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Posted: 7/21/2005 12:42:32 PM EDT

NYPD Will Begin Checking Bags on Subways

Jul 21, 2005 3:08 pm US/Eastern

(1010 WINS) (NEW YORK) Police will begin random searches of bags and packages carried by people entering city subways, officials announced Thursday after a new series of bomb attacks in London.

Passengers carrying bags will be selected at random before they pass through turnstiles, and those who refuse the police request won't be allowed to ride, Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly said.

He said officers posted at subway entrances would not engage in racial profiling, and that passengers are free to ``turn around and leave.''

Officials declined to specify how frequently the checks would occur. The checks are scheduled to be in place by rush hour on Friday.

``We just live in a world where, sadly, these kinds of security measures are necessary,'' Mayor Michael Bloomberg said. ``Are they intrusive? Yes, a little bit. But we are trying to find that right balance.''

Authorities said bus and commuter train passengers will also be checked.

William K. Williams, a 56-year-old Manhattan resident who rides the train every day, said such security measures _ while inconvenient _ are a way of life now.

``It doesn't bother me _ I mean, the whole state of things bothers me _ but it's just part and parcel of the world we live in,'' said Williams, who was carrying a briefcase outside the Brooklyn Bridge station of the subway.

New York's subways carry about 4.5 million passengers on the average weekday, according to the Metropolitan Transportation Authority. The system has more than 468 stations, most of which have multiple entrances, and during rush hours, the flood of humanity in and out of key stations can be overwhelming.

Kelly said passengers selected for searches will be approached by officers, who will ask them what they're carrying, and request them to open their bags.

Those who decline ``can't enter the system,'' he said. It was not immediately clear what would happen if an officer looking for explosives found some other form of contraband.

Similar types of random searches of subway passengers have prompted complaints from civil liberties groups in other cities, and in some cases have been challenged in court.

Christopher Dunn, associate legal director of the New York Civil Liberties Union, said the searches in New York could be problematic, if not conducted properly.

``The department can and should be actively and aggressively investigating anyone they suspect of bringing explosives into the subway, but police searches of people without any individualized suspicion is contrary to our most basic constitutional values,'' he said.

Andrew Morris, a 57-year-old Brooklyn resident who had a large bag slung over his shoulder on Thursday, said he would consent to a search if asked, but added that the extra security measures are essentially useless.

``I think these terrorists go where it's easiest to go, so if you make it hard on the subway, they'll go where we're weak,'' Morris said.

Asked whether the searches might create a bottleneck at subway entrances, Kelly said the searches might delay individuals but would not likely slow down entire crowds.

Williams predicted the new searches would frustrate New Yorkers, not exactly known for their patience.

``Sometimes you need to get to an appointment, you're running late and a cop stops you to delay you even further? That's going to create a mess,'' he said.



1010wins.com/topstories/local_story_202135404.html
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 12:47:52 PM EDT
Jesus Christ. Why not just start quartering police in your homes, for the right "balance" of safty against the almost inalienable rights we have.

That is depressing.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 12:50:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2005 12:51:36 PM EDT by HK_Shooter_03]

Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:

NYPD Will Begin Checking Bags on Subways


He said officers posted at subway entrances would not engage in racial profiling, and that passengers are free to ``turn around and leave.''



1010wins.com/topstories/local_story_202135404.html




I like Carlos Mencia's take on this topic.








After opening the show with a long and spirited tirade about Sept. 11, 2001 being the greatest day in the history of America for African-Americans and Latinos because they were finally accepted as Americans - suspicion being passed to Middle Easterners - he says those whose feelings have not yet been hurt should stick around.

Mencia spends much of the show baiting Middle Easterners. He says he is justified in this because every other minority group was forced to go through a great deal of hazing in order to be accepted into mainstream American society.
He doesn't believe any group should get to slide by on political correctness that pervades the culture.




Link Posted: 7/21/2005 12:53:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Grunteled:
Jesus Christ. Why not just start quartering police in your homes, for the right "balance" of safty against the almost inalienable rights we have.





Using public transportation is a privilege, not a right, sir. Just like putting up with the TSA bullshit at airports, you have the right to turn around & drive to where ever you're going. Ditto in NYC for subways.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 12:56:30 PM EDT

Using public transportation is a privilege, not a right, sir.

But when you're forced at gun point to pay for it through taxes, how could it not be a right?z
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 12:57:15 PM EDT
As long as you have the right to refuse consent to a search and leave without being detained, I think it's reasonable.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 12:57:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BobCole:

Originally Posted By Grunteled:
Jesus Christ. Why not just start quartering police in your homes, for the right "balance" of safty against the almost inalienable rights we have.





Using public transportation is a privilege, not a right, sir. Just like putting up with the TSA bullshit at airports, you have the right to turn around & drive to where ever you're going. Ditto in NYC for subways.



Yes, of course…

And this wailing and moaning is more hysteria without any thought attached to it.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:10:34 PM EDT
The trick will be to see what happens when the first person says "NO" and walks away.

If that's the end of it then fine. I don't like the idea but at least you have the choice.

Now, if that person is subject to ANY bullshit after saying "NO" and turning to depart, then we've got a whole 'nother kettle of fish to deal with.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:19:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2005 1:20:48 PM EDT by Grunteled]

Originally Posted By BobCole:

Originally Posted By Grunteled:
Jesus Christ. Why not just start quartering police in your homes, for the right "balance" of safty against the almost inalienable rights we have.





Using public transportation is a privilege, not a right, sir. Just like putting up with the TSA bullshit at airports, you have the right to turn around & drive to where ever you're going. Ditto in NYC for subways.



As is stepping foot out of your home I guess. Your right, I'm sure being stopped at the ferry and having your belongings searched by police was exactly what they had in mind when "secure in in their persons" was written down.

Airlines are not "public transportation" so the the TSA is not relevent. I see it differently when my tax money is taken to build things like say roads and sidewalks (are they privilages too?) and I'm then told to submit submit to whatever they decide to ask in order to to set foot on them.

Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:21:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By lu380:
As long as you have the right to refuse consent to a search and leave without being detained, I think it's reasonable.



Will you feel this way when your car is searched when leaving your neighborhood? After all, you DO have the right to cower inside your home forever, never leaving, in order to not be searched.......

When all these public places, and modes of transportation become this way, you DO have an abridgement of freedoms. Saying that people are free to leave, take another mode of transportation, etc. is just another bullshit rationalization.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:29:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BobCole:



Using public transportation is a privilege, not a right, sir. ....



except that the taxpayers paid for PUBLIC transportation.....
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:30:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Grunteled:

Originally Posted By BobCole:

Originally Posted By Grunteled:
Jesus Christ. Why not just start quartering police in your homes, for the right "balance" of safty against the almost inalienable rights we have.





Using public transportation is a privilege, not a right, sir. Just like putting up with the TSA bullshit at airports, you have the right to turn around & drive to where ever you're going. Ditto in NYC for subways.



As is stepping foot out of your home I guess. Your right, I'm sure being stopped at the ferry and having your belongings searched by police was exactly what they had in mind when "secure in in their persons" was written down.

Airlines are not "public transportation" so the the TSA is not relevent. I see it differently when my tax money is taken to build things like say roads and sidewalks (are they privilages too?) and I'm then told to submit submit to whatever they decide to ask in order to to set foot on them.




You don't think airports aren't built with local tax money?
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:33:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2005 1:54:16 PM EDT by Grunteled]
Perhaps my notion is quaint but my take on the Constitution is that I was free, in the absence of reasonable and specific suspicion of wrong-doing to go about my business unmolested by agents of the state. Not that I was free to remain indoors and never set foot in public because being out and about without random checkpoints is a privilege. The fact that I can use another mode of transport would be acceptable to me if that were a privately funded system. They are not the state and they have the right to contract with me for how I'll ride the transport and on what condition I'll be admitted.

When the system is public, and the state decides to use it's police to rifle through my possessions for no specified reason at all, I guess I see that as conflicting with the above. If we take the other view then we have no rights outside our driveway, because the state can setup and force us to waive them all to set foot of our property. I can’t imagine that was the intent of our Constitution.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:36:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2005 1:54:01 PM EDT by The_Macallan]

Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:
He said officers posted at subway entrances would not engage in racial profiling


They look for Muslim terrorists by examining the handbags of little old white ladies on subways.

They secure our border by allowing water stations along "known" illegal alien smuggling routes and denigrate citizens who lawfully try to help Border Patrol agents find illegals.

They require all people show valid ID to board a plane - but to require that all people show valid ID to vote is racism.

They refuse to offend Muslims after 9-11 by allowing public schools to have children "pretend" to be Muslim for a day, including reciting Muslim prayers - yet they tear down a sign saying "God Bless America" at public schools after 9-11 for being "establishment of religion".

Putting up an American flag on a college campus was banned as being "insensitive" after 9-11, yet burning an American flag on college campuses is considered "free speech".



We're going down. We're going down HARD.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:43:01 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:48:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Wave:
"Free" States here I come!




Wave, in case they are short in TD and you are doing bag checks at 66/Lincoln Center, please don't ask to search mine.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:52:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By guardian855:

Originally Posted By Grunteled:

Originally Posted By BobCole:

Originally Posted By Grunteled:
Jesus Christ. Why not just start quartering police in your homes, for the right "balance" of safty against the almost inalienable rights we have.





Using public transportation is a privilege, not a right, sir. Just like putting up with the TSA bullshit at airports, you have the right to turn around & drive to where ever you're going. Ditto in NYC for subways.



As is stepping foot out of your home I guess. Your right, I'm sure being stopped at the ferry and having your belongings searched by police was exactly what they had in mind when "secure in in their persons" was written down.

Airlines are not "public transportation" so the the TSA is not relevent. I see it differently when my tax money is taken to build things like say roads and sidewalks (are they privilages too?) and I'm then told to submit submit to whatever they decide to ask in order to to set foot on them.




You don't think airports aren't built with local tax money?



The carrier itself is private, but I see your point. I guess I see it as another boling frog. If they can do it to gain access to the subway, why not at the entrance to the highway? Why would this be fine and that be wrong?
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:55:19 PM EDT
NYC has already abolished our 2nd Amendment rights to keep and bear arms, so why is anyone surprised?
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 1:56:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:
He said officers posted at subway entrances would not engage in racial profiling


They look for Muslim terrorists by examining the handbags of little old white ladies on subways.

They secure our border by allowing water stations along "known" illegal alien smuggling routes and denigrate citizens who lawfully try to help Border Patrol agents find illegals.

They require all people show valid ID to board a plane - but to require people to show ID to vote is racism.

They refuse to offend Muslims after 9-11 by allowing public schools to have children "pretend" to be Muslim for a day, including reciting Muslim prayers - yet they tear down a sign saying "God Bless America" at public schools after 9-11 for being "establishment of religion".

Putting up an American flag on a college campus was banned as being "insensitive" after 9-11, yet burning an American flag on college campuses is considered "free speech".



We're going down. We're going down HARD.




On that note, I picked up another case of XM193 tonight, and will get another tomorrow.
Not that it will make any difference to my immediate freedoms, but I guess all I can do is prepare for the inevitable. It pains me to admit it, but the terrorists are winning. Americans are being forced to change the way they live, alter their actions, and accept that the liberties we once took for granted are slowly but surely being depleted in the name of ..... safety? Peace of mind?

Random searches are a continued waste of tax dollars.....we know who the fucking enemy is....when are we as a nation finally going to do something with that knowledge?

Link Posted: 7/21/2005 2:01:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By HK_Shooter_03:
I like Carlos Mencia's take on this topic.

media.collegepublisher.com/media/paper344/stills/jwpn16lk.jpg






After opening the show with a long and spirited tirade about Sept. 11, 2001 being the greatest day in the history of America for African-Americans and Latinos because they were finally accepted as Americans - suspicion being passed to Middle Easterners - he says those whose feelings have not yet been hurt should stick around.

Mencia spends much of the show baiting Middle Easterners. He says he is justified in this because every other minority group was forced to go through a great deal of hazing in order to be accepted into mainstream American society.
He doesn't believe any group should get to slide by on political correctness that pervades the culture.







Mencia is my favorite Mexican Comidian.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 2:02:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:

Originally Posted By Wave:
"Free" States here I come!




Wave, in case they are short in TD and you are doing bag checks at 66/Lincoln Center, please don't ask to search mine.



Wave can frisk me anytime..
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 2:05:02 PM EDT
This is way too cool. This is just like the old Soviet Union, my friend that I used to work with named Vladimir, was in the Soviet Union before its collapse, the KGB just just stopped him and asked to see his papers. The KGB agent said that his papers weren't in order, and he was jailed for 3 days. I bet that the if you refused, the NYPD LE would throw you into the slammer.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 2:10:49 PM EDT
Wednesday I tried to enter the tunnel wearing a bomb but they asked me to consent to a search, so I turned around and left. I'll try again on Friday.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 2:13:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2005 2:16:43 PM EDT by The_Macallan]

Originally Posted By macro:
Random searches are a continued waste of tax dollars...



Which begs the question...

Have they EVER found a bomb being smuggled onto a plane in someone's bag?

Have the ever even found a GUN being smuggled onto a plane by anyone who (after further investigation) turned out to be linked to a terrorist group?

Has this ever-growing expansion of intrusion on our basic rights really been shown to be an effective deterrance to terrorism? Or have they simply been pushing the terrorists to new avenues of targets?

They searched all bags getting onto planes - so now the terrorists are bombing subways.

Now we search bags getting onto subways and so the terrorists may bomb public buses next.

When they start searching people getting onto buses, the terrorists may bomb cabs in front of key downtown buildings.

When they start search cars heading downtown, the terrorists may walk among the crowds and bomb them on the streets.

When they start searching people just walking in public, the terrorists may stay home and bomb apartment buildings and neighborhoods they live in.

When they start searching homes... it'll be too late.

There'll be nothing worth defending in America anymore.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 2:16:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By PeteCO:

Originally Posted By lu380:
As long as you have the right to refuse consent to a search and leave without being detained, I think it's reasonable.



Will you feel this way when your car is searched when leaving your neighborhood? After all, you DO have the right to cower inside your home forever, never leaving, in order to not be searched.......

When all these public places, and modes of transportation become this way, you DO have an abridgement of freedoms. Saying that people are free to leave, take another mode of transportation, etc. is just another bullshit rationalization.



Maybe you're right, considering that it's the police doing the searching, not an employee of the transit system.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 2:16:53 PM EDT

He said officers posted at subway entrances would not engage in racial profiling

Raymond Kelly.. you stupid cocksucker.


Stop ALL muslim immigration now!!

Link Posted: 7/21/2005 2:17:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

They look for Muslim terrorists by examining the handbags of little old white ladies on subways.

They secure our border by allowing water stations along "known" illegal alien smuggling routes and denigrate citizens who lawfully try to help Border Patrol agents find illegals.

They require all people show valid ID to board a plane - but to require that all people show valid ID to vote is racism.

They refuse to offend Muslims after 9-11 by allowing public schools to have children "pretend" to be Muslim for a day, including reciting Muslim prayers - yet they tear down a sign saying "God Bless America" at public schools after 9-11 for being "establishment of religion".

Putting up an American flag on a college campus was banned as being "insensitive" after 9-11, yet burning an American flag on college campuses is considered "free speech".




This is a very succinct statement that should be used to beat our elected officials about the head with.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 3:17:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2005 3:17:56 PM EDT by magnum_99]

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:
He said officers posted at subway entrances would not engage in racial profiling


They look for Muslim terrorists by examining the handbags of little old white ladies on subways.

They secure our border by allowing water stations along "known" illegal alien smuggling routes and denigrate citizens who lawfully try to help Border Patrol agents find illegals.

They require all people show valid ID to board a plane - but to require that all people show valid ID to vote is racism.

They refuse to offend Muslims after 9-11 by allowing public schools to have children "pretend" to be Muslim for a day, including reciting Muslim prayers - yet they tear down a sign saying "God Bless America" at public schools after 9-11 for being "establishment of religion".

Putting up an American flag on a college campus was banned as being "insensitive" after 9-11, yet burning an American flag on college campuses is considered "free speech".



We're going down. We're going down HARD.




The "war on terror" will be the final nail in the coffin of freedom.

1984, your table is ready.


The "war on terror" is a fucking joke.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 3:20:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2005 3:22:18 PM EDT by HK_Shooter_03]

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

Originally Posted By macro:
Random searches are a continued waste of tax dollars...



Which begs the question...

Have they EVER found a bomb being smuggled onto a plane in someone's bag?

Have the ever even found a GUN being smuggled onto a plane by anyone who (after further investigation) turned out to be linked to a terrorist group?

Has this ever-growing expansion of intrusion on our basic rights really been shown to be an effective deterrance to terrorism? Or have they simply been pushing the terrorists to new avenues of targets?

They searched all bags getting onto planes - so now the terrorists are bombing subways.

Now we search bags getting onto subways and so the terrorists may bomb public buses next.

When they start searching people getting onto buses, the terrorists may bomb cabs in front of key downtown buildings.

When they start search cars heading downtown, the terrorists may walk among the crowds and bomb them on the streets.

When they start searching people just walking in public, the terrorists may stay home and bomb apartment buildings and neighborhoods they live in.

When they start searching homes... it'll be too late.

There'll be nothing worth defending in America anymore.




Good post...

Imagine that the Allies are defending themselves with a shield the size of a paper plate.

The terrorists throw a rock at our chest.

We cover our chest with the shield.

Next the terrorist aim for our leg.

We cover the leg.

ETA:

The terrorist wait a while for our shield to come down then they throw a rock back at our chest.


Then terrorist then aim for our head while we are busy covering everything they just hit...

We're done after that...
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 3:27:37 PM EDT
so know we have to (like in an airport) give up our right enumerated by the Constitution.

This is BLATANTLY unconstitutional, No I dont have to use said transportation but I shouldnt have to be searched UNCONSTITUTIONALY.

Those that would give up Liberty for a percieved sense of safety deserve neither Liberty nor safety
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 3:30:13 PM EDT
after this news I am never going to NY. I always knew it to be a filty place of crime anyways but this just takes the cake.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 3:36:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Luxan:
after this news I am never going to NY. I always knew it to be a filty place of crime anyways but this just takes the cake.



Ironically, it's safer than any other big city in America and is pretty clean and nice these days. That doesn't mean it's not a police state though.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 3:36:51 PM EDT
Who said "we are winning the war on terror?"
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 3:39:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By zoom:

Using public transportation is a privilege, not a right, sir.

But when you're forced at gun point to pay for it through taxes, how could it not be a right?



+1
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 3:44:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Luxan:
after this news I am never going to NY. I always knew it to be a filty place of crime anyways but this just takes the cake.



Ignorance is bliss
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 3:47:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:

Originally Posted By Luxan:
after this news I am never going to NY. I always knew it to be a filty place of crime anyways but this just takes the cake.



Ironically, it's safer than any other big city in America and is pretty clean and nice these days. That doesn't mean it's not a police state though.



You sure about that?

The top 6 largest cities in the US are New York City, Los Angeles, Houston, Chicago, Phoenix and Philadelphia. You think NYC is safer than all of those? I's bet that Houston and Phoenix are safer than NYC.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 3:52:20 PM EDT

He said officers posted at subway entrances would not engage in racial profiling


Translation: This is merely a feel good measure. We would hate to actually be effective and search the target demographic. We will therefore search the bags of teenaged schoolgirls and old Jewish women.

Come on if we are gonna do it needs to be done right, feelings and PC bullshit aside!

If I want a tart apple I grab a green one for fuck's sake. It is called common sense.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 3:54:21 PM EDT
No significant difference than Airports and courthouses doing it. As long as there is proper signage

"Those who enter this facility subject to random search. Those who refuse will be denied access."
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 3:56:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jtb33:

Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:

Originally Posted By Luxan:
after this news I am never going to NY. I always knew it to be a filty place of crime anyways but this just takes the cake.



Ironically, it's safer than any other big city in America and is pretty clean and nice these days. That doesn't mean it's not a police state though.



You sure about that?

The top 6 largest cities in the US are New York City, Los Angeles, Houston, Chicago, Phoenix and Philadelphia. You think NYC is safer than all of those? I's bet that Houston and Phoenix are safer than NYC.



The murder rate for NYC is significantly lower than for those cities... 15-40% lower.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 4:18:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Max_Mike:

Originally Posted By jtb33:

Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:

Originally Posted By Luxan:
after this news I am never going to NY. I always knew it to be a filty place of crime anyways but this just takes the cake.



Ironically, it's safer than any other big city in America and is pretty clean and nice these days. That doesn't mean it's not a police state though.



You sure about that?

The top 6 largest cities in the US are New York City, Los Angeles, Houston, Chicago, Phoenix and Philadelphia. You think NYC is safer than all of those? I's bet that Houston and Phoenix are safer than NYC.



The murder rate for NYC is significantly lower than for those cities... 15-40% lower.



Morgan Quinto Ratings

Top 10 Safest Cities (cites over 500,000 people):

1 San Jose, CA
2 El Paso, TX
3 Honolulu, HI
4 Austin, TX
5 New York, NY
6 Louisville, KY
7 San Diego, CA
8 San Antonio, TX
9 San Francisco, CA
10 Fort Worth, TX

Top 10 Most Dangerous Cities (over 500,000 people):

1 Detroit, MI
2 Washington, DC
3 Baltimore, MD
4 Memphis, TN
5 Dallas, TX
6 Philadelphia, PA
7 Columbus, OH
8 Nashville, TN
9 Houston, TX
10 Phoenix, AZ

www.morganquitno.com/cit05pop.htm#500,000+


Link Posted: 7/21/2005 4:21:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

They look for Muslim terrorists by examining the handbags of little old white ladies on subways.

They secure our border by allowing water stations along "known" illegal alien smuggling routes and denigrate citizens who lawfully try to help Border Patrol agents find illegals.

They require all people show valid ID to board a plane - but to require that all people show valid ID to vote is racism.

They refuse to offend Muslims after 9-11 by allowing public schools to have children "pretend" to be Muslim for a day, including reciting Muslim prayers - yet they tear down a sign saying "God Bless America" at public schools after 9-11 for being "establishment of religion".

Putting up an American flag on a college campus was banned as being "insensitive" after 9-11, yet burning an American flag on college campuses is considered "free speech".



We're going down. We're going down HARD.



AMEN.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 4:38:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By FiveO:

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

They look for Muslim terrorists by examining the handbags of little old white ladies on subways.

They secure our border by allowing water stations along "known" illegal alien smuggling routes and denigrate citizens who lawfully try to help Border Patrol agents find illegals.

They require all people show valid ID to board a plane - but to require that all people show valid ID to vote is racism.

They refuse to offend Muslims after 9-11 by allowing public schools to have children "pretend" to be Muslim for a day, including reciting Muslim prayers - yet they tear down a sign saying "God Bless America" at public schools after 9-11 for being "establishment of religion".

Putting up an American flag on a college campus was banned as being "insensitive" after 9-11, yet burning an American flag on college campuses is considered "free speech".



We're going down. We're going down HARD.



AMEN.



That may happen, but I sure hope we take those camel humpers with us.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 4:40:35 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AZ-K9:
Wednesday I tried to enter the tunnel wearing a bomb but they asked me to consent to a search, so I turned around and left. I'll try again on Friday.



... That's just plain old bullshit there bro.

... I worked off and on in NYC on a number of occasions. I have quite legitimate reasons to not allow just any Amerikanisch Heimatsicherheit jackboot to search my bags. My company trusts I keep many of my documents for certain eyes only (sensitive and confidential and ...)

... It's bullshit plain and simple. If you believe otherwise, the terrorists have already won.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 4:45:09 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jtb33:

Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:

Originally Posted By Luxan:
after this news I am never going to NY. I always knew it to be a filty place of crime anyways but this just takes the cake.



Ironically, it's safer than any other big city in America and is pretty clean and nice these days. That doesn't mean it's not a police state though.

You sure about that?

The top 6 largest cities in the US are New York City, Los Angeles, Houston, Chicago, Phoenix and Philadelphia. You think NYC is safer than all of those? I's bet that Houston and Phoenix are safer than NYC.

Well it certainly seems like a safe place for


Link Posted: 7/21/2005 4:53:19 PM EDT
Besides, what the hell is there to keep terrorists from getting jobs as janitors or other transit employees ? Who ever said they all had to be Muslim, or even Arab, or even foreign. About all this is going to achieve is just pissing off a lot of commuters just like TSA has done. Basically, my point is that terrorists could potentially recruit anybody, if I were running their show, I would be trying to recruit American anti-war and communist types to do my dirty work. Maybe throw in a few anarchists, just have them get jobs working on the subways. That would make it quite easy for them. Not to mention that it is child's play to conceal explosives, most police officers aren't going to know explosives if they see them anyways. So if you made a device that did not look like a device, you could get it in, esp if you work there because even if the police do search you, whatever you do have will look completely innocent. If it's the same cops everyday, everybody will get to know each other and chances are the cops will get a bit too relaxed to be any good anyway. I don't think there's really anything we can do about this aside from simply having an armed police presence around the subways and the like, searches aren't going to achieve much.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 5:10:46 PM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:
He said officers posted at subway entrances would not engage in racial profiling


They look for Muslim terrorists by examining the handbags of little old white ladies on subways.

They secure our border by allowing water stations along "known" illegal alien smuggling routes and denigrate citizens who lawfully try to help Border Patrol agents find illegals.

They require all people show valid ID to board a plane - but to require that all people show valid ID to vote is racism.

They refuse to offend Muslims after 9-11 by allowing public schools to have children "pretend" to be Muslim for a day, including reciting Muslim prayers - yet they tear down a sign saying "God Bless America" at public schools after 9-11 for being "establishment of religion".

Putting up an American flag on a college campus was banned as being "insensitive" after 9-11, yet burning an American flag on college campuses is considered "free speech".



We're going down. We're going down HARD.




Well said. I couldnt leave Guantanomo Bay until I had "Sensitivity to Arabs/Muslims Training" courtesy of the US Army Muslim Chaplain.........
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 5:58:04 PM EDT

He said officers posted at subway entrances would not engage in racial profiling, and that passengers are free to ``turn around and leave.''


rrriiiiiigggghhhhtttttt
som­e arab looking guy turns around and leaves the cops at the turnstyle might not go after him but they'll radio to the cop outside who will stop him
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 6:00:43 PM EDT
Don't thank the terrorists for this. Thank the "War on Drugs" for making it all possible.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 6:01:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sharky30:

He said officers posted at subway entrances would not engage in racial profiling, and that passengers are free to ``turn around and leave.''


rrriiiiiigggghhhhtttttt
som­e arab looking guy turns around and leaves the cops at the turnstyle might not go after him but they'll radio to the cop outside who will stop him




Yep....they'll pull the same shit they do at drunk-driving checkpoints -- anyone who turns off the road before the the checkpoint is stopped and gets the "your papers pleese" treatment, along with the third degree over why they were avoiding the checkpoint.
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 6:02:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sharky30:

He said officers posted at subway entrances would not engage in racial profiling, and that passengers are free to ``turn around and leave.''


rrriiiiiigggghhhhtttttt
som­e arab looking guy turns around and leaves the cops at the turnstyle might not go after him but they'll radio to the cop outside who will stop him



LOL...NYPD portables do not transmit in the subway....Only those assigned to transit bureau have radios that can transmit, and they don't always work either....
Link Posted: 7/21/2005 6:12:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AZ-K9:
Wednesday I tried to enter the tunnel wearing a bomb but they asked me to consent to a search, so I turned around and left. I'll try again on Friday.



bomber will just rig the bomb to blow when the bag is opened. those turnstyle areas are probably crowded enough to get numerous casulties
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