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10/30/2020 2:42:12 PM
Posted: 12/27/2003 4:48:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/27/2003 4:50:59 PM EDT by LWilde]
Every couple of months, one of us starts a "Best War Movie" thread.  The last one is only a couple of days old.

Now...for the first time at ARFCOM...we have the real deal.  The 10 Best War flics of all time...as picked by a Hollyweird critic.  Surely he, as the Pro From Dover is the final authority on this.  Well rat spit...there you have it...now we can all take it to the bank.

I will admit, some are great films and have made our lists many times.  On the other hand...some are a BIG surprise to me.

His picks speak volumes...as do his non-picks.  Read his explanations too...they are classics.  Clearly the guy has no trigger time and he is uncomfortable with real war movies...preferring the anti-war genre more.  Seven of the ten are clearly anti-war.

Here's a quote from one of his [positive] criticisms of The Thin Red Line:  "...to explore the spiritual toll of killing for God and country in the Pacific Islands."...THAT is how Hollyweird weenies see the brutal combat between our Marines and soldiers and the Japs.  We killed them for, "God and country".  Amazing.

Here is HIS top 10 list:

10. The Red Badge of Courage
9.  Gettysburg
8.  Mash
7.  Full Metal Jacket
6.  Saving Private Ryan
5.  Battleground
4.  All Quiet on The Western Front
3.  The Thin Red Line
2.  Paths of Glory
1.  Apocalypse Now

Interesting how his picks juxtapose against our generally accepted list.

Here is the link:  entertainment.msn.com/news/article.aspx?news=144003
Link Posted: 12/27/2003 4:50:09 PM EDT
MASH is not a war movie.
Link Posted: 12/27/2003 4:51:38 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raven:
MASH is not a war movie.
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My point exactly.  Read on...he gets better!
Link Posted: 12/27/2003 5:13:46 PM EDT
The Librial crowd always thinks that we [members of the Right] miss that war is nasty business. I have never thought war was fun,necessary and some times unavoidable,My father served in Korea and Vietnam and my grandfather in WWII .I would have fought if I could, but knowing what weapons can do and men can do to each other. I have never thought war would be fun and glory.Glory is what soldiers attain from doing what their country asks of them.
Link Posted: 12/27/2003 5:18:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/27/2003 5:26:23 PM EDT by 95thFoot]
"Limp-wristed feelm criteeks...." [rolleyes]

The antidote: [url]http://www.sierratimes.com/03/arc_page.php?author=Rocky%20D[/url]

A couple of RockyD's film reviews of war movies:

[url]http://www.sierratimes.com/03/03/14/rockyd.htm[/url]
Politically Incorrect Movie Reviews - Tears Of The Sun
by RadioFree Rocky D
03.13.03
The Bruce is back … again. This time he plays a tough guy hero … again. The Bruce runs between hails of bullets, shoots bad guys, blows stuff up and rescues the girl … again. Methinks The Bruce had the Tears Of The Sun script lying in a pile marked "Projects to consider during slow times," and times got a bit slow. The problem with this movie is we've seen it all before – think cheaply done Black Hawk Down with lots of mud. The only saving grace is the message, clearly printed, at the end: "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." – Edmund Burke. That statement alone will really piss off the limp-wristed liberal feelm crit-teeks. But most of the movie is formulaic flimflam, with a beginning that sounds a lot like a bad joke: A Priest and two nuns go into a jungle, see, and …(snip)
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[url]http://www.sierratimes.com/03/02/28/rockyd.htm[/url]
Politically Incorrect Movie Reviews: Gods & Generals
by RadioFree Rocky D
02.27.03
During my radio interview (WTMA, Charleston) with Ron Maxwell, Director of Gods & Generals, I asked Ron if he was assaulted by the PC thought police during the making of the movie. His response was “I have no patience for the politically correct proletariat who seek to tell me what I can think, what I can read and what I can say.” In response, I told him that he must get a lot of granola and Brie thrown at him at Hollyweird parties. He laughed. What is not laughable is the reaction to Gods & Generals by the limp-wristed feelm crit-teeques (some of whom have emailed me with orders to THTOP MY FEELM REVIEWTH). They look at this movie as “pro Southern propaganda.” That shows you right there how little the leftists either know or care about actual history. Only the liberal media elite would look at real history as propaganda.(snip)
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Link Posted: 12/27/2003 5:41:33 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raven:
MASH is not a war movie.
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Neither is Apocalypse Now.  MASH was at least a pretty good comedy.  Aside from a few scenes with Robert Duvall, Apocalypse Now is complete garbage.

Although I enjoyed FMJ (mostly for R. Lee Ermey), it's another BS POS Hollywood war movie.
Link Posted: 12/27/2003 7:11:38 PM EDT
My favorite is "The Winter War"

Followed by BHD, We Were Soldiers then Band of Brothers

All the others follow.

You would think spielberg would pick a different title for Band of Brothers, I mean, not one of them were black.
Link Posted: 12/27/2003 7:17:00 PM EDT
I also was pretty staggered by the list!!

Apocalypse Now is, IMHO, a great movie.  But describing it as the greatest war movie ever made is absolute idiocy!!
Link Posted: 12/27/2003 7:19:07 PM EDT
MASH just pissed me off. Lame-ass satire of the Vietnam war, set in Korea because they were too chickenshit to be upfront about what they were criticizing.  Supposedly set in Korea, but they smoked pot [rolleyes]

And there was not a minute of combat in the entire flick.  Catch-22 was more of a war movie than MASH, and a better satire at the same time. A lot smarter, too.  And the actors at least made an attempt to not look like they stepped out of a 1970's coke party.
Link Posted: 12/27/2003 7:25:58 PM EDT
MASH is no more a war movie then "Gone with the Wind" is. They both take place during a war, but that doesn't make them a war movie.

Apocolypse now I like, but it's less a war movie then a reinterpreation of Conrad's "Heart of Darkness". It is better then the book though.

Thin Red Line I haven't seen, but I haven't heard any particulary great reviews about.


I will say that Gettysberg was far better then Gods and Generals, which just seemed to drag on......
Link Posted: 12/27/2003 7:26:15 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 199:
I also was pretty staggered by the list!!

Apocalypse Now is, IMHO, a great movie.  But describing it as the greatest war movie ever made is absolute idiocy!!
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I think Apocalypse Now counts as a war movie, given all the combat that takes place.  But it's more about existentialism and the lunacy of "the system", the black horrible nature of man, and society. than about the Vietnam War.  I love the movie, it's profound as hell, one of my top 10 movies ever.  Not just war movies.
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 4:49:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/28/2003 6:22:27 AM EDT by LWilde]
Originally Posted By natez:
10. The Red Badge of Courage
9. Gettysburg
8. Mash
7. Full Metal Jacket
6. Saving Private Ryan
5. Battleground
4. All Quiet on The Western Front
3. The Thin Red Line
2. Paths of Glory
1. Apocalypse Now

Actually, those are mostly pretty good movies. The Thin Red Line and MASH were both sub-par, but Paths of Glory, Kubrick's first movie, was excellent. I got it in one of thoe cheapo DVD packs at Wal-Mart bundled with A Bridge Too Far. It is about a supposed "mutiny" (actually a failed assault) among French troops during WWI, and the Regimental Commander's (played by Kirk Douglas) disgust when he is ordered by his commanders to execute some of his soldiers to set an example for the rest of the Army.

I don't know that I would put Apocalypse Now at the top, or even call it a "war movie," though it was good in its own regard.
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Correct.  They are all "pretty good movies".  Problem is...they are NOT pretty good WAR movies.  In fact, 7 of 10 are ANTI-WAR movies.
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 5:05:56 AM EDT
10. The Red Badge of Courage
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OK, nothing more, nothing less.
9. Gettysburg
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Pretty good. Top 10? I don't know about that.
8. Mash
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You've got to be kidding.
7. Full Metal Jacket
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Has alot of redeeming qualities. Good pick.
6. Saving Private Ryan
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One of the best ever.
5. Battleground
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Never heard of it.
4. All Quiet on The Western Front
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See #10.
3. The Thin Red Line
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Ten minutes of battle sequences wrapped in three hours of dog shit. The "FF" button never got so much usage.
2. Paths of Glory
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Never seen it.
1. Apocalypse Now
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See #3. I demanded the video store refund my money. Now I want my three hours back too.
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 5:20:55 AM EDT
OK,

I am not a "lefty" but the whole point of a war movie is to be anti-war.

I am not a combat vet, but I have spoken to many combat vets of the WW2/Viet Nam wars.

I do not remember hearing "boy I loved war, I loved shooting the shit out of a man/woman/kid"

Being a Vet of the "Cold War" I have no say in what combat is like. I do not have delusions of feeling that I missed out by not going to war. When I got out in 87, I felt "ripped off" that I missed Gulf War 1 by 2 weeks. But after talking to friends that were there, hearing how horrible it was and how sick some soldiers got made me feel lucky I did not go.

The point of a war movie is to show us how horrible war is. Yes we MUST NOT FORGET, we MUST honor those who fought for us. But I doubt that any of us would march off to war because we love it. We would march off to war because we HAVE to. Big difference here.

All of the movies listed in my opinion are good war movies. Talk to a D-day vet, a Iwo Jima vet and they will tell you how horrible it was (if they will even talk about it) and how scared they were.  But they did what they HAD to do, for what they BELIEVED in, not because they loved it.

These movies when taken in context with war do a damn fine job.

All Vets deserve the Medal of Honor in my book.

Rant off...


oh, as for MASH, I worked with a Korean War vet and he tells me that he feels that they copied his Air Force unit for the idea of MASH. He said his unit was so far back from the line that most of what MASH showed really happened. Who knows......?


Link Posted: 12/28/2003 7:48:55 AM EDT
And where exactly is "Red Dawn", it definatly has to be on this to 10 list!
Link Posted: 12/28/2003 8:34:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/28/2003 8:35:19 AM EDT by hanko]
One vote for "84 Charlie Mopic".

[url]http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/6301538196/104-3466365-7155151?v=glance#product-details[/url]  for details.

Low budget, kind of cinema verite'.  Not sure if it can be rented or not, but a hell of a movie.

-hanko
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