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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 6/21/2003 5:28:14 PM EDT
[url=http://madogre.com/Interviews/Hate_the_AR15.htm]Why I hate the M-16/AR-15 Rifle and variants.[/url]
Like the AR? Fine. Enlist and try it out where it is supposed to be used. One thing to think about. The AR was designed back in the 1960s. Since that time there have been dozens of different military guns designed all over the world. The designers of these weapons had the advantage of being able to look at what else was out there and pick what they liked the best. So my question is, over the last thirty some odd years, how many new military rifles have come out using the AR gas system? How many have come out using a piston? How many have a spring loaded ejector vs. a fixed ejector? With some form of gas piston or op rod since the AR: K2, G36, SAR, Valmet, Sako M90, Sig 550, FNC, Galil, Tavor, AN 94, FARA 98, Aug, INSAS, AR 70/90, AR 18, Stoner 63. I'm not sure if it is Singapore or Taiwan who has built a copy of the M16 and it even has a gas piston! I've probably forgotten a few as well. Who else has used direct gas impingement in their designs? I can't think of any. The best way to improve the AR-15 is to unscrew the front sight, and put a new gun under it.
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The rest is not quite that kind. Interesting read, though. Hmm...how 'bout that FAL?
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 5:36:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/21/2003 5:37:23 PM EDT by redray]
cool pics on his site though.. [img]http://madogre.com/images/WWrifle2.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 5:44:13 PM EDT
he's got some deep-seated emotional tramua... I thought the AR15 was designed in the '50s?
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 5:50:56 PM EDT
"A Barbie doll for boys" Dammm he is a cruel one is'nt he? Some good points, But a lot of anger over a proven and tested weapon!!!
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 6:00:07 PM EDT
If the gun sucks sooooooooooo bad, then why are there so many variants out there and why are there so many owned out there? We all have our favorites, some like revolvers, some like autos. Some like bolt action, some like semis. Some like sporters and some like mil type. Personally, I like them all.
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 6:01:38 PM EDT
He is right though... In one of the upgrade the army should have added a gas piston.
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 6:02:01 PM EDT
You posted a pic of an attractive female!!!!!The Mod Nazi's will be here soon. IBTL!!!!
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 6:21:33 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 6:26:45 PM EDT
This guy REALLY, REALLY dislikes the AR-15/M-16
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Well, isn't that [i]special[/i]. J.
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 6:35:06 PM EDT
Well, shit! Made ne laugh. 3) It's very light! Answer: And it breaks! However this very light AR-15 is no longer light when you add in all the extras that are the style these days… two white lights, vertical fore grip, full length rail for your short compact optical sights… lasers… AM/FM tape deck… There is a whole Gun Industry Sub-Industry revolved around the AR-15. There are so many accessories the AR is nothing more than a Black Barbie Doll for Boys. You can dress it up for a night on the town or a day at the beach in your little pink convertible… it’s fabulous! By the time your rifle is dressed out like one of the guys from the Blackhawk Industries ads… it’s no longer very light. It now weighs as much as an M-249 SAW.
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 6:39:14 PM EDT
Well, shit again. I laughed at this one too. WTF is wrong with me tonight? [img]http://madogre.com/images/whoopass_army.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 7:42:48 PM EDT
Originally Posted By redray: cool pics on his site though.. [url]http://madogre.com/images/WWrifle2.jpg[/url]
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HMM role playing, id Hit it as soon as i get my bat man costume on.
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 7:43:36 PM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
Originally Posted By GreyGhost: You posted a pic of an attractive female!!!!!The Mod Nazi's will be here soon. IBTL!!!!
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hey i like girlie pics too! mike
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Sorry,You are one of the few cool Mods around here.
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 7:44:43 PM EDT
Originally Posted By GreyGhost: You posted a pic of an attractive female!!!!!The Mod Nazi's will be here soon. IBTL!!!!
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he's rite [b]NO POST FOR YOU[/b] IBTL
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 7:45:22 PM EDT
That poster cracks me up... Anyway, the guy makes a few valid points, and the biggest of which [i]is[/i] concerning the gas system design. Yes, it is an inferior design when compared to a piston design and the measured performance is durability. That is true. However, that isn't telling the whole story. If one stopped at that point, one might conclude that the gas tube design is a fatal flaw, which it isn't. Only under certain conditions can it be a fatal flaw. Those conditions are: 1. Extreme heat generated by extended rapid or automatic fire. 2. Neglect in cleaning the rifle over a long period of time. For instance, it would be interesting to know how many people at this site actually know of an AR cooking its gas tube to the point of non-function. Or a FTF b/c of neglect. Other than the military, I can think of no group of people who have more experience with this rifle and I'll bet not many have seen these type of malfunctions. Finally, it would be nice to see manufacturers dump R&D into a piston AR (as a few already have). In the meantime, enjoy the AR as it is, and don't forget to enjoy pistoned rifles as well. Of those, the FAL is my favorite.
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 11:13:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/21/2003 11:16:43 PM EDT by coltcarbine]
poor guy, he must have never held a like new SP1 in his hands. he must have never seen a true Colt Carbine. he must have never taken a HBAR Sporter to the range and punch little holes in paper at 300 yards with his friends. he must never have experienced the aroma of CLP and have it make him smile. he will never know what it's like to "hoard mags" for AR's. i love my AR's....... can i get a [size=5][b][blue]"HELL YEAH!"[/blue][/b][/size=5]?
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 11:23:57 PM EDT
nope
Link Posted: 6/21/2003 11:37:47 PM EDT
If the gun sucks sooooooooooo bad, then why are there so many variants out there and why are there so many owned out there?
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Reason there are so many different AR's being made? Armchair warriors who think everything milspec is the best shit on earth so they but the next closest thing they can legally get. Same thing for the 1911. The war stories have made it into a legend... for the USA, meanwhile the rest of the world has moved far away from the 45 and to 9mm and never looked back.
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 12:03:35 AM EDT
I hate ARs too. They suck up all my money. And dammit, mine all work, even when I abuse them. And they put bullets where I want them, even out to some decent ranges. Damn them. I hate AR15s.
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 12:22:45 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 12:39:27 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Scarecrow:
If the gun sucks sooooooooooo bad, then why are there so many variants out there and why are there so many owned out there?
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Reason there are so many different AR's being made? Armchair warriors who think everything milspec is the best shit on earth so they but the next closest thing they can legally get. Same thing for the 1911. The war stories have made it into a legend... for the USA, meanwhile the rest of the world has moved far away from the 45 and to 9mm and never looked back.
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Interesting version of history you have there.
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 12:48:22 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Sumo2000:
Originally Posted By Scarecrow:
If the gun sucks sooooooooooo bad, then why are there so many variants out there and why are there so many owned out there?
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Reason there are so many different AR's being made? Armchair warriors who think everything milspec is the best shit on earth so they but the next closest thing they can legally get. Same thing for the 1911. The war stories have made it into a legend... for the USA, meanwhile the rest of the world has moved far away from the 45 and to 9mm and never looked back.
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Interesting version of history you have there.
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SAS carries SIGs with 20 round mags Delta carries 1911s Draw your own conclusions... And if Im not mistaken, the SAS use the M4 now...by choice.
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 1:00:37 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Lumpy196: Interesting version of history you have there. SAS carries SIGs with 20 round mags Delta carries 1911s Draw your own conclusions... And if Im not mistaken, the SAS use the M4 now...by choice.
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Thats my point, the IDF seems fond of M16 variants also, they definately aren't armchair warriors. The note about 1911's by Scarecrow is also fairly well wrong too.
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 2:45:53 AM EDT
Just re-read that post by Scarecrow about the rest of the world moving to the nine in favor of the 45 auto....can we Americans really help it if the rest of the world's pansies[baby] can't handle a real gun???????????[nana]
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 4:08:54 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/22/2003 4:12:37 AM EDT by marvl]
Then there is the gas system. The rifle defecates where it eats thanks to it’s direct gas impingement system.
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[:D]
A jam from a stuck ejector is a special kind of jam that double feeds the next round causing a wedge that prevents further movement of the action regardless of how hard you try to pull on the bolt handle. To clear it, you have to drop the magazine (if you can) and slam the butt furiously against a hard, unyielding object… preferably Eugene Stoner’s head.
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[:D] [:D] [:D]
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 4:35:36 AM EDT
Every time I run into this kind of crap I simply post this link!!! From the IDF website!!! [url]http://www.isayeret.com/weapons/assault/m16vsak47.htm[/url] Read it and weep. These guys are some of the most experienced combat veterans on the planet. How possibly could they be so ignorant to choose such an inferior weapon? Cause it is NOT!!!!
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 9:26:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/22/2003 10:01:44 AM EDT by Lumpy196]
Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Originally Posted By Sumo2000:
Originally Posted By Scarecrow:
If the gun sucks sooooooooooo bad, then why are there so many variants out there and why are there so many owned out there?
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Reason there are so many different AR's being made? Armchair warriors who think everything milspec is the best shit on earth so they but the next closest thing they can legally get. Same thing for the 1911. The war stories have made it into a legend... for the USA, meanwhile the rest of the world has moved far away from the 45 and to 9mm and never looked back.
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Interesting version of history you have there.
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SAS carries SIGs with 20 round mags Delta carries 1911s Draw your own conclusions... And if Im not mistaken, the SAS use the M4 now...by choice.
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No, Im [b]AGREEING[/b] with you dude. LOL. They NEED 20 rounds if they are carrying wuss-ass 9mm FMJ. Where as OUR high-speed boys plan on putting them down with one or two well placed shots of .45 [;)] Eitherway, the Free World is using the M16/M4...so people can bitch all they want, but the guys that put their nuts out on the chopping block use them, and use them well.
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 9:35:49 AM EDT
Gimme his E-mail address and I'll bawl him out until all of his teeth are shaking....
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 9:45:20 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 9:55:23 AM EDT
[sarcasm mode on]lets through out the Browning .50, the 1911, cause they were designed at least 30 years ago, & do you know how many pistols, & machineguns have been designed with hind sight to these models?[/sarcasm mode off] [rolleyes][rolleyes]
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