, not inspect the chamber. I also wasn't allowed to be in the room they x-rayed my case, but it was locked and I kept the key.

but don't you feel all warm and fuzzy now?

+1 - I agree

I've traveled a lot with other "special" items and the one thing I've learned is that every airport and every screener is a crap shoot.  Many don't follow procedures or simply don't know or don't care what they're suppose to do.

You would think commonsense would enter into the equation somewhere.. Do people really think the guy who is checking his guns is the one going to shoot up the place?  I would be less afraid of someone if they are checking guns - you KNOW they are law abiding citizens.  Its the crazy guy with the gun or bomb hidden in his shoe or some shit that you gotta watch for..

You would think commonsense would enter into the equation somewhere..

common sense left this country the day affirmative action became law

-imo

I lol'd so hard, there's snot on my monitor..



Hope all goes well.



 

I  travel often with firearms. Mostly on JetBlue and Delta. I have never had to go through what you did. All I am asked to do is "slip" the declaration form in the case and follow the TSA agent to the screening area, They take my firearm in the back and minutes later they return telling me all is well.. I never give the keys to the case to anyone..

I have traveled for a very long time with firearms.  Many airlines want their uneducated gate agents to inspect your gun.  They are not allowed to touch it.  TSA is a band of fucking idiots.  Never give them the keys unless you are standing beside them.  I fixed this stupid by changing to a combo lock.  You CANNOT give them the combination, or they will then have control of your firearm, which is against regulations.  

They only inspect a bag after xray if there is a perceived threat.  Why in the fucking hell is a declared firearm in a locked case a threat?  A bomb, yes, not an unloaded gun.  A declared and inspected firearm is not a threat.  I would say the inspection by TSA would only happen about 25% of the time.  

You really haven't been hassled until they clear your bag through xray and let you go all the way to the gate and then call you back.  Next there are two neckties and dumb as fuck looking TSA idiot standing there.  You then wonder if someone "lost" your red tag and loaded your gun.  Since the cameras they have are almost always "malfunctioning" when you need them, it could be a long day.  In my case the agent probably started to wet her pants about having seen a firearm on xray and gave it some thought and felt that it was now a threat.  Fuck those fucking fuckers!

Know your rights, have a plan B and keep a lawyer's phone number in your wallet.

....on board my flight now.  
That's a GREAT idea!   I'm going to change my locks out and use different combos on each!  That will keep them from screening my weapons outside of my view.

About the ame thing happened to me in Austin, except I stood beside her as she swabbed my firearm. I asked her if she thought she might find gunpowder residue? Should I? she asked. Of course. I've fired it before.

If they're really that uninformed and don't know the potocol, they'll prolly just cut your locks like they do with regular bags that are locked.

FWIW my surefire 6p with strike bezel raised no concern as I carried it on my person not even in my carry on-

And I realized once I was at the gate that I still had a nalgene bottle full of water strapped to the side of my carry-on back pack. The TSA agents didn't even check it- which I guess is good since my nalgene is wrapped with a LaRue "Extremely Rightwing" sticker... (they fit perfectly around and leave just enough space to see the ruling/measurement on the side)

I was fortunate to make it both to and back without having any of my TA-50 or one of my 3 knives swiped.

I've taken my pistols on Southwest quite a few times. usually the checkin agent just has me demonstrate that the weapon was unloaded and that's the last I hear of it until I pick up my luggage.  One time in San Antonio years ago I was called to the TSA station and asked to unlock the case. They were very careful about having me only unlock it and not taking my key. So I unlocked it and showed them my Springfield Armory XD-40. Several of the TSA  guys were curious about the XD-40 and asked what it was (was pretty new on the market at the time). We then had a pleasant chat for several minutes discussing the merits of various .40 pistols (One guy had a Glock 22 and another had a S&W). I then went on my way. They were pretty cool!

I have only had it go a different way than what you described as normal on one flight; I was leaving Louisville on my way back to Tampa and my case got set in the back room to be x-rayed later. They said they'd call me over the P.A. if something came up.

That's sig line material right there



 

I hope it ends well. Let us know.

You are gonna be pissed one of these trips...

Nope, that's not how it's supposed to go down.  Hopefully all your shit is still good to go.

tagged, hoping to read at a later date

You are required to be the sole person with the key or combination, do not tell them or hand them the key.

Kharn

I thought this was what they are supposed to do .





I have heard several times of people being asked to remove long guns from their cases and having to show that they are unloaded

Guess my son has not seen this yet or he would have related his story of traveling with his AF Cop Unit which was either deploying to or returning from the Middle East. The idiot at the ticket counter wanted him to do basicly the same thing but his case contained an M60. Yes I said an M60 not an M16. After several minutes of my son telling the ticket agent he was nuts and that there was no way my son was going to pull his weapon out in public, a supervisor finally arrived and took over. From that point on, everything was cool.

I travel weekly with about $25k worth of camera gear, including items that look like bombs

The one thing I can tell you about airport security is that it's 100% unpredictable.

make sure you dont use those tsa friendly locks that have a bypass hole for there key to unlock it.

ugh, i gotta fly with a handgun up to TN from florida next month.  i am not looking forward to it.

Tyler - are you LEO?  We hear horror stories of people being diverted to airports (ie Wash DC, Newark) then being arrested for possession of a firearm (and FOPA be damned!)

If you aren't LEO (well, even if you are!) even though these people are morons at least it seems like you aren't worried about time in the pokey!

This is why I fly strictly American ( esp international)  or Southwest.  Not one bit of trouble even after 9-11.   Heck, they've only checked the guns maybe 4 times.  usually it's just a quick peek.

Tag for AAR hope everything works out okay.

tag for further reading

I fly Southwest and use a cable lock through the magazine well.  All I do is open the case and show it to the ticket agent and they give the thumbs-up.  I have never had a problem with Southwest.

I hate to say this, but I think it is only a matter of time, before your NFA stuff comes up missing.     You have thieving baggage handlers and petty criminals that are having a field day stealing luggage and contents.


About a year ago, local cops caught a guy that had stolen several hundred suitcases   The cops did not collect the cases without ID, and apparently, the  airlines weren't interested either.   The thief got three months in jail, and his landlord sold the luggage on craigslist, to recoup damage to his property.    I stopped by to look at trailers (also stolen), and the landlord was very upfront about the situation.   He said he had tried several times to get the cops to pick up the remaining 100+ suitcases.



Here is a more recent case.  Notice that of 1000 pieces of luggage, she was only charged with two counts of theft.  

I'll bet every major city has a group of these thieves.



Woman pleads guilty in Phoenix luggage thefts

Posted at: 06/16/2010 8:35 PM
By:

(AP) PHOENIX - A woman accused of stealing up to 1,000 pieces of luggage from Phoenix Sky Harbor International Airport with her husband has pleaded guilty to theft and other charges.

Maricopa County prosecutors say 39-year-old Stacy Legg-King originally was charged with 27 counts of theft, drug charges and tampering with evidence. She entered a guilty plea Monday on two counts of theft, trafficking stolen property and drug violations.

Legg-King’s sentencing date is July 19.

Legg-King and 61-year-old Keith King were arrested in November after police alleged that she stole luggage from a baggage claim carousel. Police say a search of the couple’s home in Waddell, northwest of Phoenix, revealed many suitcases without tags.

Keith King is due in court July 13.

___

Information from: The Arizona Republic, http://www.azcentral.com

That is how it always goes down for me when the TSA gets pisky.

 

I have done it at least 20 times with jetblue, 5 times with United, twice with the love airline, and once with Delta, it is not that hard!

 

Guess you should engrave in a hidden area name and part of ss number in a few spots, and phone number

As idiotic (fat & sweaty) as TSA folks can be, they are far more consistent from airport to airport than the old way.  I don't feel the need to carry the regulations with me anymore when I fly with guns to prove I was doing it correctly.   The finger fucking seems to be the one inconsistency.  I have had it done in the open, behind a screen and with me standing next to the TSA agent.  

The machine can be (and should be) calibrated to ignore powder residue.

For whatever reason, MagLites often swab with a positive outcome.  When I used to fly with tools a lot (FAR worse than firearms) I was often called back to security, only to hear, "Yeah, MagLites set off the machine".....

Your missing some nfa items

Several friends worked their way through college working for America West Airlines at Phoenix Sky Harbor.
While they were there (20+ years ago) a Delta or American baggage handler was arrested for baggage theft.  
He was stealing bags full of marijuana and other drugs.  The airline didn't want to publicize it and of course the passengers hadn't come forward.  He was fired and pled to several misdemeanors.....
Rumors they heard on the ramp was that he had stolen and sold a couple of MILLION dollars in drugs.
I have no idea if the airlines are being used less for drug transport in a post 9-11 world.
But gun cases were generally off limits.  Gunowners report their loss and the airlines investigate.  
So from OP's point of view, he is probably okay.

Want to see what happens....

Hah, try flying out of San Jose with American then.  I insisted per American Airlines rule they did not need to see the firearm, that's what the damn form is for.  I finally let the agent see the inside of the case and she dug my pistols out of the foam cutouts with her finger on the trigger waving around the gun like an idiot.  Great fun.  Then we argued about the placement of the form in the luggage until another agent suggested calling up TSA to explain the correct process.

+1
I rarely check luggage - but if I do it's nothing I would miss.  If someone wants to rummage my Joe Boxer's and snatch my beard trimmer - have it at you freak!  
Stealing firearms, is whole 'nother world of stooopid.

I barely made my connection in CLT and got onto my LAS flight with just a few minutes to spare before they closed the doors.  Amazingly my gear made it to LAS.  I had to wait a few minutes for a baggage handler to hand carry my case out.  (Oversized and "special items" don't usually go on the conveyor belt)
All my gear is safe & secure again - and most importantly back under my control.

When I popped the padlocks and opened the case I found a little "TSA was here" love-note to accompany my red declaration form.
All of my gear was secure in the correct foam cutouts and my BATFE paperwork was still under the foam in the lid.

So all is well.  I've got a few days here in Vegas then back to DC.   I've had no problems flying out of LAS with special items.  
After that, mMy next flight segment is out of IAD (Dulles).   That will be another "first" flying through that airport with special items.

....and I have a date behind a .50 Barret M107 this weekend!   mmmmwwaaaaaahhhh!

IIRC i read a report that said baggage containing firearms are much safer because they are redflagged and watched 24/7

could have been fluff and nothing but im not sure they would just forget about where a bunch of evil guns/parts/suppressors were at any given time

SOmeone here had a handgun with suppressor get stolen from an airport, IIRC, it was a real clusterfuck.

My only experience with airline theft was a trip to San Diego back in 1997. We were going to a model airplane race and had a large locked metal trunk to transport our airplanes and equipment. The case made it home with us but had both padlock points ripped out with a crowbar or something and the contents rifled thru. Those baggage handling monkeys have plenty of time to do whatever they want with your property, make it a hard target by making it not look like something worth stealing.

Southwest was one of the first ones to do this.........looooong before 2001.

WUT????/   Prior to TSA, after the gate agent, nobody, not even once, ever dicked with my firearm or had me open my case.  

This is after I started saving a few.  I threw them away for years:

You have been flying for a long time if you were taking your guns to the gate.  I remember Elmer Keith writing about that, decades ago.

Still, you missed my point, which was consistency.

Unlike the days of "You can't fly w/ guns", "The tag goes on the outside", "You can't fly with guns AND ammo" or my favorite "You can only check rifles, not handguns".

The days when you had to carry a copy of the Federal Regulations to make sure you would actually get your guns on the airplane.  Now, they all seem to know the basic rules.

Excellent ifo in this thread  Thanks!

I've never had a firearm declaration check go the same way twice.  Including from the same TSA agent in the same week.  Can't add too much else, but yeah, their check inspires as much confidence in me as the dog & pony gate checks we go through for our carry-ons and persons.  Zero.  Like the President.

I have thought about taking my guns to atl to have some family fun range time BUT i fly standby and dont really know if i'll make the flight usually i get but it could be hours later and i dont want my guns sitting around waiting for someone to steal them. Anyone have any non gun looking cases to transport them or any other ways to make people look past it?

I found this video very informative when it comes to flying with firearms.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGjddG5Owsc